Support NeoGAF

[Hugstable]

SSX used this multiplayer 'ghosting' model last-gen, and it actually worked pretty well but, as always, a few people complained that you couldn't really bump or hit other players while racing down the mountain like in past versions of the game.

Now in Driveclub... it is a car racing game, and actually an arcade-ish type of game, so I believe avoiding other cars is a very natural part of what racing it is all about, even though some people online can be really a-holes (like pretty much in every online game)

... IMO some of you guys just need to chill-out.. it's just a game... some of you come here venting about EXTREME frustration, anger, RAGE, etc... come on guys, take it easy, there are bigger problems to direct your anger at, and I mean this in the most kind-spirited way.

What? Was the whole chill out thing directed at me? I'm just making suggestions to maybe help better the game...

Also SSX should have no ghosting, aren't the tracks in that game pretty open?

 

[Marmac]

Do we have any idea of when the challenges will be working consistently? I have not been able to access them once yet

I can't get it either. What will the challenges be? Also when is the weather update coming?

 

[viveks86]

What? Was the whole chill out thing directed at me?

No. Thought it was pretty obvious

 

[Jimrpg]

I inadvertently have found you can "cheat" the AI in tough races. I was looking at the environment and taking some screenshots and if you go super slow and trail behind, which slows them down a ton, you can then rocket past all of them within 10-30 seconds before the AI adjusts and you can keep a comfortable lead through the rest of the race even if they start catching up to challenge you.

Even with me at 30-50mph, at no point did they go more than 15-20 seconds ahead, as I kept getting the red interval time checks. When I floored it to catch up they were all bunched up cruising and I passed every car on straight and into a tight turn as a 15 second lead at 30mph is barely a few seconds at 150mph so you fly by them. They did speed up a ton after I was in the lead and kept up but if you drive halfway clean you win.

I was also able to reproduce this multiple times, as I was curious about it. So it's not rubberbanding in the sense that they go faster than they could/should, but they do slow down significantly to the point of the ridiculous.

In other news, I am still terrible at drifting, but every now and again I have a moment of brilliance, so I think I am starting to understand how it works. I wish the ghosts appeared reliably, so I can learn how to pitch the car into the slide.

Kinda proved what I suspected b4. That the AI is pretty much one and the same for all cars and not different AI for every car.

Game is fine and hard when you are racing properly. Once you go outside of that, the AI is basically broken. They spent all the CPU resources on the physics.

 

[NEOPARADIGM]

I've had AI opponents fly by me at full speed as if they have NOS.

I'm sure virtually everyone has; the argument, however, is that if the AI is shooting past you like a rocket, you were going much slower than you could have been.

Fast runs with minimal mistakes result in 1st place 9 times out of 10. Nobody's out there setting amazing times while also getting shafted by "rubberbanding" AI.

If you're getting overtaken by the AI you're also likely setting a shit time and thus aren't running very good to begin with.

edit: hell, half the time when I win I don't set a very good time.

 

[Chabbles]

It can be done even with very low top speed, here you go: http://youtu.be/5ehdmNuEiW8?t=4m50s

If you watch the whole race you can see that I am gaining a steady 2 seconds per lap - even with shitty lines because I have to use a controller.

Ok, fair enough, you did annihilate the AI there. I've yet to drive that car, but yeah low top speed with high acceleration would be ideal on a circuit track with lots of cornering. When i unlock that car im going to do a 10 lap race on that track and see if its possible to actual lap the AI.

Edit,

Driving a twisty circuit with the BAC vs cars that don't also weigh less than a bar of chocolate or have endless grip/acceleration isn't really the right way to prove that IMO.

The BACs prowess through the corners eliminates any real competition in that race.

Yeah, he done it, but with the most ideal circumstances in his favor. But still, its nice to see the rubberbanding has some limits.

