But what about a Firesweep Bow user with CA? You get less KOs, but you're impossible to safely bait.
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Fire Emblem Heroes |OT| Mount Breeding Simulator
- Thread starter Shun
- Start date
My Brave banner pity rate just reset from 4.25 with a 5* Catria. Damned gacha.
Hopefully the winds of luck blow my way before the end because otherwise I'm stuck with only Lyn. She's really practically useful - particularly considering my lack of an effective bow unit - but I'd still have preferred a Lucina or Ike to her as far as character favouritism goes. Guess I shouldn't have assumed I'd be lucky.
Hopefully the winds of luck blow my way before the end because otherwise I'm stuck with only Lyn. She's really practically useful - particularly considering my lack of an effective bow unit - but I'd still have preferred a Lucina or Ike to her as far as character favouritism goes. Guess I shouldn't have assumed I'd be lucky.
Ah, forgot about Firesweep. Yeah you're fucked unless you can get the drop on her.
theprodigy
Member
That's a nice build to troll people with on defense.
Not so great to run yourself though.
It will still be great, but it will be very boring to play.
I know, but the problem is that this doesn't do anything but soak hits. Such a slow, trigger-less unit is not really a threat. This is just Saber's default build taken further with Urvan vs. Slaying Edge+.
Its just a trolly defense build, really.
theprodigy
Member
It has 0 killing power which means the enemies will be in range to swarm the rest of your team, since you didn't kill anybody.
edit: there's also a giant hole in that red melee likely ORKOs
Well then you modify the set based on whether you plan to use it for offense and defense. Quick Bonfire w/ QR seems nasty.
He still hit you with 52 atk in the player phase.
Without Shield Pulse, he's just target practice as Urvan just isn't a good enough effect to kill him alive.
His problem is that he has no "good" phase. He's built like a wall but Urvan almost demands he attack first otherwise (with his low speed) he'll get attacked, retaliate, and get attacked again for full damage... and be potentially dead.
If he attacks, two retaliations will have a damage penalty. But then because he's so slow, and because Urvan/SB don't won't have been able to trigger yet for his special (because he engaged), he's entering the enemy phase with less health and in front of an alive enemy.
Conversely, if he just sits around waiting to bait a kill on Urvan/SB + Ignis or whatever, he's basically just mage fodder in a mage heavy meta with no way to retaliate.
Why would you attack anything that can damage Ike? In player phase you should be attacking ranged and lances.
Blackquill
Member
Sad that Beorc's Blessing is not used
He's not a cavalry/flier unit, so his options are limited on what he can actually engage with ease and specificity. Its not like he can actually reach anything on Turn 1, so he's either front-lining and soaking hits with no response (and/or dead) or he's out of range of any initiation and waiting for your second player phase. (Or if he does have a response, he's running DC/QR and is just a worse version of his Red self or Hector.)
At which point, you've most likely been swarmed and have a wall that can't kill anything but frail mages (who are likely to be out of range given how much the AI loves to reposition/swap mages away from the front line) or blues (bulkier blues will likely survive his first and only attack). And he's so slow that he can't actually threaten a kill on Scam.
Generally, you want your walls for a *thing* to be able to counter in some fashion. Titania and Camilla? Distant Counter threats on top of excellent defenses, health, and speed. Hector/Effie/Sheena? Distant Counter and Armads and/or Wary Fighter. Good Ike? Ragnell. Better Ike? Raijinto. Mounted Ike? Siegfried. Mounted Blue Ike with a Lance? Gradivus. The latter all have distant counter freed up in their weapon and can run Fury or TA to increase their bulk considerably.
I would not underestimate the value of an enemy phase unit that can tank several different high powered units by themselves. Brave Ike's coverage is solid, and with how easy it is to manipulate A.I, his movement isn't that detrimental.
Also, the vast majority of players aren't flush with DC, so Camilla, Titania and the rest of units who rely on DC to be good don't matter to most players.
And Camus is mega overrated as a unit. DC does make him particularly good.
Also, the vast majority of players aren't flush with DC, so Camilla, Titania and the rest of units who rely on DC to be good don't matter to most players.
