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Cincinnati braces for footage release in campus cop killing (Up: Murder charge)

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W

wildfire

Banned
Dubose’s family has hired attorney Mark O’Mara, who defended George Zimmerman in the shooting death of Trayvon Martin.

“The family wants two things,” O’Mara said. “First, they want dignity for themselves and for Sam and his death, and they want transparency. They want to know what happened to what happened to him — first the ‘what’ and then the ‘why.'”
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Ha. This family wants a slam dunk and the lawyer wants positive PR. Easiest lawsuit of their lives.

Terrible circumstances that made this pairing possible.
 
B

blankempathy

Member
Liu Kang Baking A Pie said:
What objective conclusion are you going to come to when you discuss a bottle or ID in a situation where someone was murdered for no reason in a second?

It's not "ridiculous" to call out unnecessary, unrelated arguments. It's being focused on what matters. There's no reason we collectively have to entertain derails and unimportant information.
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What conclusion? Don't forget my id? Don't have open bottles of alcohol in my car? Basically don't give a reason for a police officer to escalate a situation? What matters is that a man was senselessly killed. For what? Nothing. How is what happened before he was killed unrelated? Unless you're in court trying to argue facts or on the jury then no, everything that happened is related to his death. We aren't trying to come to a conclusion of justice here though. Thats not our job. We know he was wrong but we can't punish him. You can rally against change and put pressure on public officials to do something but most likely you won't be the ones that directly impose judgement on him. So im curious what conclusion are you looking for exactly? The video is clear as day. He executed him at point blank without an immediate danger to his life. The conclusion I'm looking for here is how to protect myself. Right and wrong doesn't matter when you're dead. Police officers aren't just going to go away. Even with crack downs on police there will always be ones that slip through the cracks. I'd rather keep myself safe then rely on someone possibly being a good cop.
 
B

block tower

Member
just seeing this and following the story. these people are disease to the community the claim to serve and protect . it's funny too when people say "only a few bad apples" as if showing restraint not to kill, lie and agitate is somehow showing restraint lol. it saddens me Obama really hasn't been vocal and direct on this issue, this could've been him prior to office. these police officers see black men as lower than them so they don't feel obligated to treat us with much dignity or care, whether or not the officer is a racist his actions show he didn't hold this mans life in much regard when his reaction is too shoot him in the head , that should tell you all you need to know about what this officer was thinking on a subconscious level.
 
Chiggs

Chiggs

Gold Member
That cop is going to pay. Driver was being an idiot, but was not hostile. Glad to see they threw the book at him.
 
W

wildfire

Banned
Ke0 said:
20140909-devilsadvocate.png
Click to expand...

Sheesh I wonder how many people see it only this way? Devil advocacy is also a technique used to help you understand motivations you have difficulty grasping. It isn't only this comedic punchline.
 
G

Gotdatmoney

Member
blankempathy said:
What conclusion? Don't forget my id? Don't have open bottles of alcohol in my car? Basically don't give a reason for a police officer to escalate a situation? What matters is that a man was senselessly killed. For what? Nothing. How is what happened before he was killed unrelated? Unless you're in court trying to argue facts or on the jury then no, everything that happened is related to his death. We aren't trying to come to a conclusion of justice here though. Thats not our job. We know he was wrong but we can't punish him. You can rally against change and put pressure on public officials to do something but most likely you won't be the ones that directly impose judgement on him. So im curious what conclusion are you looking for exactly? The video is clear as day. He executed him at point blank without an immediate danger to his life. The conclusion I'm looking for here is how to protect myself. Right and wrong doesn't matter when you're dead. Police officers aren't just going to go away. Even with crack downs on police there will always be ones that slip through the cracks. I'd rather keep myself safe then rely on someone possibly being a good cop.
Click to expand...

If you are worried about how to keep yourself safe I am pretty sure we all know you should not drive with a suspended ID. You also should not have open liquor in your vehicle. Did you you really need this thread to tell you that?
 
T

Tallshortman

Member
akira28 said:
I may eventually explain it. If only to make you ashamed of your words and aspersions. Or I may not. Care to take another crack at it?

come on. impress me. with your breadth.
Click to expand...

Ah so you don't seem to know what else. lol aspersions, take your persecution complex out of it if you don't mind.

Please, do go on and make me ashamed.
 
K

Ke0

Member
wildfire said:
Sheesh I wonder how many people see it only this way? Devil advocacy is also a technique used to help you understand motivations you have difficulty grasping. It isn't only this comedic punchline.
Click to expand...

Too bad no one uses it correctly for people to see it any other way.
 
