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[Jennipeg]

I was listening to IGN Gamescoop the other day, and everyone was talking about how much they are enjoying XV. Because it doesn't have any of that 'Final Fantasy bullshit' as in a long intro and linear opening section. It just lets the player loose.

But I really like the FF bullshit. I've enjoyed this game as a change of pace for the series but I want more story. I kind of worry that the positive feedback will mean this is Final Fantasy from now on. I'm one of those people that doesn't mind linearity though so I could be in the minority.

Like where? What? Who? Apparently I missed like all of this. I'm over 50 hours in and on Chapter 14 and feel like I know almost nothing about the world and lore.

The game needs something akin to the Dragon Age and Mass Effect games for lore. If you're just talking about fucking radio messages that doesn't cut it at all and really didn't fill in didly shit about the world for me.

Lol, I had the exact same thought.

 

[elostyle]

How does this game get away with basically not auto saving progress. Stumble upon a dungeon with level 7 monsters only to die to a level 52 (!) boss at the end. Start again from last rest area.

Making me redo map discoveries in an open world game is ridiculous.

whatyearisit

 

[Gbraga]

Like where? What? Who? Apparently I missed like all of this. I'm over 50 hours in and on Chapter 14 and feel like I know almost nothing about the world and lore.

The game needs something akin to the Dragon Age and Mass Effect games for lore. If you're just talking about fucking radio messages that doesn't cut it at all and really didn't fill in didly shit about the world for me.

Optional dialogue with NPCs, hearing them talk to each other, party dialogue during gameplay, there's quite a bit of environmental storytelling, especially in Leide, Cosmogony books, even the lore paintings in the tutorial and yes, radio messages. I totally get why people wouldn't like it, but compared to a datalog in a menu? Come on.

It does tell you a lot about the world. I'm 40 something hours, 46 I think? And I'm on Chapter 3, so I'm sure there's still a lot more to learn.

 

[Grudy]

Anyone knows which shop sells the FF IX album in the game?

 

[Lynx_7]

I was listening to IGN Gamescoop the other day, and everyone was talking about how much they are enjoying XV. Because it doesn't have any of that 'Final Fantasy bullshit' as in a long intro and linear opening section. It just lets the player loose.

But I really like the FF bullshit. I've enjoyed this game as a change of pace for the series but I want more story. I kind of worry that the positive feedback will mean this is Final Fantasy from now on. I'm one of those people that doesn't mind linearity though so I could be in the minority.

I think it's a good thing that Tabata managed to reach new people with this installment, but I agree that the game should've told its story much better than it did.

Also, I don't think most people mind linearity. Most FF games are fairly linear. What differentiates the good entries from the bad ones is the design and pacing around said linear structure.

 

[NoctisVsStar]

I was listening to IGN Gamescoop the other day, and everyone was talking about how much they are enjoying XV. Because it doesn't have any of that 'Final Fantasy bullshit' as in a long intro and linear opening section. It just lets the player loose.

But I really like the FF bullshit. I've enjoyed this game as a change of pace for the series but I want more story. I kind of worry that the positive feedback will mean this is Final Fantasy from now on. I'm one of those people that doesn't mind linearity though so I could be in the minority.

The problem with XV is the disjoint mess of the story, linearity is fine if done properly within the confines of the story but a whole game like X and XIII just following a single line? Nope, I don't see that happening again. However, with FF7r I see them doing hubs like FF12 but more spacious.


Ps: To be fair X "masks it" way better than XIII the world feels alive.

 

[hamchan]

Optional dialogue with NPCs, hearing them talk to each other, party dialogue during gameplay, there's quite a bit of environmental storytelling, especially in Leide, Cosmogony books, even the lore paintings in the tutorial and yes, radio messages. I totally get why people wouldn't like it, but compared to a datalog in a menu? Come on.

It does tell you a lot about the world. I'm 40 something hours, 46 I think? And I'm on Chapter 3, so I'm sure there's still a lot more to learn.

