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[XtremeXpider]

patents don't mean anything.

Oh, yes, "patents don't mean anything", Sony is not investing in anti used methods... lol.

 

[Grecco]

Can publishers really afford making high-budget, exclusive games for the Nextbox just because they'll lose out on some new sales that ended up being used?.

Yes. They can.

 

[GopherD]

To the whole used games scenario with Sony. Internally there is real opposition for blocking used games, including - Jack Tretton

For the record, I'm totally opposed to blocking used games. I think it is great for the consumer that they can buy those. We have a customer that buys our console late in the cycle, pays less and is looking for value-priced games. I think it would be anti-consumer for us to do that

While this doesn't confirm or deny, when the console is designed in the west, with western markets in mind and the head of the largest western division in the company comes out and says that, expectation is that it holds sway.

 

[chubigans]

if microsoft or sony did this, and it was only one of them, then they did this to lock down third party support, and to do it hard. if both do this, it's because third parties were begging them both to do it.

sony's either left with less third-party support, or a comparable console. the latter is more appealing.

Third parties would NEVER leave the PS4 just to make a stand. They simply can't afford to leave millions of dollars on the table like that. It would never happen, not to mention that I don't think third parties are actually all that responsible for MS actions. Just today EA mentioned they see the value of a used game market.

Only Microsoft? Lol

http://kotaku.com/5972787/sony-pate...g-used-games-possibly-on-the-next-playstation

Holy crap why do people keep posting this.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Oh, yes, "patents don't mean anything", Sony is not investing in anti used methods... lol.

yep and the next iphone is going to have solar powered charging capabilities.

 

[Satchel]

Well, if this is all true, its going to come down to what value the consumer gets out of these schemes.

Console maker benefit? Sure. Publishers? Yep. Devs? Uh huh. Advertisers? Hell yes.

But where is the benefit to consumers? If MS (and anyone who follows these plans) doesn't offer something incredible in exchange for these restrictions then they can all go to hell.

But for the life of me, I can't even imagine what they could offer in exchange that I would believe in and that would last the lifetime of a console generation. I see no reason to expect discounts within closed systems, nor reason to expect MS to do anything other than charge for anything and everything far beyond what they've already shown in their past history.

There is nothing we get out of it technically.

but at the same time, I'm probably one of the few this doesn't affect.

I don't buy used games, my consoles are always online and my Kinect and PS Eye are always plugged in.

I was more referring to the fact that a Steambox won't be much less restrictive than the new consoles in their rumoured state.

 

[Plinko]

yep and the next iphone is going to have solar powered charging capabilities.

I also really enjoy my Sony controllers I strap all over my body to do bicycle kicks in my living room.

 

[XtremeXpider]

Then, what about this:

Just like the next Xbox/Durango, we've heard from multiple sources that the Orbis will likewise have some kind of anti-used games measures built into the console. Here's how our main source says it's currently shaping up: new games for the system will be available one of two ways, either on a Blu-Ray disc or as a PSN download (yes, even full retail titles). If you buy the disc, it must be locked to a single PSN account, after which you can play the game, save the whole thing to your HDD, or peg it as "downloaded" in your account history and be free to download it at a later date.Don't think you can simply buy the disc and stay offline, though; like many PC games these days, you'll need to have a PSN account and be online to even get the thing started. 

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

Sure, "no rumors about anti used games for ps4, we are saved". Lol.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

I also really enjoy my Sony controllers I strap all over my body to do bicycle kicks in my living room.

yep can't wait.

Seriously though. Lets make it a thing where patents are good indicators of what's to come. This is the feature I'm most looking forward to in my PS4:

 

[CLEEK]

Just today EA mentioned they see the value of a used game market.

Of cource EA see the value in a used game market. The data is there that shows the trade-ins fuel new game purchases. Without the ability to recoup money by trading in games, either new games would need a far lower price point, or initial sales would be lower.

Seeing it's really only Nintendo games and major first party ones that have any long tail in the them, having lower first week sales would be disastrous for most. Especially EA, which lives off annual updates. If you want to buy FIFA 2013, chances are you'll trade in FIFA 2012 to help pay for it.