Lamel

Lamel

Banned
Seriously, I've had discussions with people who say he wasn't innocent because he doesn't have any license/was possibly drinking. What the fuck.
 
B

block tower

Member
Lamel said:
Seriously, I've had discussions with people who say he wasn't innocent because he doesn't have any license/was possibly drinking. What the fuck.
Click to expand...

not everyone can be lucky to get a defense force like the "mentally ill" mass shooters. this guys crime was dwb and for many that's enough for him to be guilty even if they won't outright say it. more people were mad at trayvon martin than adam lanza when it came to being vocal about guilt
 
B

blankempathy

Member
Gotdatmoney said:
If you are worried about how to keep yourself safe I am pretty sure we all know you should not drive with a suspended ID. You also should not have open liquor in your vehicle. Did you you really need this thread to tell you that?
Click to expand...
I was just putting some food for thought out there is all.
 
A

akira28

Member
Tallshortman said:
Ah so you don't seem to know what else. lol aspersions, take your persecution complex out of it if you don't mind.

Please, do go on and make me ashamed.
Click to expand...

fakelol. I'm disappointed, but not exactly surprised. You couldn't be bothered to think about it, to see if there was actual meaning in the statement. ah well. do you deserve the pearl? I'm not so sure. What will you give me? I'm not sure your shame will be enough this time.

Persecution complex? reallol.

I'm willing to give you a 3rd go. secrets found 0/1. proper motivation? now go.
 
A

A Human Becoming

More than a Member
Betty said:
Slowing it down to 0.25 really shows who's fault it is.

The cop attempts to open the guys car door without warning, only saying "go ahead and take your seatbelt off for me" then lunges into the car to get either the steering wheel, ingnition or something else, but ends up grabbing the guy's seat belt.

The guy in the car reels back, covers his head and is shot, causing his body to spasm and hit the acceleration.

The altercation took place before the car started moving.

Cop done fucked up.
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Good observation. I did not know what the fuck happened on my first viewing. Really sad story.
 
G

Glass Shark

Banned
I am dumbfounded

When I heard about this before I watched the video, I assumed the guy must have provoked the cop in some way

I cannot understand how this keeps happening
 
M

minx

Member
CaptainAhab said:
The library was taking a beating on unreturned books until they changed the punishment to field execution.
Click to expand...

CaptainAhab said:
Remember when 9/11 happened and we had to pretend these guys are heroes?
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Well another shit poster arrives. Shit on fallen officers and too dense to realize why police are needed at campuses.

Enron said:
at BEST (for the defense) i think they might have a case for "finger was on the trigger while struggling, accidentally pulled" but I don't think it will matter because why was your gun drawn in the first place at that point, and why the hell was your finger anywhere inside of the trigger guard.
Click to expand...

This officer fucked up bad. In the first couple minutes after the shooting he keeps saying how he was dragged and his arm/hand got caught. He was trying to convince himself he didn't actually just straight up murder the guy. He knows he fucked up. He should have never ever had his gun out for something like this but I'm guessing Sympathetic Reaction would be his best defense.

Also to my knowledge campus police go to the same Academy as all other officers. I doubt their training is the same after the academy though.

Edit: He shouldn't be reaching into a vehicle like that in the first place. Would be interesting to know if that department carries tasers. Even if they don't it's still not a situation in which you take your gun out.
 
T

Tallshortman

Member
akira28 said:
fakelol. I'm disappointed, but not exactly surprised. You couldn't be bothered to think about it, to see if there was actual meaning in the statement. ah well. do you deserve the pearl? I'm not so sure. What will you give me? I'm not sure your shame will be enough this time.

Persecution complex? reallol.

I'm willing to give you a 3rd go. secrets found 0/1. proper motivation? now go.
Click to expand...

haha If you can't explain your own statement without admitting it was a bad hyperbole in an attempt to relay the second part of your post to the original quotee's post just take the L.

Please, show me your shame.
 
TheContact

TheContact

Member
jrh2 said:
I am dumbfounded

When I heard about this before I watched the video, I assumed the guy must have provoked the cop in some way

I cannot understand how this keeps happening
Click to expand...

It keeps happening because police firearm and conduct training is a complete joke. They need to use tazers and pepper spray first and resort to guns as a last ditch effort in the event they are actually needing self defense. Cops are support to serve and protect the citizens and they should understand the risks they take by becoming a police officer. They should put the citizens' lives above their own but a lot of them are poorly trained for a lot of situations. This cop had a freak out and shot this guy in the head because he kept his door closed. I'd say it's unbelievable but it isn't.
 
