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Final Fantasy XIV |OT| ARR: Alpha Closed. Beta mid-Feb
- Thread starter demosthenes
- Start date
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Unknown Soldier
Member
Emenis said:
All my catgirlfriends have abandoned me, one by one. I don't know where Rena and Aya went either. Well, I do sort of know where Aya (Mandoric) went, he's still hanging out with Anime-GAF over in the OT.
Rentahamster said:
I just sent him an email asking him what's up. He did say before he vanished that he had some work to do the next few days, but I guess none of were expecting him to completely vanish. :lol
mileS said:seriously!! let us know whats up. If you really are done for good at least say bye to us
same thing for kiryogi
Rain logged in last night for the first time in a week. We were all shocked to see him too. :lol
Dreamwriter said:
6 months early, if we take the PS3 release which is still March 2011 to be the original intended official release for both PC and PS3. Which is even more inexcusable really, I want to punch Yoichi Wada in the dick myself for forcing the devs to release the game in this state.
pancakesandsex
Member
Kandinsky said:
Lol. <3
You know... I understand if some people had a bad experience with FFXI. I did not. I enjoyed the challenge and took 7 jobs to 75. I rarely had to look for party for lengthy periods of time because I was either playing a high demand job, or I created my own party (something many people seemed to avoid).
Not every mob aggro'd and after going through a zone one time, if you didn't know where and which mobs aggro'd, it was your own fault for getting caught. Sure, it sucked when sneak/invisible wore at the wrong time, but that was part of the challenge. A challenge that is virtually nonexistent in FFXIV.
I'm not saying I want or need FFXI-2. However, that's the best place I can pull examples from. A challenge is all I'm really looking for. I don't care how Square Enix adds the challenge, just give it to me.
I'm sorry if you want some cake walk game where all you do is log on, grab 15 people and mindlessly mash mobs for hours. I'd prefer to have a challenge when I'm ranking... and SP issues combined with high SP required for higher ranks is not a challenge. SE has the time sinks down, now just add in some challenge and maybe I'll start having fun.
Also, my PC is fine. It worked exceptionally well during the beta and the first 6 weeks of retail. For the most part it's working again now. It's not my PC. I only use it for FFXIV and I did NOTHING to it when it started acting up a few days ago. The problem is with the game, not my PC. Just google FFXIV video card crash and you'll see a plethora of people with similar issues.
Not every mob aggro'd and after going through a zone one time, if you didn't know where and which mobs aggro'd, it was your own fault for getting caught. Sure, it sucked when sneak/invisible wore at the wrong time, but that was part of the challenge. A challenge that is virtually nonexistent in FFXIV.
I'm not saying I want or need FFXI-2. However, that's the best place I can pull examples from. A challenge is all I'm really looking for. I don't care how Square Enix adds the challenge, just give it to me.
I'm sorry if you want some cake walk game where all you do is log on, grab 15 people and mindlessly mash mobs for hours. I'd prefer to have a challenge when I'm ranking... and SP issues combined with high SP required for higher ranks is not a challenge. SE has the time sinks down, now just add in some challenge and maybe I'll start having fun.
Also, my PC is fine. It worked exceptionally well during the beta and the first 6 weeks of retail. For the most part it's working again now. It's not my PC. I only use it for FFXIV and I did NOTHING to it when it started acting up a few days ago. The problem is with the game, not my PC. Just google FFXIV video card crash and you'll see a plethora of people with similar issues.
Dreamwriter
Member
You're saying that they can't change the SP system at all in 3 months? That the formula for something like that would take a team of programmers longer than 3 months to change and test during beta tests? And since a lot of people have no problem with the SP system, and most reviews haven't complained about it, that sounds more like something you personally don't like anyways rather than an "egregious problem that people are complaining the most about".jiggle said:
And I don't get the whole "if it's not an AH exactly like FFXI had, it's the worst shit imaginable" point of view. If you can search a market ward to find exactly what you want, what's the problem? That you actually have to spend a couple minutes to walk over to the guy before you buy the exact item you were looking for?
Really, by the December patch, almost all the problems reviewers have mentioned will be fixed. That would be a good launch, even if it's not the most perfect game ever made.
