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Final Fantasy XIV |OT6| Casino Royale
- Thread starter tiggerkiddo
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PhillipCostigan
Member
nah, levelling classes on your main is faster since you get an exp bonus to make up for the loss of quest exp but also don't have to do quests, so you can just do dungeons/fates to level.
only reason to level an alt is if you have every class at 50 on your main already. Or if you want to gear two classes at the same time with poetics/raid gear.
Or if you want to go through the story again... >.> (hey, I started an Alt just for this reason. I'm sure some others do as well <_< )
PhillipCostigan
Member
yeah that too, I'll probably do that at some point.
I forget if this has been posted yet but:
http://www.siliconera.com/2015/03/1...explains-heavenswards-new-jobs-planned-au-ra/
Siliconera interview with Yoship
http://www.siliconera.com/2015/03/1...explains-heavenswards-new-jobs-planned-au-ra/
Siliconera interview with Yoship
It's about the same. Alt you get quest exp, main can take a while with queues.
Munba
Member
All new jobs seems really interesting, astrologian especially.
Looks like interview is slightly more detailed stuff we already knew.
The DRK mechanic sounds great, wonder if piety tank will be a thing now. From the sounds of it, the defensive aura could work like bard songs and continuously drain MP as you can spend MP for other defensive/offensive abilities too. I assume there will be some mechanic to regain MP or else things would get ugly pretty fast. If BLMs didn't already get Convert I'd think a mechanic like that would make a lot of sense, both as a mechanic and thematically for DRK, but guess we will see. He sort of implies there may be casted spells too, THM being cross-class is definitely a possibility if so. (Surecast alone would be a must have if you wanted to cast while tanking) I really wish siliconera had cut him off at the beginning and said "WE GOT TIME" though. C'mon yoshi! Give us the hard details!
AST almost sounds like mudra but with an RNG element where you don't know what mudra you are getting. Sounds terrifying.
Quests make the leveling less painful to sit through but fate/leves/dungeons are still generally way faster, even before the buffed exp that is how people got their first 50s super fast at launch.
The DRK mechanic sounds great, wonder if piety tank will be a thing now. From the sounds of it, the defensive aura could work like bard songs and continuously drain MP as you can spend MP for other defensive/offensive abilities too. I assume there will be some mechanic to regain MP or else things would get ugly pretty fast. If BLMs didn't already get Convert I'd think a mechanic like that would make a lot of sense, both as a mechanic and thematically for DRK, but guess we will see. He sort of implies there may be casted spells too, THM being cross-class is definitely a possibility if so. (Surecast alone would be a must have if you wanted to cast while tanking) I really wish siliconera had cut him off at the beginning and said "WE GOT TIME" though. C'mon yoshi! Give us the hard details!
AST almost sounds like mudra but with an RNG element where you don't know what mudra you are getting. Sounds terrifying.
Why not just rewatch the important stuff at the inn. 93% of the story quests in this game are filler anyway.
No way it's the same. You still gotta deal with queues on alt since a lot of the story is locked behind dungeons, and you get 50% extra exp on main.
Quests make the leveling less painful to sit through but fate/leves/dungeons are still generally way faster, even before the buffed exp that is how people got their first 50s super fast at launch.
Pyros_Eien
Member
Well unlike Mudras I guess you have to check what you get, so lag wouldn't be nearly as much of an issue, unless for some reason you'd always want to draw several cards because single cards end up sucking or whatever. It's a bit like how you play around procs with BLM DPS and have to put together your rotation depending on those procs(like when you get a thunder proc during a fire cast, you use it right after the fire cast unless you already have firestarter then you use fire III then recast fire before you use thunder and such).
That sounds pretty fun, although I'm not entirely sure how much it lends itself to healer gameplay which generally requires your attention to already be split between healthbars and dodging mechanics. If all you're drawing is shitty selene buffs and stuff, it sounds just like it'd make healing more annoying than anything else. Now if you can draw like Benefiction or Virus and stuff, that sounds pretty cool(and I don't mean exactly the same skill, I mean in terms of relative power).
Either the draws adhere to some kind of pattern or they aren't significant enough to dramatically affect the flow of the battle. I just can't see pure RNG draws. "Sorry guys, 15% damage isn't showing up--- oh here it is, pull!" "Oh no we wiped to enrage because the cards were shitty." Pretty risky concept with the way battle system is set up.
I challenge somebody to make an AST nicknamed Poker Face though.
I don't know, I just like the idea of getting story quests and then going to a new area because that's where you're being led to (plus I like some of the filler quests).
