Support NeoGAF

[Lucis]

This is exactly how I feel. Back when FFXI launched back 10 years ago? I was so caught up with exploring the then massive world that it took me nearly a year to hit the first cap. The world being so big had you travel to all these obscure places to level and that really hit it in line with the adventure and journey to end game.

Yes, it was satisfying.

But I'm not sure I can do it again, hell, I'm not certain that SE could do it again without having people cry terrorism at them. It's an old system and it's definitely not user friendly - but I was glad to be apart of it.

Time has changed and we're set to play something within comfort until we hit cap and try difficult things again, I'm fine with that. A lot of the OF people are too caught up nostalgia that they don't realise exactly what it is they're asking for.

All I am referring to was mob grind.
Sense of adventure? I am all for it. A bit slower progress? I am not against it. I REMEMBER how it was back then. Getting Genkai quest item was a MAJOR task and it was fun. Getting your AF felt epic. I thought it was a big deal when I got Sandoria Rank 10. The first time that I killed Zirat Boss's boss in Tulia. The first time getting all 4 triggers to spawn Kirin. Camping Kraken with friends for hours... Wiping on Fenrir when it first came out... Then Diablo when that came out... One of the COP quest where you first saw bahamut... and etc etc.

That's the fun I had, not the mob grind though.

 

[IonicSnake]

I'm not really trying to be facetious here, but are you saying dungeon leveling isn't largely mindless monster grind?

Of course it is if it was the only thing you could do to level. Now you have quest, dungeons and if you wish grinding monsters though it isn't as effective as the other two.

 

[Ala Alba]

On that note, if they randomized dungeon enemies, I'd have nothing to complain about!

Huh, that's actually a really good idea. Even if it was only four or five variations (ideally there would be more), that would go a long way towards keeping dungeon runs fresh.

I also have hopes that there will be some "outside" dungeons, at least for a nice change of scenery.

 

[ebil]

I'm not really trying to be facetious here, but are you saying dungeon leveling isn't largely mindless monster grind?

I'm not saying outdoor leveling is the holy grail of exp or anything or that 1.x exp parties were somehow mind-blowingly different from leveling in dungeons, but, really, come on. If I'm gonna have to kill hordes monsters I'd rather do it in the less predictable, more exciting scenario, which the outdoor scenario wins by a bit.

On that note, if they randomized dungeon enemies, I'd have nothing to complain about!

OK, I see your point a bit better now.
Randomizing dungeon encounters to keep you on your toes would definitely be a step in the right direction (this would make for a nice suggestion on the feedback forums), even though to be honest I never felt I was challenged at all during open world xp partying in V1.x.
Worse than that, I never felt that I was "learning the ropes", so to say, and I had to actually learn how to play my job(s) at cap on more difficult and gimmicky encounters. The levelling process never prepared you for endgame, which is something I really didn't like, and I feel like the learning curve will at least be a lot smoother in ARR.

 

[Jinko]

I can't speak for everyone, but it's not the same at all.

Instances have little to no variation.

Mobile outdoor roam grinding is constantly changing.

That may not seem like a big difference but it's huge.

Except in most cases people pick one monster type and grind for hours and hours, Natalan and Raptor parties for example.

I have to admit that dungeon grind is just as bad as open world grind in terms of variety and fun factor lol, but I suppose at least you get gear from dungeons.

This is exactly how I feel. Back when FFXI launched back 10 years ago? I was so caught up with exploring the then massive world that it took me nearly a year to hit the first cap. The world being so big had you travel to all these obscure places to level and that really hit it in line with the adventure and journey to end game.

Yes, it was satisfying.

But I'm not sure I can do it again, hell, I'm not certain that SE could do it again without having people cry terrorism at them. It's an old system and it's definitely not user friendly - but I was glad to be apart of it.

Time has changed and we're set to play something within comfort until we hit cap and try difficult things again, I'm fine with that. A lot of the OF people are too caught up nostalgia that they don't realise exactly what it is they're asking for.

This pretty much echoes my feelings, FF11 was a great experience but I am happy to leave it in the past where it belongs.

 

[omlet]

Except in most cases people pick one monster type and grind for hours and hours, Natalan and Raptor parties for example.

You're just fixating on XI/1.x and not reading my point. Forget about XI and 1.x.

If ARR had real incentive for moving around in a group to keep scenery fresh and not "camp" all the time, like say if *coughNDAcough*

Spoiler

hunting log

was expanded on to last more than the piddly single-digit kills it does now. Or, like, what if leves scaled in such a way that they could spawn lots more monsters (rather than just increasing the level of the same number of monsters on higher difficulties) to account for a larger group of people doing them and give people an/more incentive to group up for them?

