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[SJRB]

Diversifying a portfolio if not a bad thing. Trying to bruteforce into GaaS territory is only a problem if other, hallmark IP suffer. As long as the traditional Sony games keep coming there’s no reason not to give it a shot.

Sure I don’t give a shit GaaS but plenty people do.

 

[LordCBH]

Ultimately, all they need is one hit.

The issue is it’s getting harder to get that one hit. They by and large missed the boat. There’s only so many people and hours in the day, and most players don’t have time for more than 1 of these live service titles, and a ton of people have already invested in a live service title or two.

I can’t blame them for chasing this whale, because if they get one that hits and has staying power then they’ve hit the gold mine, but I think they waited too long.

 

[vkbest]

Diversifying a portfolio if not a bad thing. Trying to bruteforce into GaaS territory is only a problem if other, hallmark IP suffer. As long as the traditional Sony games keep coming there’s no reason not to give it a shot.

Sure I don’t give a shit GaaS but plenty people do.

The last state of play didn't look diversifying to me, was like investing everything in those games. No new single player game from Sony announced since Spiderman 2 or Wolverine. They announced 5 GaaS games.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

Yeah that comment made me roll my eyes. A studio they just finalized the purchase of a year ago would only have made such a sudden shift if they sacrificed a virgin to the Dark Lord. That assertion is even more bizarre considering that Schreier reported the situation involving Bungie telling Naughty Dog to rethink their multiplayer game. That was alongside the seeming cancellation of Deviation's game, the announcement of Marathon, and the purchase of Firewalk, who is also working on a live service game set to be released next year. Bungie is clearly stepping up to shape things. You're just not going to suddenly see the fruit of that in a mere 12 months after purchase.


They know damn well that live service is a crap shoot. So you just increase your odds of success by throwing in many attempts. Accuracy by volume.

You made a great post but you're way off base here.

The top 20 most played multiplayer games of today all fall into one of 4 genres.

Additionally, PlayStation wouldn't be investing in Bungie and a Live Service Center of Excellence if it was just a crap shoot.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Learn the rules. Apply the rules. Find success. It's not magic.

 

[Orutisu Furio]

And they may be attempting to bring back SOCOM. Guerrilla brought on the director of R6S but it appears they are working on Horizon Online, which is ultimately a disappointment.

But hey, Horizon Online might be bigger than Horizon offline, it strikes some level of success that we've seen with say Monster Hunter World... I personally can't explain the success of a single GaaS game, because there is pretty close to zero chance I'd ever play one, but Sony might be able to take the Horizon world much further than the single-player games it was based. It wouldn't be the first time a game franchise became more successful by moving to a different phase.

I think Sony would be smart to bring back SOCOM, but you have to ask yourself a lot of questions. Should it remain 3rd person? Should it be 1st person? Who would be best within Sony to create it? I think we'll see SOCOM for sure though.

I'm sure Sony is kicking themselves for not holding on to Everquest.

SOCOM when it released back on PS2 had a huge following and was a success for PS2 Online at the time. This was also of course before Call of Duty was the behemoth it is today but they're both very different games. I think there's a market and fanbase for a good quality third person shooter.

Sony would be wise to bring back SOCOM. PS5 doesn't have any exclusive must-buy online multiplayer games.

 

[Men_in_Boxes]

The issue is it’s getting harder to get that one hit. They by and large missed the boat. There’s only so many people and hours in the day, and most players don’t have time for more than 1 of these live service titles, and a ton of people have already invested in a live service title or two.

I can’t blame them for chasing this whale, because if they get one that hits and has staying power then they’ve hit the gold mine, but I think they waited too long.

This post was true in 2004.
This post was true in 2014.
This post will be true in 2024.

In those 20 years, the popularity and success of GAAS has skyrocketed.

I have yet to see one person adress this.

 

[Varteras]

You made a great post but you're way off base here.

The top 20 most played multiplayer games of today all fall into one of 4 genres.

Additionally, PlayStation wouldn't be investing in Bungie and a Live Service Center of Excellence if it was just a crap shoot.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Learn the rules. Apply the rules. Find success. It's not magic.

I don't have the energy to rebutt. So I'll just slap yours.

Good game, bro.

 

[Winter John]

When I think of PlayStation I think of single player games like Bloodborne and TLOU. The last thing I want from Sony is some half assed, money grubbing GAAS COD style bullshit. I got an Xbox for that.

 

[HawarMiran]

Doom&gloom attracts people. That is why I don't ever give clicks to those articles.

 

[Robochobo]

Honestly it's far to early to even argue or assume if it's going to be a successful endeavor or not. Tired of the negativity that always emanates from the industry and news in general. Report the facts, not skepticism, rumor and opinions.

 

[StereoVsn]

I love bitter tears like this.