 

[Reiko]

If I only need it online once to "verify it" I wouldn't feel so bad. Still a shitty deal for gamers.

 

[chubigans]

Then, what about this:



http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

Sure, "no rumors about anti used games for ps4, we are saved". Lol.

Oh hey a year old article. With it confirming backwards compatibility, even though that doesn't seem true or possible given recent leaks. Gee, maybe that means things have changed since then.

 

[Razdek]

What kind of thinking is this? I completely agree Microsoft will try to squeeze every penny they can out of the consumer (like every other company), but to say they will neglect millions of dollars from the people that are not connected to the net and buy retail games in hopes of regaining their losses through digital purchases is crazy. They don't include "always online" and they make money from both.

Anything good for the consumer? Really? Microsoft provides services and products. Do you expect them to give stuff away?

You have too much faith in them because of all the companies they're the most likely to do it. I use their services like SkyDrive and it's good but nothing better than the alternatives out there. The way they've handled their past software and hardware launches doesn't inspire too much confidence in them IMO.

 

[mavs]

Oh hey a year old article. With it confirming backwards compatibility, even though that doesn't seem true or possible given recent leaks. Gee, maybe that means things have changed since then.

Wait, when was BC confirmed?

 

[XtremeXpider]

Oh hey a year old article. With it confirming backwards compatibility, even though that doesn't seem true or possible given recent leaks. Gee, maybe that means things have changed since then.

Yes, maybe things have changed (I hope) but is a lie that only durango have anti used games rumors.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Then, what about this:

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-p...re-the-details

Sure, "no rumors about anti used games for ps4, we are saved". Lol.

were you around pre-PS3 launch? There were these exact same rumours, but nothing very credible or concrete. Turned out false. Not saying they wont adopt anti-used game policies, anything is possible in this crappy age we live in. But I think during these crazy next gen times it's important to take info one at a time and analyse it as it comes. If the rumour resurfaces or sony confirms it in the near future, we shall go from there. For now, all we have is reliable durango info from EDGE. Guess we'll see if it's true.

 

[haikira]

I feel really out of touch, since i think the online DRM is far worse than attaching games to your account.

What would happen in the unlikely albeit, but possible situation, of something similar to the PSN outage happening again? Would your console be useless for those weeks it was down? What about high profile launches, like Call of Duty? The Diablo 3 launch night wasn't exactly fantastic. Would i have to deal with that for every Call of Duty, Halo and so on?

I know attaching games to your game account is a pain for collectors or people wanting to lend out games. But i definitely see it as the lesser of two evils.

 

[XtremeXpider]

were you around pre-PS3 launch? There were these exact same rumours, but nothing very credible or concrete. Turned out false. Not saying they wont adopt anti-used game policies, anything is possible in this crappy age we live in. But I think during these crazy next gen times it's important to take info one at a time and analyse it as it comes. If the rumour resurfaces or sony confirms it in the near future, we shall go from there.

Sure, but as I said, there are rumors about anti used games for both.

 

[Soriku]

Oh hey a year old article. With it confirming backwards compatibility, even though that doesn't seem true or possible given recent leaks. Gee, maybe that means things have changed since then.

The article actually says there won't be BC.

Sure, but as I said, there are rumors about anti used games for both.

No real "confirmations" on the Sony side though.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Sure, but as I said, there are rumors about anti used games for both.

except one is very credible, one is not o_0 that's where we're at now. I wouldn't be surprised if kotaku based that off the patent.

I feel really out of touch, since i think the online DRM is far worse than attaching games to your account.

What would happen in the unlikely albeit, but possible situation, of something similar to the PSN outage happening again? Would your console be useless for those weeks it was down? What about high profile launches, like Call of Duty? The Diablo 3 launch night wasn't exactly fantastic. Would i have to deal with that for every Call of Duty, Halo and so on?

I know attaching games to your game account is a pain for collectors or people wanting to lend out games. But i definitely see it as the lesser of two evils.

