Suburban Thug
Member
You're just proving my point. It's still an RPG.
Edit: Just realized this thread has turned from discussing the new combat system to trying to define RPG LOL
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Final Fantasy VII Remake: Nomura Confirms Combat is Action Based
- Thread starter Exentryk
- Start date
Edit: Just realized this thread has turned from discussing the new combat system to trying to define RPG LOL
If you ignore all the resource management issues and are only fighting 1v1 against medium sized slow enemies, sure.
LordKasual
Banned
I didn't even think about Cait Sith lol.
What about Enemy Materia, summons, <All> spells, 2/4x cut, ect? Something tells me some of it may not make it off the cutting room floor.
What if they remove the 3-character limit and just Star Ocean 5 it with your whole squad going in on enemies and you switching between them?
How will fights like the Shinra Elevator play out? Or Diamond Weapon? Will they still allow me to fight Rufus or that fat guy with the silly gun?
So many good things to spectulate on as a fan, but everyone here would rather assert how much they hate XV for not being turn based
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
I expect this to get quoted at bar minimum 50 times your on gaf talking good about ffxv
shark sandwich
tenuously links anime, pedophile and incels
KH games has its share of QTEs
The funny thing is that QTEs are actually more interactive and require more skill than FF VII's battle system.
And at bottom, they're both about the same thing: watching some neat eye candy and seeing those big numbers flying all over the place.
I don't see how someone could say that QTEs are the bane of gaming, while at the same holding up basic + unchallenging turn-based combat as good gameplay
stargateheaven
Member
i just can't wait to see cait sith in full HD.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
thats what a remake is. Theres no precedent for this "its a remake not a remaster" thing that pops up only when talking about FFVII
Resident Evil remake, Is still resident evil 1
Ratchet and Clank is still a third person action platformer (with heavy story modifications though)
Dead Or Alive Ultimate is still a 3D fighting game
Kingdom Hearts chain of memories, still a card based action game, though they swapped to 3D action
MGS Twin Snakes: Still a 3rd person stealth game
Metroid Zero Mission: Still a side scrolling action game
Odin Sphere Leifthrasir: Still a sidescrolling action game
I cant think of the name, but there was only one remake I remember people talking about that shifted genres from turn based rpg to action RPG, and it was universally panned. There is no precedence for this, remakes tend to be faithful to the genre of the game they are remaking.
theaffection
Member
Fuck all that! Holding (preferably mashing) circle and watching shit fly across the screen with a few warp strikes for good measure is great fun. Mindlessly flashy, but at the same time very bulky and weighty. No substance to it at all and none needed, just straight up CHAOS
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
It'll be hilarious like he fights with a megaphone if I remember right
LordKasual
Banned
Oh and also, guys
If we're talking FF6 and onward, then there is no such thing as a "difficult" Final Fantasy game. They are all braindead if you have even a tiny grasp on its mechanics. Just about the only enemy i've ever been stuck on (outside of being 7 years old) has been Adel from FF8.
Final Fantasy post SNES era has never been about skill or difficulty. It's about spectacle.
If you want to play Final Fantasy and actually lose, go play Tactics. Or go raid endgame in XIV or something.
If we're talking FF6 and onward, then there is no such thing as a "difficult" Final Fantasy game. They are all braindead if you have even a tiny grasp on its mechanics. Just about the only enemy i've ever been stuck on (outside of being 7 years old) has been Adel from FF8.
Final Fantasy post SNES era has never been about skill or difficulty. It's about spectacle.
If you want to play Final Fantasy and actually lose, go play Tactics. Or go raid endgame in XIV or something.
Trogdor1123
Member
This disappoints me, I was hoping it to be more true to the original. I've said before that this was a deal breaker for me but I think I should reconsider. I will give it a chance.
theaffection
Member
NoctisVsStar
Member
Do your thing Nomura
Psychological Intellect
Banned
Because I'm excited that the remake is action based?
Cool? Im not shitting on anyone who likes that genre of rpgs.
potatohead
Member
This. If it has to be action, just do a normal action game like your best action games which are the KH series.
Please fuck off with the unresponsive XV system.
100%.
Agree as well.
7 in particular is really easy even compared to the others post 6.
NoctisVsStar
Member
Remember that the system changed when Tabata took over, e32013 was the last time xv played like KH.
Nah, FFX and FF4 DS had good combat. Just those two though. I died plenty on them.
Bolivar687
Banned
This can't be happening...
it was confirmed back at psx 2015 yes. somehow we still have people surprised.
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
It was confirmed two years ago. A
LordKasual
Banned
I've personally never really cared. Final Fantasy seems to balance its enemies just enough so that your new abilities are enough to rip through them.
FF is good at giving you a significant enough challenge in the endgame bonus fights. Those are usually the areas where the game makes FULL use of its mechanics, and the strategy, skill and difficulty comes into play. (FFX is my favorite example of this).
I also appreciate FF's capacity to allow you to create your own challenge runs, though this really only started with FFX.
FFXII can go from absolutely braindead to panic-inducing difficult, all depending on how you configure the options. Full Speed + Active mode? Run up on the wrong mark/boss/enemy and prepare to get your ass handed to you. That game did not play around with status effects and enemy special attacks.
It was admittedly extremely difficult to actually GAME OVER in FFXII because your entire party had to be wiped out. But there were many, many, many situations where I was forced to retreat, or eat a game over screen.
