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[VAL0R]

The more we embrace assisted suicide, abortion and eugenics (such as aborting healthy babies with down syndrome, etc.), the more we signal that we as a people don't place an enormous value on human life. Human life becomes cheapened and devalued as these attitudes permeate the culture.

If I suffer a doctor may take my life. Why then if I suffer can I not take my own life? If it was morally OK for someone to kill me minutes before my birth, why not minutes after? Why not years after? Why not now? And so on.

 

[BANGS]

It's really scary to see people try and argue that white American men have it the worse/are the most oppressed in America.

Why, afraid of an upset in the oppression olympics?

 

[Red Crayon Aristocrat]

The more we embrace assisted suicide, abortion and eugenics (such as aborting healthy babies with down syndrome, etc.), the more we signal that we as a people don't place an enormous value on human life. Human life becomes cheapened and devalued as these attitudes permeate the culture.

If I suffer a doctor may take my life. Why then if I suffer can I not take my own life? If it was morally OK for someone to kill me minutes before my birth, why not minutes after? Why not years after? Why not now? And so on.

Not sure if abortions can work that way, to where you can abort minutes before a birth (maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it)

And doctor assisted suicide is usually someone suffering from a terminal illness, right? That's very different than someone simply suffering from depression.

 

[VAL0R]

Also, if children are only taught the bleakness of atheism, that they are merely soulless and highly evolved animals and/or morality is merely a social construct, of course they will not see themselves as having any inherent value. They are merely a collection of atoms, a random event that appeared in the universe. Absurdly able to ask, "why am I here and what is the meaning of life?" to a dead universe that isn't listening. They have no ultimate purpose, no value, no future. Soon, they will die like all other animals as individuals and eventually as a collective species. And then the universe after us will eventually perish in the great heat death when all light and warmth and life are forever extinguished.

I get depressed just thinking of it! Compare that with what I tell my children, that they are created by a transcendent God who loves them, who made them in his image. He is supremely good and wills their good and their inheritance will be with him forever, if only they love him and follow after him and obey his good laws.

I know we don't judge the truth of a claim based on how good it makes us feel or the rewards it promises. So I agree that because faith gives children hope, it doesn't make it true. But there can be no doubt that atheism offers them no hope and only darkness in the end. You can play nonsense games, "but the memory of daddy and mommy will be with you forever!", but kids are too clever to be fooled by that shallow promise for long. Nobody remembers Julius So-and-so who mopped the floor of the coliseum. No one will remember me or my children in a very brief period of time unless there is a God.

 

[SLoWMoTIoN]

I wake up every morning happy that Trump is president and Obama is gone. Joyful, in fact. Remember that half the nation voted for him and it isn't a national period of mourning.

As somebody that can't stand politicians and snake oil salesmen. Could you tell me why? Do you think a billionaire cares about you? You think he is gonna make your life better? You think a President can do anything but divide its people for the sake of "fuck you I got mine" mentality?

 

[VAL0R]

Not sure if abortions can work that way, to where you can abort minutes before a birth (maybe I'm wrong, but I doubt it)

And doctor assisted suicide is usually someone suffering from a terminal illness, right? That's very different than someone simply suffering from depression.

I don't want to turn this into an abortion thread, but yes you can get an abortion during all 9 months of pregnancy in the US. Our abortion laws are less restrictive than many European nations.

And assisted suicide is not only performed on the terminally ill, at least globally speaking. But murdering the terminally ill is still murder, at any rate. I'm not exactly sure where our laws are at right now in the US on this. A Catholic neurologist friend of mine is giving a lecture soon on this very subject and I should educate myself.

 

[VAL0R]

As somebody that can't stand politicians and snake oil salesmen. Could you tell me why? Do you think a billionaire cares about you? You think he is gonna make your life better? You think a President can do anything but divide its people for the sake of "fuck you I got mine" mentality?

Sorry, I don't want to turn this into a Trump thread. Maybe we can take this up in a political thread sometime.

 

[Dee Dah Dave]

We just aren't living like humans are naturally supposed to these days. Not enough exercise and crappy food intake. That's the foundation of the problem.