I'm with you. I would dislike anti-used games but always online is FAR worse. Anyone who has ever played an always online game can attest to it. It's usually disastrous.

 

[rdrr gnr]

Sure, but as I said, there are rumors about anti used games for both.

Except these are recent and we have two insiders confirming them.

 

[chubigans]

Wait, when was BC confirmed?

It never was (aside from that Kotatu article), and it doesn't seem like it's going to happen.

Yes, maybe things have changed (I hope) but is a lie that only durango have anti used games rumors.

I mean recent insider leaks, not rumors. I know they have patents and I know the used game talk has been with Sony since the launch of the PS3. I still say it's looking more than likely the PS4 will be used game friendly. If one of the major leak guys came out and said otherwise, then yeah, I'd change my stance. So far that hasn't happened.

 

[Beermeister]

Guess I will skip it.

.

 

[XtremeXpider]

except one is very credible, one is not o_0 that's where we're at now.


I'm with you. I would dislike anti-used games but always online is FAR worse. Anyone who has ever played an always online game can attest to it. It's usually disastrous.

People believe that they want to believe.

 

[Darryl]

yep can't wait.

Seriously though. Lets make it a thing where patents are good indicators of what's to come. This is the feature I'm most looking forward to in my PS4:

patents are the only hard evidence we have of anything. everything else is complete rumors and speculation.

 

[enzo_gt]

Then, what about this:

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

Sure, "no rumors about anti used games for ps4, we are saved". Lol.

People are more willing to rag on MS because the Sony hype train is rolling, and more sources have corroborated that Durango will have some sort of anti-used game technology in place. It makes it easier to folks to erroneously see the lack of info on Orbis as being some indicator of hope. Ignorance is bliss. They don't want to consider that if MS is reaping the rewards and is even MORE buddy buddy with publishers than they were last gen, Sony will logically follow suit.

Sony really can't take that risk OR the hit. They will do it out of necessity, and if MS is doing it too, it makes it even safer for them. They don't really have any other choice I think.

Nobody will care if GameStop dies at the end of this controversy. Plenty other retailers are competing with each other already and have been doing a better job at serving gamers than GameStop ever has. GameStop is the only retailer to piss off because they've been at flipping used games for the longest. The increased flow of customers from GameStop to other retailers will be more than enough to make up for them making small profits from flipping used games in the shadow of GameStop.

 

[CLEEK]

It never was (aside from that Kotatu article),

The Kotatu article says the opposite.

Remember how the PlayStation 3 swiftly dropped the ability to play PS2 games? Well, our main source tell us the Orbis won't even bother, and that Sony has no plans to offer backwards compatibility for its existing catalogue of PS3 games.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

People believe that they want to believe.

if PS4 also had it, would anyone be surprised? Probably not. But with it being revealed in 8 days, and also considering the huge amount of leaks lately, one would think such an important rumour would resurface. It's worth considering but not on the level Durango is, since we seem to have more concrete info on it.

 

[mavs]

It never was (aside from that Kotatu article), and it doesn't seem like it's going to happen.

If "that" Kotaku article was the one you quoted, "that" article explicitly ruled out BC on Sony's next gen console.

 

[Soriku]

People are more willing to rag on MS because the Sony hype train is rolling, and more sources have corroborated that Durango will have some sort of anti-used game technology in place. It makes it easier to folks to erroneously see the lack of info on Orbis as being some indicator of hope. Ignorance is bliss. They don't want to consider that if MS is reaping the rewards and is even MORE buddy buddy with publishers than they were last gen, Sony will logically follow suit.

Sony really can't take that risk OR the hit. They will do it out of necessity, and if MS is doing it too, it makes it even safer for them. They don't really have any other choice I think.

Nobody will care if GameStop dies at the end of this controversy. Plenty other retailers are competing with each other already and have been doing a better job at serving gamers than GameStop ever has. GameStop is the only retailer to piss off because they've been at flipping used games for the longest. The increased flow of customers from GameStop to other retailers will be more than enough to make up for them making small profits from flipping used games in the shadow of GameStop.