 

[AndyD]

Thanks I'll try it out next. I remember this is how we used to beat AI in MCLA, another game notorious for its rubberbanding, you practically had to use nitro boost just to keep no.2 behind you before crossing the finish line. And yeah, what you said above is textbook definition of rubberbanding, it goes both ways.

It's completely different in that once you are ahead here, they don't really contest you if you are half good. So they don't cheat to artificially catch up to you, but they slow down to let you catch up to keep it "fun".

I've had AI opponents fly by me at full speed as if they have NOS.

Again, show us a video of them zooming by when they should not. If you make mistakes or drive slow, then they should zoom right past. Much like we can zoom past if they drive slow or make mistakes.

 

[GoldenCrow]

What? Was the whole chill out thing directed at me? I'm just making suggestions to maybe help better the game...

Also SSX should have no ghosting, aren't the tracks in that game pretty open?

That was one of the best features of SSX. Proper multiplayer races were missing though as that series has always been good with other people even if they are those that like to take people out as it is all part of the hustle and bustle of snowboard cross.

 

[QaaQer]

I will. Been playing racing games for over two decades and I've never been so infuriated by AI drivers, not even in Motorstorm games or Forza' drivatars, because the roads are wide enough so I can just avoid them if they get too aggressive. The fact that I'm enjoying time trials and drifts 10 times more than actual races should tell you how much I dread going against the asshole AI in this game.

If it's getting you angry, maybe it's the wrong game for you.

I'm no expert on AI, but I kinda like it. It adds an extra element of chance to the game. It has also taught me about when to brake and what lines are optimal.

 

[QaaQer]

. I wish the ghosts appeared reliably, so I can learn how to pitch the car into the slide.

yeah, what's up with that? It is some an online thing? I really miss it when I'm trying to get my times down.

 

[mangochutney]

I can't get it either. What will the challenges be? Also when is the weather update coming?

Challenges are, after you complete an event you have the Continue/Restart etc, one option is to send a challenge, of your time/score to beat to your friends, or to clubs.

They then have to try and beat your time within a set period of time.

 

[Nafai1123]

Had fun playing with you fellow members of GAFCLUB last night! Let's do it again soon.

 

[OccamsLightsaber]

I've had AI opponents fly by me at full speed as if they have NOS.

Me too, but I had stopped to look at some auroras.

 

[viveks86]

Had fun playing with you fellow members of GAFCLUB last night! Let's do it again soon.

Soon = tonight? If so, I'm in

 

[Chabbles]

When the AI spin you off the road knocking you out of 1st place only to leave you in dust, its time to change to cockpit view, kick back and drift into the sunset.

 

[Bunta]

Driving a twisty circuit with the BAC vs cars that don't also weigh less than a bar of chocolate or have endless grip/acceleration isn't really the right way to prove that IMO.

The BACs prowess through the corners eliminates any real competition in that race.

It doesn't matter what you're driving (within reason, not a VW vs. a P1) if there's actually rubberbanding. I ran the same track and car in a 3 lap race, and finished the race 16 seconds ahead of the computer.

 

[AndyD]

yeah, what's up with that? It is some an online thing? I really miss it when I'm trying to get my times down.

It's the online issue. When it will be fully on I imagine we will see those nonstop.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Soon = tonight? If so, I'm in

Im down.

 

[OccamsLightsaber]

When the AI spin you off the road knocking you out of 1st place only to leave you in dust, its time to change to cockpit view, kick back and drift into the sunset.

You can see the light reflecting off the dash then reflect off the windscreen.

 

[Square Triangle]

Once they do what they need to do to make sure everyone can actually play the game please address the FUCKING ROAD RAGE AI.

Holy fuck, I want to give up on this game sometimes. You can be in the lead and instead of the AI passing you..they'd rather pull a P.I.T. manuver on you. This isn't Burnout, Evolution.

 

[Nafai1123]

Soon = tonight? If so, I'm in

Not sure I'll be on tonight. I have a date so if you guys see me you'll know how it went

 

[M.W.]