How could something like that not be, like, a great compromise, really?

Worse than that, I never felt that I was "learning the ropes", so to say, and I had to actually learn how to play my job(s) at cap on more difficult and gimmicky encounters. The levelling process never prepared you for endgame, which is something I really didn't like, and I feel like the learning curve will at least be a lot smoother in ARR.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=49735749&postcount=1795

:x

 

[ebil]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=49735749&postcount=1795
:x

Again, I fail to see your point here, because in the post you linked (correct me if I'm wrong), you're mainly talking about mindless questing while I mentioned low to mid-level raiding fully integrated to the levelling process/experience (which actually provides you with the tools and knowledge that will be necessary when you reach endgame content, something that questing and XP parties, in my opinion, don't, at least in FF14).

If your point was lamenting the fact that endgame is all that matters in MMOs nowadays, which is the other part of the post you linked, I can't argue with that, as this is true.

Edit: don't get me wrong, I'm all for grouping, and I think you have some good ideas. But your ideas, albeit good, are not what the OF's asking about. They want straight-up FF11 style xp parties. Again, I think you should make some suggestions on the appropriate forums.

 

[omlet]

Again, I fail to see your point here, because in the post you linked (correct me if I'm wrong), you're mainly talking about mindless questing while I mentioned low to mid-level raiding fully integrated to the levelling process/experience (which actually provides you with the tools and knowledge that will be necessary when you reach endgame content, something that questing and XP parties, in my opinion, don't, at least in FF14).

If your point was lamenting the fact that endgame is all that matters in MMOs nowadays, which is the other part of the post you linked, I can't argue with that, as this is true.

Was agreeing with you on the whole leveling doesn't really teach you how to play "real" content thing (in 1.x specifically, but other games as well).

Edit: don't get me wrong, I'm all for grouping, and I think you have some good ideas. But your ideas, albeit good, are not what the OF's asking about. They want straight-up FF11 style xp parties.

Yeah, and they're nuts.

 

[Jinko]

You're just fixating on XI/1.x and not reading my point. Forget about XI and 1.x.

If ARR had real incentive for moving around in a group to keep scenery fresh and not "camp" all the time, like say if *coughNDAcough*

Spoiler

hunting log

was expanded on to last more than the piddly single-digit kills it does now. Or, like, what if leves scaled in such a way that they could spawn lots more monsters (rather than just increasing the level of the same number of monsters on higher difficulties) to account for a larger group of people doing them and give people an/more incentive to group up for them?

How could something like that not be, like, a great compromise, really?

Yea not disagreeing with you really, a repeatable hunters log I would definitely be in favour of.

 

[Riposte]

I am getting more excited about the aspect of this game.

How old guard argue that grinding mobs for hours in "open world" is better than anything ARR has to offer now still puzzle me.

I don't really want this, but I'm perfectly fine with a bunch of challenging roadblocks which require others (they don't even have to be that challenging, just enough to encourage player growth). I would gladly trade away grinding for level limit quests (except more and earlier) and stuff like AF quests, that's just a win-win in my book. To me good progression in one you find in something like Monster Hunter (gear is "levels" in that game and content is locked until you face a harder challenge).

EDIT: When is the next time will I be able to make my roegadyn?

 

[N.A]

On that note, if they randomized dungeon enemies, I'd have nothing to complain about!

That's actually a great idea.

They could even kill two birds with one stone by having rare NM's occasionally appear in them like PSO2.

 

[we.are.the.armada]

Hey guys, I'm not up on current events - beta happening this weekend?

 

[Allard]

Hey guys, I'm not up on current events - beta happening this weekend?

Yes, 8PM PDT the 15th to 2:00 AM PDT March 18th, more or less the same time period as the last one.

 

[we.are.the.armada]

Yes, 8PM PDT the 15th to 2:00 AM PDT March 18th, more or less the same time period as the last one.

Hey thanks!

 

[Xux]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=49735749&postcount=1795

:x

Probably has nothing to do with what you were getting at but I think it'd be neat if they just dropped levels(edit' affect on statistics. Have progression boiled down to learning abilities, stat allocation, expanding gear options with less shear escalation, content tied to quest progression, etc.

It kinda flies in the face of the people that need to feel stronger after playing for 100+ hours than someone who just booted up the game for the first time but I think it'd just be more interesting.

 

[Ala Alba]

Probably has nothing to do with what you were getting at but I think it'd be neat if they just dropped levels. Have progression boiled down to learning abilities, stat allocation, expanding gear options with less shear escalation, content tied to quest progression, etc.

