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Final Fantasy XIV |OT| ARR: Alpha Closed. Beta mid-Feb

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Forbiden

Member
Salaadin said:
Im pretty sure of this too.

It was, but I don't think that was his point. I think his point was that the exp required to go between one level to the next in FFXI at some point was so horrible that they had to readjust the values to make it less annoying.

However, this is completely different I'd say. The problem with FFXIV is not that a lot of SP is required to go from one level to the next. The problem is just how stupidly random and low SP gain can be from mobs. I mean, there have been times when I'll be PTing with my friends in XIV and they'll be getting upwards of 200 SP per kill and I don't get jack shit. That is honestly ridiculous
 

JudgeN

Member
Reallink said:
Removing the guesstimates, the average yield of an efficient SP party at present is widely agreed to be b/t 10-15k SP/HR. This results in an average of 3-4 hours per level starting at lowly R30 and increasing quickly from there. In early years XI, average XP/HR was agreed to be around 3k/HR, resulting in around 2 hours or less per level starting around level 30. I've never really looked the numbers like this, it's pretty amazing XIV is basically twice as grindy as XI despite all their rhetoric about casualizing and making the game easier. I guess their internal estimates included the hours required to seek/form XI's cookie cutter parties and a fair amount of XP lost on deaths.

On paper it looks like this but we all know back into 2003, it took way longer then that with bad party setups, still learning game mechanics, goblin smithy trains, and other bullshit.

Ahh the good old days :lol
 

Jinko

Member
I think some of you are missing the point like Forbiden said, with the SP so random it hards to say "this is the SP" i get an hour.

Even at 11's worst grind you still felt as if you were making progress, 14 feels like you are wading in glue, it makes is so much worse especially because there is nothing to actual strive towards.

There is nothing at cap waiting for us, the most we have to look forward to is main story quest which had nice pacing up to rank 20, after the rank 20 quest though it feels like a slog to get to the next story point.
 
JudgeN said:
On paper it looks like this but we all know back into 2003, it took way longer then that with bad party setups, still learning game mechanics, goblin smithy trains, and other bullshit.

Ahh the good old days :lol

No merits, no added spells / abilities / a lot less advanced jobs available / new equip added later for low lvls / etc. People really forget HOW much FFXI changed.
 
demosthenes said:
No merits, no added spells / abilities / a lot less advanced jobs available / new equip added later for low lvls / etc. People really forget HOW much FFXI changed.

It certainly would be instructive if people remembered this history when bashing this game like it will always be like this forever and nothing will ever change. The real question is if Squenix can fix this game while there is anybody still willing to play it.
 

Cmagus

Member
sky said:
I haven't played in like a week...

... and I only just realized that :(

Same I played last night for abit but once i started doing the leves and a little crafting I shut it off I really can't be bothered.I started making the run to Gridania and like half way through I was just like this is such a waste of time I'm gonna spend the next 20 minutes running instead of just playing.
 

DrDogg

Member
Unknown Soldier said:
It certainly would be instructive if people remembered this history when bashing this game like it will always be like this forever and nothing will ever change. The real question is if Squenix can fix this game while there is anybody still willing to play it.

I don't think many of us are saying the game will never get better. In fact, I think you're putting that in people's mouths more than people are actually saying it. The only point that I'm seeing here is that people know the game is shit now and the Nov/Dec updates won't be enough to take it to where it needs to be.

I personally expect to start having fun by the PS3 release. If I'm not, there's a very good chance I'll take a break and wait for the fun to be patched in. I think most people here expect the game to come into it's own at the PS3 release or around the one year mark or first expansion.
 
Explain this to me - how is Wada able to keep his job? FFXIII was for all intents and purposes a disappointment, FFXIV is done, that MMO had disastrous launch. Versus is no-where in sight.

How can such a moron keep his job?
 

Ravidrath

Member
Castor Krieg said:
Explain this to me - how is Wada able to keep his job? FFXIII was for all intents and purposes a disappointment, FFXIV is done, that MMO had disastrous launch. Versus is no-where in sight.

How can such a moron keep his job?

Because he's the President and CEO of the company?

The only thing that could remove him is shareholder revolt or personal shame, and he clearly lacks the latter.

It's likely Wada was the one that urged them to rush the game out, too. If so, that means he may have personally sabotaged what could've been the company's most successful product ever.

Their most successful product before was Final Fantasy XI before, and given enough development time, it seems possible that XIV could've surpassed it. It seems unlikely that can happen now, regardless of whether or not they "regain the players' trust."
 
Ravidrath said:
Because he's the President and CEO of the company?