The natural male - female roles are being turned on their head too which doesn't help. All this shit has consequences.

 

[VAL0R]

According a study from the American Journal of Psychiatry:

https://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/doi/full/10.1176/appi.ajp.161.12.2303

CONCLUSIONS: Religious affiliation is associated with less suicidal behavior in depressed inpatients. After other factors were controlled, it was found that greater moral objections to suicide and lower aggression level in religiously affiliated subjects may function as protective factors against suicide attempts. Further study about the influence of religious affiliation on aggressive behavior and how moral objections can reduce the probability of acting on suicidal thoughts may offer new therapeutic strategies in suicide prevention.
...
Studies of religious commitment in general suggest a protective effect as well.
...
Subjects with no religious affiliation were more often lifetime suicide attempters, reported more suicidal ideation, and were more likely to have first-degree relatives who had committed suicide than religiously affiliated subjects.
...
The main finding of this study was that religiously affiliated subjects were less likely to have a history of suicide attempts, the best predictor of future suicide or attempts (31). Moreover, greater moral objections to suicide that may represent traditional religious beliefs mediated the protective effect of religious affiliation against suicidal behavior in a clinical sample of depressed patients. Individuals with a religious affiliation also reported less suicidal ideation at the time of evaluation, despite comparable severity of depression, number of adverse life events, and severity of hopelessness. Of note, suicidal ideation, a risk factor for suicidal acts, has been found to be inversely related to religion (5, 8–10). Therefore, religion may provide a positive force that counteracts suicidal ideation in the face of depression, hopelessness, and stressful events.

 

[Panda1]

Smells like nationalism

Smells like being a pirate too, but fuckit I'm down to blame whitey too.

 

[mckmas8808]

should we just pretend that depression, suicide, drug use ,etc etc isn't on the the rise in their community. How is that a good thing?

It's a terrible thing. I wish more people in the media talked about this about white people exclusively! We've had many conversations about things black people aren't good at. It'd be great to start seeing articles and TV programs about "JUST" white people and why they are struggling so much in some parts of the country. Just don't dress it up as "America's" problem. NO! Shoot it straight. Lets only talk about why white people (even though they make more money, have more land, and get the best side of the legal system relative to every major ethnic group in America) are having it so bad compared to 30 years ago.

You're talking about being bombarded with choice 24 hours a day with the constant saturation of comparison of a person's ideal life against your own. Social media doesn't often represent an accurate slice of a person's life, but instead the theatrical, edited versions presenting the highlights like a "best of" episode of reality. Yet somehow, we present this as our existence.

Accepting this reality is part of the reason that we're in the troubled, polarized state of affairs that we're in. As social creatures, we've always succumbed to some kind of showmanship and exaggeration - but this isn't neighborhood anymore. Your frame of comparison was your immediate surrounding. We check the internet from our phones a dozen times an hour and then make desperate attempts to differentiate ourselves through online pissing contests of virtue. When we check back in with the real world, we're disgusted by the humans around us and how they're so indifferent to this cause or so blind to the suffering of these people.

I remember studies published data regarding media coverage of September 11th. We watched it over and over again for weeks and felt growing misery because of the unrelenting stream. In the Twitter age, it's constant. It makes us feel like school shootings are happening in our neighborhoods while every police officer is gunning down every black teenager they see. Our brains aren't meant to handle 24 hours of choice, comparing ourselves against 7 billion others, and misery. I'd wager suicide rates get worse before they get better. We have to learn to compartmentalize our worlds much better than we have.

This post is so great. I wish GAF had a donate button for post, just so I could give you $1 lol. You're so right though. We as humans aren't designed or ready for what social media does to us as a society. We aren't built for discussing things with 200 people all at once. So when 3 people disagree with us at the same time we call it "piling on" or "mob mentality" when honestly it's just 3 people disagreeing with you at once. There's no "mob mentality", but you'll see people use that term all the time when discussing social media. We aren't socially ready for what it means to discuss things amongst 1,000s of people all at once.