It kinda flies in the face of the people that need to feel stronger after playing for 100+ hours than someone who just booted up the game for the first time but I think it'd just be more interesting.

I think that would be interesting to see how much enjoyment would be affected by the loss of leveling.

To be honest, I've thought about that kind of game as well. I thought, "oh, take out the leveling, make it purely gear-based progression, with abilities tied to equipment or something. And then make it real-time action combat! Yeah, sounds awesome!"...

...but recently I realized that I pretty much just described Monster Hunter.

 

[Xux]

Wow, I worded that weird looking back at it. I meant more along the lines of stats not increasing by themselves when you level up. Instead you just gain allocatable points, traits, actions, and access to different gear. Start everyone with level 50 stats but only their level one action and access to unspecialized armor and have them level up by gaining access to more abilities, custom stats, and more role specific armor.

 

[zulfate]

watching some videos: i love that some of the inspiration for the game seems to be drawn from final fantasy I-V, watching everyone standing around in AF gear fighting makes me "feel" like i am just one of the characters i was controlling when i was a kid.when i first played WOW i wanted to feel like one of the grunts from warcraft of old, all the media at the time were saying "it feels like your just a soldier from warcraft but through a different perspective" but sadly i didnt feel like that at the time but i still very much enjoyed the game. this game actually gives me the feeling of playing an old FF.

i still got some noobs questions, as much as i been reading interviews and watching videos i still cant find a decent FAQ about all the changes this game is getting and how certain mechanics will work.

1.leveling up tech tree/grid sphere/junction or is it all jobs only?

2.can you allocate skills points like str, dex or does that come from the gear?

3.how does the materia system work?

thanks!

 

[Xux]

watching some videos: i love that some of the inspiration for the game seems to be drawn from final fantasy I-V, watching everyone standing around in AF gear fighting makes me "feel" like i am just one of the characters i was controlling when i was a kid.when i first played WOW i wanted to feel like one of the grunts from warcraft of old, all the media at the time were saying "it feels like your just a soldier from warcraft but through a different perspective" but sadly i didnt feel like that at the time but i still very much enjoyed the game. this game actually gives me the feeling of playing an old FF.

i still got some noobs questions, as much as i been reading interviews and watching videos i still cant find a decent FAQ about all the changes this game is getting and how certain mechanics will work.

1.leveling up tech tree/grid sphere/junction or is it all jobs only?

It's all jobs. You learn abilities through leveling up but some you have to quest for.

2.can you allocate skills points like str, dex or does that come from the gear?

After level ten, you start getting points to allocate but it's not really enough to offset gear.

3.how does the materia system work?

thanks!

As you use equipment you have equipped, you gain a "spirit bond" with it and when that maxes out you can transform it into a not-completely-random materia that you can then attach to certain armor with the help of a "catalyst" that you also have to buy or get through gathering. The first attachment or "meld" is guaranteed but the success rate falls through the floor after the second meld and failure means losing the materia and equipment.

 

[zulfate]

It's all jobs. You learn abilities through leveling up but some you have to quest for.

After level ten, you start getting points to allocate but it's not really enough to offset gear.

As you use equipment you have equipped, you gain a "spirit bond" with it and when that maxes out you can transform it into a not-completely-random materia that you can then attach to certain armor with the help of a "catalyst" that you also have to buy or get through gathering. The first attachment or "meld" is guaranteed but the success rate falls through the floor after the second meld and failure means losing the materia and equipment.

questing for skills sounds awesome me, it makes you feel like you earned it. i liked how guild wars 1 did it, you only get skills through questing.

materia sounds weird but unique and cool lets hope it works, if not then well who knows. maybe we can just make materia system into a gems socket like every other rpg.

 

[Xux]

Oh yeah, that's how materia worked in the original; they've said it'll be different but not in what way.

 

[Ravidrath]

Oh yeah, that's how materia worked in the original; they've said it'll be different but not in what way.

With gear becoming bound as soon as it gets any Spirit Bond now, there isn't any need to destroy gear through materia any more. So a more standard socket system could make economic sense now.

 

[Kokonoe]

Are they going to send more invites this weekend? Getting tired of FFXI again and would like to try this out already.

-edit-

I'm late to this but...

[1:16:03]
Q: How will we fight notorious monsters in A Realm Reborn? Will they only appear in FATE battles and dungeons?

A: For the most part, NMs will only appear in FATE battles. Once a FATE has started nearby, it will be marked on the map, so players that join will notice the NM right away. We want these battles to be a fun experience that brings players together. Some very large NMs are hiding out there somewhere, so stay alert!

