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Darksiders II |OT| What starts with War, ends with Death.

Creamium

shut uuuuuuuuuuuuuuup
Tried some of the optional bosses last night (lvl 13, apocalyptic), and only managed to beat Gorewood, a pushover. The other two,
lava dragon and some giant skeleton knight
, were way too strong still. Probably better to go for the main quest a bit longer...

When fighting equal level enemies though, Apol. is very doable to sometimes easy. I'd recommend everyone who's yet to start, to play on this difficulty. Normal must be a cakewalk.
 

Dahbomb

Member
Alright so I beat the game yesterday but I wanted to take a day to think on it and assess my experience. Be WARNED that the following wall of text will contain spoilers so DO NOT READ unless you have completed the game. I will not be spoiler tagging it, it will just look like a giant CIA document.

My general impression is overall I really enjoyed the game, enough to go back to 100% it on New Game+ and especially complete Crucible which is probably my favorite part of the game. I think it straddles somewhere around good to great game, the game's quality varies not only from platform to platform, world to world but also from user to user because there are of course random elements to the game (bug or RPG loot system). While there are a lot of stuff that DS2 does better than DS1, it doesn't invalidate DS1 as there are things that DS1 does better. It's a great entry for the franchise but just like DS1, it's an entry where they can learn from to improve the next game even more. Because the game is so huge I am going to split up my more in-depth impressions based on the various facets of the game. In my impressions are a lot of feedback so I hope the Vigil developers are reading this (those parts are bolded):

Combat: I feel this is one of the strongest points of the game. The combat is surprisingly fluid and responsive, you are always fully in command of Death and the game doesn't hold you back. While there aren't a huge amount of combat options and mechanics available, those that are there are very solid and surprisingly balanced. To master the combat you have to master every facet of the combat which I like. It reminds me of original DMC1 where pretty much every move and mechanic was very important to master but there weren't a lot of them. There is also a greater emphasis on resource management (Wrath) and the game is more grounded and aggressive so you have to constantly be dodging. Timing dodge rewards you with an Evade Counter which is very useful as it stuns some opponents even sub bosses enough for you to follow up. I love the various Just Frame inclusions in the game and they add another layer to the combat and depth. Since you are dodging so much, the little time you have to actually attack you want the attacks to do as much damage in as little time as possible and you can do that if you master the Just Frames. I want to see more combat options and moves that allow for more Just Frame follow ups in future DS games.

There are some problems with the combat still. I feel the weapon "variety" held back the combat a lot. There were essentially only 3 weapons to really tinker around, the secondary weapons really only differed in their charge/special moves. I felt that there wasn't much need to split the weapons and that Vigil should've figured out a way to incorporate all the various special moves into just one class of secondaries. I want to play a gauntlet weapon where I can do Meteor like attacks, a projectile attack AND a counter. I also felt that it was a missed opportunity to not have a button (even on the D-pad) to swap between two different secondary weapons as even DS1 allowed it. These few tweaks to the weapon system could've added a lot of depth to the combat and I hope Vigil incorporates it into their next game.

The other problem with the combat is that the lock on is really bad especially in tight corners. You lose focus of yourself because the camera is so zoomed in and the game is much faster than the previous DS1 meaning the camera moves around a lot. Enemies are a lot more aggressive and you need all the screen to watch out for them. The next game needs to tinker around with the lock on system a lot, it just doesn't cut it and I found myself playing on soft lock on way more in enemy groups. Lock on is mostly fine against single bosses though even adding a single regular enemy into the fray messes you up greatly.

But still aside from these issues it was a great system and you really get to push it in something like the Crucible or the Soul Arbiters maze which is essentially a mini-Crucible. So many different enemy types to worry about and you are always on edge. I personally like that juggling enemies don't launch them too high up in the air, it makes you vulnerable and it makes doing air combos/juggles intense because you know at any time you can get swatted out of the air. This makes some clutch aerial moves like Meteor Strike, Flip Saw and aerial just frames very important to get you out of a bad situation. Many action games go into combo video mode as soon as you initiate the launcher because of the relative safety of doing air combos but not in DS2 and that differentiates it from other action games I feel.