Unknown Soldier
Member
Jinko said:
DrDogg said:
{Hmmm...}
Dreamwriter said:
Do you really have to be such a mindless toady for the developers?
For people who value their time, being able to find what they want without unnecessary tedium would be preferable. You may not care about your time, and you may be happy if SE simply punched you in the face for your monthly fee but this doesn't change the fact that the Retainer system is time-consuming tedium. Especially since games almost a decade old has better features.
With an AH, any individual has or can do the following:
- Quick access to the items they require for sale.
- Price and buyer/seller history of items for sale.
- Ability to determine demand and supply.
- Standardization of prices based on demand and supply.
- Ability for arbitrage to take occur.
- A record of all items that can and have been sold in the market.
Even if they implemented the search system in FFXIV it would still be terrible because you have to check every ward in every city to find a specific item.
Let's say I wanted to buy a Toadskin Cesti and I'm willing to pay someone 22 million gil.
Where do I find one? I could go to the appropriate Ward, but of course there are 3 of them in the world separated by lengthy runs. Then, you have to factor in that someone who MAY have it might have their retainer summoned in a different ward to sell other items of greater priority. On top of this, you have to contend with the fact that whomever who may have it, may also not be bazaaring it on the retainer while YOU are simultaneously looking for it by physically walking through each and every ward doing a search.
Then when I find one person selling the Cesti, I see it posted for 30 million. How do I know if this price is within the average range for the item and not on the higher end? All this while waiting as the wards load, waiting as the retainers load, and waiting as the bazaar inventory loads.
Don't tell me that all of this magically escaped your senses?
SuperLurker
Member
The SP system is the thing that's bothering me the most these days. Its silly that the best way to get SP is to just grab a mob of people and zerg mobs that don't even pose a threat. At rank 30 my leves are only useful for gaining money, as they average a few hundred SP each. I think I got a little over 2000 SP for doing all 8 of my leves today, some with guardian aspect on.
Dreamwriter said:
actually i'm saying they can
hence it's not related to the game early release
it's not bad programming due to lack of time
it's just bad design
a better system is already in the codes even
Dreamwriter said:
but i'm not the only one
and i'm pretty sure reviewer didn't play long enough into rank 20s to encounter it
Dreamwriter said:
you really think 50 hours grind for 1 rank is a problem that's isolated to my preference?
even in a pt, it'll still be 20 hours or so for 1 rank on certain job because of the uneven skill up
that's not a problem?
FieryBalrog
Member
Dreamwriter said:
Do you have any experience with other games or MMOs patching which would lead you to believe that a 3 month schedule is enough? How many times will people "cry wolf" about the upcoming miracle patch which only ever ends in tears? Miracle patches just don't exist. I believe you vastly underestimate the time and testing required to push through fixes in all these areas.
Oh, and it's not surprising most reviewers didn't complain about the SP system given that most reviewers probably didn't get past rank 20 in any job (if even close).
Dreamwriter
Member
Square gave a list of specific items they were going to implement in the November and December patches. That is what I'm basing that statement on. Square does not have a history of listing specific things in a patch and not delivering them; in FFXI's lifetime it was extremely rare for them to make one of these lists and not deliver on every single thing they listed.FieryBalrog said:
You don't make any sense. You are now saying that this would be a quick and easy thing to fix...yet if they had had 3 more months of full beta testing and balancing before launch, they wouldn't have had time or ability to fix it? I wasn't saying if the game wasn't rushed they would have just sat on it for 3 months programming. It would have had a normal schedule, and not super-rushed beta testing, like it did have.jiggle said:
Oh, so you aren't complaining about the SP system, but balance. I thought you were complaining about the randomness or something. Especially when you say it takes until beyond rank 20 to notice the problem - that shows that the underlying system is just fine, it just needs balancing. Which would have been easy for them to do during the final 3 months they didn't get.jiggle said:
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
3 Simple ways SE can fix SP gain and make everyone happy:
1. Make SP rewards static like phys EXP.
2. Keep the current system, but instead, at the end of the fight, total up all SP gained by all party members and split it evenly amongst those who took part in battle.
3. A mix of 1 and 2.
The current system of gaining SP is so stupid it's mind-boggling. It totally incentives you to play your job in an extremely ass-backwards manner.