I should you should progress further in the game before telling someone who actually finished it that they're wrong. There's a lot of moments later that feels like stuff was cut or happened off-screen and that are never really explained, which a datalog would have helped with.

 

[Adaren]

Optional dialogue with NPCs, hearing them talk to each other, party dialogue during gameplay, there's quite a bit of environmental storytelling, especially in Leide, Cosmogony books, even the lore paintings in the tutorial and yes, radio messages. I totally get why people wouldn't like it, but compared to a datalog in a menu? Come on.

It does tell you a lot about the world. I'm 40 something hours, 46 I think? And I'm on Chapter 3, so I'm sure there's still a lot more to learn.

The lore paintings are worse than a datalog imo. The very definition of telling instead of showing, made worse because it's your first introduction to wtf is going on in the world.

The lore in the tutorial could have been done so much better. Like, have Ignis explain it for Prompto when you first rest at a campsite. Or have some ominous voice narrate it while you're running around in Chapter 0 (basically, Bayonetta's intro, lol).

 

[#sorrynotsorry]

How does this game get away with basically not auto saving progress. Stumble upon a dungeon with level 7 monsters only to die to a level 52 (!) boss at the end. Start again from last rest area.

Making me redo map discoveries in an open world game is ridiculous.

whatyearisit

It's intentionally not in dungeons. I like it.

 

[RedlineRonin]

Anyone knows which shop sells the FF IX album in the game?

Cauthess on the west side of the crater, IIRC

 

[Shanlei91]

I was listening to IGN Gamescoop the other day, and everyone was talking about how much they are enjoying XV. Because it doesn't have any of that 'Final Fantasy bullshit' as in a long intro and linear opening section. It just lets the player loose.

But I really like the FF bullshit. I've enjoyed this game as a change of pace for the series but I want more story. I kind of worry that the positive feedback will mean this is Final Fantasy from now on. I'm one of those people that doesn't mind linearity though so I could be in the minority.

Funny enough, this is my first Final Fantasy I've played since 7 (picked it up when I saw combat wasn't turn based). Reached the final boss fight this morning and I'm finding myself wishing the game was more linear. I feel like stories lose their oomph when a game is open world and I find this game is no exception.

While the infamous chapter 13 is horrible from a gameplay standpoint, in terms of narrative and atmosphere I thought it was the best because its linear nature allowed for more crafted storytelling.

Maybe my issue is just that I got sick of driving around by the end. ¯\_(&#12484_/¯

 

[Gbraga]

I should you should progress further in the game before telling someone who actually finished it that they're wrong. There's a lot of moments later that feels like stuff was cut or happened off-screen and that are never really explained, which a datalog would have helped with.

But that's the point, even as early as I am into the game, I can say they're wrong. It's not true that the game gives you no information on its world at all.

Follow the discussion, I never said there aren't narrative issues or whatever, what are you on about?

The lore paintings are worse than a datalog imo. The very definition of telling instead of showing, made worse because it's your first introduction to wtf is going on in the world.

The lore in the tutorial could have been done so much better. Like, have Ignis explain it for Prompto when you first rest at a campsite. Or have some ominous voice narrate it while you're running around in Chapter 0 (basically, Bayonetta's intro, lol).

I don't disagree it could've been done a lot better. But it's there, saying there's no information is just not true.

And I'm not sure I agree with this obsession over "show, don't tell". So we need cutscenes for every single thing in the world? Is Soulsborne storytelling trash because it tells us everything and shows us nothing but the results of the important events that happened long ago by the time our journey starts? I think there can be a balance. It's ok to tell instead of showing when it comes to overall lore and mythology, imo.

 

[Jennipeg]

I think it's a good thing that Tabata managed to reach new people with this installment, but I agree that the game should've told its story much better than it did.

