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Game of Thrones *NO BOOK SPOILERS* |OT| Season 4 - Sundays on HBO [Read the OP]
- Thread starter Steelyuhas
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YesNOnoNOYes
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AS A MOUNT
as a plushie mount thinger that a jester was ridinggggg
lol you
and whoa, that imgur series of pics really follows my train of thought too, but i still am not convinced, because why. why would she. the marriage is not yet cemented with an heir, etc.
as a plushie mount thinger that a jester was ridinggggg
lol you
and whoa, that imgur series of pics really follows my train of thought too, but i still am not convinced, because why. why would she. the marriage is not yet cemented with an heir, etc.
Dubbedinenglish
Banned
I think Granny's angle is Cersi's marrige. Then as Cersi is regent and re-marries, Loras becomes the king.
Saw this episode last night. Although I was expecting that psycho Joffrey to die at some point, due to how he behaved against everyone, I did not see this coming in this episode.
I think the old lady was the one who poisoned Joff and I don't think Sansa was aware of what was going on at the time it happened. I am sure she is happy about it though.
Would not be surprised if Tywin planned this as he probably felt he couldn't control Joff.
As for Tyrion beeing blamed was just unfortunate, don't think that part was planned as no one could know that psycho would persistantly toy with Tyrion. Had he been allowed to leave with Sansa early on, no one would have suspected him to be the one who did it.
Anyway, I am glad the psycho is dead and hope Tyrion gets off the hook.
Oh yeah, I was also expecting Shae to be brought forward and executed as part of Joffs entertainment. Still unsure if she made it or if we will see her in the next episode, since Cersei is vengeful now and thinks Tyrion did it. Can't wait for next episode.
I think the old lady was the one who poisoned Joff and I don't think Sansa was aware of what was going on at the time it happened. I am sure she is happy about it though.
Would not be surprised if Tywin planned this as he probably felt he couldn't control Joff.
As for Tyrion beeing blamed was just unfortunate, don't think that part was planned as no one could know that psycho would persistantly toy with Tyrion. Had he been allowed to leave with Sansa early on, no one would have suspected him to be the one who did it.
Anyway, I am glad the psycho is dead and hope Tyrion gets off the hook.
Oh yeah, I was also expecting Shae to be brought forward and executed as part of Joffs entertainment. Still unsure if she made it or if we will see her in the next episode, since Cersei is vengeful now and thinks Tyrion did it. Can't wait for next episode.
Atraveller
Banned
No, the "things" the dwarves are riding on.
Vulcano's assistant
Banned
Why did this punk have spermatozoa in his crown?
Oops
edited.Or just have Margaery marry Tommen who is next in line because that would make the Tyrells look even better to the people while giving Margaery a lot of power in a much safer setting since Tommen doesn't seem to be a madman...at least yet...
But I keep going back to Littlefinger being involved though due to Sansa being helped to flee the city. I posted about it a few times explaining his motives and his goals, and it just makes sense to me. Repaying Joffrey for Catelyn's death among other things, including Ros's death, but it also gives him Sansa who he wanted in the past since she can be used in the North while also being the daughter of his beloved Catelyn. Maybe he'll keep her hidden a while before making his own moves.
So many people have something to gain with this move and this just seems like something Littlefinger would do. Oberyn definitely wouldn't do something like this since he seems very vocal about his hatred for the Lannisters and wants to kill them himself and poison is seen as being very cowardly and lacking any honor. Who else would use the drunk guy as a patsy to cover his/her tracks and want Sansa to escape as well?
I also try to look at it from a story-telling perspective since Littlefinger has gone missing since going to The Vale. He was a major character in the past and I don't see him going away anytime soon, so what better way to bring him back than this? Maybe Olenna and LF teamed up for this joyous occasion!
I want it to be Littlefinger! I go back and forth between loving and hating him. Such a mysterious character who plays the game dirty, but survives.
ErinIsADrunk
Member
Unless I am misremembering, Littlefinger sends Ros to Joffrey after discovering she was spying for Varys, knowing full well what would happen to her.
Hmm, didn't remember that although I do recall her spying. Thanks.
Still, the Lannisters killing Catelyn like that would be motivation enough considering how much he would do for her regardless of how she felt.