Millions of gamers love them, which has now extended across PC in recent years. When factoring the latter is that still "because Playstation is popular" or is it more because you have no idea how to (or can't) appreciate them?

Yep. It was the same sort of thought that pegged freakin Spider-Man as niche. I am sure people like that one because only it’s Sony too.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

SOCOM when it released back on PS2 had a huge following and was a success for PS2 Online at the time. This was also of course before Call of Duty was the behemoth it is today but they're both very different games. I think there's a market and fanbase for a good quality third person shooter.

Sony would be wise to bring back SOCOM. PS5 doesn't have any exclusive must-buy online multiplayer games.

When you look at the lack of success for a lot of Sony shooters and multiplayer games it's I think because the PS2 and PS3 weren't really where the multiplayer community went to play their games.

A Resistance remaster could find some success across PS5 and PC. Same with a Killzone Reboot that was also on PC. SOCOM could definitely find some success in this era. You take elements of the original, rainbox six siege, and counter strike.

You look at some of their old school games and you wonder why they wasted time with destruction all stars.

 

[onnextflix5]

Trying to get more gass games out there is fine but using ur big AAA single player studios to make them, that’s not gonna end well and it might damage ur single player output, considering how bad PlayStation showcases have been in the last 2 years, the damage is already happening.

 

[YOU PC BRO?!]

Whatever Bungie does next will likely be a banger. Destiny always did have great gunplay and is probably the most seamless jump in/out live service game there is. It’s a shame they got so greedy. How they have shamelessly and relentlessly milked their fan base is truly despicable. I wonder if anyone knows how much it cost in total to play Destiny 2 and all the expansions to date? I’m guessing $300-400?

 

[realcool]

i liked things better when it was "games as a hobby."

 

[RoboFu]

So basically these guys read a bunch “ glad Jim is gone “ posts on a few forums and decided to turn it into a click bait article.

“ journalism “

 

[kaizenkko]

The real problem with Sony is the lack of announcements about their single player games. Show Ghost of Tsushima 2, new Astros game, projects from Naughty Dog, Bend, Bluepoint and others.

If they do that people will just stop carry about all that gaas bullshit.

 

[K' Dash]

is there a thread discussing the latest hack Sony suffered a couple days ago? I haven't seen anything around here

 

[ReBurn]

is there a thread discussing the latest hack Sony suffered a couple days ago? I haven't seen anything around here

Ransomware group claims to have breached Sony

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/a-ransomware-group-claims-to-have-beached-all-sony-systems/ Ransomware group Ransomed.vc claims to have successfully breached SonyGroup and is threatening to sell a cache of data stolen from the Japanese company. While its claims remain unverified...

www.neogaf.com

 

[nial]

Let's count out the games we know or can speculate on

1. Factions (delayed beyond the show's release)
2. MLB The Show
3. Gran Turismo 7 (we're just going to count this as live service)
4. Horizon Online
5. Fairgames (Haven Studio)
6. Likely cancelled Deviation game
7. Twisted Metal? (Delayed beyond the show's release, changed studios?)
8. Horizon MMORPG (different from Horizon Online)
9. Dreams (maybe the had planned a PC release and it was canceled)
10. Firewalk game
11. Firewall Ultra
12. Helldivers 2
13. Concord
14. Marathon

concord is firewalk's game

 

[LakeOf9]

Who could have seen this coming

 

[Loxus]

I think there is a realistic concern. Their own internal presentation showed that the plan was to drop traditional AAA funding to 45% by 2025 and raising live service funding to 55%. If the budget goes from 88% traditional funding 12% live service (2019 budget) to 55% live service, 45% traditional there is no way that they will be able to maintain single player release cadence. Especially in the setting of inflation/ballooning production costs. These numbers are all pulled from SONYs presentation to investors directly from their own charts.

Percentages doesn't tell the whole picture.
That could imply total investment budget is higher.

Don't anyone learn from the past playstation is doom articles that never happened?

I've been on Gaf for 3 years and it's the same shit over and over.

 

[Rhazer Fusion]

What concerns me about the big push for GAAS games from Sony is if any of the live service games succeed and even get remotely close to the success of Sony’s AAA games financially, I feel they will eventually put single player games on the backburner. Sony eventually dropped Japanese games and focused primarily on Western AAA, big budget releases. I feel the same thing could happen if live service games take off and are cheaper to develop for Sony.

 

[K' Dash]

Ransomware group claims to have breached Sony

https://www.videogameschronicle.com/news/a-ransomware-group-claims-to-have-beached-all-sony-systems/ Ransomware group Ransomed.vc claims to have successfully breached SonyGroup and is threatening to sell a cache of data stolen from the Japanese company. While its claims remain unverified...

www.neogaf.com

Thank you!