I'm down for some races.

 

[NullPointer]

You can be in the lead and instead of the AI passing you..they'd rather pull a P.I.T. manuver on you. This isn't Burnout, Evolution.

Its funny that I never heard this precise term until these DriveClub threads, and reading it in context I figured it meant any aggressive move to damage another race car and send it to the pit for repairs. I had no idea it was that one specific spin-out move or that the acronym had so many possible interpretations:

The PIT maneuver, or precision immobilization technique, is a pursuit tactic by which a pursuing car can force a fleeing car to abruptly turn sideways, causing the driver to lose control and stop. It was developed and named by the Fairfax County Police Department of Virginia, United States. Other interpretations of the acronym "PIT" include pursuit immobilization technique, pursuit intervention technique, push it tough, parallel immobilization technique, and precision intervention tactic. The technique is also known as tactical car intervention, tactical ramming, legal intervention, and fishtailing. The technique is typically used by law enforcement officers as a safer alternative with which to bring car chases to a conclusion

(full article on PIT Maneuver)

 

[mangochutney]

Its funny that I never heard this precise term until these DriveClub threads, and reading it in context I figured it meant any aggressive move to damage another race car and send it to the pit for repairs. I had no idea it was that one specific spin-out move or that the acronym had so many possible interpretations:


(full article on PIT Maneuver)

Don't worry, I thought it was something to do with the pits as in your garage

Ok, fair enough, you did annihilate the AI there. I've yet to drive that car, but yeah low top speed with high acceleration would be ideal on a circuit track with lots of cornering. When i unlock that car im going to do a 10 lap race on that track and see if its possible to actual lap the AI.

Here, I saved you the bother. Those bloody rubberbanding, cheating scumbag AI drivers keeping on my tail for the whole race!

First place nearly 40 seconds behind me, lapping what I think was 8th/9th place.

Final classifications.

 

[ChainsawFilms]

Somebody is about to try out the t300rs + wheelstand pro... oh my. Let the games finally begin.

I've got myself a T300rs for xmas, really looking forward to having a wheel this generation (never had one before). Saving Driveclub for then as well. Very excited

I think an option to add no-hit-detection with other players online would be great. I used to play a lot of Trackmania on PC, a very different style of racing to DC, and it worked great. You'd be concentrating on your own thing, with the added incentive of your mates doing their thing around you. Seems like it would work well. Just make it a unique gametype.

 

[iFootball]

What? Was the whole chill out thing directed at me? I'm just making suggestions to maybe help better the game...

No sorry, not at all, I was using your comment just to reply about SSX and then make a sort of an open statement... sorry if I was not clear

Also SSX should have no ghosting, aren't the tracks in that game pretty open?

Very open, but the Devs just decided not to include that type of racing... you're pretty much always racing against ghosts

Spoiler

and falling into pits

 

[viveks86]

Not sure I'll be on tonight. I have a date so if you guys see me you'll know how it went

LOL. Good luck!

 

[viveks86]

Here, I saved you the bother. Those bloody rubberbanding, cheating scumbag AI drivers keeping on my tail for the whole race!

First place nearly 40 seconds behind me, lapping what I think was 8th/9th place.

Final classifications.

Nice!

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I'm down for some races.

Whats your PSN? I'll invite you if we get together.

Nvm. Saw it in your profile.

 

[viveks86]

I figured it meant any aggressive move to damage another race car and send it to the pit for repairs

Haha!

 

[poros1ty]

leaderboards still broken?

 

[Afrikan]

Anyone ever save their teammates from spinning out?

I've done it a few times...but i don't think those drivers knew I did it on purpose to help them...and probably thought I was crashing in to them or i'm an asshole teammate...and they just lucked out.

Usually the only time it's worth taking a risk, is after a tight turn...and you can obviously tell they are about to lose control.

 

[SymbiantXenos]

Hit me up Gafclub

PSN Leon200079

 

[mangochutney]

Anyone ever save their teammates from spinning out?