One Tweet can get retweeted 5,000 times and get 2,000 comments. Out of those 2,000 comments, there can be a legit 500 hateful comments. No one human-being is supposed to hear or read 500 hateful comments about them or about what they think about something. It can take a mental and emotion toll on a person. It's why one of the Gaffers this past weekend said he needed to take 3 months off from NeoGaf. I get it! I had to take a break from Twitter for a while, because it can get to be too much some times.

they are by far the group with the highest suicide rates to call them privileged is insane

The privileged part is talking about their lot in life "on the average" and "COMPARED" to other major ethnic groups (basically compared to black and brown people). Let me be honest and show you how it's done. I have some levels of privilege in America because I'm a "straight" "male". Both of those things give me some measures of privilege compared to being a woman or part of the LGBTQ group. I know that to be true and I'm happy to openly admit that.

 

[BANGS]

It's a terrible thing.

This is where your post should have ended. The rest is just "boo hoo rich white man"...

Protip: This isn't a nation of 6 races. This is a nation of 300 million individuals all with there own issues...

 

[Dunki]

I
The privileged part is talking about their lot in life "on the average" and "COMPARED" to other major ethnic groups (basically compared to black and brown people). Let me be honest and show you how it's done. I have some levels of privilege in America because I'm a "straight" "male". Both of those things give me some measures of privilege compared to being a woman or part of the LGBTQ group. I know that to be true and I'm happy to openly admit that.

Please tell me these privileges. Because right now women have more advantage in terms of laws. They have an advantage in many aspects of life be it something like affirmative action etc. They outclass men in terms of education still they get more support programs than men. I basically did live for 2 years with 160 Euro a month which is not much at all. I had to fight to get my scholarship and now a new job etc. I am not privileged because I am white straight and male. It depends on the money, on your looks. on your charisma etc. To make it look like you have a fucking great life because you are white straight and male is ridiculous just as ridiculous as ignoring that white males are by far far outnumbering any other group in terms of suicides.

White Privilegs is as much a generalization as black people can not swim.

 

[BANGS]

Please tell me these privileges. Because right now women have more advantage in terms of laws. They have an advantage in many aspects of life be it something like affirmative action etc. i basically did life for 2 years with 160 Euro a month which is not much at all. I had to fight to get my scholarship and now a new job etc. I am not privileged because I am white straight and male. It depends on the money, on your looks. on your charisma etc. To make it look like you have a fucking great life because you are white straight and male is ridiculous just as ridiculous as ignoring that white males are by far far outnumbering any other group in terms of suicides.

White Privilegs is as much a generalization as black people can not swim.

Don't you know? You have privilege because other people who kinda look like you have better lives than other people who don't look as much like you...

Seriously this oppression olympics shit is so sad. I can't believe so many people allowed themselves to get caught up in it...

 

[mckmas8808]

Please tell me these privileges. Because right now women have more advantage in terms of laws. They have an advantage in many aspects of life be it something like affirmative action etc. They outclass men in terms of education still they get more support programs than men. I basically did live for 2 years with 160 Euro a month which is not much at all. I had to fight to get my scholarship and now a new job etc. I am not privileged because I am white straight and male. It depends on the money, on your looks. on your charisma etc. To make it look like you have a fucking great life because you are white straight and male is ridiculous just as ridiculous as ignoring that white males are by far far outnumbering any other group in terms of suicides.

White Privilegs is as much a generalization as black people can not swim.

If you think women have more privileges in America than men, then there's no reason for us to discuss this. You seem to think the word "privilege" means "perfect" or "untouchable". You don't understand the definition of "privilege" when used in the way it's being used here.

 

[Phoenix RISING]

I wake up every morning happy that Trump is president and Obama is gone. Joyful, in fact. Remember that half the nation voted for him and it isn't a national period of mourning.

Now everyone knows all your proselytizing is fraudulent.

 

[Dunki]

If you think women have more privileges in America than men, then there's no reason for us to discuss this. You seem to think the word "privilege" means "perfect" or "untouchable". You don't understand the definition of "privilege" when used in the way it's being used here.

Privileges are advantages aka Affirmative action, aka more support programs, better laws especially in terms of custody. Cry Rape and everyone will believe you if you have evidence or not. #Metoo showed that. Or how about places like women shelter while men have NOWHERE to go even though statistics say that women hit more often than man while man doing more damage.