Also, I don't think most people mind linearity. Most FF games are fairly linear. What differentiates the good entries from the bad ones is the design and pacing around said linear structure.

Yeah I think that's really positive, even Greg Miller is playing it. And I don't think he has ever made it through the first few hours before.

I had a debate once on another forum about the linearity of FF. I also think they are pretty linear as a whole, and people disagreed with that because of the world map. But you could only venture so far until the latter part of the game. It was masked very well in the older games. Not wanting to have a character tower over a town on the world map really gave them a problem to fix. The nearest they have got to a solution is XII imo.

The problem with XV is the disjoint mess of the story, linearity is fine if done properly within the confines of the story but a whole game like X and XIII just following a single line? Nope, I don't see that happening again. However, with FF7r I see them doing hubs like FF12 but more spacious.

Ps: To be fair X "masks it" way better than XIII the world feels alive.

Yeah I agree, even I thought X was a bit disappointing when I realised there was no world map. I got over it because I love the story of X so much. XIII didn't have the benefit, there is no excuse for a nonsensical story in such a linear game like that.

 

[Zafir]

Optional dialogue with NPCs, hearing them talk to each other, party dialogue during gameplay, there's quite a bit of environmental storytelling, especially in Leide, Cosmogony books, even the lore paintings in the tutorial and yes, radio messages. I totally get why people wouldn't like it, but compared to a datalog in a menu? Come on.

It does tell you a lot about the world. I'm 40 something hours, 46 I think? And I'm on Chapter 3, so I'm sure there's still a lot more to learn.

No way. At least with a Datalog you aren't going to miss it. You figure out you don't know something and look it up.

All that exposition you're on about is so easily missable it's no wonder no one knows what's going on. It doesn't even do what say Dragon Age or Mass Effect does where it adds it to your log after reading. So you can't even go back to read something you already found/heard.

I mean I'd agree if you were solely talking about lore, as lore tends to not be quite as crucial to the plot. But this game misses out important plot information left right and centre.

I mean the

Spoiler

Ring of Lucii is a good example. Everyone talks of how important it is, but you'd never know it from the main story. Most of that information was relegated to Kingsglaive, which a lot of people probably didn't watch.

 

[vareon]

The sidequests should've tied more with the world lore, IMO. A lot of it is simply sending us to a place to find stuff without interesting context, like Dave asking us to find tags again and again. Cindy's quests did it better because she told us about how the world used to be.

I also miss Bestiary and flavor texts for Hunts.

 

[Grudy]

Cauthess on the west side of the crater, IIRC

Thanks!

 

[BlazingDarkness]

As a general rule, always check the radio after a story event happens (even minor ones), there is always new information revealed on the radio that gives more context to everything that is happening.

Given that our heroes spend much of their time away from the centres of activity, in my mind, this kind of exposition works very well. The gamer is viewing the world largely through the eyes of Noctis and his group, so that we're not necessarily seeing disparate events (like some omnipresent god) is kinda nice (though I realise this isn't entirely the case.) Though one criticism is that NPCs don't talk enough about world events (much of their dialogue remains detached from ongoing plot points), but the radio messages always change.

 

[LiK]

I wonder who decided to give Noct a dumbass hat for Casual outfit. Looks so bad on him.

 

[Gbraga]

No way. At least with a Datalog you aren't going to miss it. You figure out you don't know something and look it up.

All that exposition you're on about is so easily missable it's no wonder no one knows what's going on. It doesn't even do what say Dragon Age or Mass Effect does where it adds it to your log after reading. So you can't even go back to read something you already found/heard.

I mean I'd agree if you were solely talking about lore, as lore tends to not be quite as crucial to the plot. But this game misses out important plot information left right and centre.

I mean the

Spoiler

Ring of Lucii is a good example. Everyone talks of how important it is, but you'd never know it from the main story. Most of that information was relegated to Kingsglaive, which a lot of people probably didn't watch.