And Camus is mega overrated as a unit. DC does make him particularly good.
This is more a discussion on practical unit ceiling potential. Remember, the contention isn't that he's some Odin-tier unit, it's that while on paper "big" and can definitely be used, he's just not some fancy pants McGee like Lyn, Grand Theft Horse, or Lancina.
For how popular he is and how much they seem to have buffed him, they did so in such a weird way that he's a flawed/pigeonholed flavor of unit.
Camus and Bike are about as good as each other.
Exactly.
To be fair it took me about three months to get a Hector, then another four months to get another one to finally put DC on Effie, and now the metagame is not going to be kind to her regardless.
Anyway I'm already seeing people build things like this in arena chat:
See, this is the filth I'm talking about. Nobody wants to take that hit, especially not all the TA Robins coming out of the woodwork to counter Lyn. Xander and Hector can't even hit back, Letting Lyn safely soften them up for the rest of team to finish off.
Bear in mind, this is just one of THREE viable builds for her, one of which is just Reinhardt but Better.
How rich are the people in that chat? You keep linking +10 characters. Do those people drop a grand on each banner or something?
I am pretty sad that Effie isn't that useful these days. She was one of my first promotes, and then I quickly found that her mobility kept her out of most situations. So she was promoted and then benched extremely quickly.
I have a Tana now, so maybe I can try some team that airlifts Effie around or something.
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
This negative Ike take is at least making pulling less tempting. 
I think he is good unit hampered by an odd stat distribution.
I think he is good unit hampered by an odd stat distribution.
Man-is-Obsolete
Member
Effie is still excellent. She became even more so with Armor March. Her moving two spaces with Brave Lance+ is amazing and Wary Fighter makes her tough to take down.
You'd be amazed at the amount of money some are willing to spend on the choice of hobbies. 💰💰👀
Ayup, thats the way i would build her.
It's a chat for competitive arena players, some of them are huge whales but there is a good amount of people who haven't paid anything and make do with what they have. I could post some of the more peculiar f2p counter builds like +Def Bowbreaker Fae if there is real interest. I just wanted to illustrate that Firesweep Lyn is indeed a build that is being made, and I dread seeing it.
This particular player is going to couple her with two Reinhardts and a Dancer, his total merge level will only be about +21, so it's possible for some of us to encounter him.
Effie is a great unit but if the most oppressive ranged threats are Lyn and Reinhardt I don't really know how to justify a team slot for her anymore. I'm strongly considering Fury Bowbreaker Nowi.
Firesweep weapons are becoming such a nuisance in arena I feel like those may be the next target for counter-skills. They might not just add a skill which disables them, but maybe a skill that denotes that you get X defense/res if your unit is attacked by something it can't retaliate against. I suppose Urvan already works like this in a way.
does this particular player know he is an asshole?
does this particular player know he is an asshole?
I think everyone who puts things like these on defense - particularly Rally Dance traps and dual Reinhardt/Reinhardt+Lyn is to a certain extent aware that they have gone full villain mode.
When they are already staying in tier 20 (and top 100 of it) every week, the only arena challenge left is to accumulate defense wins, as hollow as that sounds - so they keep trying to find new ways to make it harder to beat them.
Have I mentioned his Reinhardts Goad buff each other and Lyn?
Blackquill
Member
I always got completely obliterated by Chain Challenges if I lost my first time (which is Ike, Eirika, Nino and Azura), If I use another team I can win barely 2 maps. I can't wait to try out Chapter 11 and 12
I have a Rein but I refuse to put him on my defense team. Well, that plus I don't have DB3 or a good horse team, so he's very incomplete.
I haven't gotten a defense win in weeks, though.
You may be in luck as they are giving out 900 feathers per season to players who have been affected by a bug preventing them from getting defenses.
I've only missed my defense once and that was the last time Cecilia was a bonus. The odd thing is it was a team that had gotten me 7-8+ the week prior, so maybe I'll get paid.
I've been eking by with one defense lately (even with 4* Subaki on the team) but have nothing right now. I always seem to have more luck with Hector and reasonable teams instead of pure bullshit.