How about the stigmatization of men when they alone with a kid in a park. how many think these days pedophile or even call the cops on you? Should I continue or is this already enough? But if you want we can also go into the role of a professional Victim and Victim hood as a deeply psychological issues these days. how about about the double standard of objectification how one is bad and how the other is celebrated by women? You can think that people based on race and gender have Privileges all day and I would call this generalization and maybe even a bit racist and sexist.

So if you want to have an discussion about suicides rates and you counter with white Privilegs I only can facepalm pretty hard.

 

[BANGS]

If you think women have more privileges in America than men, then there's no reason for us to discuss this. You seem to think the word "privilege" means "perfect" or "untouchable". You don't understand the definition of "privilege" when used in the way it's being used here.

Because the way you're using it is intentionally false and completely devoid of any logic. Women DO have more privileges than men in this country by law. They can choose whether or not to bear your child, they have a bigger say in court regarding pretty much any domestic dispute. There are no legal rights men have above women. You cannot say a man is privileged because other men have better lives than other women on average, you'd either have to be an idiot or a liar to parade that nonsense around. You can certainly make the argument that as a group on average, white men have it better than others. But passing that down to the individual and making the claim that white people have some special privilege is just plain dishonest and stupid. Men aren't doing better on average do to any privilege that benefits them, they are doing better on average because some individuals in that group are doing better for a variety of reasons that don't relate to everyone else in the group...

 

[BANGS]

You can think that people based on race and gender have Privileges all day and I would call this generalization and maybe even a bit racist and sexist.

It's VERY racist and sexist, not just a little bit. It's judging an individual based on what you think you know about the group they belong to... the very definition of discrimination...

 

[VAL0R]

Now everyone knows all your proselytizing is fraudulent.

Ha! I have very morally good and defensible reasons for voting for Trump over Clinton and for Obama's opponents.

 

[Insane Metal]

Thanks, Trump.

 

[mckmas8808]

Because the way you're using it is intentionally false and completely devoid of any logic. Women DO have more privileges than men in this country by law. They can choose whether or not to bear your child, they have a bigger say in court regarding pretty much any domestic dispute. There are no legal rights men have above women. You cannot say a man is privileged because other men have better lives than other women on average, you'd either have to be an idiot or a liar to parade that nonsense around. You can certainly make the argument that as a group on average, white men have it better than others. But passing that down to the individual and making the claim that white people have some special privilege is just plain dishonest and stupid. Men aren't doing better on average do to any privilege that benefits them, they are doing better on average because some individuals in that group are doing better for a variety of reasons that don't relate to everyone else in the group...

1. The baby is "IN" the woman's womb. Men don't have wombs.
2. Our society and how we treat the relationship of men and women in relation to a child is how we got to the court system when it comes to custody. When men leave women with the baby so many times, yes court systems will opt to give the child to the gender that's usually there to care for the child more. In this area, women do have the upper hand. I didn't say the score between men and women was 140 - 0. It's clear we have more privileges though. Men built the system.

 

[Dunki]

1. The baby is "IN" the woman's womb. Men don't have wombs.
2. Our society and how we treat the relationship of men and women in relation to a child is how we got to the court system when it comes to custody. When men leave women with the baby so many times, yes court systems will opt to give the child to the gender that's usually there to care for the child more. In this area, women do have the upper hand. I didn't say the score between men and women was 140 - 0. It's clear we have more privileges though. Men built the system.

About that

much more here in terms of abusive behaviour etc.

http://www.breakingthescience.org/SimplifiedDataFromDHHS.php

Abuse fatilities

Mother Only Abuse: 1,452,099 fatilities 1,704

Father Only Abuse 661,129 fatillities 859




Please again tell me these privileges . Again Women outclass men these days in almost everything and still getting more support. The system today is built for women. Even the school systems are more favorable to women. There are studies that shows that boys getting more discriminated in school by feminist teachers. Its also proven that the current system is favorable to girls since boys get mostly punished for what they like.

