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[semiconscious]

Sony is very confident in the success of its studios and the Brazilian Rafael Grassetti, former Santa Monica art director on God of War, talked about this in a participation in the Flow Games Podcast. According to him, the company demands "at least" a 90 score on Metacritic from its major studios like Santa Monica and Naughty Dog...

just looked it up, &, aside from a handful of games (like bloodborne, demon's souls, ico/sotc collection), santa monica & naughty dog are basically the only major sony studios to do this repeatedly...

so, yeah, even if true, 'like sm/nd' apparently really means 'sm/nd'...

 

[ANDS]

Well, everyone here shits on gaming journalists and sites like IGN and Polygon so to see everyone saying that Sony is right making their games to what those people will see as a good game is interesting.

Except everyone here doesn't. And IGN and Polygon and whomever else is on this "refined gamer shitlist" make up a small portion of the review scores that would go into making a game a "90+ metascore" game. There are far more ostensibly independent reviewers driving the critical quality narrative than there are the "mainstream" outlets you think everyone on this forum is against.

 

[Esca]

I can't really bad mouth it when you see their results

 

[Arioco]

Nonsense. Spiderman didn't get +90 Metascore but since it sold +20 million I'm sure SONY didn't mind too much.

 

[OmegaSupreme]

---

 

[Sophist]

By that, Sony is asking them to make a game for the press first, not the people. Yes, it's bad. Then the editors will do all kind of tricks like offering a whole week of vacation to influent reviewers on some tropical island to "test" the game (Just Cause editor did that).

 

[bitbydeath]

Hopefully this applies to all their devs, quality is important.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Yep. How is this a bad thing? This should be expected when you invest in your top studios that are not only paid very well, but receive Hollywood sized budgets.

Demanding you make bangers for gamers to enjoy?

Oh, the horror!

 

[Batiman]

It’s good to demand that from your devs but I feel it might limit experimentation in the gameplay department. It’s why most of Sony’s IPS trending to be more and more similar to one another. Very checklist looking.

 

[SeraphJan]

I agree to aim for better quality, however Metacritic score is not a reliable metric for that

I can't imaging a scenario where Sony make a game like Undertale even hypothetically that game is objectively better than Undertale, it would get a 90+ score.

 

[Topher]

It’s good to demand that from your devs but I feel it might limit experimentation in the gameplay department. It’s why most of Sony’s IPS trending to be more and more similar to one another. Very checklist looking.

Horizon....Spider-man....God of War....Ghost of Tsushima....TLOU. Those are the top Sony franchises and the gameplay is not similar in any of them.

 

[DaleinCalgary]

Why wouldn’t they, hey make a piece of shit and we will pay for it.

 

[itsjustJEFF]

I've played and loved a lot of 75-85 games in my life.This doesn't seem like a healthy thing to me.

I also have enjoyed many 7-8 games... but I have no issue with a 9 standard.

I believe every creative endeavor shoots for the BEST and yes that means a 10. I have never started a project and thought this will be a 7-8, I wish it to be the best its going to be... but sometimes timelines and other factors end up making is a 7-8, or less. Every single creative wants their "thing" to be a 10, that's just how it is. It doesn't matter if it's healthy or not, that's how they are wired.

 

[Corndog]

I don't see any problem... Or do I?
Imagine having to make games appealing to games journalists? Yeah, that's a problem right there.

I think as long as they are just using their own internal criteria it’s fine.
Also not every game needs to be a giant AAA game. I think you should allow studios to experiment more with smaller titles.

 

[Maxwell Jacob Friedman]

You're telling me a gaming company cares about the quality of their games??? No shit

 

[bender]

Plenty of Sony's games don't hit 90+ so I'm not seeing where this obsession is.

 

[Varteras]

When you're spending hundreds of millions over 4 or 5 years on one project, yeah. You want to know you're investing well. One metric is critical reception.

I think that's important to remember. Santa Monica and Naughty Dog are among the best in the business. They're likely paid very well.

I doubt it's just Sony that wants that. It would not be at all surprising if those studios have their own personal expectations to keep landing that kind of reception.

It's not just some gamers and critics that care about that. Watch a video of Cory Barlog's reaction to God of War's metacritic average. Dude cried for the whole world to see. That shit matters to developers, too.

Both companies have a legacy of excellence and that has likely become part of their culture.

 

[March Climber]

It's not a 90+, which is what the demand is?