The Tank/Healer Dilemma:
Mages get dick SP trying to use nukes and go DPS. Mages get much more SP AoE healing a huge party.
This means - the more damage the party takes, the more SP the mages get. A tank is supposed to have the right gear, stats, and playstyle to mitigate as much damage to him as possible. This is not good for the mages. The less damage the tank takes, the less SP the mages get. Therefore, to optimize SP gain for the mages, the tank should take as much damage as possible without dying.
That. Is. Fucking. Retarded.
The melee DPS vs. mage DPS Dilemma:
Melee DPS gets a shitton more SP than mage DPS ever will (only on single target enemies, but you're usually fighting single targets anyway when not doing leves)
You wanna be a nuker? Good luck getting past rank 25.
The Mob Dies Too Fast Before it Does any Damage Dilemma:
Usually, killing mobs fast is a good thing. Not in this game, if you want decent SP. Killing mobs fast might be good SP for the melees, but not for the mages. Kill a mob too fast, and it doesn't have time to properly do damage, which means the mages can't heal the damage, which means they get crap SP.
More incentives to play your class the WRONG way to optimize SP gain:
(Tanks need to take more damage, DDs need to do less damage, mages can't be as flexible or offensive as they want to be)
The whole SP gain as it currently stands just makes party members compete with each other for SP gain. This does not foster good party play. The current system incentives you to draw out fights, do less damage, take more damage, and act in a way that maximizes your own SP gain at the possible detriment of your party members.
The goal should be: Kill a mob as fast as possible, as safely as possible, and as efficiently as possible. The current SP system does not incentive any of those three objectives.
Whoever designed this system needs to find another job. Seriously. Keep the music and art guys. Fire everyone else, and get this game where it needs to be.
Also - debuffs are pretty damn useless if they only last 2 seconds on higher level mobs. What the hell's the point? Lower the effectiveness if you must, but at least keep the duration at a reasonable amount.
1. Make SP rewards static like phys EXP.
2. Keep the current system, but instead, at the end of the fight, total up all SP gained by all party members and split it evenly amongst those who took part in battle.
3. A mix of 1 and 2.
The current system of gaining SP is so stupid it's mind-boggling. It totally incentives you to play your job in an extremely ass-backwards manner.
The Tank/Healer Dilemma:
Mages get dick SP trying to use nukes and go DPS. Mages get much more SP AoE healing a huge party.
This means - the more damage the party takes, the more SP the mages get. A tank is supposed to have the right gear, stats, and playstyle to mitigate as much damage to him as possible. This is not good for the mages. The less damage the tank takes, the less SP the mages get. Therefore, to optimize SP gain for the mages, the tank should take as much damage as possible without dying.
That. Is. Fucking. Retarded.
The melee DPS vs. mage DPS Dilemma:
Melee DPS gets a shitton more SP than mage DPS ever will (only on single target enemies, but you're usually fighting single targets anyway when not doing leves)
You wanna be a nuker? Good luck getting past rank 25.
The Mob Dies Too Fast Before it Does any Damage Dilemma:
Usually, killing mobs fast is a good thing. Not in this game, if you want decent SP. Killing mobs fast might be good SP for the melees, but not for the mages. Kill a mob too fast, and it doesn't have time to properly do damage, which means the mages can't heal the damage, which means they get crap SP.
More incentives to play your class the WRONG way to optimize SP gain:
(Tanks need to take more damage, DDs need to do less damage, mages can't be as flexible or offensive as they want to be)
The whole SP gain as it currently stands just makes party members compete with each other for SP gain. This does not foster good party play. The current system incentives you to draw out fights, do less damage, take more damage, and act in a way that maximizes your own SP gain at the possible detriment of your party members.
The goal should be: Kill a mob as fast as possible, as safely as possible, and as efficiently as possible. The current SP system does not incentive any of those three objectives.
Whoever designed this system needs to find another job. Seriously. Keep the music and art guys. Fire everyone else, and get this game where it needs to be.
Also - debuffs are pretty damn useless if they only last 2 seconds on higher level mobs. What the hell's the point? Lower the effectiveness if you must, but at least keep the duration at a reasonable amount.
demosthenes
Member
Post that everywhere Renta, please.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
When I purposefully fight naked so that...