 

[mckmas8808]

About that

much more here in terms of abusive behaviour etc.

http://www.breakingthescience.org/SimplifiedDataFromDHHS.php

Abuse fatilities

Mother Only 1,452,099 1,704

Father Only 661,129 859




Please again tell me these privileges . Again Women outclass men these days in almost everything and still getting more support. The system today is built for women. Even the school systems are more favorable to women. There are studies that shows that boys getting more discriminated in school by feminist teachers. Its also proven that the current system is favorable to girls since boys get mostly punished for what they like.

Feminist teachers? See I won't do this with you man. You're speaking my a guy that dislikes women in general.

 

[Phoenix RISING]

It's a terrible thing. I wish more people in the media talked about this about white people exclusively! We've had many conversations about things black people aren't good at. It'd be great to start seeing articles and TV programs about "JUST" white people and why they are struggling so much in some parts of the country. Just don't dress it up as "America's" problem. NO! Shoot it straight. Lets only talk about why white people (even though they make more money, have more land, and get the best side of the legal system relative to every major ethnic group in America) are having it so bad compared to 30 years ago.

White America is America.

Yeeennnnknow???

Let me put this another way: to outwardly acknowledge the struggles of white people is to acknowledge that other people actually exist.

Tertiary: explicit recognition of white struggles is direct blow to white supremacy, white nationalism, as untenable.

This post is so great. I wish GAF had a donate button for post, just so I could give you $1 lol. You're so right though. We as humans aren't designed or ready for what social media does to us as a society. We aren't built for discussing things with 200 people all at once. So when 3 people disagree with us at the same time we call it "piling on" or "mob mentality" when honestly it's just 3 people disagreeing with you at once. There's no "mob mentality", but you'll see people use that term all the time when discussing social media. We aren't socially ready for what it means to discuss things amongst 1,000s of people all at once.

One Tweet can get retweeted 5,000 times and get 2,000 comments. Out of those 2,000 comments, there can be a legit 500 hateful comments. No one human-being is supposed to hear or read 500 hateful comments about them or about what they think about something. It can take a mental and emotion toll on a person. It's why one of the Gaffers this past weekend said he needed to take 3 months off from NeoGaf. I get it! I had to take a break from Twitter for a while, because it can get to be too much some times.

I disagree. I love Twitter because when someone starts popping off their ignorance, 1,000 people will drag them.

Get gud or get out. Everyone might have an opinion, but a lot of them are wrong.

 

[Dunki]

Feminist teachers? See I won't do this with you man. You're speaking my a guy that dislikes women in general.

I can back everything I say and its not about hating women why should I hate women? If I hate something than it is modern Feminism nothing else. And modern feminism =! women.

The problem of boys' underachievement in primary and secondary school follows them into their later lives. Research from 2006 has tracked the decline in male academic performance over the same period as the rise of feminist-dominated ideologies in academia and policymaking.

The answer lies in the way teachers, who are statistically mostly women, evaluate students without reference to objective test scores. Boys are regularly graded well below their actual academic performance.

Boys are falling significantly behind in grades, "despite performing as least as well as girls on math tests, and significantly better on science tests."

Further:

The disparity between the sexes in school achievement also far outstrips the disparity between ethnicities. Cornwell notes that "the girl-boy gap in reading grades is over 300 percent larger than the white-black reading gap," and boy-girl gap is about 40 percent larger than the white-black grade gaps.

"From kindergarten to fifth grade," he found, "the top half of the test-score distribution" among whites is increasingly populated by boys, "while the grade distribution provides no corresponding evidence that boys are out-performing girls".

These disparities are "even sharper for black and Hispanic children" with the "misalignment of grades with test scores steadily increases as black and Hispanic students advance in school."

The study, he said, shows that "teachers' assessments are not aligned with test-score data, with greater gender disparities in appearing in grading than testing outcomes". And the "gender disparity" always favours girls.

White male priviliege am I right=?

https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/e...r-bias-erases-boys-falling-grades-study-finds

 

[llien]

..even though they make more money, have more land, and get the best side of the legal system relative to every major ethnic group in America...

That is factually wrong though, unless you consider Asian Americans to be non major ethnic group (6% of population). Gender incarceration gap is times bigger than racial.

Men built the system.

Men almost never act as a (gender) group.