RPG Elements: Another strong point of the game that IMO was done better than I thought it would be. I really loved the Possessed weapons system, I found myself hoarding weapons/items with good stats so that I could feed them into a Possessed weapon later on. I loved the Skill tree and I could feel that the game being on the console limited the selection of the skill tree because you can't have too many active skills otherwise it would overwhelm the controller (the controller already is packed up with so many inputs). The loot system works, you are constantly getting solid items whether it be from killing enemies, chest or from vendors. The best thing about the RPG system is that the game doesn't feel like a massive gear check like other games in the genre. What I mean is that just because a dungeon or enemy is 5-6 levels above you doesn't mean that you can't beat them just because you are undergeared/underleveled. With proper skill such hurdles can be passed and I appreciated this. Coming from Diablo 3 which is nothing more than a gear check in terms of skill, this was refreshing to experience.

My only real problem with the RPG system is the two stats Health Steal and Wrath steal. IMO these should've been Unique Legendary items only and even then should be restricted to lower level Unique Legendary items... they are WAY TOO OVERPOWERED! Just because they are rare doesn't mean that they should be in the game to begin with as you only really need one of them to drop in the game to exploit. They take away a great deal of skill from the game when you can just tag them on your PW and go ham against anything in the game. I feel this is an example of an RPG element overtaking the standard combat mechanics in an action game. I hope to see this greatly nerfed in upcoming DS games if they plan to even keep it which IMO they shouldn't for anything outside of Legendary Uniques.

A slight problem with the loot system is that I felt that the chests should've been balanced based around the difficult of acquiring them. In the game it feels like regular chests you just walk up and open have about the same chance of giving you good items as something where you have to do a lot of complex puzzle solving and tons of platforming to get to. I feel that more difficult chests should reward you with a base level of items at least at your level or higher even. This is just something to consider for future games. Overall I like that the chests and enemies generally scale to your level and I know that it isn't really a hard and fast rule especially to the enemies but it generally works well enough.

The Collectibles: Wow there are a TON of collectibles in the game. What I like about the collectibles as compared to other games is that while they are a great way to reward your exploration, the collectibles can be turned in for rewards some of them being fairly significant. I love the fact that stones can be collected and then combined in 3 different orders to yield different permanent stat bonuses, it adds yet another layer to the RPG system. I also liked the idea of the Soul Arbiter maze where you had to collect scrolls to essentially "unlock" levels for it, it sort of reminded me very old games where you collected cheat codes/passwords for levels. A lot of the collectibles are well hidden and I completed the game with only 1 Resistant stone!!!

I loved the Legendary weapons/items too and I felt it was greatly expanded from the original game. While some Legendary weapons/items were gimmicky as intended, some were rather useful and lasted me until the end of my first walkthrough. They are a great reward for exploring the content in the game. I hope to see more Legandaries with more unique functionality in future DS games.

The only thing I would change for the collectibles is that there should've been a Legendary item that showed locations of all the collectibles in the game just like DS1. I felt that was sorely missed in this game especially one that is so huge with so many collectibles. For someone collecting everything without a guide, it would take them dozens of hours to find everything.


The Side Quests: This one took me by surprise as well. I was not prepared for such a vast amount of effort and time put into fleshing out the side missions. At times I felt the side quests were better design and at the very least more challenging than a lot of the main quests. The Crucible and Soul Arbiter side quest/features being my favorite as they are almost exclusively combat related and I am a combat guy but I liked the other side dungeons like the Scar, the Shattered Forge and especially the elite side boss quest from Thane. I also liked that you were rewarded well from all these quests so I knew that my efforts were not in vain. I felt that some of the side quests were so good that they should've been incorporated into the main game instead (not the Maze though). I will for sure be going back and completing all the side quests in this game.