I've done it a few times...but i don't think those drivers knew I did it on purpose to help them...and probably thought I was crashing in to them or i'm an asshole teammate...and they just lucked out.

Usually the only time it's worth taking a risk, is after a tight turn...and you can obviously tell they are about to lose control.

I have tried to stop people spinning out if I accidentally caused it.

I also try to let someone go back ahead of me if hit them when trying to overtake or go into a corner. Did that earlier but ignored the opportunity and instead hit me in a rage and spun themselves out again, oh well

 

[viveks86]

I have tried to stop people spinning out if I accidentally caused it.

Does apologizing count? I spun random people out a few times yesterday (team mates and opponents) and felt bad

No idea if they could hear me

 

[3rdamention]

If anyone would like to race this weekend, hit me up! I hope the servers will connect.
Or, if you just need a new friend, my PSN is below lol.

I am in the Gaf Corridor Racing Club as well.



PSN: Filth_Flannigan

 

[Tankshell]

leaderboards still broken?

Yep

 

[IISANDERII]

Have you been gunning for progression rather than levelling up? Cars & driver level are unlocked by fame points, so if you've been romping through the races you're fame might be lagging your progress.

So what I should do? Re-do some events and aim for points? What gets you the most, clean driving? Winning?

 

[dano1]

I'm sure virtually everyone has; the argument, however, is that if the AI is shooting past you like a rocket, you were going much slower than you could have been.

Fast runs with minimal mistakes result in 1st place 9 times out of 10. Nobody's out there setting amazing times while also getting shafted by "rubberbanding" AI.

If you're getting overtaken by the AI you're also likely setting a shit time and thus aren't running very good to begin with.

edit: hell, half the time when I win I don't set a very good time.

That's a very good point!! Anyone out there that sets top 100 times ever get rubberbanded?

 

[-Amon-]

Does apologizing count? I spun random people out a few times yesterday (team mates and opponents) and felt bad

No idea if they could hear me

No mercy.

I start as a gentleman but when they start to push me around i make them pay.

 

[Nafai1123]

That's a very good point!! Anyone out there that sets top 100 times ever get rubberbanded?

No, which is why I've never understood the rubberbanding complaints. I wouldn't even call it rubberbanding since that generally implies a unfair system where the AI drivers do not adhere to the limits of the car the same way a player does. It's more like a dynamic difficulty system.

Last place = AI will drive like slow idiots
First place = AI will drive like competent drivers

If you've ever been passed by AI so fast that it felt like they were using NOS, it's because you either took the previous turn so slow that your exit speed is terrible, or they have a faster car than you (faster accelerating or higher top speed depending on the situation).

 

[NullPointer]

No, which is why I've never understood the rubberbanding complaints. I wouldn't even call it rubberbanding since that generally implies a unfair system where the AI drivers do not adhere to the limits of the car the same way a player does. It's more like a dynamic difficulty system.

Last place = AI will drive like slow idiots
First place = AI will drive like competent drivers

If you've ever been passed by AI so fast that it felt like they were using NOS, it's because you either took the previous turn so slow that your exit speed is terrible, or they have a faster car than you (faster accelerating or higher top speed depending on the situation).

Absolutely, and I only have problem with the bold.

If the AI is screaming past you, try playing a time trial against a player's ghost on the same track - chances are you'll see other players blowing right past you in the same way.

And every time I read a complaint about a player's car getting slammed in the rear the first thought that comes to mind is always - well maybe you should be going faster? Because if the car behind you is faster and you're purposefully blocking them, expect to get smacked.

 

[dano1]

I've been playing Driveclub for over two weeks now. So I dicided to fire up GT6 and compare. Wow everything just feels slow! And less exciting. Driveclub has captured the sence of speed almost perfectly! The handling of the cars are both great. Can't wait to compare driveclub to GT7!!

 

[LookAtMeGo]

Absolutely, and I only have problem with the bold.