Actually that's one of the things I'm looking forward to in the expansion. New Story quests that will lead me into each new area.
Rose of Eternity
Banned
These are the real dungeons though, not just story dungeons. Sastasha is basically Dead Mines, meant to ease people who have never played mmos into group content. AI wouldn't be the same thing. I've seen some genuinely new people in those early dungeons with no idea how an mmo dungeon work, so the human interaction is necessary to help teach them.
The issue with FF14 it seems is that dps queues are outrageous. I mentioned last night when I finally hit 50 on my warrior that seeing all those fate/first room dungeon grind guides seemed so weird because I did nothing but main story quests and daily roulettes all the way to 50 and I was drowning in exp. I averaged 2 levels a day on days I played. But I have instant roulette queues. I can get 150k exp in like 30 minutes. It seems the only players that have to do fates/leves in this game are dps, which is kind of weird in different ways.
As a tank, I've experienced like nothing of the world in terms of environments or lore outside of the main story and class quests - and I just teleport around instantly to wherever they tell me to go. I basically log on, queue up, get my levels, log off. So if you're getting to go around the areas and meet npcs and see mini storylines, that's sort of a trade off for not having the exp on tap from dungeons. I guess.
I didn't personally say he was a no lifer and I couldn't care less what people do with their lives as long as they're happy, but saying that just because someone is an MMO player they can't have an negative opinion of how another plays (or implying that just because we all play a lot of an MMO we're all no lifers) is a terrible opinion.
I also didn't say I wouldn't find it fun, just that I thought it was bonkers. Lots of stuff I think is bonkers would probably be fun.
cultureculture
Member
PhillipCostigan
Member
Don't know if you're familiar with League of Legends, but I'm sure you could find video of this if you wanted.
There's a champion in it called Twisted Fate, and one of his abilities is called pick a card. He has 3 different cards that have three different effects (gold = stun, red = AoE slow, blue = mana restore) and the way that works is that when you activate the ability the cards show above his head in a rotating order and you have to click the button again when the card you want shows.
That's what Yoshi-P's explanation of astrologian seems like to me. There'll be an ability like that with a rotating set of cards. The more you play it the more you learn the rotation so you know exactly what comes after what and you can snap pick that card when it shows up.
Just a thought. That's what I got from the reaction stuff etc.
I may have to fight Ash about his change to Machinist. It feels like I need it in my life. Then Kagari and I can be Balthier-wannabe-bros.
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
Where's my Meepo class???
Are Arcanist considered dps? I'm trying to decide between that and the 2h tank.
I haven't reached the level where you can start a different class yet but how are stats handled? Are you a little gimped or is gear more important then base stats?
EndcatOmega
Unconfirmed Member
Arcanist is a bit weird as it's the only class with two jobs- bonus stats are class dependent. You can do a 15/15 split of INT/MND though and muddle along, at least until cutting edge content.
PhillipCostigan
Member
So, this.
That's only slightly less obnoxious.
nope
like this (best gif I could find)
press button to activate rotation, press button again to pick the card you want.
cultureculture
Member
Arcanist is considered a DPS class. At level 30, you can pick up the Summoner (DPS) and Scholar (healer) jobs.
Your base stats change depending on which class/job you currently are, so no issues there. Your racial stats don't matter. It's really gear that's the deciding factor. In order of importance, the most influential pieces of gear are: weapon > body/legs > head/hands/feet > belt > accessories.
Edit: Also, as pointed out, Arcanist is a bit weird because the bonus stats you can allocate when you hit certain levels also apply to both Summoner (main stat: Int) and Scholar (main stat: Mind), but on the bright side, you can later buy an item to change your bonus stats relatively cheaply.
nope
like this (best gif I could find)
press button to activate rotation, press button again to pick the card you want.
What's the functional difference? It's a slot machine with one slot.
Arcanist is DPS until level 30; then you can unlock SCH and queue as scholar to 50, even if your end goal is for some strange reason summoner.
Each class allocates stats seperately--so points for Gladiator are seperate from points for Conjurer, for example. Arcanists are kind of weird in that they're one class with two jobs, so share a stat pool. If you're going Scholar for sure points to into mind, usually, but if you're going summoner or flipping back and forth between the jobs you spec into INT. I think allocated stats are equivalent to, like, one accessory. Not nothing but not huge.
PhillipCostigan
Member
aye, it's a slot machine with one slot. i.e. there's no matching or any of that bullshit. And it's I guess a better visual representation for cards since you could have cards with different backs for the ability. Like red = damage, green = shield, gold = burst heal, blue = buff etc.