 

[James Sawyer Ford]

Where did you see that? And pretty sure Marathon isn't going to be SP, which is a huge miss. Sony EASILY could put a shit ton of money into a new engine for a single-player exclusive game that has a GaaS multiplatform world built around it. The game could basically play exactly like Halo.

Bungie sent out a survey asking players if they would enjoy periodic single player content every few years

IMHO, I think it's a good strategy. It gets the Single Player type players to play their games, and may lead to them getting back into their GaaS stuff that they support on a yearly basis

 

[GigaBowser]

Sony should nort pursuit GaaS this is a mistake

I am known for my industry predictions

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Bungie sent out a survey asking players if they would enjoy periodic single player content every few years

IMHO, I think it's a good strategy. It gets the Single Player type players to play their games, and may lead to them getting back into their GaaS stuff that they support on a yearly basis

That's where I feel like they could leverage some of the PlayStation Studios if they don't want to make a single player game themselves. They could have partnered with Sucker Punch, Insomniac, or Bluepoint to co-develop Marathon as a single-player Halo-esque game starring the security officer.

 

[Kerotan]

Sony software found huge success on ps4 because the heavy single player focus. GAAS can be more profitable but it can easily crash and burn. Be careful what you wish for.

 

[Tiago Rodrigues]

even Bungie's expertise has not yet been able to turn PlayStation Studios into a service-game factory".

I mean…not a single one of those games has been released. It would be hard for this to happen lmao

 

[L*][*N*K]

Besides wolverine we don't know but the assumption that single player games that were being worked on before gaas was even uttered by Jim has stopped or been canceled is wild. hell the only Gass we even have information on isn't even made by first party (helldivers).

FYI I don’t think Helldivers is one of those 10 GaaS games that he was talking about, it is not AAA and it is not a major release

 

[EDMIX]

Sony's live service pivot "may not pay off the way Jim Ryan had once hoped", says industry insider

Sony is reportedly "uncomfortable" about outgoing PlayStation boss Jim Ryan's pivot to games as a service.

www.eurogamer.net

What do you guys think?

Its hard to say for a lot of this shit.

I try to keep an open mind as shit, I'm wrong about a lot of shit. I thought APEX would flop cause its like, its not Titanfall, its not COD, Battlefield is EA's big hitter annnnnnnnndddd shit just got 100 million users

So i really don't know, even with Fortnite was first announced (back when it was suppose to be that night and day type concept with monsters and shit) I thought that would flop too.

So.....we don't really know, the way that market moves, its worth the investment on some trusted teams to allow their new ideas to be something to see if they can get a hit. Its not like they are doing this like generations ago where a team would just add on MP or Co-op, they are very much seeking the talent that has a actual history in that genre to try this. So its hard for me to say what will or won't be a massive hit.

I'm open with being wrong. Sometimes something we thought would flop, ends up with 100 plus million users, who is to really say those GAAS titles won't find their market?

 

[Shubh_C63]

It's risky but necessary.
Playstation needs atleast 1-2 successful GaaS to support their PS+ service also.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

The key reasons Sony is doing a big focus on GAAS:

1. The obvious one is money potential. All it takes is a game to be a hit and it'll be billions of sales bucks per year

2. GAAS is Sony's best way to get into the PC crowd. They launched almost all the key hits with 2+ year gaps and none of them have sold great. Add up the total sales of all ~10 PC ports so far and the money they've made is negligible. Since they havent proven or said they'd launch day one PC ports for their heavy hitters, their next avenue to cash in is day one GAAS games

 

[Seider]

Naughty Dog doing Gaas is a disgrace. They never should be using their resources to make Gaas instead single player games they mastered in last 20 years.

 

[RGB'D]

Percentages doesn't tell the whole picture.
That could imply total investment budget is higher.

Don't anyone learn from the past playstation is doom articles that never happened?

I've been on Gaf for 3 years and it's the same shit over and over.

The only thing I'm interested in from SONY is the traditional model so I hope that's true. And we aren't talking about a few percentage points. Their plan is a fundamental change in approach and they would literally have to double their overall budget for their investment in traditional models to remain the same. They aren't doubling their budget by 2025...

 

[Lupin25]

Its hard to say for a lot of this shit.

I try to keep an open mind as shit, I'm wrong about a lot of shit. I thought APEX would flop cause its like, its not Titanfall, its not COD, Battlefield is EA's big hitter annnnnnnnndddd shit just got 100 million users

So i really don't know, even with Fortnite was first announced (back when it was suppose to be that night and day type concept with monsters and shit) I thought that would flop too.

So.....we don't really know, the way that market moves, its worth the investment on some trusted teams to allow their new ideas to be something to see if they can get a hit. Its not like they are doing this like generations ago where a team would just add on MP or Co-op, they are very much seeking the talent that has a actual history in that genre to try this. So its hard for me to say what will or won't be a massive hit.