#1 - I can take more damage so the mages can heal me more for better SP.
#2 - My gear doesn't lose durability and I don't have to spend a bajillion gil repairing it.
...you know something's wrong.
#1 - I can take more damage so the mages can heal me more for better SP.
#2 - My gear doesn't lose durability and I don't have to spend a bajillion gil repairing it.
...you know something's wrong.
pancakesandsex
Member
Dreamwriter said:
:lol
In the few years I've been playing XI they have done this multiple times.
One of the largest ongoing delays were the new avatars, which I understand were promised years ago and only delivered on recently. The most recent being the end of WOTG (which was scheduled for September at the same time as scars), and I am anticipating a nice delay in the level cap increase to 99 (which was scheduled to complete in december) while they squeeze 2 more updates out of it next year.
FrankNitty
Member
Yeah the SP gain is slowing down a lot more now at rank 40 on Conj, before I would be able to pull in at the minimum 8k capping at around 14k per hour, usually averaging 12k/h. Now since it is harder to find camps that accommodate both melee and mages in my LS is hard. Anything that AoE's has been giving shit SP to our Melee and everything that gives good SP for them doesn't AoE. I am still happy to get SP as compared to no SP from not being able to get a party but damn.
at 70K plus in rank 40+ to level it will either take me 1 all day session or 2 small great sessions to lvl if I'm pulling in at least 10K/h, being that I work fulltime and I'm married the all day session is not an option lol. I'm already 25k into rank 40, so I figure I need a great 15k an hour session to lvl in a decent time of 3 hours, or I'll have to get a group that can get me at least 9.5k an hour to lvl in 5 hours. It's bullshit that it fluctuates this much. Ecspecially since some of the melee I party with can pull down 14k+ easily where we are partying.
I'm noticing more people quiting at this level now then I did in the 30's.
Also I still think there is some sort of exploit going on with mages, because I have been seeing some strange stuff from a few of the higher lvl ones on my server. Like 1 tank, and 5 conj just stading in a circle doing buffs, or I saw one just standing way out in the boonies in Mor Dohna by himself just buffing over and over again. Maybe I'm just paranoid but has anyone else seen this? They always seem to be in some really deserted area.
Anyways I'm just bitching lol.
End the end I would much rather have a set amount of SP given for a mob, just like XP. If they did that I woul djust grab some Conj and go manaburn some elementals or something.
at 70K plus in rank 40+ to level it will either take me 1 all day session or 2 small great sessions to lvl if I'm pulling in at least 10K/h, being that I work fulltime and I'm married the all day session is not an option lol. I'm already 25k into rank 40, so I figure I need a great 15k an hour session to lvl in a decent time of 3 hours, or I'll have to get a group that can get me at least 9.5k an hour to lvl in 5 hours. It's bullshit that it fluctuates this much. Ecspecially since some of the melee I party with can pull down 14k+ easily where we are partying.
I'm noticing more people quiting at this level now then I did in the 30's.
Also I still think there is some sort of exploit going on with mages, because I have been seeing some strange stuff from a few of the higher lvl ones on my server. Like 1 tank, and 5 conj just stading in a circle doing buffs, or I saw one just standing way out in the boonies in Mor Dohna by himself just buffing over and over again. Maybe I'm just paranoid but has anyone else seen this? They always seem to be in some really deserted area.
Anyways I'm just bitching lol.
End the end I would much rather have a set amount of SP given for a mob, just like XP. If they did that I woul djust grab some Conj and go manaburn some elementals or something.
Dreamwriter said:
I'd agree with that if the problems with FFXIV weren't actually design issues. The systems designed for this game don't have anything to do with the game being rushed out I feel. They were purposely made this way from the start. There is no other way to rationalize them otherwise. If they were rushed there would be different issues with them.
Unknown Soldier said:
Seriously? Name one thing that's actually challenging about FFXIV... other than finding an item you want in the market wards. :lol
I'm not talking AV difficult here, but right now NOTHING is challenging and EVERYTHING is a cake walk. That's not fun...
Dreamwriter said:
The Nov/Dec patches will not magically save the day, even if everything SE has promised comes to pass.
As has already been explained, adding a search to the market ward does not fix the problem. You still have to spend FAR longer searching than you would with an AH system.
