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Devil May Cry 4 Special Edition |OT| Two girls, one motivated Vergil

S

Sephzilla

Member
badcrumble said:
Basically, I think it's important to critique both DmC and DMC4 and understand what they each did right and wrong, and though I generally prefer DMC4, I think some people go too far and basically claim that DMC should do absolutely nothing to make casual players (or people just playing to see the campaign) feel more comfortable and engaged, and I think that's really dangerous thinking.
Click to expand...

Honestly, I think some fans are afraid to critique DMC4's flaws because last time they did Capcom threw the baby out with the bathwater and went full reboot
 
B

BadWolf

Member
GuardianE said:
The issue with the jump arc is that it's designed for combat with intentional limitations on horizontal movement. It's kind of a series staple, and why characters have other moves that give them horizontal clearance.
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This is a good point, they have to be careful with it since in addition to being a jump it is also very important for evasion (i-frames) and offense. Not to mention its uses for Royal Guard etc.
 
S

Shinjica

Member
badcrumble said:
I think some people go too far and basically claim that DMC should do absolutely nothing to make casual players (or people just playing to see the campaign) feel more comfortable and engaged, and I think that's really dangerous thinking.
Click to expand...

You cannot make everyone happy, sometime you have to choose who'll be your target.

Trying to make everyone happy will result in no one happy (see DmC).
 
B

badcrumble

Member
Sephzilla said:
Honestly, I think some fans are afraid to critique DMC4's flaws because last time they did Capcom threw the baby out with the bathwater and went full reboot
Click to expand...

Yep, sadly. DMC4's campaign is really clearly quite bad and everyone agrees on that, and it's important to stick up for the fact that DMC is about more than just the campaign quality. DMC5 still needs to do much better in that regard, though.
Shinjica said:
You cannot make everyone happy, sometime you have to choose who'll be your target.

Trying to make everyone happy will result in no one happy (see DmC).
Click to expand...
Eh, disagree. I think DmC's problems exist for very specific reasons (extremely bad writing, poor design decisions regarding color-coded enemies, way too much emphasis on the platforming to the extent that one of the missions is basically just a platforming gauntlet). The basic principle of making a character action game more accessible to more-casual players without destroying the hardcore appeal isn't a problem, which is why we have perfectly successful examples of that in DMC3 and Bayonetta.
 
S

SpiceMelange

Member
Is it 1080p on Xbone or 900p? I can run the original game at 60fps 1080p on my old i7920 AMD HD5850 but with the lazy ports nowadays I wouldn't be surprise this game inexplicably is much more demanding than the original one and DMC deserves no less than 60fps.
 
S

Shinjica

Member
badcrumble said:
Eh, disagree. I think DmC's problems exist for very specific reasons (extremely bad writing, poor design decisions regarding color-coded enemies, way too much emphasis on the platforming to the extent that one of the missions is basically just a platforming gauntlet). The basic principle of making a character action game more accessible to more-casual players without destroying the hardcore appeal isn't a problem, which is why we have perfectly successful examples of that in DMC3 and Bayonetta.
Click to expand...

Wasnt bayonetta, salewise not so good?
 
B

BadWolf

Member
badcrumble said:
Yep, sadly. DMC4's campaign is really clearly quite bad and everyone agrees on that, and it's important to stick up for the fact that DMC is about more than just the campaign quality. DMC5 still needs to do much better in that regard, though.
Click to expand...

At this point there is no way they aren't aware of the campaign issues, if they do it again in DMC5 then they clearly just don't care.

I think they do care though and the issue will be remedied in both DMC5 and RE7, going by how they admitted their mistakes with RE6 iirc.
 
M

Menthuss

Member
Pai Pai Master said:
The original port was godlike on PC so hopefully this is the same.

I bought on PS4 but will probably grab the PC version on a steam salw at some point
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Oh, I thought the game was already released on Steam. I know DMC4 on PC was amazingly well optimized. I remember playing it on my toaster :p
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
DmCs level design isn't that good either.

Most of these games (as in games in the genre) have dated as fuck level design and haven't evolved much from DMC1. Games with good level design are the Souls games especially Bloodborne in terms of the proper evolution of the DMC1 look and feel.

And yeah the DMC4 camera is dated as fuck. It still has the RE roots in it. It's very obvious with the new sprint system too.

Pretty much the only thing that Capcom should be retaining for DMC5 from DMC4 are the combat mechanics. Unfortunately since DmC kinda tanked I worry that we might just get DMC4.5.
 
J

justjustin

Member
Wow, the rebalanced orbs are really something. I picked Lady/Trish on Legendary Dark Knight mode and I die/restart so much at this rate I'll have every move unlocked by the end of chapter 3. I also had 60000+ red orbs to purchase enough blue orbs to start a second line of life bars already. There's no way it was like this in the original game, right?
 