I'm open with being wrong. Sometimes something we thought would flop, ends up with 100 plus million users, who is to really say those GAAS titles won't find their market?

I think it’s a bit of an exaggeration to say they’re too far gone, but their walking into murky waters…

The other angle in favor live-service games, is if the dev can succeed with just 1, the profit and amount of time it allows the dev to output other high-quality products grows exponentially.

Clearly Valve & Rockstar have been the truest visionaries. With DOTA, Counter-Strike & GTAO they’ve had a head start on the live-service era with established online infrastructure since the ‘00’s.

The problem for Sony is deciding to establish this so late and was it the right move for every developer?

Who knows.

It hasn’t turned out well for Deviation Games, Naughty Dog (yet), Destruction All-Stars, Dreams looked like it was going that route, but didn’t generate enough interest even as a cheaper product. People don’t even know what Fairgame$ will play like, but already hate the concept based on the trailer feedback.

But we’ll see about the others…

It’s a big risk they need to take. 12 was a bit much. Let’s just hope they turn out well, so they’ll be fun enough for us to try.

 

[Keihart]

is this an article talking about another article without adding any new information like insight or opinions? am i missing something?
Look dude, i also think that Jim Ryan can suck a dick, but this is ridiculous.

 

[GigaBowser]

In the end, at least one of the titles will be a smash hit and several others will be moderate successes. They will earn back multiple times what they spent developing these 12 gaas titles. While gaf and the old heads hate them, the larger market absolutely embraces them.

thirs is like defending Wii because grandmas bought it gaas is crud just like wiimotes

Im sorry my friends

 

[semiconscious]

sony's

2023 has been pretty rough but looks like we might be in for an extra rough couple of years.

yep. sony's definitely a bit adrift right now. them last 2 major sequels (gow ragnarok & horizon fw)? fundamentally inferior retreads. the 5 year development thing is starting to take its inevitable toll on a console company that's always relied heavily on triple-a single-player exclusives...

 

[mrmustard]

The risc is that if they use a known ip for gaas and it sucks it devalues the ip. Before Fallout 76 people smiled when thinking about Fallout now they roll their eyes.

 

[davidjaffe]

You made a great post but you're way off base here.

The top 20 most played multiplayer games of today all fall into one of 4 genres.

Additionally, PlayStation wouldn't be investing in Bungie and a Live Service Center of Excellence if it was just a crap shoot.

Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic

Learn the rules. Apply the rules. Find success. It's not magic.

You have been saying this- to me for sure, perhaps others here- for over a year: It's not magic, it's a formula.

But you never share what the formula is. Which leads me to think either:

a- you think your statement is accurate but as you've never (from what I've seen, maybe I missed it) expanded on this non magic formula, you've not really thought it thru and don't know what the formula actually is. Or the rules, or whatever.

b- you know exactly what the rules are/formula is but- understandably- are not willing to give it up for free. I get it. But you'd think by now you woulda shared it with SOMEONE for a lot of cash. And maybe you have but you keep your finances private, which I understand.

 

[X-Wing]

"even Bungie's expertise has not yet been able to turn PlayStation Studios into a service-game factory".

I mean… they expected this to happen from one day to another?

 

[Cyberpunkd]

What do you guys think?

That all the GAAS development efforts seem to ignore the simple fact that people have time for max. 1, maybe 2 service games, not more.
Then consider the fact many of them are already invested in different service games e.g. Destiny 2, Fortnite, CoD.
So you better be sure you have another Destiny on your hands (you know you don’t, otherwise you will not be making 10+ of them), otherwise your are wasting money aka throwing shit on the wall to see what sticks.

 

[Hudo]

Man, gaming blogs really have gone down the shitter, huh?

 

[mejin]

They finalized the Bungie acquisition in July 2022... what's supposed to have happened in the space of a year?

Idiotic.

Seems there is no "Wait till next E3" for PlayStation. It's Joever.

 

[sinnergy]

This is what got him fired.

 

[FunkMiller]

GaaS is gaming cancer, and Jim’s pushing of it is the main reason I’m glad he’s going.

 

[Zathalus]

I hope these live service games fail. Not platform warring here, I hope the same for Microsoft as well.

Why? Because I'm selfish and want more single player bangers.

 

[MasterCornholio]

This is what got him fired.

Was that confirmed?

You : Oh no it wasn't confirmed. I just want it to be true.

Cool thanks for clarifying that.

 

[sinnergy]

Was that confirmed?

You : Oh no it wasn't confirmed. I just want it to be true.

Cool thanks for clarifying that.

It’s a message board discussion.. don’t take everything as fact .. but it’s a plausible reason anyway. Personally I don’t like GAAS. I rather like good story driven single player experiences.