The only thing that could remove him is shareholder revolt or personal shame, and he clearly lacks the latter.

This is what I meant. Isn't S-E stock on a downward spiral, and lost 40% last year?
 

Ravidrath

Member
Castor Krieg said:
This is what I meant. Isn't S-E stock on a downward spiral, and lost 40% last year?

Who knows... with the dollar so low compared to the yen and the general worldwide economy, I'm not sure that's something you can blame on Wada.

If they were going to get rid of him, they probably would've done it already.
 

Kintaro

Worships the porcelain goddess
Castor Krieg said:
Explain this to me - how is Wada able to keep his job? FFXIII was for all intents and purposes a disappointment, FFXIV is done, that MMO had disastrous launch. Versus is no-where in sight.

How can such a moron keep his job?

Final Fantasy XIII has sold over 6 million copies so far. Its sold faster than any other FF ever in the US.

Sorry, but Wada's job is well intact. Even with FFXIV's sales. In the end, if they can turn the game around and gain a decent userbase, they will still end up profiting.

I'm not saying SE hasn't slipped, but Wada isn't going anywhere.
 

Awntawn

Member
jiggle said:
imo they're comparable
cuz FFXI launched with a lv50 cap also
lv85 didn't come about until this year
When XI launched with the 50 cap it was WAAAAAY slower than XIV is right now
 
Kintaro said:
Final Fantasy XIII has sold over 6 million copies so far. Its sold faster than any other FF ever in the US.

Sorry, but Wada's job is well intact. Even with FFXIV's sales. In the end, if they can turn the game around and gain a decent userbase, they will still end up profiting.

I'm not saying SE hasn't slipped, but Wada isn't going anywhere.

More to the point, people don't realize just how long Wada has been President and CEO. He was President and CEO of Squaresoft before the merger and he oversaw the glory years on the PSX with FFVII, which broke Final Fantasy out of Japan and made it the worldwide franchise it is today. He oversaw the successful PS2 years with FFX, my favorite of the modern era, and FFXI. It should not escape anybody's notice that after the Square-Enix merger, even though Wada was the President and CEO of the company that was acquired, he retained the top post. Enix basically acquired Squaresoft through a stock swap because Squaresoft's value was in the toilet after the spectacular theatrical failure of Final Fantasy: The Spirits Within. Nevertheless the acquirers saw fit to keep the acquired President and CEO for the merged company.

Say what you will about Squenix's missteps in the HD consoles era, and to be perfectly honest, SE's screwups are pretty much in line with the screwups made by the other big Japanese game publishers this gen. Wada has kept his job for a decade and a half because he actually did know what he was doing. It's fashionable to bash FFXIII but it did sell more than 5 million copies worldwide, making it the single most successful Japanese-developed console title this generation. FFXIV did manage to eke out 600k sales despite almost universally terrible word-of-mouth and reviews. And we still have FF Versus XIII in the pipeline. And for anyone who cares, Crisis Core and Dissidia both sold well and Dissidia Duodecim is in the pipeline.

The malaise which has infected JP developers this past decade has hurt Squenix as badly as the other big companies. The brain-drain from Squenix has been tremendous, starting with Hironobu Sakaguchi leaving, and followed out the door by Nobuo Uematsu, Yasumi Matsuno, and Koichi Ishii (Mana series). After Uematsu left, his fellow composers Hitoshi Sakimoto (FFXII) and Masashi Hamauzu (FFXIII) also left the company. Right now, Squenix is using a famous character and scenario designer (belts-and-buckles Tetsuya Nomura) and a famous scenario writer (Yoshinori Kitase) as executive leadership of product development teams. No, that isn't good, and it reflects in the products Squenix is making these days. Oh, right, the other guy who's leading a development team is Akitoshi Kawazu, famous for making one of the worst games Squaresoft ever released (Unlimited Saga), and his team has been consistently producing shitty games this whole decade for the DS and Wii, namely the Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles series.

No, things are not good at Squenix, and it's hard to blame Wada for everything, even though it's always easy to point a finger at the CEO. Wada is surrounded by people who obviously don't know what they are doing because the people who do know what they are doing have all quit the company. And it's not as if Wada isn't fully aware his Japanese development staff are seriously stuck in second gear and failing badly at this generation, because he has overseen the acquisition of Eidos Interactive to form Square-Enix Europe. The first test of the new East-West Squenix will be Deus Ex: Human Revolution, in development at the new Eidos Montreal studio made up mostly of people who were tired of Ubisoft Montreal and quit. It's a 3-continent collaboration, with Squenix Japan's Visual Works studio supplying cutscenes and additional story work, Square-Enix Europe/Eidos supervising the project, and Eidos Montreal doing the development and scenario design. Squenix is pretty far ahead of the curve in the current movement among the Japanese developers in trying to collaborate with Western developers and DX:HR will be the make-or-break project for this new paradigm.
 