Also, SP gain and the SP system in general is a HUGE problem, as Renta already explained. What I find funny is that the current SP/XP system is almost identical to the system FFXI uses. It's just that SP = weapon skill ups in FFXI instead of class progression.
I don't know anyone who liked skilling up weapons in FFXI, and I don't know many people who think the SP system in FFXIV is "good". I mean can you honestly tell me that a system is good when fighting an easier mob grants more SP than a harder mob (in most cases), and it's not uncommon to get 0 or very low SP from a mob of any difficulty?
demosthenes
Member
Some on ZAM talking about getting 12 people in Cass around rank 21-25 and getting 500sp per kill, that sound realistic?
FrankNitty
Member
demosthenes said:
Yeah it is pretty realistic, as I have 2 failry large groups on my server doing the same thing and they are catching up fast to the few of us that are in the 40's. It's not really viable though at higher levels I'm finding as when you get that much dmg on a mob it just melts. Not enough chance for skill up. And anything that has enough life is not usually worth it. Hell I was in a party of 8 the other day, and we got a link on some Pieste by the time my sleep finished casting the party had already killed one. :lol
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Just realized something - was the FF11 auction house able to be camped and used by bots and scripts? Was that easy to do? Is this prevalent in WoW and other MMOs too?
I guess I can understand where SE was going with the Market Wards, since having a player actually move around in the game world in order to buy and sell stuff would be hard for a bot to do.
Still doesn't excuse them from the fact that they still managed to fuck it up and make it a nightmare to use...
I guess I can understand where SE was going with the Market Wards, since having a player actually move around in the game world in order to buy and sell stuff would be hard for a bot to do.
Still doesn't excuse them from the fact that they still managed to fuck it up and make it a nightmare to use...
The only thing thats been difficult for me is when you have to fight multiple enemies with a variety of skills ( theives / crabs / undead). The battles ( when evenly matched and with fairly normal party size/make up) can be alot more strategic than XI (positioning, attack types, etc.)...but the whole SP gain mechanics of the game still need adjusting.
I dont think the backlash set S-E's plans back either. If anything, they'll have to roll out stuff that should've been there day one, alot sooner than planned.
Also random chest appearances in dungeons and the overworld outside of leves needs to be added. They are already trying to make this closer to classic FF than FF meets MMO, so they might as well toss that in.
I dont think the backlash set S-E's plans back either. If anything, they'll have to roll out stuff that should've been there day one, alot sooner than planned.
Also random chest appearances in dungeons and the overworld outside of leves needs to be added. They are already trying to make this closer to classic FF than FF meets MMO, so they might as well toss that in.
Rentahamster said:
There was a huge problem with RMT playing the AH to their advantage causing huge price hikes, I don't know if they used bots and scripts to do this, although 11's AH had price history which encouraged many players to try and hike prices.
WoW doesn't have this problem, 11 used to hide who was selling what, so you were always bidding blind and not knowing what the price of something was until you bought it.
WoW on the other hands shows everything, who is selling what, what the buy out price is and what the current highest bidding price is.
Think of WoW AH pretty much like the computer game version of Ebay.
I would have personally liked to see players stock stores with goods, NPC's would buy your items for a set price and sell them for a small mark up, it would create a completely stable economy that could be tweaked by the developer.
Leaving the economy in the hands of the player has never been a good thing.
Dreamwriter
Member
To my knowledge they never put new avatars in a list of features that were going to be in a specific scheduled patch. Yes, they promised features in the future that sometimes took a lot longer than they expected (in this case, that would be something like Chocobo's or guild-halls), but I'm talking about when they make their long lists of what's going in a specific scheduled patch.pancakesandsex said:
pancakesandsex
Member
My video card is dying so I won't be able to tax it by playing 14 for a bit, I'm probably ordering a new machine soon so I'll be on again after I get it.
question: do you only get guild marks on rank20+ local leves, if you complete ALL the crafts, including the extras?