Here's a good analogy: When you're playing most sports, you're aiming for the highest scored points possible. That doesn't mean that you'll always get it, but it's better to aim as high as possible instead of being one of those athletes who just shows up for the paycheck and cameras.

 

[March Climber]

You're telling me a gaming company cares about the quality of their games??? No shit

This isn't always true. Some care more about money than quality. Like it's been mentioned before, some companies will pad their portfolio just to get a check. Others will make the focus the GAAS instead of the game. This whole forum has complained for months about these things and they've been deathly scared of Sony falling into the same trappings.

 

[Batiman]

Horizon....Spider-man....God of War....Ghost of Tsushima....TLOU. Those are the top Sony franchises and the gameplay is not similar in any of them.

There’s definitely similarities.

 

[Maxwell Jacob Friedman]

There’s definitely similarities.

Third person perspective, OMG SO SIMILAR WE GOTT'EM, yea, no

 

[ryzen1]

Imagine, releasing good games is bad now.

 

[Danjin44]

Fuck the "score" and thats the "nicest" way I can put it.

 

[Topher]

There’s definitely similarities.

Outside of third person, no there are not. The gameplay is distinctly different in each of the games I listed.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Outside of third person, no there are not. The gameplay is distinctly different in each of the games I listed.

I've heard some even have a jump button!

 

[TheThreadsThatBindUs]

What's wrong with this?

Isn't this a good thing that we should all celebrate?

If Sony demanded their first-party games instead made a certain amount of profit, then the games would all be GaaS loot box/MTX-fiddled grind fests.

 

[DeltaPolarBear]

The only reason this thread even exists, is because Xbox doesn't care about high scores and only care about game quantity for Gamepass. Because arguably Nintendo has even HIGHER demands of quality for their major studios than Sony does. So the only exception is the console that came third.

 

[tmlDan]

Sure Jim Ryan.

The Dark Pictures: Switchback VR is great example

First party made that?

(the answer is no)

 

[Heimdall_Xtreme]

First party made that?

(the answer is no)

But is a Playstation exclusive

 

[tmlDan]

But is a Playstation exclusive

the title of the thread should help you

 

[Batiman]

Third person perspective, OMG SO SIMILAR WE GOTT'EM, yea, no

Outside of third person, no there are not. The gameplay is distinctly different in each of the games I listed.

Third person camera
Single player
Action/adventure
Action sequences/set pieces QTEs
Realistic artstyle
Story driven/cinematic cutscenes
Handhold platforming
Light rpg elements with very similar customization options
No MP

I mean most of them are great but they are definitely very similar

 

[March Climber]

Fuck the "score" and thats the "nicest" way I can put it.

Ah I remember these days, back when places like IGN and Gamespot would play roulette with their reviewers. "Hey Sports games expert, go play this 3DS Sonic game and write up a long review about it".

I bet they regret ever doing this because it slowly eroded their credibility to the point where they're the joke of the industry.

 

[Maxwell Jacob Friedman]

Third person camera
Single player
Action/adventure
Action sequences/set pieces QTEs
Realistic artstyle
Story driven/cinematic cutscenes
Handhold platforming
Light rpg elements with very similar customization options
No MP

I mean most of them are great but they are definitely very similar

Wow welcome to 70% of the gaming market!!! You're a genius!!!!
Sonys games are too similar...

 

[TexMex]

Good.

 

[vaibhavpisal]

This saps away creativity if a department is guiding you how to make game in a specific way to maximize the score.

Shocking to hear this exists.

 

[Dr. Claus]

as they should. If more developers cared about reviews, fans and sales instead of money and MTX gaming would be in a better place

Reviews don't mean shit. They don't indicate a quality game and gaming "journalists" should not be in control of people's jobs. The only thing that matters is sales and great consumer thoughts/demand.

Wow welcome to 70% of the gaming market!!! You're a genius!!!!
Sonys games are too similar...

Not even 5% of the gaming market - but it is the majority of what Sony publishes. Personally I would rather they take more risks and branch out into other genres/art directions/game design styles. Like they did during hte PS2 and PS3 era.

 

[K' Dash]

I guess that’s why they’re all post apocalyptic daddy issue walking simulators, they score well enough.

 

[Dr. Claus]

Horizon....Spider-man....God of War....Ghost of Tsushima....TLOU. Those are the top Sony franchises and the gameplay is not similar in any of them.