Jinko

Member
It's still Wada's fault, if he is surrounded be people who don't know what they are doing he should be acting on that.

Part the reason SE is failing is because there is no new blood or new idea's coming into the company. (the exact thing keiji inafune was talking about in his interview)

FF13 may have sold well but as far as Final Fantasy games go it was pretty pathetic.
 

JudgeN

Member
Jinko said:
I think some of you are missing the point like Forbiden said, with the SP so random it hards to say "this is the SP" i get an hour.

Even at 11's worst grind you still felt as if you were making progress, 14 feels like you are wading in glue, it makes is so much worse especially because there is nothing to actual strive towards.

There is nothing at cap waiting for us, the most we have to look forward to is main story quest which had nice pacing up to rank 20, after the rank 20 quest though it feels like a slog to get to the next story point.

I get what he's saying and I agree random SP is shitty and should be changed to static SP. But the reason FFXI grind had progress was because the game was out for a year 1/2 before NA got its hands on it.

I'm going to ask a general question for anyone because I'm curious as Ive never played any other MMO other then FFXI.

How does FFXIV stack up with other MMO's at launch in terms of content/max level?

How was WoW when it was first released, did it have max level content day 1? what about Aion? Eve? City of Heroes? Etc?

I'm asking to give a sort of apples to apples comparison. I think it will help put FFXIV in more light for people who haven't really played MMO's. Thanks for anyone who takes the time to answer :lol
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
SE celeb marketing fail. :lol

http://www.ffxivblog.com/content.php/446-History-function-reveals-flaw-in-SE-s-JP-Marketing!


...But when Square Enix released the "History/Achievement" feature on Lodestone a couple of days ago, they accidentally dropped the balls, and revealed that 2/7 of those celebrities wern't really doing their homework, so Square Enix was just writing Blogs of adventures that these celebrities didn't even go through, and yea was caught by Japanese players.
 

DrDogg

Member
My video card is crashing... again.

It was fine for the last few days with ZERO crashes, then suddenly this morning it has crashed three times in less than 15 minutes. No changes have been made on my end, and my laptop has been used for NOTHING other than XIV. I haven't even opened a browser window on it.

The only possible thing I can think of now is that it's the dust storm in Ul'dah. When it started this morning, my card crashed shortly after, and when I logged back in, it was going again... and I crashed within a minute of logging in.

Even if this is the issue, it wasn't a problem in the first few weeks I played, when I spent most of my time in Ul'dah, so I'm still assuming it's a problem on Square's end. I've tried finding a program that will increase my GPU fan speed, but I've found nothing that works for an ATI Mobility Radeon. -_-
 

Cmagus

Member
I picked this up today to play for abit but is anyone noticing lag badly? I dunno last little while I have been lagging uncontrollably and on the days I have played I have almost always fallen through the map at some point.I attached a fun video running under uldah but yeah I dunno whats going on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ocaPS0PZiUA
 

DrDogg

Member
Nevermind about the dust storm. I logged in with no dust storm and still crashed. SE fails... severely.

Rentahamster said:

I really don't understand what SE was going for here. It seems like everything is geared toward the DoW classes. Feel like ranking up a crafting class, well only Alchemist and Culinarian use DoM stats... everything else uses DoW stats for their primary tool.

It's almost like they want you to use points across all stats... which basically defeats the purpose of giving us the option. Why let us distribute our own points if it's best to just distribute them evenly? Why use a fatigue system when it's best not to rank up multiple classes?

I really feel as though XIV is far more constrained than XI... at least in terms of stats. I could tank as a Tarutaru in XI and do a better job than many other races until endgame. I could also raise whatever craft I wanted to and be the best BLM around. But in XIV it's like I have to choose 2-3 classes if I want my stats to match up properly. :(
 

Salaadin

Member
DrDogg said:
Nevermind about the dust storm. I logged in with no dust storm and still crashed. SE fails... severely.

Have you tried one of those fan mats for laptops that blow air through them? That might help if it is an overheating issue.
 

Cmagus

Member
Oh wow Im stuck.After I fell through the map I have been trying to get out but can't I wandered around I'm like all the way out in the sea area on some island called Cactus Basin and I cant get off I tried to teleport and the game crashes :lol .

wtf.jpg


wtf2.jpg
 

Salaadin

Member
Cmagus said:
Oh wow Im stuck.After I fell through the map I have been trying to get out but can't I wandered around I'm like all the way out in the sea area on some island called Cactus Basin and I cant get off I tried to teleport and the game crashes :lol .

