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Dota 2 |OT11| $400 of Support and Passion

S

Shuggananas

Banned
NormalFish said:
QmV5DG6.jpg


W A I T I N G 4 G A M E
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>BEYOND THE SUMMIT

Every day [...]
 
S

sixghost

Member
It's completely viable to not be anywhere near the action with AA. If the other team wants to group up and push a tower just TP to another lane to split push and send in the massive fucking ult from the other side of the map. Super early on you want him with the team because the chilling touch damage makes a huge difference in fights, but like 20+ minutes in to the game, just go split push. At worst you make some space when they come to kill you
 
I

iamblades

Member
You just have to think how fucking great ice blast is as an ability.

at level 16 it's a 450 damage nuke that has a potentially huge AoE, followed by a 320(544 with aghs) damage DoT that disables all healing and regen, and shatters when the target reaches 12% hp.

Though chilling touch and ice vortex also require you to be nowhere near the front lines, and even cold feet has a 700 cast range. You can stay well out of the shit and still contribute in team fights as AA, barring certain super high mobility heroes on the enemy team(ie storm spirit, antimage) or heroes that dirsupt the standard battle lines(clinkz, riki, brood).
 
Wok

Wok

Member
I don't get the "stay far from the action" advice since it would hamper gold and experience gains due to team fights.
 
C

Chris R

Member
Recall is so much fun when you have people who understand how it works

I did just recall a bloodseeker to our top lane for a sick team fight only for him to TP to our top T1... never recalled that fucking idiot again.
 
S

sixghost

Member
Wok said:
I don't get the "stay far from the action" advice since it would hamper gold and experience gains due to team fights.
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That's why the midas is such a common pick up on him. Also, who cares how much exp and gold the AA is getting if he's constantly hitting 3 or more people with the ult during teamfights. The job of a support is to benefit the team as much as possible while sacrificing gold and experience.
 
D

Deleted member 77995

Unconfirmed Member
Drkirby said:
Who buys a 3k MMR account?
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you'd be surprised. I see lots of comments in game or on reddit from 1 or 2k players that use 3k mmr as the low bar for a "decent mmr." Pretty similar to League where a lot of silver and bronze players look up to gold v as the standard for acceptable play but in reality it's still pretty awful.
 
J

JC Sera

Member
jrh2 said:
Does anyone here play Dota on a Mac? Is it supposed to run like complete garbage, or is this just something I'm doing wrong?
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I do
it runs ok, but I have a rather limited perspective on running games, I tend to play mainly isometric RPG/Tactics games outside of dota, which aren't to taxing.
try turning down all the graphics settings, and then slow push the limit out

good guide: http://www.logicalincrements.com/games/dota2/?graphics

Also try reborn out. Reborn, unlike normal dota is not running in a mac wrapper. See if there is any difference.

good luck!
happy.gif
 
Robot Carnival

Robot Carnival

Gold Member
iamblades said:
This is my personal opinion, but if you don't have free farm and a team that can go even as 4v5, then don't build a radiance in the early game. I basically always get at least drums yasha or drums vanguard or aquila and one of the above on almost any hard carry I play other than AM(and I fucking suck with AM), because all you have to do on most hard carries is survive the early to mid game.

Rad rush makes your early game so weak that it makes it impossible for you to help out and turn around a poor early game by the rest of your team, even if you get it relatively quickly.

You don't even have to go diffusal as an alternative to radiance. Straight up treads(or phase)>drums>manta is a super powerful early game fight build that does not gimp your farming speed much at all.

I also second the motion about getting at least a casual ring of health if not just a full vanguard occasionally as spectre. If you don't have a completely controlled static free farm lane, you will have to dip into the jungle occasionally, which means you will not be full HP if a fight breaks out unless you build some regen.

Spectre is an almost unchallenged late game beast, so it does little harm in delaying your late game by 5 or so minutes to insure that your team can survive to that point. This is especially crucial when going up against cores like shadow fiend and Leshrac like that loss that you posted, who come online much much sooner than radiance spectre does.

Also don't let people convince you that radiance is only good if you get it early game. I get the logic, but spec doesn't really use the rad to farm like a naga or something, so it isn't mandatory to get it (or diffusal) as a first core item.
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I'll try that next time, go for an Aquila and PMS then see where to go from there. maybe build Yasha into either S&Y or Manta.
 
G

Glass Shark

Banned
Yeah my PC is top-notch so I have no trouble running it maxed out there, but I just got this Mac laptop for work and I'm trying to get it running just to spectate games if nothing else. But the whole Retina display thing is not working or something, the game looks totally pixellated and runs so bad.
 
I

iamblades

Member
Robot Carnival said:
I'll try that next time, go for an Aquila and PMS then see where to go from there. maybe build Yasha into either S&Y or Manta.
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IMO Manta is far superior on spectre, as manta illus proc desolate. The ability to purge off silences and stuff helps as well, means that in most cases if they come to gank you, they are going to need to come as five(or have a shit ton of CC and burst), or you just manta and haunt to whoever didn't come.

More importantly, you aren't really going to want to build that sange into anything late game and the maim doesn't really do much for chasing when you already have yasha and dagger and probably drums as well.
 