The Story: I knew going into the game that DS2 would be a parallel entry for the series in terms of story. I wasn't expected much but I still felt a bit disappointed in the story overall. What really held back the story IMO was the pacing of the entire main quest which I will get into the next section. I felt that the story should've moved forward some after the events of DS1. Whatever story that was in the game was well presented enough and my favorite thing about it was the whole "this is the tale thus far" intro before you started the game. I hope that stays, I loved that, it was a nice touch. The VA was solid all around and the writing was alright.... it's just there wasn't much for the characters to work with. I like Death as a character but I felt that the story did not do him justice as a lot of the time he was just trekking through worlds literally fetching items to progress to his main goal. I guess I shouldn't be too harsh as most games really boil down to this too but I expected a bit more from DS2 as I feel it is one of those series with a solid mythos and world to base a good story around. Overall I don't look forward to another DS game which takes place in the same time zone as the DS1 and DS2, I feel the fanbase wants to move forward with the story with the next DS game.


Pacing and Main Quests: Frankly speaking the pacing of the game was pretty much the worst part of the game. If you take the game in a vacuum and assess its individual strengths, this game looks godlike on paper. But then you run through the main quest and stuff that you thought was going to be godlike didn't really pan out that way. In a nutshell, the pacing in the first two worlds especially the first one was REALLY SLOW and the pacing in the last two "worlds" (I put this in quotation marks as they weren't really worlds as compared to the first two) was a bit too fast. It took you so long to acquire new gear like the Death Grip in the first world or to move the story forward or to encounter bosses. Plus the "move ball over hole" puzzles were done a bit too much. I felt that the 2nd world was the best paced out of all the worlds but it was held back by the inordinate amount of things you had to do in 3s. Normally this stuff doesn't bother me but really most of those quests should've been combined into one for a meaty singular goal to reach not split into 3. The pacing significantly held the story back as it took so long for the story to reach its stride and by the end it was roaring to finish already and run through the motions.

If anyone said that the last section of the game felt rushed they would be right in saying so. Not that it's bad, I actually really liked the content after the earth part. The earth part was easily the worst part in the game and possibly the worst part in the entire series, there is nothing that I can add to that, it shouldn't have been in the game. The Angel and Demon worlds should've been nearly as fleshed out as the first two yet what we ended up with was 2 starting world that went on for a bit too long and the last 2 worlds that were basically a fraction of ONE of the first two worlds. This was basically like Diablo 3 taken to the extreme and no one likes this. I can understand the last world being shorter than the rest to get the story moving and not have the ending drag out but this game took it to extreme.

I felt that DS1 was vastly superior in the pacing department and the story. Aside from the final major fetch quest, the game was solidly paced all around. The worlds were much smaller but all of them were generally of similar length and all felt very different from each other. The design of the main quests were also much better, while DS1 was essentially a bunch of fetch quests when taken as a whole (like collecting 4 hearts from Samael) it was done so in a smarter way where fetching one item basically meant beating an entire world/dungeons and its boss, which is acceptable. Having to fetch 3 horns, then fetch 3 dead council members and then have to fetch 3 souls for one of that dead council member... yeah not the best idea right there.


Puzzles and Platforming: I thought they were alright, not too great but not bad either. The puzzles generally felt toned down from the original. One thing that immediately struck as odd to me was the lack of sprint. Now I know that DS1 didn't have a sprint either but this game needed it a lot especially since it being generally faster than the original. Basically if you wanted to get around fast in the game without using the horse, you would dodge three times and cancel that into the Teleport Slash (no cost if you just hit air).... which is just dumb to look at and do.