I fell through the boat once and ended up in some underwater cave that looked too much like Cassiopeia Hollow. I also logged and teleported and couldnt get away. WHen the boat docked, it shot me underneath the docks and I had to find a weird piece of land that clipped down to where I was. I touched that and it shot me back up to land.
 

DrDogg

Member
I officially give up for today. I *hate* PC gaming with a passion.

- Game works fine for 6 weeks; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly for 3 days
then
- Game works fine for a little less than a week; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly for an hour
then
- Game works fine 3 hours; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly until I give up

Throughout all this, changes to the driver seemed to have no effect.

*hate*
 

CrankyJay

Banned
DrDogg said:
I officially give up for today. I *hate* PC gaming with a passion.

- Game works fine for 6 weeks; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly for 3 days
then
- Game works fine for a little less than a week; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly for an hour
then
- Game works fine 3 hours; zero video card crashes
then
- Video card crashes repeatedly until I give up

Throughout all this, changes to the driver seemed to have no effect.

*hate*

sounds like overheating.
 
CrankyJay said:
sounds like overheating.

Yup. Especially since he is using a laptop. If you cram an even decently powerful enough GPU into a laptop which can actually run FFXIV, you're going to run into cooling issues. It's why people have always steered clear of the gigantic gaming lapzillas from Alienware and their ilk, because you just can't dissipate that kind of heat output effectively in a tiny laptop chassis.

FFXIV has very, very variable demands on the GPU as it's basically CPU-limited in some situations and GPU-limited in others. So I'm willing to bet that he rarely if ever crashes in cities, where there are lots of other people around and the CPU is the bottleneck and the GPU isn't working hard (and therefore not hot). But if he goes out into the field alone or with a small party to fight mobs, then the CPU is more idle and the GPU is being pushed to it's limit. Were I troubleshooting his laptop, I would see WHERE he is in the world when he crashes and I would be running the game in a window and using a temperature monitoring program on my CPU and GPU. I use Core Temp for CPU temperature monitoring and MSI Afterburner for GPU temperature monitoring.
 

CrankyJay

Banned
Unknown Soldier said:
Yup. Especially since he is using a laptop. If you cram an even decently powerful enough GPU into a laptop which can actually run FFXIV, you're going to run into cooling issues. It's why people have always steered clear of the gigantic gaming lapzillas from Alienware and their ilk, because you just can't dissipate that kind of heat output effectively in a tiny laptop chassis.

FFXIV has very, very variable demands on the GPU as it's basically CPU-limited in some situations and GPU-limited in others. So I'm willing to bet that he rarely if ever crashes in cities, where there are lots of other people around and the CPU is the bottleneck and the GPU isn't working hard (and therefore not hot). But if he goes out into the field alone or with a small party to fight mobs, then the CPU is more idle and the GPU is being pushed to it's limit. Were I troubleshooting his laptop, I would see WHERE he is in the world when he crashes and I would be running the game in a window and using a temperature monitoring program on my CPU and GPU. I use Core Temp for CPU temperature monitoring and MSI Afterburner for GPU temperature monitoring.

I actually torched a video card playing massive amounts of FF 11 Online, and I attributed the issue to me not taking car of removing dust from my tower. It looked like a bunch of dust got caked on the video card fan and that ultimately burnt out the fan motor from the additional weight. Luckily I had it on warranty from Dell and they sent me another one about 3 weeks later after jumping through all of the Dell India hoops.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
Are there any utilities that can crank up the fans on laptops? Do Speedfan or Ruvatuner even work on laptops?

Dogg - it's possible your laptop could use a nice burst of canned air to clear out some dust, as well.
 

DrDogg

Member
It's absolutely a GPU overheating issue. My problem is that the issue didn't occur for the first 8 weeks I played the game (if you include the OB). I'm not doing anything now that I didn't do before when things were fine. It doesn't matter if I'm in the city or out in the open.

I've tried to find ways to increase the fan speed on my laptop, but I can't find any way to do it. The laptop is only 4 months old, so while I'll give the canned air a shot, I can't imagine it's so dusty it's causing the GPU to overheat. I'm looking into other cooling measures though. I'm open to suggestions.