M

Mass Effect

Member
akira28 said:
yeah! bad police training!

we obviously need more funding for better police training, and more money to hire better police. Unfortunately, so many of our tax dollars go to entitlements, while people out there are dying.
Click to expand...

I... this is so accurate it hurts...

I hate this country.
 
D

Downhome

Member
I hope this is acceptable, but I'd like to share a story from here in my small hometown. There are a few similarities between the two cases. This just happened this past Sunday night...

http://m.wyff4.com/news/coroner-tee...FF News 4&utm_medium=FBPAGE&utm_source=Social

SENECA, S.C. -
A 19-year-old who was shot by a Seneca police officer was hit twice, and one of those shots killed him, according to the coroner.

Oconee County Coroner Karl Addis said an autopsy confirmed that Zachary Hammond was wounded once in the chest and a second shot hit him in the collarbone. He said the chest wound is what killed Hammond.

The results of toxicology tests are not yet available, Addis said.

Coroner Teen shot while driving car toward officer

Addis said the State Law Enforcement Division is investigating the shooting.

Hammond was shot at about 8:20 p.m. Sunday at the Hardee's on Bypass 123 in Seneca.

Addis said the initial investigation showed Hammond was attempting to evade a police stop in the parking lot of Hardee's. A Seneca police officer said he felt threatened by Hammond, who was driving his car toward him, Addis said.

On Wednesday, Hammond family attorneys Eric Bland and Ronnie Richter met with the coroner. Both attorneys said that meeting brought up new concerns about the shooting.

"Our concern is that we have an independent investigative agency look into this shooting that is very, very troubling. This is a 19 year old kid without a weapon in his car clearly in the Hardee's parking lot on a date, and within five minutes he has two shots that appear to be in his back and his side, from an officer shooting him from the back and he's dead and this family needs answers," said Bland.

"We don't know all the facts, but we know that Zach Hammond did nothing to deserve to die in a Hardee's parking lot that night, and from the evidence that we reviewed it's clear that the shot that killed Zach Hammond came from behind not from in front," said Richter. "The evidence seems to suggest that the officer was parallel to the driver's side window at the time the shots were fired, so if the suggestion is the vehicle was traveling toward the officer, I don't know that the photographs bear that out. That's for a judge and jury and another day."

Seneca Police Chief John Covington told WYFF News 4 that Hammond's car came at the officer at an angle, which is why he said the officer shot through the driver's window.

The coroner said he is unable to release anymore information at this time because of the ongoing investigation.

Covington said a passenger in the car, Tori Dianna Morton, 23, was charged with simple possession of marijuana.
Click to expand...
 
T

Tallshortman

Member
Downhome said:
I hope this is acceptable, but I'd like to share a story from here in my small hometown. There are a few similarities between the two cases. This just happened this past Sunday night...

http://m.wyff4.com/news/coroner-tee...FF News 4&utm_medium=FBPAGE&utm_source=Social
Click to expand...

It seems from some of these stories that have gone national, in a lot of instances small towns or small cities handle these cases much better than the big cities where maybe the culture of the blue wall of silence is more entrenched.

Also, that case sounds completely fucked up. I'm not sure how the cop can say he shot because he was being driven at and yet the kid is shot in the back, even at an angle the only way it could happen is if he the front of the car had already passed the officer.
 
A

akira28

Member
Tallshortman said:
haha If you can't explain your own statement without admitting it was a bad hyperbole in an attempt to relay the second part of your post to the original quotee's post just take the L.

Please, show me your shame.
Click to expand...

drawing silly conclusions when all you have is a pile of fortified ignorance? remaining true to form, though I'm not sure piggy deserves to know... How about this? You give it another try in good faith and I'll probably, maybe, actually explain it from the top.

even though it could very well be a further waste of my time :)

or not. the idea that you'll stick to the same bad conclusion bothers me a lot less in the face of how wrong you are. If you're looking to outdick me, I'm content to let you be a dick.

so what will it be, dickery or profundity?
 
W

wiggleb0t

Banned
Mathunilx said:
Seriously, this polarization has to stop. It's now so bad that black people now get shot when they drive without a license. It's crazy.
Click to expand...

Exactly. He shot at him when he found out he had no license???No! He shot once the suspect tried to drive off while his arm was in the car. Did you watch a different video or is hyperbole the only way to roll on gaf when it comes to police shooting people?

Extreme reaction.
I'm not American and even I've seen the show Cops enough to know that it's moronic to try and flee police.