To be fair it kind of makes sense from a design perspective, it's not a sim and there is no rewind mode so it does help with making it so you don't have to restart after every major crash.

It does appear that it can be exploited though to make for an easy win by only driving skillfully at the end of the race.

I don't know what a proper solution would be for this without adding something like the rewind feature which I personally would not find welcome in a game like DC.

 

[NullPointer]

To be fair it kind of makes sense from a design perspective, it's not a sim and there is no rewind mode so it does help with making it so you don't have to restart after every major crash.

I wouldn't mind it so much if it wasn't so painfully obvious. I think its tuned to be super-permissive right now. Slowing them down is one thing, but its like they stay in slow-down until you zoom past all of them - they're too slow to wake from their torpor and get back into the fight.

Ideally though? I mean, Ideally? Ideally each car would have its own AI and personality and they'd be directly engaging each other for position rather than staying in that placid line until you got near before putting on a show and pretending the race mattered.

"I'd like to thank the Academy..."

Its all smoke and mirrors, but right now you can see the smoke machines, the crowd is reflecting in the mirrors, and there's a boom mic hanging down into the frame.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I wouldn't mind it so much if it wasn't so painfully obvious. I think its tuned to be super-permissive right now. Slowing them down is one thing, but its like they stay in slow-down until you zoom past all of them - they're too slow to wake from their torpor and get back into the fight.

Ideally though? I mean, Ideally? Ideally each car would have its own AI and personality and they'd be directly engaging each other for position rather than staying in that placid line until you got near before putting on a show and pretending the race mattered.

"I'd like to thank the Academy..."

Its all smoke and mirrors, but right now you can see the smoke machines, the crowd is reflecting in the mirrors, and there's a boom mic hanging down into the frame.

Lol. Thats a good point, I have no rebuttal.

Are there racers out there with that kind of AI?

 

[NullPointer]

Are there racers out there with that kind of AI?

I don't know what I'd consider great AI, as all racers seem to come with their own problems, though to be sure I do enjoy the DriveClub AI when they're actually trying to win.

I guess I'm a firm believer in the concept of Drivatars, which is the closest to the ideal I suggested, though even that system is marred by the game's reliance - (like every other racer out there) - on very short two to three lap races where the player starts in the back of the pack, which makes those players have to go full aggro to come in first, and thus so do their Drivatars. So you get real personality, but at the expense of bump and grind in short races or thin or more technical tracks.

Evo has always seemed to want to keep the player in the middle of the pack, which makes for that stampede feeling you get in all the Motorstorms rather than the more abstract time-trial-with-other-cars-on-the-track feeling you'd get from a Gran Turismo.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I don't know what I'd consider great AI, as all racers seem to come with their own problems, though to be sure I do enjoy the DriveClub AI when they're actually trying to win.

I guess I'm a firm believer in the concept of Drivatars, which is the closest to the ideal I suggested, though even that system is marred by the game's reliance - (like every other racer out there) - on very short two to three lap races where the player starts in the back of the pack, which makes those players have to go full aggro to come in first, and thus so do their Drivatars. So you get real personality, but at the expense of bump and grind in short races or thin or more technical tracks.

Evo has always seemed to want to keep the player in the middle of the pack, which makes for that stampede feeling you get in all the Motorstorms rather than the more abstract time-trial-with-other-cars-on-the-track feeling you'd get from a Gran Turismo.

I'll have to give Forza a try and see what the drivatars are all about.

 

[kitschbeam]

Sometimes I can't mute other player in MP and that really pissed me off.

 

[torontoml]

So I wasn't getting the leaderboards to come up/record my time during some time trials on the Frasier Valley circuit?, Canadian track anyway. Had a top 3 time for the Pagani Huayra, so I thought I'd change my DNS back to the regular one. Apparently if I disconnect from the Internet I get booted from my current event, kinda sucked. And now it says it can't connect at all, so I quit for the night.