It has been mostly men who signed this, for instance:
Girls' education gets $3.8-billion boost at G7

(Why someone would help Sudan's girls (76% go to school) but not boys (80% go to school) is... rather puzzling.)

 

[mckmas8808]

I disagree. I love Twitter because when someone starts popping off their ignorance, 1,000 people will drag them.

Get gud or get out. Everyone might have an opinion, but a lot of them are wrong.

I don't think we disagree there. I do like when people with terrible opinions get dragged and kicked out the paint on Twitter. But my point is, what is that person thinking right after that. They think the world hates them and their opinions when in reality it was just a small section of Twitter that dragged you. In reality, there's 1,000s if not millions of people that agree to that person's terrible opinion they originally gave on Twitter.

That is factually wrong though, unless you consider Asian Americans to be non major ethnic group (6% of population). Gender incarceration gap is times bigger than racial.

I'm not including Asian Americans. You're right. There's just not enough of them here. And they don't have a huge influence on "how" the country is run from a governmental prespective.

 

[llien]

The baby is "IN" the woman's womb. Men don't have wombs.

Should that matter when baby is... outside of the womb?
There is a legal way for a mother to opt out of motherhood, but there is no way for the father.

I'm not including Asian Americans. You're right. There's just not enough of them here.

Fair enough. Interesting fact: it is actually Asian women, not white men, who are top paid group in the USA.

 

[Phoenix RISING]

I don't think we disagree there. I do like when people with terrible opinions get dragged and kicked out the paint on Twitter. But my point is, what is that person thinking right after that. They think the world hates them and their opinions when in reality it was just a small section of Twitter that dragged you. In reality, there's 1,000s if not millions of people that agree to that person's terrible opinion they originally gave on Twitter.

If 1,000 (plus plus plus) people comment or like a drag, that's significantly than the sample size of your standardard scientific [sociological] poll. Quite indicative of consensus that that person's opinion is trash.

But yes, what does that person think? That the world hates them? I did say "git gud or get out." It's up to that person to keep believing in trash pseudoscience, or like Evilore told someone the other day, pick up a book (or Wikipedia) and read!!!

 

[mckmas8808]

Should that matter when baby is... outside of the womb?
There is a legal way for a mother to opt out of motherhood, but there is no way for the father.


Fair enough. Interesting fact: it is actually Asian women, not white men, who are top paid group in the USA.

Interesting way to describe that. I've seen people talk about wanting laws for guys to sign some docs and paying some fees upfront to "opt out" of fatherhood for life with no way of getting it legally back. What you think?

 

[Dunki]

If 1,000 (plus plus plus) people comment or like a drag, that's significantly than the sample size of your standardard scientific [sociological] poll. Quite indicative of consensus that that person's opinion is trash.

But yes, what does that person think? That the world hates them? I did say "git gud or get out." It's up to that person to keep believing in trash pseudoscience, or like Evilore told someone the other day, pick up a book (or Wikipedia) and read!!!

Anita Sarkkessian or Zoe Quinn would call this Harassment. So what is it to you? Treat everyone the same or deicide on which side of history they are staying?

Also mckmas8808 waiting for some respsonse or are you just ignoring me now . since I post facts?

 

[llien]

If 1,000 (plus plus plus) people comment or like a drag, that's significantly than the sample size of your standardard scientific [sociological] poll. Quite indicative of consensus that that person's opinion is trash.

Haha, hell yes, but implication hell no, you can't be serious. Look at any doxxing story.
A group of people with the same interests in no way represents generic population.

 

[llien]

Interesting way to describe that. I've seen people talk about wanting laws for guys to sign some docs and paying some fees upfront to "opt out" of fatherhood for life with no way of getting it legally back. What you think?

I think it's not right the way it is now, especially in bizarre cases such as adult women raping a boy (still a father, must pay child support) or "got pregnant after oral sex" (a real story).

I mean, if one can be "not ready to become a mother" or "not ready to BE a mother", one should also be able to be not ready to be/become a father.

 

[BANGS]

1. The baby is "IN" the woman's womb. Men don't have wombs.
2. Our society and how we treat the relationship of men and women in relation to a child is how we got to the court system when it comes to custody. When men leave women with the baby so many times, yes court systems will opt to give the child to the gender that's usually there to care for the child more. In this area, women do have the upper hand. I didn't say the score between men and women was 140 - 0. It's clear we have more privileges though. Men built the system.