I have zero issues with lore stuff being missable. On the contrary, I think it provides great incentive to exploration and paying attention.

I really don't mind that people who aren't looking for it won't know about it, I think that's great, even. Better than stopping the game all the time to read a bunch in the menu and then going back to playing. It feels more organic and part of the gameplay loop that way, imo.

EDIT: I do agree that it would be nice to have something in the menu to check again the stuff you've found already. Or at least if people would update the wiki more often. Bloodborne doesn't give you an easy way to check lore notes, but you can just enter the wiki page for them and it's all there nicely organized. Though I guess that's also my fault, since it's a community effort

The sidequests should've tied more with the world lore, IMO. A lot of it is simply sending us to a place to find stuff without interesting context, like Dave asking us to find tags again and again. Cindy's quests did it better because she told us about how the world used to be.

I also miss Bestiary and flavor texts for Hunts.

Yeah, I agree. Sania's questline had some very interesting setup before, but so far it still didn't go anywhere. I hope she goes back to the radio at some point to talk about her discoveries.

I do think Dave is an interesting character and I liked both his dialogue back in Chapter 1 and the radio shows he's present, his dialogue gives some interesting information on the world and its organization beyond the walls of Insomnia. But collecting dog tags felt random. I don't mind doing it, I actually have fun and some interesting stuff happened while doing them, but yeah.

As a general rule, always check the radio after a story event happens (even minor ones), there is always new information revealed on the radio that gives more context to everything that is happening.

Given that our heroes spend much of their time away from the centres of activity, in my mind, this kind of exposition works very well. The gamer is viewing the world largely through the eyes of Noctis and his group, so that we're not necessarily seeing disparate events (like some omnipresent god) is kinda nice (though I realise this isn't entirely the case.) Though one criticism is that NPCs don't talk enough about world events (much of their dialogue remains detached from ongoing plot points), but the radio messages always change.

Yup. It makes contextual sense since you experience the story from their point of view.

The world building stuff Noctis hears is only the world building stuff you hear and experience.

 

[Zafir]

As a general rule, always check the radio after a story event happens (even minor ones), there is always new information revealed on the radio that gives more context to everything that is happening.

Given that our heroes spend much of their time away from the centres of activity, in my mind, this kind of exposition works very well. Though one criticism is that NPCs don't talk enough about world events (much of their dialogue remains detached from ongoing plot points), but the radio messages always change.

They should have done what GTA does in that case though. Where the radio in the car just forcibly changes to say this new information or whatever.

I have zero issues with lore stuff being missable. On the contrary, I think it provides great incentive to exploration and paying attention.

I really don't mind that people who aren't looking for it won't know about it, I think that's great, even. Better than stopping the game all the time to read a bunch in the menu and then going back to playing. It feels more organic and part of the gameplay loop that way, imo.

But that's what I'm saying, I don't mind lore being missable.

The issue is, in XV it isn't just lore what is missable or just not mentioned.

 

[Ishida]

I have zero issues with lore stuff being missable. On the contrary, I think it provides great incentive to exploration and paying attention.

I really don't mind that people who aren't looking for it won't know about it, I think that's great, even. Better than stopping the game all the time to read a bunch in the menu and then going back to playing. It feels more organic and part of the gameplay loop that way, imo.

I agree with this. I actually love exploring in games. Finding small pieces of lore while exploring is a great feeling for me. I don't like being feed stuff in datalogs.

 

[silva1991]

I wonder who decided to give Noct a dumbass hat for Casual outfit. Looks so bad on him.

It would look better if he get a hair cut lol.

 

[shark sandwich]

It kind of kills me that I had three separate revelations about who the fuck Jared was because of how much of a nothing character he is.
The first was

Spoiler

that the random-ass old guy had a name and was apparently dead or something. The second was that he was that annoying kid's grandfather, and the third was that he was supposed to be a butler. I literally just didn't get the memo about any of these parts of his character when he was "intoduced." I can't believe this fucking game lol.