Rabid-Coot
Member
We haven't seen his reaction after his son died right ?
This show has managed to create a pretty unprecedented atmosphere
And she was right..
I shouldn't have clicked on that. I feel like I was completely spoiled about the events of the last episode and peekinf at the comments of that page it looks like I'm right.
I don't recommend clicking this link to anyone who wants to keep the revelation as to whodunnit a surprise.
Not a book reader, just a humble observer of the shows, but it seems to me it isn't supposed to be a big whodunit. It seemed pretty obvious that it was Loras/Oberyn.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4Fhdtp1V4#t=255
No Idea what you guys with the necklace are on about. Watch the YouTube - no stones are missing from Sansa's neck. The Fool merely whisked Sansa away because she is Tyrion's wife and it was clear he was about to take the fall for Joffrey's death, making her useless to House Lannister and thus good as dead. If I'm wrong and it was Oleanna then really, those who claim to have "figured it out" probably got book spoilers because it just doesn't effing look like it, even on replay.
Edit: Actually, the YouTube just makes it hard to see that a stone is missing from Sansa's necklace. Looks like those zany Tyrells were all in on it together.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mo4Fhdtp1V4#t=255
No Idea what you guys with the necklace are on about. Watch the YouTube - no stones are missing from Sansa's neck. The Fool merely whisked Sansa away because she is Tyrion's wife and it was clear he was about to take the fall for Joffrey's death, making her useless to House Lannister and thus good as dead. If I'm wrong and it was Oleanna then really, those who claim to have "figured it out" probably got book spoilers because it just doesn't effing look like it, even on replay.
Edit: Actually, the YouTube just makes it hard to see that a stone is missing from Sansa's necklace. Looks like those zany Tyrells were all in on it together.
No it wasn't. That didn't seem obvious or even hinted at to me? I mean what little we've seen of Oberyn he seems more the time to do it in plain sight man to man rather than slip some poison into his drink. And Loras? I don't even know why. If it was that look they gave each other that seemed to me like they were checking each other out more than anything - Loras is quite clearly homosexual and Oberyn has shown that he pretty much doesn't care whether he's with a woman or a man.
Umm... yes there is. Screen caps have been posted and if you watch it in HD you can see it.
Sure, sure, I'm sure grandma acted alone and Loras had an evil smile on his face because he remembered a cruel, but funny joke.
LOL - yeah, no.
LOL yeah actually. They have a flirtatious glance at each other from across the wedding. I don't see how that could be taken any other way.
Then when the dwarfs are recreating the war of the five kings Loras is offended when the Stannis dwarf attacks Renly, because he was in a sexual relationship with Renly, and walks off in disgust. He is not seen after that. I never noticed any "evil look" given to Olenna and I wouldn't be surprised if she acted on her own if it is her.
But look man, I gave a pretty decent reply to your post. If you're gonna reply with one liners again don't even bother.
Honestly there are just way too many people who wanted the kid dead, had motives, and the means (being near to his food or cup). I think if there was a smoking gun in the background, the Internet as a whole would have seen it by now.
It's going to be a complete random crapshoot who the murderer is. We hadnt even seen Dontos since like Season 2, and all of the sudden he shows up and whisks Sansa away? The murderer could have been Jaquen H'gar disguised as Loras for all we know. I just expect an awesome story whoever it ends up being.
It's going to be a complete random crapshoot who the murderer is. We hadnt even seen Dontos since like Season 2, and all of the sudden he shows up and whisks Sansa away? The murderer could have been Jaquen H'gar disguised as Loras for all we know. I just expect an awesome story whoever it ends up being.
ebullientprism
Member
I dont understand the necklace theory. Why would someone need to smuggle in poison through a necklace gem? Its so overly complicated and risky. The poison capsule (if it was the gem) is tiny as hell. Just palm it and walk in. Or hide it in the seams of your clothes. Much safer and quicker access, its not like they are frisking people at the entrance. LOL.
EatChildren
Currently polling second in Australia's federal election (first in the Gold Coast), this feral may one day be your Bogan King.