I think that would make for some cool gameplay.
Definitely gonna give the astro-thingie a spin but maybe also check the machinist out. The way he is talking about exploring areas in an airship seems to imply there'll be lot's of landmass to explore that you couldn't just ride to on your choco. I wonder if this is really the case.
Pyros_Eien
Member
Yeah but he does mention using the card right away or picking another card to combo, so I think it'd be a bit more complicated than that. It could work like mudras or something. The cards could also maybe just add more power to each other.
Example, let's say you have 3cards you can initiall get, a heal card, a debuff card and a buff card. Buff is +10%dmg on someone, debuff is -10%str, heal is like 10% health heal. You can use the card right away but the effect is kinda meh. Instead if you wait for the Draw Card cooldown(as I'm sure it will have one), you'll get a 2nd random card. That card can be AoE, Double, Half. AoE makes it into an aoe obviously, Double simply doubles the value and Half is the get bent card. Now I don't know if they'd go with a Half type system, and instead it could be AoE, Double Power, Double Duration. All positive effects. What you get however differs everytime. Maybe you can keep drawing but whatever you drew first doesn't stack. Or maybe you get another set of cards that have even different stuff like Additional Effect(heal also restores TP/MPl, debuff also affects int/mnd, buff also increases skill/spellspeed/crit), Echo(recast the same power 5-10secs later), Inverse(heal also does damage to enemies in an aoe, debuff also buffs stats for the party, buff also debuffs the enemy dmg%).
All those cards could be mixed up too instead of being 3 by 3, which maybe the base effect always being the same(a heal for example) and then everything else being added on top based on card picks(so a heal that also buffs or a heal that makes the target apply debuffs when they hit a bit similar to Eye for an Eye).
That's kinda how I see it happening. I sure hope they'll show the class at some point.
Eh.. can't have a little joke? First thing that popped in my mind was that scene when i was reading his grind story.
This.
PhillipCostigan
Member
Yeah that could definitely be the case too.
I still think it will be some sort of "pick a card" system. If it was just random that would really suck. You could be looking for the damage mitigation buff card with the AoE card during a big raid hit (akin to gigaflare or something) and end up getting the damage up + double card which would be completely inappropriate for the situation.
Random could be what card the rotation you pick from starts on so you have to know the rotation etc.
Like with Mudras you know exactly what Mudra you're getting because you know the exact combination you need.
I still think it will be some sort of "pick a card" system. If it was just random that would really suck. You could be looking for the damage mitigation buff card with the AoE card during a big raid hit (akin to gigaflare or something) and end up getting the damage up + double card which would be completely inappropriate for the situation.
Random could be what card the rotation you pick from starts on so you have to know the rotation etc.
Like with Mudras you know exactly what Mudra you're getting because you know the exact combination you need.
Well healing is kind of a critical/time sensitive function so I don't think anyone would be comfortable with a healer who heals via pure RNG.
"Where's the heals, dude?"
"Sorry, man... RNG gonna RNG"
That's why I'm really interested to see how they implement it. I think they will have to be able to do basic healing on demand at least.
"Where's the heals, dude?"
"Sorry, man... RNG gonna RNG
"That's why I'm really interested to see how they implement it. I think they will have to be able to do basic healing on demand at least.
Random would also be the worst thing ever to have in one of the most important positions of a four-eight man raid. Seriously, I've seen healers straight up will a group to victory. In some very rare occurrences, I've been that guy. If anything is left up to rng, it'll probably be extra healing or superfluous skills that won't make or break a raid.
I don't really understand why they'd institute a card draw mechanic for a healing class, but maybe it won't suck. Maybe there will be one astrologian out there who doesn't macro "HEART OF THE CARDS <se.6>" to their card draw ability. That astrologian needs to rethink their profession.
Pyros_Eien
Member
Well it seems they're using the Corsair draw cards concept, which was random, which could draw complete garbage(since cards were class specific and I think you could draw cards for classes not even in the group...). I would rather it be consistent and a roulette system to add an element of skill but not a guaranteed specific card would be a lot better than random elements. There could be 3 different card draw spell you start with(heal buff debuff) which then get random effects, so you could still kinda aim towards something. Maybe you don't get the best aoe mitigation possible but you get additional effects that might be useful.
If they make it so you can choose the power easily, then the power won't likely be very strong, meaning other classes having the same power would probably be better due to easier access. If they make it so it's hard to pick, they could make it a lot stronger, but obviously it'd be even harder to use and unreliable tricks is the last thing you want your healer to have even if those tricks could sometimes be crazy good. If it's both better and easy to pick, then obviously it becomes the best choice. It seems hard to balance to make it just right so it's not too good or not too bad.