Sad that the zany-looking quest-dispenser characters are more memorable than the ones who are actually part of the story.

 

[Adaren]

Funny enough, this is my first Final Fantasy I've played since 7 (picked it up when I saw combat wasn't turn based). Reached the final boss fight this morning and I'm finding myself wishing the game was more linear. I feel like stories lose their oomph when a game is open world and I find this game is no exception.

While the infamous chapter 13 is horrible from a gameplay standpoint, in terms of narrative and atmosphere I thought it was the best because its linear nature allowed for more crafted storytelling.

Maybe my issue is just that I got sick of driving around by the end. ¯\_(&#12484_/¯

I also thought the story got way better from Chapter 9 onward. (General impressions, no spoilers of anything past chapter 11)

Spoiler

The story is messy all the way through, but at least after Chapter 9 it feels like things are happening that have consequences that characters react to.

Like, look at the transition from Chapter 4 [Titan + Ardyn revelations] -> Chapter 5 ["dude where's our car]. Now compare that to the transition from Chapter 9 -> Chapter 10, where you see the fallout of everything that went down in the previous chapter. The linear part of the game jumps between locations, but at least it feels like story events have consequences and outcomes.

Chapter 10 is actually when I liked the main characters the most. Seeing the party actually evolve, have conflicts, suffer setbacks, was waaaaay more impactful than more "bro" dialogue that rarely progressed the characters past their one-dimensional initial impressions. Watching Prompto tear up as his friends argue in front of the campfire touched my heart in a way that the beginning of the game never did.

The whole train sequence was the high point of the story for me. It's dramatic and sort of silly, but at least it feels like things are happening that will actually affect the characters.
Crazy Noctis trying to explain how he pushed Prompto off a train >>>>>>>>>>>> normal Noctis

Currently starting Chapter 14. Will finish tonight. Looking forward to it!

 

[ElephantShell]

Endgame question:

Spoiler

is there anywhere else to buy the weapons that the Arms vendor at Hammerhead before the final mission sells?

 

[adversarial]

This game has the best fighting of any RPG I've ever played. This game is so good.

Fucking stoked for them releasing this after so long and it not flopping.

 

[RDreamer]

Optional dialogue with NPCs, hearing them talk to each other, party dialogue during gameplay, there's quite a bit of environmental storytelling, especially in Leide, Cosmogony books, even the lore paintings in the tutorial and yes, radio messages. I totally get why people wouldn't like it, but compared to a datalog in a menu? Come on.

It does tell you a lot about the world. I'm 40 something hours, 46 I think? And I'm on Chapter 3, so I'm sure there's still a lot more to learn.

I don't actually know the answer, but I'd be surprised if there are more than 6 Cosmogony books. Plus, if you're going to feed me lore by putting it in a tiny paragraph each and spreading it around a world you completely and utterly ignore with the main story then at least do me the fucking courtesy of putting the shit I found in a menu so I can re-read it.

Lore paintings in the tutorial? Really? That tutorial was freakishly awful and boring as shit. They should have integrated things into the game, but I guess that's the story of this game. Nothing is integrated. Why in the world do you think paintings in some separate crappy tutorial before you start without any context is better than datalogs?

My experience so far is that yeah the radio adds a slight bit, but for the most part it was repeating the shit that I just saw happen. I'm not entirely sure I learned much of anything.

There wasn't enough of people talking about things, I think, and what was there was pretty hamfisted and poorly written.

 

[Gbraga]

They should have done what GTA does in that case though. Where the radio in the car just forcibly changes to say this new information or whatever.

Then people would complain that they missed it because they were fast travelling everywhere, or using the chocobos, or walking.

It did this once for Luna's speech, actually. Even though I already heard it on the regular radio broadcasts before.

But that's what I'm saying, I don't mind lore being missable.