Wow, they got rid of one of the most annoying aspects of FFXI. Pure awesome.

 

[N.A]

New blog post: http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/blog/post/253

Greetings, seekers of knowledge.
Fernehalwes here, and for this post I come to you with an actual scoop du jour!
While Project Manager M was diligently crafting away, I slipped over to the BG design section and snapped a few shots of what I’d bet my Meteor Survivor shirt to be...magitek armour!

But what kind of area would house this many─ OH...　

Now, while the map and armour are obviously still just mockups, word has it that Yoshi-P has already given the final OK on the designs, so now comes the polish.
But why wait for polish, when I can borrow the keys to the prototype and take a little test spin on the internal servers...

♪Rollin' in my 2.0, with my mag-top down so my hair can blow.♪
♪The Miqo'te on standby, waving just to s─ Hey! Bad squirrel! Bad squirrel!
Fernehalwes

 

[Darryl]

Wow, they got rid of one of the most annoying aspects of FFXI. Pure awesome.

they don't feel like NMs now though, they just big mobs that no one really cares about

 

[Riposte]

FATE kind of sounds like it is just a clusterfuck sort of thing. Send unorganized bodies at a big target.

 

[Kesagiri]

New blog post: http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/blog/post/253

Wow, that magitek armor. Looking good.

 

[Munba]

That magitek is so nice. :0 The 'hangar' screens reminds me Xenogears in some way.

 

[Xux]

FATE kind of sounds like it is just a clusterfuck sort of thing. Send unorganized bodies at a big target.

Yeah, that's how it is in the Beta with the entire server in the same couple zones. Better hope your moves don't have spell casting times 'cause it's pretty fast paced!!

Though, I've heard the highest level one is involving enough to require effort.

 

[Jinko]

Meh it looks ok, not a huge fan of magitek.

 

[ebil]

Wow at that Magitek Armor!

Wow, I worded that weird looking back at it. I meant more along the lines of stats not increasing by themselves when you level up. Instead you just gain allocatable points, traits, actions, and access to different gear. Start everyone with level 50 stats but only their level one action and access to unspecialized armor and have them level up by gaining access to more abilities, custom stats, and more role specific armor.

Kind of looks like what The Secret World tried to do, actually. There are no "real" levels in TSW, you earn points by doing quests you're then free to spend them on a wheel gaining access to new gear options and abilities. Specialized stats are all tied to your gear. While the concept looks nice on paper, it just hides levelling up behind another, rather complicated, system.

 

[Kokonoe]

FATE kind of sounds like it is just a clusterfuck sort of thing. Send unorganized bodies at a big target.

Perfect, just like campaign and besieged, my two favorite things in FFXI.

 

[Jarnet87]

I like the look of the Magitek Armor, just hope it will attainable and not some crazy quest chain item or drop lol.

I doubt I'll be playing the beta tonight. Starts at 11:00 PM EST for me, and then we will probably see some login issues per usual. Think I'm lvl 17. Finished up all the quests and the hunts besides the does in South Shroud which are too high, guess I'll just do runs of TTD till I'm 20.

 

[Babalu.]

wow that magitech armor looks awesome.

but i loved NM's and how you can just run around exploring and see a random monster with a different name.

so far the fates have been horrible. even as an archer its just 100+ enemies respawning.

you get 1 or 2 hits in and they are dead and do it again and again and then get a medal.


if later on they have like, 1 giant monster instead of a zerg rush of little ones, it might be good. Like Tera's BAM fights.

 

[Lucis]

I like the look of the Magitek Armor, just hope it will attainable and not some crazy quest chain item or drop lol.

I doubt I'll be playing the beta tonight. Starts at 11:00 PM EST for me, and then we will probably see some login issues per usual. Think I'm lvl 17. Finished up all the quests and the hunts besides the does in South Shroud which are too high, guess I'll just do runs of TTD till I'm 20.

They are not hard if you get a party... I did them at 14.

At 18 you get a quest which after you finish the chain, unlock you to get a free boost to 25

wow that magitech armor looks awesome.

but i loved NM's and how you can just run around exploring and see a random monster with a different name.

so far the fates have been horrible. even as an archer its just 100+ enemies respawning.

you get 1 or 2 hits in and they are dead and do it again and again and then get a medal.


if later on they have like, 1 giant monster instead of a zerg rush of little ones, it might be good. Like Tera's BAM fights.