Another thing that I felt lacking was the Crossblade. That was a great tool in DS1, not just for crazy puzzle solving but for the combat too. Yeah it involved a bug to really unlock its true potential but even without it I rather enjoyed charging it throwing it enemies to keep them in stun lock. It was sorely missed in DS2 especially where combat is much better. I also felt that DS1 had more puzzle tools for you to play with PER HOUR SPENT in the game. What I mean is that while DS1 was like a 12-15 hour game it had just as many puzzle tools to play around with like DS2 which was easily a 22+ hour game. This really falls back into my complaint about pacing, I felt that a lot of the areas where there wasn't nothing going on and you were doing similar type puzzles in succession could've used a new item to changed things up. Thankfully the items presented in DS2 were all really great, I really liked the Soul Splitter and the Void Walker plus the Death Grip is a great upgrade to the chain tool in DS1. I hope future puzzle tools are more like the Death Grip/Cross Blade which not only help you solve puzzles but greatly aid you in combat too.

Platforming was basically just POP 2008 plugged into the game and it generally worked well amongst all the puzzle solving. It was just a bit too automatic and I hope that in future games that you can wall run and cling on to just about any surface that isn't OBVIOUSLY marked with a texture. What I liked about the platforming is that it wasn't frustrating and it was basically just a cool way to get around and I can respect that. It didn't detract from the enjoyment and it essentially allowed you to navigate and enjoy the environments more. I also want more types of platforming abilities like double jump, the glide from DS1 back, a type of air dash and the ceiling crawl from POP 2008.


Enemies and Bosses: Not much to say here, enemy variety was alright but again going back to the issue of pacing the first world felt like there weren't that many types of enemies to throw at you so it felt mostly the same. Thankfully by the time the 2nd world came around you had a better idea of what was in store for the game. The bosses were alright, my favorite were the Guardian (just on a presentation scale, felt like a SOTC fight) and the Samael fight (for the bad ass scale). Most other bosses were more like sub bosses and some you had to fight 2-3 at once so that's cool. You don't really start enjoying the enemies/sub bosses until they difficulty level is ramped up and the game throws you crazy combination of enemies at once like in the Crucible. Stuff like a giant Beetle and the shield + lance enemy at once provides some interesting challenge as both are capable of blocking/parrying your attacks and if one parries you the other can easily attack.

The wasn't really much specific strategy to beating many of the bosses and enemies, most can be beaten easily by properly dodging and analyzing attack patterns. At least they all attacked fast and it kept you on edge which is refreshing to see because a lot of action games have pretty listless enemies who attack very infrequently especially in groups. In future DS games I want to see more abilities per enemy especially the sub bosses and I want to see enemies become smarter on higher difficulties, not just have high health/high damage.

Soundtrack: Probably the singular best thing about the game, the guy who did the soundtrack was channeling something fierce when he came up with it. Stellar all around, from the first minute to the last. There isn't much I can add here aside from saying it's a 10/10 in my book. I hope future DS games retain this level of quality.

Visual Art Design: Very solid all around and for the most part a step up from DS1. The artists at Vigil really have taken the world of DS and pushed it to its level maximum. Locales like the Tree of Life, various areas of Forge Lands, the Eternal Throne, the Gilded Arena, the City of Dead, the Spire and Black Stone all were wonderful to look at and behold. The game may not be a technical powerhouse but it holds strong with its art design. The only stain on the art was the earth part... nothing redeemable about that part of the game at all.

Bugs: Normally this isn't even a category of impressions for most games and it shouldn't be but I feel like this requires special attention for DS2. These are the known bugs in the game and should be corrected immediately. I don't mark down games for bugs because generally the experience varies among playerbase:

*3rd row of items cannot be sacrificed for Possessed weapons as they don't show up when you click upgrade.

*On the PC version, the hot key for the Reaper does not work properly. Its mapped to the V button but for me personally it has NEVER worked. I have tried remapping it but to no avail. I have to use the skill dial to select the Reaper and then use it.

*On console versions, the Legacy box isn't even available to purchase.

*On PC version the map key is swapped with the L3 and A buttons for the controller.

*Level 20 and level 95 of the Crucible don't give any loot.