D

Deleted member 77995

Unconfirmed Member
G-Unit said:
You are missing the point. The point is, how can you die so much, so easy? I honestly think I sacrifice myself when i play support. But when our damage dealers play this bad I wonder if they ever even try.
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I don't know what MMR it's at (rumored mid 4ks) but playing support "properly" in anything below that can be a bit of a hellish experiment. Thing that's rough when you're playing mostly support in the trench is that laning and early gameplay is so fundamentally different compared to the higher brackets. You can't try to zone the offlaner because it's always a dual lane, you can't roam because your carry will absolutely not respect the other lane and die and you're very unlikely to get another support in the team so you'll be stuck on warding/dewarding duty for the first 25 minutes of the game until someone finally questions why you haven't gotten a blink/aghs/euls/force or w/e. Personally, I'd grab supports that are versatile where if need be can grab some kills and farm early and then transition into a late game carry (mirana, windranger, sven, wraith king, etc). That or Omniknight since he is the official pubstomping support and things like dispel are unheard of.
 
J

JC Sera

Member
whiskeystrike said:
I don't know what MMR it's at (rumored mid 4ks) but playing support "properly" in anything below that can be a bit of a hellish experiment. Thing that's rough when you're playing mostly support in the trench is that laning and early gameplay is so fundamentally different compared to the higher brackets. You can't try to zone the offlaner because it's always a dual lane, you can't roam because your carry will absolutely not respect the other lane and die and you're very unlikely to get another support in the team so you'll be stuck on warding/dewarding duty for the first 25 minutes of the game until someone finally questions why you haven't gotten a blink/aghs/euls/force or w/e. Personally, I'd grab supports that are versatile where if need be can grab some kills and farm early and then transition into a late game carry (mirana, windranger, sven, wraith king, etc). That or Omniknight since he is the official pubstomping support and things like dispel are unheard of.
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Don't forget that people will most harshly criticise not 100% perfect supporting
You have to actively look at someone to see their farm, with supporting the wards are on the minimap. The flaws are just easier for others to see, and they don't get you are getting no farm and trying your best to keep them alive.
//take with a grain of salt this is 2k perspective
 
D

Drkirby

Corporate Apologist
G-Unit said:
You are missing the point. The point is, how can you die so much, so easy? I honestly think I sacrifice myself when i play support. But when our damage dealers play this bad I wonder if they ever even try.
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Yeah, I guess you got a point. My record deaths is 20, and that was a month after I stated as CM.
 
D

Deleted member 77995

Unconfirmed Member
Saprol said:
armada
PogChamp.png


also GGs whiskey. maybe i should have repicked into somebody with more disables and let viper take mid
stunned.gif
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it's fine man. There were a number of mistakes made across the stack, the biggest being that we have a serious lack of coordination and communication, even while being on Skype.

You played extremely well and outperformed the rest of us in both games, so cheers and we'll invite again if you don't mind us on our path to actually working as a team.
 
H

Hylian7

Member
Sorry I didn't get to chime in more on the AA discussion. Anyway, reading more if your comments I kind of get it now. I was trying to play it like someone more like Lion, thinking I could set up things early on like your more "Mary Sue" supports do. AA feels like an oddball support to me and I think after that game, he isn't really a good solo support if the team needs that solo support to keep wards on CD at all times, smoke, sentries, etc.

In that game I played, I did pick up FB against the Huskar, however I died almost immediately after from burning spears. Chilling Touch definitely picked it up though. It really is strong and then kind of falls flat at about 10 minutes.

In retrospect, that game needed a support and I picked AA for the Huskar, but it probably wasn't a good pick as I couldn't be very active beyond throwing out ults and chilling touch. Not the kind of support you can say "Yeah, smoking over there right now" when mid needs a gank. In that game, I don't think Huskar was the biggest issue, it was just everyone else. All our lanes lost, and me dying a lot certainly didn't help either, although I got an opinion from someone saying that only having 4 more deaths than most of the team in a game like that wasn't terrible.


JC Sera said:
http://wudgiefudgie2.tumblr.com/post/124442609120/oo

cocky.gif


edit: oh I also forgot to thank hylian for yesterday. Thanks Hylian!
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No problem! Hope it worked!
 
S

sixghost

Member
whiskeystrike said:
I don't know what MMR it's at (rumored mid 4ks) but playing support "properly" in anything below that can be a bit of a hellish experiment. Thing that's rough when you're playing mostly support in the trench is that laning and early gameplay is so fundamentally different compared to the higher brackets. You can't try to zone the offlaner because it's always a dual lane, you can't roam because your carry will absolutely not respect the other lane and die and you're very unlikely to get another support in the team so you'll be stuck on warding/dewarding duty for the first 25 minutes of the game until someone finally questions why you haven't gotten a blink/aghs/euls/force or w/e. Personally, I'd grab supports that are versatile where if need be can grab some kills and farm early and then transition into a late game carry (mirana, windranger, sven, wraith king, etc). That or Omniknight since he is the official pubstomping support and things like dispel are unheard of.
Click to expand...

If I wanted to win games supporting at low MMRs I would just pick ganking support and go kill shit. You have to get decently high up before people have any sense of positioning or map awareness at all. You don't even need smoke at like 2k mmr because it's not like people are buying wards. Also no one farms remotely well in thsoe brackets so the support are the dominant force for 20+ minutes.

The problem is that people's idea of supporting below 3k is standing in lane taking experience from their carry.
 
J

JC Sera

Member
inkls said:
attack speed, treads switching so you don't run out of mana as fast, more hp
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First couple I went treads for those reasons
Then I went to phase
my experience was 100% better
The ability to phase through things has gotten me more kills and escapes
I can get the mana & EHP from blademail basher
like once I have phase/BM/basher I have everything I need
 
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