You're responding as if I said female privileges were unfair. I never did, I'm just stating that they exist. It's not clear men have more privileges though. You've yet to provide any example of a privilege a man has, other than the ability to pee standing up. I dunno about you, but I didn't build the system, it certainly doesn't cater to me...

 

[Future]

You're responding as if I said female privileges were unfair. I never did, I'm just stating that they exist. It's not clear men have more privileges though. You've yet to provide any example of a privilege a man has, other than the ability to pee standing up. I dunno about you, but I didn't build the system, it certainly doesn't cater to me...

You really believe men have no advantages in the world today. None at all? In fact, that we are disadvantaged somehow compared to women?

 

[llien]

You really believe men have no advantages in the world today.

He might be playing devil's advocate, or serious, why does it matter?

 

[BANGS]

You really believe men have no advantages in the world today. None at all? In fact, that we are disadvantaged somehow compared to women?

I wouldn't call the extra priveledges women have a huge disadvantage to men, but then again I've never been involved in a serious domestic dispute. My wife is awesome...

But No, I don't see any advantage I have because of a man that my wife does not have. Other than biological of course. But please enlighten me... I'm all ears...

 

[Dunki]

You really believe men have no advantages in the world today. None at all? In fact, that we are disadvantaged somehow compared to women?

No everyone has advantages and disadvantages in Life but that was not the statement. The statement was that men are much more privileged than women and this is just insane thinking IMO.

 

[Future]

I wouldn't call the extra priveledges women have a huge disadvantage to men, but then again I've never been involved in a serious domestic dispute. My wife is awesome...

But No, I don't see any advantage I have because of a man that my wife does not have. Other than biological of course. But please enlighten me... I'm all ears...

Just wanted to clarify this. Already you have some people posting in response for you as if this wasn't exactly what you were saying or that you might be playing devils advocate. But you truly do believe this. Cool

It's just a rare thing to see. Not really worth debating. One google search would provide any information you would need. I will say that considering that 100 years ago women couldn't even vote, and that since then there has been a consistent push for achieving equality and fixing the pay gap, I am always curious when people think that we are done.

Meaning, that clearly laws were made in the past to fix clear legal privileges men had. Do you believe that once laws like that were passed, that men were no longer privileged in any way?

 

[BANGS]

Do you believe that once laws like that were passed, that men were no longer privileged in any way?

Exactly. Once a law is passed that means you no longer have privileges that others don't, then you no longer have privileges that others don't. I don't benefit from the fact that all of the other men make more money then all of the other women on average, I'm still going to get paid what I get paid regardless of my gender because it's illegal to pay me otherwise.

Again, don't dodge the question. I've already answered two of yours. Please answer this:

I don't see any advantage I have because of a man that my wife does not have. Other than biological of course. But please enlighten me... I'm all ears...

 

[llien]

It's just a rare thing to see.

It's hard to disagree.
This is one of the cornerstones of a number of very influential movements, which, unfortunately, tend to win debates by silencing opponents.
It is extremely rare you see that being debated.

One google search would...

Nah.

I will say that considering that 100 years ago women couldn't even vote

If I say, that 200 years (in many countries 100 years and less) ago neither could men, would it surprise you?
Regardless, even several decades of "he could, she couldn't" is still disadvantage, but you should be able to explain the impact it has on "here and now".

 

[BANGS]

Regardless, even several decades of "he could, she couldn't" is still disadvantage, but you should be able to explain the impact it has on "here and now".

There is no question that injustice in the past has an impact on modern people today. But that's not a "privilege". We all have the same rights, abide by the same laws, therefor have the same privilege in regards to our race/sex. I wasn't born cash in hand because a bunch of other white people were, that's not how reality works...

 

[Dunki]

Just wanted to clarify this. Already you have some people posting in response for you as if this wasn't exactly what you were saying or that you might be playing devils advocate. But you truly do believe this. Cool

It's just a rare thing to see. Not really worth debating. One google search would provide any information you would need. I will say that considering that 100 years ago women couldn't even vote, and that since then there has been a consistent push for achieving equality and fixing the pay gap, I am always curious when people think that we are done.