Agree to disagree. They are all narratively focused third person action-adventure games with a focus on cinematics/narratives to the point of detriment. Padding out the story with long winded walking/talking sections, awful replayability, and numerous, shallow game systems that never mesh well in a finished product. All having sequels that just add more of the same, don't fix what was initially wrong, and make it even *more* tedious to play and enjoy.

Long gone are the days where we would get a Mod Nation Racers, Resistance, Uncharted, Puppeteer, Infamous, and more from first party devs. Each more different than the last.

 

[DeepEnigma]

Third person camera
Single player
Action/adventure
Action sequences/set pieces QTEs
Realistic artstyle
Story driven/cinematic cutscenes
Handhold platforming
Light rpg elements with very similar customization options
No MP

I mean most of them are great but they are definitely very similar

 

[Topher]

Third person camera
Single player
Action/adventure
Action sequences/set pieces QTEs
Realistic artstyle
Story driven/cinematic cutscenes
Handhold platforming
Light rpg elements with very similar customization options

You've got a got a couple of gameplay items in your list and the rest is non-gameplay filler. Not much else to say.

Agree to disagree. They are all narratively focused third person action-adventure games with a focus on cinematics/narratives to the point of detriment. Padding out the story with long winded walking/talking sections, awful replayability, and numerous, shallow game systems that never mesh well in a finished product. All having sequels that just add more of the same, don't fix what was initially wrong, and make it even *more* tedious to play and enjoy.

Long gone are the days where we would get a Mod Nation Racers, Resistance, Uncharted, Puppeteer, Infamous, and more from first party devs. Each more different than the last.

That's all fine, but I'm talking strictly about gameplay as that was the point I was originally replying to. None of those games I listed play the same.

 

[Gamerguy84]

The new trope is all their games are the same thing. It's getting as bad as all the NASA employees coming out about the controller.

Well at least they are demanding their studios make something great instead of buy something great.

 

[Batiman]

 

[ShadowkillXNA]

Good. They should.

 

[Dr. Claus]

You've got a got a couple of gameplay items in your list and the rest is non-gameplay filler. Not much else to say.



That's all fine, but I'm talking strictly about gameplay as that was the point I was originally replying to. None of those games I listed play the same.

Oh yea, gameplay they are all quite different. One being a heavy brawler, one being a third person shooter, another being a stealthy-focused third person shooter, and another a hack and slash with a focus on strategy.

 

[DeepEnigma]

 

[Unknown Soldier]

"Sony demands it's studios make good games"

Someone try and spin this for me and tell me how it's bad

 

[DeepEnigma]

"Sony demands it's studios make good games"

Someone try and spin this for me and tell me how it's bad

Some are trying in this thread.

 

[Solidus_T]

Imagine, releasing good games is bad now.

It's pretty crazy, but you don't really have to imagine it. You can see some trying to make that case in this thread.

 

[rabbity-thing]

I guess that’s why they’re all post apocalyptic daddy issue walking simulators, they score well enough.

A selection of Metacritic titles this year (90's):

• Tears of the Kingdom
• Metroid Prime Remastered
• Tetris Effect
• Street Fighter 6
• Resident Evil 4 (REmake)
• Diablo IV
• Xenoblade Chronicles 3
• Moss: Book II

A selection of Metacritic this year (80's)

• Dead Space (Remake)
• Hi Fi Rush
• Monster Hunter Rise
• Theatrhythm Final Bar Line
• Hogwarts Legacy
• Returnal
• Octopath Traveler II
• Jedi Survivor
• The Murder of Sonic the Hedgehog
• Powerwash Simulator
• Dredge
• Ghostwire Tokyo

It's so weird. There's this assumption of what scores well these days and that it's only certain types of cinematic third-person hyper-realistic titles and that's just not the case. The perceptions don't match the reality.

 

[ProtoByte]

just looked it up, &, aside from a handful of games (like bloodborne, demon's souls, ico/sotc collection), santa monica & naughty dog are basically the only major sony studios to do this repeatedly...

so, yeah, even if true, 'like sm/nd' apparently really means 'sm/nd'...

It is pretty clear that those studios are what Sony considers their A+ tiers. I think it would behoove them to spread that target of consistent industry leading quality to their other studios. It means that things will start to change at those studios, but that's for the better.

Insomniac, for example, needs to focus less on getting a lot of games out "quickly" and more on getting fewer games out at a higher quality.