i like how they do it with SP gain from crafting
translating that into DoW + DoM
0 for TW
1 - 100 for EP
101 - 200 for DC
201 - 300 for EM
301 - 400 for T
401 - 500 for IT
doing a little calculation
to go from rank26 to 27 requires 32,000 sp
in a pt fighting IT, that's 401-500sp per kill
so it takes 80 - 64 kills to rank up
assuming each mob takes 30 seconds to kill
it will take 40 - 32 minutes to ding 1 rank
comparing it to XI
to go from lv26 to lv27, you need 5400xp
and at 200-250xp per kill
it takes 27 - 22 kills to level up
assuming each mob takes twice as long kill, at 1 minute
it will take 27 - 22 minutes to ding 1 level
won't break the progression balance at all
still a longer grind than FFXI
but at least now it makes sense
unless they actually want ppl to spend 20 hours for 1 rank...
ppl can't complain about no endgame if they can't get to that point i guess...
something like chests or coffers like in XI
but don't require keys
will spice up the boring traveling between 3 cities and encourage explorations
they're pratically throwing out gils with leve anyway
why not
Rentahamster said:
i like how they do it with SP gain from crafting
translating that into DoW + DoM
0 for TW
1 - 100 for EP
101 - 200 for DC
201 - 300 for EM
301 - 400 for T
401 - 500 for IT
doing a little calculation
to go from rank26 to 27 requires 32,000 sp
in a pt fighting IT, that's 401-500sp per kill
so it takes 80 - 64 kills to rank up
assuming each mob takes 30 seconds to kill
it will take 40 - 32 minutes to ding 1 rank
comparing it to XI
to go from lv26 to lv27, you need 5400xp
and at 200-250xp per kill
it takes 27 - 22 kills to level up
assuming each mob takes twice as long kill, at 1 minute
it will take 27 - 22 minutes to ding 1 level
won't break the progression balance at all
still a longer grind than FFXI
but at least now it makes sense
unless they actually want ppl to spend 20 hours for 1 rank...
ppl can't complain about no endgame if they can't get to that point i guess...
Teknoman said:
something like chests or coffers like in XI
but don't require keys
will spice up the boring traveling between 3 cities and encourage explorations
they're pratically throwing out gils with leve anyway
why not
By the way, FFXIV track names:
http://rpgfan.com/soundtracks/ff14battle/index.html
http://rpgfan.com/soundtracks/ff14field/index.html
Someone should tell him Nail of the Heavens (while awesome) isnt a boss battle theme. Its the normal La Noscea region battle theme.
Also there is a battle theme called In the Shadow of the Colossus.
http://rpgfan.com/soundtracks/ff14battle/index.html
http://rpgfan.com/soundtracks/ff14field/index.html
Someone should tell him Nail of the Heavens (while awesome) isnt a boss battle theme. Its the normal La Noscea region battle theme.
Also there is a battle theme called In the Shadow of the Colossus.
Unknown Soldier
Member
So a small group of us were running madly around trying to cram in something like 10 rank 40 battle leves in Ul'dah in a few hours before maintenance begins.
This game really is quite good in a small group of guys who know each other, doing leves which aren't the same damn ones over and over again. It reminds me a lot of Phantasy Star Online at it's best when it's just clicking and you're just having fun running around going here and killing this. If they would only triple the number of different leves and add more interesting leve types with different goals and victory conditions, they would at least have the basis for moving the game forward on it's positive aspects. The mission-based structure of guildleves has been done before and done right in the PSO series of games and also in the Diablo series, after all. It's not that hard, just give people more quantity of and more interesting missions to do and they'll happily be going here and killing this all day and be happy to be engaging in what is essentially well-disguised grinding.
I honestly don't think there will be much use for large groups with the exception of mob-killing hundreds of black efts to get steady SP until Squenix puts the big boss monsters in. {Notorious Monster} {Can I have it?}
As opposed to you, who ignores anything remotely good about the game, and thus are far too pessimistic? I mean, why do you even still log on if you hate the game so much? Especially since you seem to think that it will never be even a pale shadow of your beloved FFXI much less any good, ever?
This game really is quite good in a small group of guys who know each other, doing leves which aren't the same damn ones over and over again. It reminds me a lot of Phantasy Star Online at it's best when it's just clicking and you're just having fun running around going here and killing this. If they would only triple the number of different leves and add more interesting leve types with different goals and victory conditions, they would at least have the basis for moving the game forward on it's positive aspects. The mission-based structure of guildleves has been done before and done right in the PSO series of games and also in the Diablo series, after all. It's not that hard, just give people more quantity of and more interesting missions to do and they'll happily be going here and killing this all day and be happy to be engaging in what is essentially well-disguised grinding.