Sushen
Member
All these super high level arena build discussions are kind of discouraging to me. I play the arena only for some feathers. Being in tier 20, which I am atm, doesn't mean much to me, beyond more feathers.
I'm a collector and more interested in single player modes in general. It's just too much thinking and second guessing involved for my liking.
I'm a collector and more interested in single player modes in general. It's just too much thinking and second guessing involved for my liking.
Don't be discouraged. The vast majority of us are in a similar position, with the general strengthening of teams being the primary goal (and not just for Arena). You'll see Lyns, but it's doubtful you'll ever start to consistently run into Super Lyns.
I usually float between T19 and T20 too, and I don't really feel the urge to go higher in arena anymore. I find there's a line somewhere a little past 4810 where you have normal teams of unmerged 5* units on one side and full teams of +5 units with multiple 5* sacrifices on the other.
Fighting the normal teams is fun. Fighting whale teams isn't, and feels kinda like Tempest where the challenge is nice for a while, but gets old real fast. You also get REALLY tired of seeing the same four or so units over and over again.
Fighting the normal teams is fun. Fighting whale teams isn't, and feels kinda like Tempest where the challenge is nice for a while, but gets old real fast. You also get REALLY tired of seeing the same four or so units over and over again.
And its not like you don't have options for dealing with her, as meta evolves people put up builds that can deal with these things. You can even get far in Tier 20 with extensively or entirely f2p teams as prod or I do (though I have a BST issue with my team comps and I need to start working on merges rather than promoting everything). A large degree of arena is about AI manipulation and a balanced core comp that you can cobble together from 3*/4* promotions.
I run MRobin (now extensively built to deal with Cordelia/Lyn in all their incarnations), Roy (now to be replaced with Better Roy), Nino (forever Nino), and *bonus*. Serves me fine and is entirely built on f2p luck, inheritance, and thoughtful promotion.
I had been, for a while now, focusing on rounding off 3-core teams and 4-off core teams for Squad/Arena Assault. From here, I will look to focus on merging to make it easier to stay in T20 with my rather crappy BST base from two mages.
Hector/Ryoma/Nowi seem to avoid most cavalry bullshit teams, provided I back out of obvious bait.
What is bait you ask?
Alfonse/Anna/Sharena: Clearly bait for triple horse/flier and only there because they still need their 1 win for the season
Shitty bonus unit that nobody uses normally, GHB unit, or anyone on a current banner: See above
Dancer: They lack confidence in their horse team so they throw a dancer in as well. But if you put Reinhardt out front you give it away.
Reinhardt: They put him out front so you second guess yourself thinking maybe they don't know that you're not supposed to do that.
Healer: I guarantee there's a +8 Rein+Olwen in there too, especially if it's Elise
What is bait you ask?
Alfonse/Anna/Sharena: Clearly bait for triple horse/flier and only there because they still need their 1 win for the season
Shitty bonus unit that nobody uses normally, GHB unit, or anyone on a current banner: See above
Dancer: They lack confidence in their horse team so they throw a dancer in as well. But if you put Reinhardt out front you give it away.
Reinhardt: They put him out front so you second guess yourself thinking maybe they don't know that you're not supposed to do that.
Healer: I guarantee there's a +8 Rein+Olwen in there too, especially if it's Elise
I don't actually back out of all these, but I'm also only half joking
Did you not get some of the F2P horse units?
You can make a pretty ridiculous horse emblem team which should get you to tier 20 these days. You won't stay in tier 20, but you can bounce between 19/20.
The extra movement means losing a unit is very unlikely.
Flier Emblem ignoring terrain is something else that is pretty strong for arena, and doesn't have a bst penalty. However that's dearer to make.
Yeah I know that feeling. It does get pretty tiring seeing the same units. I did an arena run yesterday I think it was, and I'm not even joking. I came across the same composition 4 battles in a row, Effie/Hector/Amelia/Zephiel.
SenorArdilla
Member
I wonder if people are going to use Burger King over Zephiel when he comes out.