The weight on Olenna isn't just because of the missing gem or whatever, but also (from my perspective) an observation of how this and the last episode were cut together in relation to this. Bad narrative has twists and other bullshit pulled out of nowhere with no substance or reasoning in retrospect. Good twists play the pieces right before your eyes and it only becomes obvious when you have the "gotcha" moment. Roose's betrayal of Rob is an example of this: his house has a rough history, Cat makes it clear he cannot be trusted, and his military policies butt heads with Rob's on several occasions. Again, Theon being flayed. The mystery is who is this guy and where the fuck is he. Meanwhile Theon is on a gigantic fucking flaying cross, while being flayed, and is continually taunted by a horn, the exact same horn blown by Bolton's men when they surround Winterfell.
So much emphasis was put on fucking necklaces and Olenna's disgust for Joffrey and Lannister bullshit in general was prevalent in the last episode and throughout the last season. Yeah sure, it could be anybody, but when freeze frame shows a fucking necklace gem disappear after Olenna is near by, the same Olenna who made a fuss about shitty nicklaces prior to the wedding, the same Olenna who knowingly loathes a sociopath marrying her granddaughter, etc etc. Come on. Good story telling, which Game of Thrones almost always has, suggests the killer can be implicated or at least narrowed down to a small pool based on events so far. Bad story telling suggests that the killer was fucking Hot Pie, cos pies. Or the kid sucking on his mum's tit, because...I dunno, tits.
I know a dude who I'm 100% positive hasn't read the books, and even he is hedges his bets on Olenna due to how the scene was cut. I don't think there's much plausibility to suggest anybody else specifically was involved. Maybe Olenna acted alone, being the craft mistress of awesome she is. Or maybe she had helpers, like the drunk, that will be revealed. That's the big picture that we don't know, but the writing on the wall for the time being says OLENNA.
Meanwhile, the book spoilers people are probably laughing at us because it was indeed Hot Pie.
I said this earlier, but Game of Thrones continually makes a point of how fucking hard it is for anybody of name and status to do anything without a spy picking up on it. This is like...one of the most prevalent core themes, integral to so many developments and twists. This exact episode makes a point of it, both Jamie and Tyrion reminding us how easily information slips out. Shit, even Lorris reminded us, hitting Jamie with the ol "yo you fuck your sister" shit. Nobody can shit, eat, breath, fuck, or do anything without someone noticing because movements of the rich and powerful are valuable commodities and essential political tools.
Yes, poison is small. But I think trying to smuggle in a poison that powerful, that active, and that deadly would be something watched out for by parties who know that information would be valuable. How does royalty get a hold of such things? How does a guest at Kings Landing acquire what seems to be one the most secretive and potent killing tools, without anybody noticing, and get it into a wedding.
Nobody suspects or watches a drunken nobody. A nobody in the strictest sense: nobody knows him. Even Sansa doesn't recognise him at first. The logistics are still murky, but it makes a lot more sense to use a tool that'll go unseen than to just piss away risk doing it yourself.
So much emphasis was put on fucking necklaces and Olenna's disgust for Joffrey and Lannister bullshit in general was prevalent in the last episode and throughout the last season. Yeah sure, it could be anybody, but when freeze frame shows a fucking necklace gem disappear after Olenna is near by, the same Olenna who made a fuss about shitty nicklaces prior to the wedding, the same Olenna who knowingly loathes a sociopath marrying her granddaughter, etc etc. Come on. Good story telling, which Game of Thrones almost always has, suggests the killer can be implicated or at least narrowed down to a small pool based on events so far. Bad story telling suggests that the killer was fucking Hot Pie, cos pies. Or the kid sucking on his mum's tit, because...I dunno, tits.
I know a dude who I'm 100% positive hasn't read the books, and even he is hedges his bets on Olenna due to how the scene was cut. I don't think there's much plausibility to suggest anybody else specifically was involved. Maybe Olenna acted alone, being the craft mistress of awesome she is. Or maybe she had helpers, like the drunk, that will be revealed. That's the big picture that we don't know, but the writing on the wall for the time being says OLENNA.
Meanwhile, the book spoilers people are probably laughing at us because it was indeed Hot Pie.