I honestly don't think there will be much use for large groups with the exception of mob-killing hundreds of black efts to get steady SP until Squenix puts the big boss monsters in. {Notorious Monster} {Can I have it?}
DrDogg said:
As opposed to you, who ignores anything remotely good about the game, and thus are far too pessimistic? I mean, why do you even still log on if you hate the game so much? Especially since you seem to think that it will never be even a pale shadow of your beloved FFXI much less any good, ever?
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
Nah, Dogg's not overly pessimistic, he's got his issues with the game, just like the rest of us.
He likes gathering and crafting, and doesn't like market wards and the party battle system - simple as that.
All those folks who truly had a problem with this game left already. We should give some benefit of the doubt to those who still choose to play this gorgeous train-wreck.
He likes gathering and crafting, and doesn't like market wards and the party battle system - simple as that.
All those folks who truly had a problem with this game left already. We should give some benefit of the doubt to those who still choose to play this gorgeous train-wreck.
jiggle said:
While I do think the game is a bigger grind this FFXI because of the random exp, you can't directly compare FFXI to FFXIV because FFXI max level is 85 while FFXIV is 50. If FFXI max level was 50 I'm sure it would take more exp to get from 26-27. You want to compare FFXI 46-47 range and see how it stacks up.
I do agree with ya, the crafting exp system is good and should be applied to the rest of the game.
Rentahamster
Rodent Whores
My god, I've been so out of it I didn't even realize Blizzcon has come and gone already. I had been really looking forward to the fifth class unveiling, but had really taken a break from all the Diablo III news for the past several months.
Watching the DIII panels - these devs get it. They know what they want, they know what the customers want, they know what they need to do to make their game fun - and are willing to put in the effort to make it so. If the malaise indicated by the Inafune interview is what's been infecting SE as of late, I can see how that has led to FF14 being what it is currently.
Watching the DIII panels - these devs get it. They know what they want, they know what the customers want, they know what they need to do to make their game fun - and are willing to put in the effort to make it so. If the malaise indicated by the Inafune interview is what's been infecting SE as of late, I can see how that has led to FF14 being what it is currently.
Haint
Member
jiggle said:
Removing the guesstimates, the average yield of an efficient SP party at present is widely agreed to be b/t 10-15k SP/HR. This results in an average of 3-4 hours per level starting at lowly R30 and increasing quickly from there. In early years XI, average XP/HR was agreed to be around 3k/HR, resulting in around 2 hours or less per level starting around level 30. I've never really looked the numbers like this, it's pretty amazing XIV is basically twice as grindy as XI despite all their rhetoric about casualizing and making the game easier. I guess their internal estimates included the hours required to seek/form XI's cookie cutter parties and a fair amount of XP lost on deaths.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Also worth noting that at some point in FFXI's life (I totally forget when) they adjusted the exp requirements to level up lowering it the final 75 level was still 44,000 exp, but the increase to get there was less severe per level, making lower levels need less exp to level up.
Also, since the level cap increases to 80 and now 85 (and eventually up to 99) leveling is not an issue. Abyssea has totally changed the way you get exp and merits in end game. Taking a job from 75-85 will take maybe 5 hours of leveling (with just an average party) previously, even the best parties took over an hour to rack up 40,000 exp. The last level cap ,it took more time to do the level cap quest than to actually level from 80-85.
Also, since the level cap increases to 80 and now 85 (and eventually up to 99) leveling is not an issue. Abyssea has totally changed the way you get exp and merits in end game. Taking a job from 75-85 will take maybe 5 hours of leveling (with just an average party) previously, even the best parties took over an hour to rack up 40,000 exp. The last level cap ,it took more time to do the level cap quest than to actually level from 80-85.
Haint
Member
DrForester said:
For some reason I'm thinking they only adjusted the TNL's from 51-75 and left 1-50 untouched. Maybe I'm mistaken, but that's sticking out in my head. I recall I was in my late 60's when they did it, so it was within the first year or two of NA availability, probably the first year.
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