*I already linked the video with the Black Demise + Wrath potion bug. Equipping Black Demise prevents you from using Wrath potions.

*Constructs don't reset properly in various dungeons, generally impeding your progress.

*When I first got into the 2nd world, all enemy hit box and AI was pretty much disabled. I came into a dungeon where I had to kill all the enemies to open the door... well they never showed up so I had to restart my game to fix it.

*Due to the way the camera/lock on works when you are cornered, it tends to make Death invisible for a short period of time so that you can actually look at the enemy. There is a way to bug the game to make Death invisible. Similarly there is another bug to make Death in permanent Reaper form.

*Some bugs in the Soul Arbiter maze, one of which is that experience does not seem to add up properly before the 10th level.

*Various other reports of game crashing/progress preventing bugs.

*Item duplication bug through tome exploit.

*Weapon swapping in the menu resets jump action allowing infinite jumps.

Probably a lot more. Game feels like it came a month or 2 earlier than it should be, a lot of these bugs you don't even need to actively go searching for them to find out. There are a lot more bugs that I experienced in my play through that are minor but distracting (like Death floating in the air for a few seconds when he rubs against an invisible hit box).
 
I got through the Soul Arbiters Maze yesterday. I went for getting all the secret rooms on each level before moving to the next level. Holy shit that took forever. It gets kind of challenging, not as bad as the crucible, way more easy with my lvl 30 Death.

Now im just going to finish up the damn stone collection side quest, then wait for DLC. I hope they release more armor variations too.
 

Oliuarius

Neo Member
I'm playing on a fat xbox elite, through VGA cables hooked up to a PC monitor, with the game installed. I have almost no tearing and the framerate is solid the vast majority of the time.

Alélouia, everyone has now realized that there was no problem in VGA mode ?!

This would explain the differences in the feeling (on XBOX 360).
 

ShdwDrake

Banned
Apparently in the foundry karn is supposed to throw me so I can get to the second heartstone and I've did everything else like crush the golem for the ball etc. I hate this game right now if I have to restart imma be pissed bc I don't have alot of time to play games but I loved the first DS and I really wanna get through this one. :/
 

Gbraga

Member
OMG THE SOUL SPLITTER COMBO!

O

M

G!

image.php
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
Apparently in the foundry karn is supposed to throw me so I can get to the second heartstone and I've did everything else like crush the golem for the ball etc. I hate this game right now if I have to restart imma be pissed bc I don't have alot of time to play games but I loved the first DS and I really wanna get through this one. :/

You get to the second heart stone from the top of it. He doesnt throw you to it


Yeah fuck this game waste of 60$
LOL puzzles are hard
 

Vortex566

Member
Just finished it and while I enjoyed it I felt the story really was lacking! Not sure if I want to spend anytime on doing a New Game +, but overall a very solid game. I will be really sad if they don't get a chance to make a sequel.
 

Dahbomb

Member
I can only record 30 sec footage at a time and to be honest I only really had one swag combo.

That was some boss shit! I was actually theorizing about Soul Splitter as a pseudo Doppelganger style. I also now want to put points into Frenzy for some high flying combos.

Man so many mechanics in that video, Buckler cancels, Redemption cancels.... This party is getting crazy!!!
 

BY2K

Membero Americo
First item in the list of stuff Vulgrim sells are Legacy Artifacts (on PC footage I saw.) No idea what they do.
 
First item in the list of stuff Vulgrim sells are Legacy Artifacts (on PC footage I saw.) No idea what they do.

It's a level 40 (I think) artifact without any stats. It says "sacrificial artifact" in the description, so I guess it's for leveling up possessed weapons, which seems kind of useless.
 

BY2K

Membero Americo
It's a level 40 (I think) artifact without any stats. It says "sacrificial artifact" in the description, so I guess it's for leveling up possessed weapons, which seems kind of useless.