Would probably have fit more on a DPS class which can average the good and bad card picks over time and stuff without affecting much and sometimes get very good draws for higher than usual DPS(just like a BLM can sometimes get a ton of thunder procs and get a lot higher damage just due to RNG) as healers and tanks are more about consistency than good/bad spikes.
PhillipCostigan
Member
It could be cool if they allow you to store the card for like 30 or so seconds. Like pick your cards and combine them in between heal down time, and then use your really powerful ability at a certain time. Damage mitigation for gigaflare, damage up for the time between megaflare so your DPS can go ham etc. etc.
there are definitely some cool things with the card selection and combination mechanics.
there are definitely some cool things with the card selection and combination mechanics.
I kind of weirdly like the idea of a randomized healer provided the results pool has a reliable 'bad' result of a still-useful heal. The game as a whole is insanely scripted, so having to alter healing strategy on-the-fly even slightly (for reasons beyond people standing in stupid) could be cool?
Specifically I'd like to see the 'bad' result of a draw/draw pair be sufficient to keep people up, but maybe the 'good' result gives the healer extra breathing room to DPS or something. So if it goes bad you get, like, Cure 1.5, but if you stack the right cards you get a Crit adlo equivalent and can pewpew for a few seconds.
At the very least they're trying something different.
Specifically I'd like to see the 'bad' result of a draw/draw pair be sufficient to keep people up, but maybe the 'good' result gives the healer extra breathing room to DPS or something. So if it goes bad you get, like, Cure 1.5, but if you stack the right cards you get a Crit adlo equivalent and can pewpew for a few seconds.
At the very least they're trying something different.
Playing the imperial in triple triad seems to be the best way to do it consistently. I personally like choco racing, but it's a lot slower than consistent winning at triple triad.
You could always win the Jumbo Cactpot and be set for life.
PhillipCostigan
Member
the issue with that, as mentioned previously, is that for the class to be balanced and not just a harder to use WHM or SCH the highs have to be really high, but the lows also have to straight up be lower than the other classes. In which case, most raid groups would rather pick the safe and reliable option because raids are so structured you need to know what you can do and when.
I think a straight random element sounds cool in concept but in practice it feels like garbage to play, because you are always worried that you won't get what's enough to get you by.
I'm really excited to see what exactly they do and if & how they manage to balance a class if it is that RNG based.
What if I want the cloud card and the fenrir mount? Definitely have to win it twice to be set.
Yeah, no. Imagine if the monk did 400 DPS on one pull then 600 on the other while playing exactly the same. A class like that will get laughed out of raids. "You were still useful. Kinda."
There's already crit of course but it's not that large of a difference in the long run.
Tell your monk not to be shit. Why is he putting out garbage numbers with no buff?
Ah cool. I've picked up some new cards in my travels and I haven't even checked out the racing yet so now's the time I guess. Thanks!
Yes, it would be dumb to tune a class such that their output could vary a third over the course of a 12 minute fight due to RNG. I think there are ways they could introduce RNG into specific heals that would, over the course of the fight, even out (especially if, say, the second draw deck cards had cooldowns) provided they were handled properly by the player.
I don't know; I also have a preference for proc-based classes than just set rotations. I just think there are avenues along which this could be cool/interesting.
irfaanator
Banned
I know one of those healers isn't bara
Yeah. Full on random for a major class mechanic is essentially sending it out to die. That alone makes me feel like that they won't do something that silly since class balance has been pretty good for the most part.
At worst I imagine they'll just make it similar to BLM Firestarter procs of "oh, neat" when they occur and not "welp, it didn't happen ggwp wipe"
Is it Eos
PhillipCostigan
Member
Yep. I know Drama's not super into raiding but she is a super fucking clutch healer and saved our runs multiple times (and some of them with her i115 weapon). I would hate to have situations where that couldn't happen because :lol RNG
Maybe if she used some MP once in a while. We all know how frugal she is with resources, amirite guys?
Also inadvertently putting docbon on blast~
popcorn.webm
On serious notes, the cards could be used to augment heals like I think someone said. You could maybe have like a poison pill card that reverses effects, an aoe, or a buff, etc. Pick a card, pick a spell, etc etc. Maybe everything astro boy/girl/kitten does will be preventative in a way that scholar and whm could only
Maybe it'll totally suck butt and need to be buffed out of the stratosphere.
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