They do, as early as level 14 i think in south of central shroud right under the cliff where hakkuen is . There are more later on. South shroud one at level 30+ that's pretty cool, giant collosus rock

 

[Jarnet87]

They will probably will have fates with NM monsters and big encounters. I remember there was a fate near where the skeletons at the southern part of East Shroud, and it was just a named mob, nothing else.

We've already seen that they have added cool monsters to quests, we saw the big malboro and rock golem already, so I have to think that we will see the same in fates as they progress.

 

[Relaxed Muscle]

FATE will be better when they aren't like 1k people in every area.

 

[theSlacker]

I like the look of the Magitek Armor, just hope it will attainable and not some crazy quest chain item or drop lol.

I just hope we never see stuff like it on a cash shop.

 

[N.A]

I like the look of the Magitek Armor, just hope it will attainable and not some crazy quest chain item or drop lol.

I doubt I'll be playing the beta tonight. Starts at 11:00 PM EST for me, and then we will probably see some login issues per usual. Think I'm lvl 17. Finished up all the quests and the hunts besides the does in South Shroud which are too high, guess I'll just do runs of TTD till I'm 20.

I remember Yoshi saying it will be relatively easy to get.

 

[Munba]

I remember Yoshi saying it will be relatively easy to get.

He said it could be a reward from the garlean's story.

 

[ROBOKITTYZILLA]

I just hope we never see stuff like it on a cash shop.

I just hope we never see a cash shop.

 

[Jijidasu]

So I ventured back to FFXI on a trial to see how the game had changed and I honestly can't see why people want the old schemes back. It took me nearly 3 minutes to kill a Lv.1 Mandragora outside Windurst as a Warrior. Why do people want this?

 

[QisTopTier]

So I ventured back to FFXI on a trial to see how the game had changed and I honestly can't see why people want the old schemes back. It took me nearly 3 minutes to kill a Lv.1 Mandragora outside Windurst as a Warrior. Why do people want this?

http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/19364-Combat-is-too-fast-for-strategy-and-cooperation!

:lol

 

[Jijidasu]

http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Test/threads/19364-Combat-is-too-fast-for-strategy-and-cooperation!

:lol

The time invested/reward ratio is too low if we're spending minutes killing field monsters at that level. No one has time for that any more!

 

[Ricker]

Goddamit,11 PM EST,so late for me lol,might logging to see if Toonberry is still full up and play till midnight...did they send anymore beta invites since Phase 1 started or is it pretty much the same amount of people...?

 

[Riposte]

So I ventured back to FFXI on a trial to see how the game had changed and I honestly can't see why people want the old schemes back. It took me nearly 3 minutes to kill a Lv.1 Mandragora outside Windurst as a Warrior. Why do people want this?

If I had a choice, I rather have fewer, but longer (and more damaging) battles across the board (that could mean a strong enemy or multiple enemies at once that are not so easy to crowd control). So, like, the complete opposite of what XI's exp parties turned into at endgame.


I'm probably going to log on just to mess with the character creator. Totally not interested in this phase of the beta.

 

[SnakeLinkSonic]

So I ventured back to FFXI on a trial to see how the game had changed and I honestly can't see why people want the old schemes back. It took me nearly 3 minutes to kill a Lv.1 Mandragora outside Windurst as a Warrior. Why do people want this?

Loose screws.

 

[Jinko]

Tried moving items and selling them on a retainer today ... SERIOUSLY !!! ?

They still don't get it, try it out

http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Te...iners-Feedback?p=300257&viewfull=1#post300257

 

[Xux]

Wow at that Magitek Armor!


Kind of looks like what The Secret World tried to do, actually. There are no "real" levels in TSW, you earn points by doing quests you're then free to spend them on a wheel gaining access to new gear options and abilities. Specialized stats are all tied to your gear. While the concept looks nice on paper, it just hides levelling up behind another, rather complicated, system.

Those systems are already there, though; I just want base stats to stay the same regardless of level; keep content relevant throughout the lifetime of the game and not separate newcomers and longtime players and force the need of a Level Sync system.

Tried moving items and selling them on a retainer today ... SERIOUSLY !!! ?

They still don't get it, try it out

http://forum.square-enix.com/ARR-Te...iners-Feedback?p=300257&viewfull=1#post300257

That second point is what disappointed me; I remember just being in shock at how awful the 1.0 system was the first time I tried it and this seems like only halfway to being improved.

 

[Riposte]

Trying to remake my character more or less (a roegadyn) and I can only make it look like he has de-aged about 10-20 years and his jaw structure totally changed. Don't quite like it.

EDIT: And yeah, can confirm I'm 21 letters long in my name :/. dropped in the e in "skoef" part of last name.