Either way, in March I'm switching to the PS3 version and selling this laptop (which was my intention from day 1). I don't like PC gaming for this very reason. I would have just upgraded my desktop, but it's an HP mini-tower and a decent video card would not physically fit inside. I was not pleased, but considering I use it primarily for a media server, I couldn't complain. :lol
 
DrDogg said:
It's absolutely a GPU overheating issue. My problem is that the issue didn't occur for the first 8 weeks I played the game (if you include the OB). I'm not doing anything now that I didn't do before when things were fine. It doesn't matter if I'm in the city or out in the open.

I've tried to find ways to increase the fan speed on my laptop, but I can't find any way to do it. The laptop is only 4 months old, so while I'll give the canned air a shot, I can't imagine it's so dusty it's causing the GPU to overheat. I'm looking into other cooling measures though. I'm open to suggestions.

Either way, in March I'm switching to the PS3 version and selling this laptop (which was my intention from day 1). I don't like PC gaming for this very reason. I would have just upgraded my desktop, but it's an HP mini-tower and a decent video card would not physically fit inside. I was not pleased, but considering I use it primarily for a media server, I couldn't complain. :lol

It was working b/c it could do the job but it was still taking wear and tear during those 8 weeks, and then it finally snapped is what it sounds like.
 

DrDogg

Member
Rentahamster said:
Have you tried turning off the shadows and physics and lowering the textures and resolution, too?

Yep...

demosthenes said:
It was working b/c it could do the job but it was still taking wear and tear during those 8 weeks, and then it finally snapped is what it sounds like.

But then it worked fine for nearly a week after the first couple days of crashes...
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
In these kinds of situations where nothing seems to work, I usually just fall back to: Reinstalling Windows.

Not sure how that would work on a laptop and if they gave you an OS CD or just a recovery partition or something...I dunno what they do nowadays I always just build my own PCs.
 
JudgeN said:
How was WoW when it was first released, did it have max level content day 1?

WoW launched with a metric shit-ton of content, especially compared to the MMOs of the day. Something like 40 zones, 1300 quests, 17 five-man dungeons, and I believe 2 forty-man raids.

DrDogg said:
It's absolutely a GPU overheating issue. My problem is that the issue didn't occur for the first 8 weeks I played the game (if you include the OB). I'm not doing anything now that I didn't do before when things were fine. It doesn't matter if I'm in the city or out in the open.

Does it only crash when running FFXIV? What about other graphics intensive games or just generally?
 

Cmagus

Member
I truly do not get this lag situation.For me this game never ever plays consistently constant stuttering, falling through the map almost everytime I play cause the game freezes for periods.I've dropped the graphics to lowest possible to the point where it looks like shit.

I play Aion its fine, I play battlefield 2 its fine and any other online game runs fine but not final fucking fantasy XIV like holy shit my patience for this game is fucking gone.Tonight my character is just standing there not doing shit i cant even tell what damage I am doing.My internet connection is strong and my computer is spec'd more than enough to play this game.I have tried 4 different servers now and the same thing I just don't get it I really don't.I am so done with this game I can't be bothered anymore.
 

Anno

Member
Any idea if there is or will be a trial coming out? Or buddy pass things? I wasn't able to find anything through the Googles. I'm pretty sure I'd like the game but rather dubious that my computer could handle it without exploding.
 

Teknoman

Member
Thats really strange. I've never had any strange graphic glitches/fall through map issues or anything serious...aside from one or two random crashes awhile back. No real lag problems either, except maybe players not loading for awhile in dense areas. Dont really get stuttering aside from hitting certain packed city areas for the first time.

The only "problem" i've had most of the time was the semi transparent head glitch, when you return from getting killed.

As far as free trials go, you could probably download the client from FFXIVcore and then use a buddy pass someone might have laying around.
 

jiggle

Member
game is REALLY becoming gratingly repetitive :/
trapped in a cycle of an exact same set of leves with no end in sight
digging through the old posts in this thread, i realized it's been 25 days since i first graduated to rank30 leves
and in that time, i only gained 4 ranks
so at this rate, won't be seeing any new leves until middle/end of December
fucked up :/
 

Teknoman

Member
Well I know the November patch isnt adding NMs, but as long as it adds new leves, and other new content as well as the promised fixes, that should help.
 

Rentahamster

Rodent Whores
jiggle said:
i realized it's been 25 days since i first graduated to rank30 leves
and in that time, i only gained 4 ranks
so at this rate, won't be seeing any new leves until middle/end of December
fucked up :/
Er, once you hit rank 33, that's it for leves. There aren't any rank 50 leves.


There is a way to gain ranks fast. And it's not leves. Don't do leves by yourself expecting to gain lots of SP.
 
Im still enjoying the game. Dinged rank 44 last night, and going for 45 today. Just sucks cause fatigue kicked in Saturday and I do not reset until Wed :lol
 
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