Guessing the defence will elaborate on:
Guy caught committing a crime, attempts to evade police. A Split second reaction by the officer trying to prevent a life threatening situation of being dragged by the drivers car results in the officer discharing his weapon.
Had he not fired he could have been dragged to his death & a pursuit of the suspect endangers everyone both on and off the road.

Not sure how victim blaming goes only one way when the cop was a victim of circumstances brought about by the suspect committing a crime & attempting to flee the scene with his arm inside the vehicle.
 
B

Betty

Banned
NEOPARADIGM said:
Just curious, why are you skipping the part where the driver pulls the door back shut? Is it irrelevant?
Click to expand...

Yes it is, because it's not what makes the cop lunge in, the cop doesn't even seem irritated by it, the guy starting his engine was what set off the cop, and the driver hadn't moved or acted violently in any way.
 
T

Tallshortman

Member
akira28 said:
drawing silly conclusions when all you have is a pile of fortified ignorance? remaining true to form, though I'm not sure piggy deserves to know... How about this? You give it another try in good faith and I'll probably, maybe, actually explain it from the top.

even though it could very well be a further waste of my time :)

or not. the idea that you'll stick to the same bad conclusion bothers me a lot less in the face of how wrong you are. If you're looking to outdick me, I'm content to let you be a dick.

so what will it be, dickery or profundity?
Click to expand...

Well it does seem your shame has been shown as you promised. Please do actually take your time to come up with your next kernel of wisdom.

I await the dickery, or was it profundity? Profound dickery perhaps? Ah yes that sounds about right.
 
D

DOG3NZAKA

Banned
Attitude or not, compliant or not, license or no license there is absolutely NO reason for the cop to even put his hand on his weapon in this situation. Now someone is dead. Even if the guy was mouthy and/ or drunk, there is no reason for the cop to escalate the situation further by even thinking about using his weapon. It's his job to be in control,be objective and be composed. What a total fuck up.
 
A

akira28

Member
Tallshortman said:
Well it does seem your shame has been shown as you promised. Please do actually take your time to come up with your next kernel of wisdom.

I await the dickery, or was it profundity? Profound dickery perhaps? Ah yes that sounds about right.
Click to expand...

well actually after reading your history I'm pretty convinced you're not capable of understanding. I'm willing to explain to someone else though.

perfectly happy to
 
B

Bubble Metropolis

Member
FadedRevolution said:
Are you fucking serious right now? A dude gets murdered and the fact that he closed the door makes his murder justified?
Click to expand...

No, bro, he's just sayin'.

Anything you infer from his just sayin' is on you, and also totally missing the point btw. The point not being that this guy's actions are responsible for his own murder. No, they won't tell you what that point is, but it's definitely not to blame the victim's actions. They're just sayin' what happened, man.
 
T

Tallshortman

Member
akira28 said:
well actually after reading your history I'm pretty convinced you're not capable of understanding. I'm willing to explain to someone else though.

perfectly happy to
Click to expand...

lol I gave you every opportunity to explain your post however you feel like deciding you meant.

Please, I was hoping poor attempts at ad hominem were above you, I guess I was wrong.
 
Y

Yukiari

Member
I honestly think that the police forget that the cameras are there or maybe they think it won't be looked at. Take this Las Vegas cop who injured and possibly caused the death of a women in the back of her squad car after assaulting her several times.

The camera captured the Los Angeles police officer hissing a cruel threat at the handcuffed woman, striking at her throat with an open hand and kicking her in the crotch.

The video of the arrest, recorded by a patrol-car camera, persuaded jurors to convict Officer Mary O’Callaghan on Friday of assault under color of authority.

During the two-week trial, in which the defense argued that O’Callaghan hadn’t used excessive force, the video gave jurors an unvarnished view of what happened, one said.

“It played a big role,” said Deedra Garcia, the jury forewoman. “It gave us a lot of evidence.”

LAPD Officer Found Guilty of Assault in Arrest of Woman Who Died in Custody

A Los Angeles Police Department officer who was seen on video kicking and punching a handcuffed woman who lost consciousness and died was found guilty Friday of assaulting the woman during her arrest.

In a crowded courtroom Friday, O’Callaghan, 50, rested her head in her hands and her attorney rubbed small circles on her back. A relative of Alesia Thomas, the 35-year-old mother assaulted by O’Callaghan who lost consciousness in the back seat of the patrol car and died soon later, tapped her left foot over and over. The jurors — 11 women and one man — walked to their seats.

When a clerk read the guilty verdict, O’Callaghan whispered to her attorney and gave him a hug. Her face reddened and her eyes filled with tears. She noticed a bailiff standing behind her and swooped her hands behind her back, holding them in two fists — a position she had, for years, commanded arrestees to assume. The courtroom fell silent and the handcuffs clicked four times as they closed around her wrists.