Not really. If they are inexpensive, they could be used to level up possessed weapons so you can keep weapons with other stats.
 

jett

D-Member
Ah just finished the game, really great overall, although the endgame is disappointing. The difficulty level is kind of non existent too, possessed weapons can be made incredibly powerful. The only unique weapon I put any sort of time into was the Goremaul. Everything else I collected served to strengthen other PWs I picked up. :p Great experience though, combat has a great feel to it and the dungeon design is amazing. LOTS of dungeons too, LOTS of content for that matter.

GOTY so far.
 

Dahbomb

Member
So do I but it's cheaper to just buy some crappy weapon instead or find some junk in the wild. Maybe if it amplified stats it would be useful.

Q have you beaten the game yet?
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
So do I but it's cheaper to just buy some crappy weapon instead or find some junk in the wild. Maybe if it amplified stats it would be useful.

Q have you beaten the game yet?

Yeah I did it last night. I gave my thoughts on things in the spoilers page. For the most part I agree with your long post about the game :p

Im getting all the pages I missed and stone bites I missed now before going to new game plus. I have no idea how the fuck I missed 8 pages.

Missing 8 bites too
 

Dahbomb

Member
Damn we finished it at the same time although I am sure you have more collectibles than me. Going to read those impressions.
 

jett

D-Member
Is there any new content in NG+ ?

I'm pretty much done with every sidequest with the exception of Soul Arbiter maze and the Bloodless.
 

Dahbomb

Member
There are apparently new game + only legendary items. Plus your stones are reset so you can acquire them again for additional stat boosts. It's really mostly about maxing your character.
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
Damn we finished it at the same time although I am sure you have more collectibles than me. Going to read those impressions.

It was mostly just talking about story stuff. Gameplay wise I've said in this thread a few times that I would have prefered super long dungeons over doing things in sets of 3. I love just about everything else about the game. I'd say part one was more raw fun, but this game felt like an epic journey.
 

Duffyside

Banned
Any finished the Crucible? To get the trophy do you have to start at the first floor and do all 100 in one go? How difficult is it? Does it scale to your level/weapons? Etc questions.
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
Any finished the Crucible? To get the trophy do you have to start at the first floor and do all 100 in one go? How difficult is it? Does it scale to your level/weapons? Etc questions.

Crucible is preset. Later levels get tough.

I just don't get what so many people expected out of the story. It's a side story who's sole purpose is to develop the universe around the games, and it does just that.
 

EscoBlades

Ubisoft Marketing
Really want the full Abyssal Armor set. Got the boots at the moment. Hunting down the remaining Book of the Dead pages and have a chat with Vulgrim.
 

Gbraga

Member
I can only record 30 sec footage at a time and to be honest I only really had one swag combo.

That was some boss shit! I was actually theorizing about Soul Splitter as a pseudo Doppelganger style. I also now want to put points into Frenzy for some high flying combos.

Man so many mechanics in that video, Buckler cancels, Redemption cancels.... This party is getting crazy!!!

I don't think tragic should let that go unanswered.

tragy pls
 

Raxum

Member
Crucible is preset. Later levels get tough.

I just don't get what so many people expected out of the story. It's a side story who's sole purpose is to develop the universe around the games, and it does just that.

I think difficulty affects the crucible though. Definitely had an easier time of it playing on normal than when I've since tried it on apocalyptic. Probably just the scaled health and damage though.

Also agreed with the story, though they definitely could've done a little bit more to make the story engaging instead of a bunch of fetch quests. Why does everything seem so MMOish lately in that regards? Did we get burned out too much on fetch quests in MMOs or did they just become popular since MMOs used them a lot?
 

Duffyside

Banned
Crucible is preset. Later levels get tough.

I just don't get what so many people expected out of the story. It's a side story who's sole purpose is to develop the universe around the games, and it does just that.

Thanks. Do you have to do it all in one go to get the trophy, or just at some point finish the final level? Any reason I wouldn't want to do ten levels, quit and get the gear, then do ten levels later, quit for the gear, and repeat?
 
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