NoctisVsStar
Member
Some were in denial.
ditto.
MadChapelier
Member
Thank you so much Nomura. I worried about this since the game's announcement, because they didn't clearly say it was action-based. But now there it is!
Icyflamez96
Member
I swear we've had this thread at least 4, maybe 5 times. I literally thought this thread was going to be some kind of joke based on the title.
Hibiki Kurosawa
Member
Figured. I kinda thought it was already confirmed, tbh.
Dark_castle
Junior Member
Says who? Also the remake is still the same genre as the original, that is role-playing game, RPG.
You're thinking of Lufia 2 remake on DS, and yes that wasn't a good one, but that doesn't mean it cannot be done really. There is no rule that forbids remake to change the battle system drastically, even if the convention is otherwise.
7-12 still involved strategy, there isn't a single fight in FFXV outside maybe some of the 99 floor filler post-game dungeons where you have to actually think about what gear you're wearing or what weapons to use, your stack of potions and the grace period when you hit 0 HP will ensure you never die while you hold some O.
'but the old games u just pressed X', yeah, that's the select button for an entire command menu - a far cry from a singular attack button that doesn't even have button press combos in an ARPG.
FFXV's combat is only impressive to people who have never touched other ARPG's to understand how much it sucks.
Suburban Thug
Member
Eh, it's news to me. I'm not refreshing neogaf every waking moment nor have I dug deep for info considering I just started playing the original.
ShadowSoldier89
Member
action RPGs and turn based RPGs are far too different to consider one genre. They play nothing alike. RPG doesnt even make sense for games called RPGs most of the time, as its far better at describing a game like Mass Effect than a game like final fantasy. Its a near worthless descriptor, attached to any game with stat growths.
Blackleg-sanji1
Banned
I'm in for that exact reason. Maybe I'll like it more. In my mind Viii and Ix are vastly superior
afternoon delight
Member
When has hope ever once deterred franchise fans?
I'm right there with you though.
ethomaz
Banned
That is what a remake means.
A change in genre already give the game the power to be a spinoff.
Suburban Thug
Member
...They are both RPGs, doesn't matter what the battle system is.
You can also have sub-genre's, ya know.
I feel like AAA devs are missing out on flash potential with Turn based combat.
With turn based its possible to make battles really impressive graphically without sacrificing playability and strategy.
And it doesn't have to be slow or clunky either.It could be amazing.
Just wish someone would give it a shot on modern hardware with AAA money.
With turn based its possible to make battles really impressive graphically without sacrificing playability and strategy.
And it doesn't have to be slow or clunky either.It could be amazing.
Just wish someone would give it a shot on modern hardware with AAA money.
DarkConfidant
Member
This.
I'm expecting it to play like Crisis Core or probably moreso like Versus XIII.
Maybe Dragon Quest XI will make you happy. I think that's turn based still, and it's on PS4.
TheOfficeMut
Unconfirmed Member
I really dislike that you're making up arguments that make no sense. It's actually really annoying me. You keep saying that being over-leveled in an ARPG coupled with button-mashing makes it meaningless, but being over-leveled in a turned-based RPG is somehow different? FYI I always button-mash in turn-based RPGs because once I am strong enough there requires no strategy in some games.
Stop arguing for the hell of it if it makes no sense.
I really can't believe someone is trying to argue that actively managing time constrained battles is somehow easier than taking all the time in the world to make a decision in non-time constrained turn-based battles. Really, it depends on the game, so stop making sweeping statements that paints all ARPGs one way and turned-based RPGs another. Some turn-based RPGs are more or less difficult than ARPGs. It all depends on the game.
This whole idea of "skill" is nonsense. By your logic, chess takes monumental skill because it involves making informed decisions whereas physical activities require very little.
It seems you already have some preconceived notions as to what kind of an action system FF7R will have and you're also ignoring turn based games that operate on a faster note.
I'm feeling extra dumb today.
What's the difference between an action versus a command?
When I read command, I'm thinking Crisis Core where there are literal attack and magic "commands" you have to toggle between and select.
When I read action, I'm thinking XV where circle is attack, square is defend/phase.
I guess I'm confused because if Nomura says it's action, then it'd be (in my mind) closely resembling XV, but the screenshots I've seen look much more command-based, with attack, magic, and other options being select-able (which look more like Crisis Core).
What's the difference between an action versus a command?
When I read command, I'm thinking Crisis Core where there are literal attack and magic "commands" you have to toggle between and select.
When I read action, I'm thinking XV where circle is attack, square is defend/phase.
I guess I'm confused because if Nomura says it's action, then it'd be (in my mind) closely resembling XV, but the screenshots I've seen look much more command-based, with attack, magic, and other options being select-able (which look more like Crisis Core).
ShadowSoldier89
Member
err, I'm not making any preconceived notions on FF7R's combat, other than the fact that its an action game devalues it into oblivion for me. I also am not sure how I'm ignoring faster turn based games. Making turn based games faster (FFXIII) Still doesnt make them play anything like action games. There is an inherent difference from command based combat and action combat that makes them incomparable. They are vastly different takes on gameplay.
Kingdom hearts and crisis core have a weird command menu, but they are action combat. You press a button and the action happens. The feedback is immediate. Command based games are where you are issuing a command to a character, you are not in direct control.
Suburban Thug
Member
I agree. Can you imagine a turn based RPG with the graphics of The Order 1886? That would be bonkers.