The issue is, in XV it isn't just lore what is missable or just not mentioned.

About that, then yes, I'll have to advance the story a lot more to be able to properly talk about.

I agree with this. I actually love exploring in games. Finding small pieces of lore while exploring is a great feeling for me. I don't like being feed stuff in datalogs.

"Small" being a keyword, here. I'm also not a fan of the books you find everywhere in WRPGs. They're not too long, but they're long enough that when you find more than one somewhere, I feel like it stops the gameplay for too long.

I don't actually know the answer, but I'd be surprised if there are more than 6 Cosmogony books. Plus, if you're going to feed me lore by putting it in a tiny paragraph each and spreading it around a world you completely and utterly ignore with the main story then at least do me the fucking courtesy of putting the shit I found in a menu so I can re-read it.

I won't disagree with that, it should have an option to read/listen/whatever the things you've already found in the menu.

Lore paintings in the tutorial? Really? That tutorial was freakishly awful and boring as shit. They should have integrated things into the game, but I guess that's the story of this game. Nothing is integrated. Why in the world do you think paintings in some separate crappy tutorial before you start without any context is better than datalogs?

The paintings are the weakest part, for sure, but I still think it's more interesting than having datalog entries added throughout the game.

It would be much better if it was part of the main game, but again, there's a difference between "I don't like how it's told" and "there's no information anywhere". The first actually requires you to understand how it's told in order to criticize it, the other is just wrong, and useless for discussion.

My experience so far is that yeah the radio adds a slight bit, but for the most part it was repeating the shit that I just saw happen. I'm not entirely sure I learned much of anything.

There wasn't enough of people talking about things, I think, and what was there was pretty hamfisted and poorly written.

Maybe we're just disagreeing on what constitutes "a lot", if you've actually been following all of the things I mentioned.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

They should have done what GTA does in that case though. Where the radio in the car just forcibly changes to say this new information or whatever.
.

Yeah that would have been a good idea, to have important announcements interrupt your radio etc. or at least SE making the idea of checking the radio often more visible.

But at the same time I feel like SE are moving away from that forced presentation of exposition, and leaving it in the hands of the player (who can search for as much or little as they like) - you could argue this suits the open-world nature of the game a bit better. There absolutely is depth in the story, its just very fragmented, so you need to find the pieces yourself.

The lore is there for people who go looking for it, that's the kind of gamer I am (exploration is a big deal for me!)

 

[Zafir]

Then people would complain that they missed it because they were fast travelling everywhere, or using the chocobos, or walking.

Not necessarily, as there is forced driving parts to the game. Numerous, in fact.

 

[Mcdohl]

By the way, are there 14 chapters or 15 chapters?

And when people say endgame, do they mean playing after killing the final boss? Or playing after having reached the final save point but before the final boss?

 

[Dimmle]

I wonder who decided to give Noct a dumbass hat for Casual outfit. Looks so bad on him.

Yes, we need to talk about the biggest travesty of FFXV, that outfit.

 

[RDreamer]

By the way, are there 14 chapters or 15 chapters?

And when people say endgame, do they mean playing after killing the final boss? Or playing after having reached the final save point but before the final boss?

I haven't actually got there, but what I gather is that once you beat the final boss it puts you back at that final "save point" again so that's when you do endgame stuff.

 

[Arex]

About to start chapter 13

Anyway some impression so far up to that, maybe some spoiler,

Spoiler

Pretty disappointed with how much of Altisia is explore-able considering how big the map is, and how little to do there.
I feel they killed Luna too fast
And did they kill off Ravus via radio news? hope not haha

The leviathan battle, I didn't equip any royal arms and it went forever until I did change to one lol
The battle with Marlboro, I totally missed that arrow thing I'm supposed to flee to. Bad design >_<.