Why do publishers have a choice? Can they afford making exclusive games? I doubt it.

 

[thuway]

To the whole used games scenario with Sony. Internally there is real opposition for blocking used games, including - Jack Tretton



While this doesn't confirm or deny, when the console is designed in the west, with western markets in mind and the head of the largest western division in the company comes out and says that, expectation is that it holds sway.

Nice catch.

 

[Darryl]

if PS4 also had it, would anyone be surprised? Probably not. But with it being revealed in 8 days, and also considering the huge amount of leaks lately, one would think such an important rumour would resurface. It's worth considering but not on the level Durango is, since we seem to have more concrete info on it.

any company ran half-way decently would not have such negative rumors leading up to a major advertising event. instead, putting out positive news, viral marketing, and news against their competitors is most likely.

 

[KimonoNoNo]

Whatever the situation about used games and always online, we wont get confirmation about it until the consoles are about to be put on sale later in the year.

Watch in the coming months for rather evasive answers from company executives to simple yes or no questions.

 

[Tripp Daily]

You have too much faith in them because of all the companies they're the most likely to do it. I use their services like SkyDrive and it's good but nothing better than the alternatives out there. The way they've handled their past software and hardware launches doesn't inspire too much confidence in them IMO.

It has nothing to do with the amount of faith I have in them. It has everything to do with seeing Microsoft as a profitable company and not a charity. What ground are you basing the "they are most likely to do it" statement on? I've been treated well by Microsoft. And when catastrophe struck (see RROD) Microsoft admitted the mistake and went above and beyond to make right by it with their warranty extensions and customer service.

Also, their history should insure plenty of confidence. Their software and hardware releases outside of the RROD, which was adressed, have always been reliable. They are not market leaders by luck.

 

[chubigans]

The Kotatu article says the opposite.

If "that" Kotaku article was the one you quoted, "that" article explicitly ruled out BC on Sony's next gen console.

No, I meant the one that's a year old. Not the current one.

edit: wait, sorry, I'm completely mistaken.

 

[CLEEK]

No, I meant the one that's a year old. Not the current one.

Dude, you don't know what you mean! That Kotatu article is a year old. March 2012.

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

 

[rdrr gnr]

People are more willing to rag on MS because the Sony hype train is rolling, and more sources have corroborated that Durango will have some sort of anti-used game technology in place. It makes it easier to folks to erroneously see the lack of info on Orbis as being some indicator of hope. Ignorance is bliss. They don't want to consider that if MS is reaping the rewards and is even MORE buddy buddy with publishers than they were last gen, Sony will logically follow suit.

Utter trite. 'And more sources have corroborated' -- oh well, let's just make that secondary to the 'hype train.' Or the exact opposite. Consumers react and MS will logically follow suit.

Sony really can't take that risk OR the hit. They will do it out of necessity, and if MS is doing it too, it makes it even safer for them. They don't really have any other choice I think.

It seems like you're rationalizing your preference for Microsoft. I get it -- you like Halo or whatever. Yet it's the same annoying argument over and over again. If Microsoft confirms this and Sony follows suit; and then you see all the outraged posters in thread seemingly quiet or not offended-- then you get to call people out on their bullshit. Right now people are reacting to the evidence they have. And can publishers afford to isolate half their fanbase?

 

[Saint Gregory]

Can publishers really afford making high-budget, exclusive games for the Nextbox just because they'll lose out on some new sales that ended up being used? If publishers are pushing for no used games, and Sony disagrees, I'm sure that'll hurt relationships. However, do third parties really have a choice? It's unimaginable that they'll back MS with exclusives when, even if they lose out on some new sales, they'll make much more money if they just swallow the pill and make games for the PS4 as well.

I don't think they would be successful in pressuring Sony unless the Next Xbox is a major success out of the gate and the PS4 struggles. If that happens then all bets are off.