Reached by phone after the verdict, Phillip Washington — the father of Thomas’ youngest daughter — said the 2012 death devastated the family, especially his daughter, who was 3 when her mother died. He couldn’t attend the court proceeding Friday because his daughter felt sick, but he praised the verdict.

“I’m hoping the outcome of this is that the system will change,” he said.

A statement released by Benjamin Crump, a civil rights attorney representing the family, called the conviction one step toward justice for Thomas’ children.

“Our family prays,” the statement reads, “that the unedited video will be released soon.”

The prosecution's case centered on the video, which showed O'Callaghan jab at Thomas’ throat with an open hand and threaten to break her arms and kick her in the crotch. In the video, O’Callaghan then raises her boot and strikes Thomas, whose body shakes in response.

The recording captured Thomas — who asked officers for an ambulance more than 30 minutes before one was called — breathing heavily and repeatedly saying, “I can’t.”

A video from a dashboard camera in another patrol car, which was also played during the trial, recorded O’Callaghan laughing and smoking a cigarette as she peeked inside the car at Thomas, whose legs were tied with a nylon hobble restraint.

“That ain’t a good sign,” O’Callaghan says out loud in the video.

Assistant Head Deputy Dist. Atty. Shannon Presby told jurors that O’Callaghan was “immune from any empathy” and that the video clearly showed the officer kicking Thomas in the crotch and the stomach.

But O'Callaghan's attorney, Robert Rico, disagreed, telling jurors that the recording instead showed his client pushing Thomas with her boot.

Rico told jurors that although the footage showed an “ugly” scene, his client’s use of force was “reasonable, justified and necessary.” Thomas wasn’t complying with the officers' orders, he said.

The attorney played an audio clip, which he said showed O’Callaghan didn’t want to hurt Thomas, for the jurors.

“If you want to kill me, just kill me,” Thomas says in the recording.

“I don't want to kill you,” O'Callaghan responds. “I just want to transport you.”

“Why?” Thomas asks.

“To get you some help,” the officer says in the recording.

After the verdict, Rico said he planned to file a motion for a new trial, saying he believed jurors had based their decision on emotions — and his client’s profanity captured on camera — not on evidence. Rico described O’Callaghan as far from callous, saying she often bought Halloween costumes and Christmas presents for children in local housing projects.

“Mary O’Callaghan is today — and was — the type of officer that goes above and beyond, not only for her fellow officers but also for the community,” Rico said.

Thomas was pronounced dead at a hospital after her July 22, 2012, arrest, which came after officers arrived at her home to investigate claims that she had abandoned her two children by dropping them off at a police station.

Washington, the father of Thomas’ daughter, said he thought Thomas acted responsibly, adding that she had dropped the children off at the station with clothes and a note. His daughter, he said, still doesn’t know how Thomas died.

“She was too young then to understand,” he said. “I’m waiting for her to have questions of her own.”

O'Callaghan, who did not testify in the trial, was not charged in connection with Thomas’ death.

An autopsy by the Los Angeles County coroner determined that cocaine intoxication was probably a “major factor” in Thomas’ death. It wasn't possible to determine what role, if any, the struggle with O’Callaghan or other officers who took part in the arrest played in it. The official cause of death was listed as “undetermined.”

O’Callaghan is one of three Los Angeles Police Department officers charged with assault under the color of authority for on-duty incidents captured on camera. In April, Officer Richard Garcia, 34, was charged with using unlawful force during an arrest in South L.A. Officer Jonathan Lai, 31, was charged last year with using excessive force while detaining a man near Staples Center in 2012.

Police Chief Charlie Beck said in a statement Friday that patrol car cameras, when used appropriately, “can help ensure that officers who operate outside of the law, and tarnish our badge, are held accountable.”
Click to expand...
 
A

akira28

Member
Tallshortman said:
lol I gave you every opportunity to explain your post however you feel like deciding you meant.

Please, I was hoping poor attempts at ad hominem were above you, I guess I was wrong.
Click to expand...

ad hominem? I just said I read your history, bro. I didn't attack your character, lololol. Although I do see the similarities.
 
O

Opto

Banned
Yukiari said:
I honestly think that the police forget that the cameras are there or maybe they think it won't be looked at. Take this Las Vegas cop who injured and possibly caused the death of a women in the back of her squad car after assaulting her several times.
Click to expand...

In the body cam footage, Tensing acknowledged his camera was on and working, and that it would not write over any footage if it kept recording. Ass probably thought it would exonerate him.
 
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