Also feels like it became train stations rpg after chapter 9/10.., like, finally Tenebrae! oh just the train station :|

The story seems a bit rushed after the open world bit, left me a bit confused.. I'm liking the bros relationship though.
And Araena.. she is awesome. I want more of her XD

 

[Gbraga]

Yeah that would have been a good idea, to have important announcements interrupt your radio etc. or at least SE making the idea of checking the radio often more visible.

But at the same time I feel like SE are moving away from that forced presentation of exposition, and leaving it in the hands of the player (who can search for as much or little as they like) - you could argue this suits the open-world nature of the game a bit better. There absolutely is depth in the story, its just very fragmented, so you need to find the pieces yourself.

The lore is there for people who go looking for it, that's the kind of gamer I am (exploration is a big deal for me!)

Not necessarily, as there is forced driving parts to the game. Numerous, in fact.

It does happen once in Chapter 1. Luna's speech about the marriage and how it'll affect her duties as Oracle will be played over the radio no matter what, even if you've already heard it before.

They probably should've done it more often, if that's the only instance in the entire game, I agree.

Yes, we need to talk about the biggest travesty of FFXV, that outfit.

That was so disappointing :C

Can't we just get a bunch of DLC outfits already?

 

[LordKasual]

Datalog sucks. Not because it's a bad idea, but because there's nothing you can put in a datalog that you can't just put in the actual game you're playing.

XV didn't need a datalog, it just needed Kingsglaive to not be a movie. The issues with XV's narrative wouldn't have been made better with a datalog, it just needed more time.

By the way, are there 14 chapters or 15 chapters?

And when people say endgame, do they mean playing after killing the final boss? Or playing after having reached the final save point but before the final boss?

There are 14 chapters. When you beat the game, the game gives you the option to make a save file that puts you in Chapter 15, which is the equilivent of saving before the final boss to go do other stuff, but i assume there are things that only unlock after beating the game.

So when you get to the final area, don't worry about waiting to beat the final boss. Just go enjoy the fight and the game will set you up for endgame by itself.

 

[Geg]

Endgame question:

Spoiler

is there anywhere else to buy the weapons that the Arms vendor at Hammerhead before the final mission sells?

Is that the ones that cost 10,000 gil? Yeah, the Meldacio Hunter HQ sells those, it's in the northern Cleign region near the big lake/swamp area you went to in chapter 7.

 

[Kyoufu]

Just did Adamantoise for the platinum trophy.

Worst fight in the history of fights.

 

[Adaren]

On the "natural storytelling" discussion, I do think that they did a really good job throughout Chapter

Spoiler

13

and in the opening of Chapter

Spoiler

14

.

There should have been way more worldbuilding / lore in the side quests, though. Like they off-hand mention that Lestallum is a city where only women work in skilled positions, right? That's interesting! How did the city end up this way? How does that affect city politics and power structure? Is the government of Lestallum entirely women? There's one random comment about a man feeling insignificant - is that a common feeling? How do the women feel? Do they feel empowered, exploited, or does it feel so normal to them they they don't have strong feelings one way or another?

All of these are questions that could and should have been integrated into side quests. Instead, we get loreless fetch quests from nameless NPCs. Yay green beans.

The lore paintings are inexcusable. The whole tutorial is bad, but they're the worst part of it.

 

[RDreamer]

Datalog sucks. Not because it's a bad idea, but because there's nothing you can put in a datalog that you can't just put in the actual game you're playing.

XV didn't need a datalog, it just needed Kingsglaive to not be a movie. The issues with XV's narrative wouldn't have been made better with a datalog, it just needed more time.

I can't disagree with the second part of what you say, but I disagree that there isn't anything you can put in a catalog that you can't just put in the actual game. I mean that works to an extent, but there are budgetary constraints to these things. And some info may not make terribly much sense to just give it. I think the Dragon Age and Mass Effect games were really excellent with this. I fucking loved getting all the lore in Dragon Age Origins, specifically. Could they have told all that in the game somehow? I guess, but that would mean paid voice actors and creating tons of scenarios for it when you're mostly talking about countries that might not even exist in that particular game.