 

[chubigans]

Dude, you don't know what you mean! That Kotatu article is a year old. March 2012.

http://kotaku.com/5896996/the-next-playstation-is-called-orbis-sources-say-here-are-the-details

Whoops, you're right. XD

I am dumb.

 

[rakkadakka]

Yes people. Steambox is the answer. Great sales on indie games available only on PC.

Great prices on Triple A games a year after release, modestly close to what will be available on Amazon!

Protest MS and Sony's adoption of always online DRM and no used sales by going to the exact platform that inspired it!

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

Publishers ignoring a console because they don't conform to policy makes zero sense for a lot of reasons.

 

[NullPointer]

It has nothing to do with the amount of faith I have in them. It has everything to do with seeing Microsoft as a profitable company and not a charity. What ground are you basing the "they are most likely to do it" statement on? I've been treated well by Microsoft. And when catastrophe struck (see RROD) Microsoft admitted the mistake and went above and beyond to make right by it with their warranty extensions and customer service.

Also, their history should insure plenty of confidence. Their software and hardware releases outside of the RROD, which was adressed, have always been reliable. They are not market leaders by luck.

That's a laugh. Things would have been far worse for them if they didn't do exactly that.

And their history of forced premium DLC and charging for peer to peer multiplayer, Netflix, browser usage, etc makes me anything but optimistic.

I'm a consumer here, not a shareholder.

 

[Satchel]

I don't think they would be successful in pressuring Sony unless the Next Xbox is a major success out of the gate and the PS4 struggles. If that happens then all bets are off.

This was along the lines I was talking about before.

If only ONE of Sony or Microsoft block used games, I doubt they're doing so without backing from major devs and publishers.

I'd say exclusives, both timed and outright, have already been locked in. Assuming used games are blocked.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

This was along the lines I was talking about before.

If only ONE of Sony or Microsoft block used games, I doubt they're doing so without backing from major devs and publishers.

I'd say exclusives, both timed and outright, have already been locked in. Assuming used games are blocked.

so publishers would choose to make less money than they would if used games were available? Because they would lose more money buy ignoring a console then by allowing used games.

 

[Hana-Bi]

To the whole used games scenario with Sony. Internally there is real opposition for blocking used games, including - Jack Tretton



While this doesn't confirm or deny, when the console is designed in the west, with western markets in mind and the head of the largest western division in the company comes out and says that, expectation is that it holds sway.

Well, there is no reason to not reasonably price three year old games. I think the current prices for things like games on demand won't be any indicator on how MS and Sony will sell their games online. If they want this to work, there have to be sales and reasonable price reductions on older titles.

 

[XtremeXpider]

if PS4 also had it, would anyone be surprised? Probably not. But with it being revealed in 8 days, and also considering the huge amount of leaks lately, one would think such an important rumour would resurface. It's worth considering but not on the level Durango is, since we seem to have more concrete info on it.

I'm not saying Orbis will stop used games, just saying that both have rumors about it. Some guy said that not rumors about ps4 and it is a lie.

 

[mavs]

Why do publishers have a choice? Can they afford making exclusive games? I doubt it.

Yeah, I think the risk Sony absolutely can't afford is not getting their consoles into peoples' homes. If limiting used games is going to cause a backlash then they can't afford it. But what they can do is not say anything about it.

If they do have this system then they are idiots for announcing first and giving up the chance to have Microsoft take the hit on this.

 

[harriet the spy]

Are the (few) posters who are saying they will skip PS4/720 if there is a no used game policy and go for steambox instead being cheeky?

In any case, I'd be shocked if only one of them went with it.

Maybe WiiU has a chance after all!

 

[Reiko]

Publishers ignoring a console because they don't conform to policy makes zero sense for a lot of reasons.

EA refused to have online enabled for Madden on Xbox until MS complied to their policies and dropped NFL Fever.

 

[-Pyromaniac-]

EA refused to have online enabled for Madden on Xbox until MS complied to their policies and dropped NFL Fever.

there's a big difference between that and not releasing a game on a console because that console allows people to play used games. Huge difference. Which was obviously the context I'm referencing.