G

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
justjustin said:
Wow, the rebalanced orbs are really something. I picked Lady/Trish on Legendary Dark Knight mode and I die/restart so much at this rate I'll have every move unlocked by the end of chapter 3. I also had 60000+ red orbs to purchase enough blue orbs to start a second line of life bars already. There's no way it was like this in the original game, right?
Click to expand...

Nope. They increased the drops significantly. You can get all Blue and Purple Orbs in the shop within one playthrough. You can get all skills within two playthroughs.
 
V

ViewtifulJC

Banned
Dahbomb said:
DmCs level design isn't that good either.

Most of these games (as in games in the genre) have dated as fuck level design and haven't evolved much from DMC1. Games with good level design are the Souls games especially Bloodborne in terms of the proper evolution of the DMC1 look and feel.

And yeah the DMC4 camera is dated as fuck. It still has the RE roots in it. It's very obvious with the new sprint system too.

Pretty much the only thing that Capcom should be retaining for DMC5 from DMC4 are the combat mechanics. Unfortunately since DmC kinda tanked I worry that we might just get DMC4.5.
Click to expand...
People were saying DMC4 was DMC3.5 back in the GameFAQs/TheHandvsEye days.

DMC3.75 incoming B O Y Z
 
B

badcrumble

Member
Shinjica said:
Wasnt bayonetta, salewise not so good?
Click to expand...

Yeah, but this is largely because of its incredibly wacky aesthetic (which I personally love but which I absolutely recognize isn't exactly great for mass appeal) and, I suspect, partly because the PS3 version got such a godawful port.
 
S

Sephzilla

Member
ViewtifulJC said:
DMC3.75 incoming B O Y Z
Click to expand...

iaintevenmad.jpg


I'd like less Resident Evil camera though

Shinjica said:
Wasnt bayonetta, salewise not so good?
Click to expand...

PS3 port of Bayo 1 was legitimately awful and then the sequel was released on a system 12 people own.
 
B

badcrumble

Member
Dahbomb said:
Games with good level design are the Souls games especially Bloodborne in terms of the proper evolution of the DMC1 look and feel.
Click to expand...

Yes, this. If they're not gonna do missions out of the shop, they should do something similar to Bloodborne as far as world/level design are concerned.
 
A

akidnamededdy

Banned
Shinjica said:
You cannot make everyone happy, sometime you have to choose who'll be your target.

Trying to make everyone happy will result in no one happy (see DmC).
Click to expand...

If that's the case (which I really don't think it is), then why would Capcom target a shrinking hardcore audience instead of the broader group?

This kind of thinking will lead to decisions that don't end well for us.
 
G

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
akidnamededdy said:
If that's the case (which I really don't think it is), then why would Capcom target a shrinking hardcore audience instead of the broader group?

This kind of thinking will lead to decisions that don't end well for us.
Click to expand...

That same argument could have been levied (was levied, actually) at the Souls series. It's doing pretty well right now.
 
J

justjustin

Member
GuardianE said:
Nope. They increased the drops significantly. You can get all Blue and Purple Orbs in the shop within one playthrough. You can get all skills within two playthroughs.
Click to expand...
Crazy. I can see how some people wouldn't like it at all, getting stronger by dying over and over, basically. Works for me, though!
 
C

Coda

Member
Gonna give the game another go after breakfast. I think I was just too tired to play well last night. Def gotta get used to Lady's ranged mechanics though.
 
B

biteren

Member
getting my ass kicked now, but its still fun battling a bunch of dudes at once.

that spike ceiling on mission 3 is killing me right now...i forgot how you get past it
 
G

GuardianE

Santa May Claus
biteren said:
getting my ass kicked now, but its still fun battling a bunch of dudes at once.

that spike ceiling on mission 3 id killing me right now...i forgot how you get past it
Click to expand...

Don't move around. Just line yourself up, wait for the grim grips to line up or come close to lining up, then mash O/B.

Moving around or waiting gets you hit.
 
G

gunbo13

Member
DMC4 is an incredibly detailed combat system rooted in PS1 level design. You come for the combat, not the levels, or you pass.
 
C

cheesekao

Member
I may have some bad news guys. It seems that the PC version of SE is not as well optimized as Vanilla DMC4. Not sure how true this is though.

1435066337518.jpg
 
D

Dahbomb

Member
Sephzilla said:
It's funny because DMC didn't exist on the PS1.
Click to expand...
But RE1 did and DMC1 basically aped the level design of the RE games.

And by level design I mean how the levels are actually framed out, their progression and their interconnectivity... not how they look visually.
 
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