I guess to sum up, we're probably mostly in agreement. A datalog shouldn't be needed content. It should be extra lore to enhance the game for those that really want it. The problem with FFXV is that a lot of needed content isn't there, so while a datalog is a step up in that having it is better than not, the ultimate step is to put everything needed into the fucking game.

 

[Lunafreya Nox Fleuret]

Just did Adamantoise for the platinum trophy.

Worst fight in the history of fights.

I haven't tried it yet but they really missed a huge opportunity with trophies. The super hard dungeons should have been required.

 

[n0razi]

Has anyone gotten the DLC codes from Carbuncle Surprise yet? ie the Cindymobile skin, etc..

 

[Lexxism]

There's a cutscene

Spoiler

where Pyrna was killed on Noctis dream.

A nightmare? Or its real? Will it be mentioned in the next few chapters?

 

[hamchan]

But that's the point, even as early as I am into the game, I can say they're wrong. It's not true that the game gives you no information on its world at all.

Follow the discussion, I never said there aren't narrative issues or whatever, what are you on about?

I was never talking about how there was no information about the world, but instead I was saying that there wasn't enough of it, a fundamental difference. There was enough lore about the world missing that I felt it affected character motivations and events that take place because the lore is not there to inform the player as to why all this stuff was happening. I felt that it wasn't an issue of me not exploring but rather the lore just not being in game at all or enough to be significant. I'd rather take a datalog of information if they couldn't fit it in the game than nothing at all.

But y'know what, if you think the world building is great where you then good for you and I sincerely hope you enjoy the rest of the game!

 

[LiK]

I haven't tried it yet but they really missed a huge opportunity with trophies. The super hard dungeons should have been required.

Yah, there should've been trophies for the secret dungeons.

 

[BlazingDarkness]

I think everyone can agree that the world is a very good canvas for SE to develop further, so there is lots of potential material for them to use for DLC etc., and that is definitely promising.

 

[Zafir]

There's a cutscene

Spoiler

where Pyrna was killed on Noctis dream.

A nightmare? Or its real? Will it be mentioned in the next few chapters?

You mean the Omen trailer?

Spoiler

Nightmare. I'm not sure why it was inserted in there, doesn't really have any baring on the plot.

 

[davidwhangchoi]

anyone find any rainbow frogs for the professor? there's no big leads.

 

[Bladelaw]

anyone find any rainbow frogs for the professor? there's no big leads.

Save yourself some pain and use a guide. That quest is unmitigated bullshit.

 

[RDreamer]

Just finished Chapter 13, and here's my own thoughts:

Spoiler

Honestly I didn't think it was the travesty others thought. I think some of it could be clipped a little bit, but I do like what they were going for in it. Personally I didn't sneak at all. I used the counter attack thing for all the axemen, and that worked out fine. I liked the feeling you got when you finally got a sword, and it was nice when you reunited with everyone and were able to take down enemies that were just giving you trouble. I think overall the idea and execution were pretty good. The problem is that people don't like it when the idea is to oppress them with gameplay.

I also think the other big problem with the chapter, though, is that it feels like nothing else in the entire game is focused on as much as this chapter. If this had been one of 15 or whatever actual focused pieces then that would be different. When one chapter is this weird thing where you fight in a circle with obviously-Gladio and have no real clue why and nothing ever comes of it and then you get to this chapter where things are so drawn out it's confusing as fuck.

That's the problem with XV so far. The game suffers from some really odd choices on what to focus manpower on, it seems. Why are there tons of post-game dungeons but literally nothing to do in Altissa? Why is the snow area with Shiva one screen when they've apparently got a post-game fucking Mario simulator? I don't get it.

Overall, though, I left Chapter 13 feeling much, much better about the story than anywhere else in the game. Hands down. I think that alone says at least something good about the chapter.