Meaning, that clearly laws were made in the past to fix clear legal privileges men had. Do you believe that once laws like that were passed, that men were no longer privileged in any way?

we are in some aspects already past equality. Example women outclass men in almost everything now. Women in their twenties earn already more in average than men. Women in their twenties already are more often in powerful positions than men. And this is just one sector if we go to custody right it would be another one. As I said there are many sections we already need to counter steer especially in terms of education

 

[llien]

There is no question that injustice in the past has an impact on modern people today.

To me, nothing is clear about actual impact something from far in the past has, especially something that disadvantage one of the genders
E.g in Imperial Russia there was a period women couldn't go to Universities, tell me what impact does it have on today's education system?

 

[Future]

Exactly. Once a law is passed that means you no longer have privileges that others don't, then you no longer have privileges that others don't. I don't benefit from the fact that all of the other men make more money then all of the other women on average, I'm still going to get paid what I get paid regardless of my gender because it's illegal to pay me otherwise.

Again, don't dodge the question. I've already answered two of yours. Please anser this:

Nah, I got the information I wanted. Once laws are passed to prevent legal inequality, then you perceive that as having zero advantages moving forward. It's an interesting perspective, and explains a lot

If I say, that 200 years (in many countries 100 years and less) ago neither could men, would it surprise you?

Not sure of the relevance of this. My comment about women being unable to vote was simply that previously society viewed women in such a way, that they were incapable of doing the things men could. Laws were passed to correct that, but obviously that doesn't mean that society's views on women changed instantly. The question always is how long does it take for society to catch up and actually remove the inherent privileges that were built into US society. According the Bang, apparently no time at all. The law itself ensures equality

 

[llien]

My comment about women being unable to vote was simply that previously society viewed women in such a way, that they were incapable of doing the things men could.

Why didn't men have voting rights 150 years ago, then? In what way where they viewed?

 

[Future]

Why didn't men have voting rights 150 years ago, then? In what way where they viewed?

Id need more information on your point. Viewing the history of voting rights in the US:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voting_rights_in_the_United_States

What historic milestone are you referring to for rights to vote? Near 150 years ago non white men were given the right to vote yes, which is a similar point... it took a while for society to grow to accept the growing equality between whites and non whites.

 

[BANGS]

As I said there are many sections we already need to counter steer especially in terms of education

We don't need to counter steer. If women are doing better, it's for a reason. Just like if men are doing better, it's for a reason. All we can do is give both the same opportunities and see what they do with it. We don't have to balance things out, that's not natural...

To me, nothing is clear about actual impact something from far in the past has, especially something that disadvantage one of the genders
E.g in Imperial Russia there was a period women couldn't go to Universities, tell me what impact does it have on today's education system?

I mean for entire races. Wealth is inherited, and if your race had no wealth it's harder to get it. But that doesn't change the fact that today, two people of two different races have the exact same opportunities so long as they come from the same wealth class...

 

[Future]

I mean for entire races. Wealth is inherited, and if your race had no wealth it's harder to get it. But that doesn't change the fact that today, two people of two different races have the exact same opportunities so long as they come from the same wealth class...

It's more of a question if you believe in the concept of institutional discrimination or sexism. The idea that there are lasting effects felt in society that transcend the laws. If you look at the laws alone, everyone is equal. The question is what lasting effects are there for living so close to a time where things were actually legally unequal.

Affirmative action is the same. With this lense, it would be perceived that this actually makes things inequal if you don't believe in the institutional discrimination it is meant to counter.

To me, logically you cannot expect society: employers, politicians, people in power to immediately bend over once laws are passed to force equality. It makes sense that people would try to maintain the inequality if it benefits them. This is the "privilege" that people describe: simply not having to be on the receiving end of the negative effects of this. It's indisputable IMO that these privileges existed directly after laws were passed

Now of course there is a question on when does it stop? When can we truly say that we have weeded our sexism or discrimination? Unfortunately all you can point to is statistics, and see if there actually is equality represented.