I said this earlier, but Game of Thrones continually makes a point of how fucking hard it is for anybody of name and status to do anything without a spy picking up on it. This is like...one of the most prevalent core themes, integral to so many developments and twists. This exact episode makes a point of it, both Jamie and Tyrion reminding us how easily information slips out. Shit, even Lorris reminded us, hitting Jamie with the ol "yo you fuck your sister" shit. Nobody can shit, eat, breath, fuck, or do anything without someone noticing because movements of the rich and powerful are valuable commodities and essential political tools.
Yes, poison is small. But I think trying to smuggle in a poison that powerful, that active, and that deadly would be something watched out for by parties who know that information would be valuable. How does royalty get a hold of such things? How does a guest at Kings Landing acquire what seems to be one the most secretive and potent killing tools, without anybody noticing, and get it into a wedding.
Nobody suspects or watches a drunken nobody. A nobody in the strictest sense: nobody knows him. Even Sansa doesn't recognise him at first. The logistics are still murky, but it makes a lot more sense to use a tool that'll go unseen than to just piss away risk doing it yourself.
I did not expect Joffrey to die so soon. Sheeeeit.
Wait a second . . . You've read all the Mass Effect junk but haven't had time to read these books?
Definitely this. With people like Varys around who seem to know everything that happens as it happens the last thing you'd want is for the trail to lead back to you. By having the poison hidden in a necklace and pass hands from the Fool to Sansa it would be much more difficult to trace it back to Olenna.
Although there's still the issue of whether she personally dropped it in the drink or not. But I suppose all eyes were on the scene Joffrey was making at that point anyway.
Hours Left
Member
I was thinking about this too. If Olenna is the killer, why would she need to have someone else bring in the poison? I don't think she's getting a shakedown at some behind the scenes security check point.
If the missing stone is indeed a plot point, then maybe it's for some other use. Perhaps it was a sign, or maybe to be planted as a decoy. (But that would mean someone is trying to frame Sansa, and I don't think that's happening.)
Haha, but your small pool of potential killers isn't that small. Even if you take out all of the Hot Pie-like minor characters you still have a ton of people who all have motive and were there: Olenna, Mace, Margeary, Sansa, Tyrion, Dontos, Oberyn, Varys, Tywin, Tommen, Loras, Shae, Iron Bank people, maybe Brienne. And I'm sure I'm forgetting a few. Any one of them could have done it and had a plausible motive and have a good story behind it. And then it still COULD be a random Dontos-like character. Everyone can guess until they turn as Purple as Geoffrey, but there was no bloody knife or poisoned fingers in this. Everyone had a potential motive. Guessing is dumb in this case until more is revealed.
I just realized she's wearing skinny jeans.Now that the King is dead we await the arrival of Our Beloved Rightful Queen Dany.
Can't wait for her to team up with the remains of House Lannister to rid Westeros of all the trash.
Fashion Queene
Now that the King is dead we await the arrival of Our Beloved Rightful Queen Dany.
Can't wait for her to team up with the remains of House Lannister to rid Westeros of all the trash.
Can a woman rule Westeros? Even if she is the Queen, just like Cersies was a Queen, they still had a male actually doing the ruling.
But then again with 3 dragons (currently) I can't see many people saying she can't. Although I see the Black Dragon growing too big and causing all sorts of problems to the other 2 dragons and Denaeris.
I haven't even read the books but you are so, so wrong.
That look between them was clearly one of "mm, you're hot, you like?" "indeed, you're hot, I do like".
Did her
Now that the King is dead we await the arrival of Our Beloved Rightful Queen Dany.
Can't wait for her to team up with the remains of House Lannister to rid Westeros of all the trash.
She's just going to be the Mad Queen Daenerys. Her self-righteousness is beginning to grate.
As if looking at all those dead slave children on the way to Meereen makes her a better person in anyway.
Sent you a PM
From the screen caps and the build up to this episode it seems that Olenna is definitely the culprit, but she wouldn't be acting alone. I don't think Tywin is involved, given how much weight he places on the family name, even for people like Tyrion. No way he would ever kill one of his own.
Little Finger has been completely out of the picture for too long and I'd be surprised if he wasn't pulling the strings somewhere. Given how he knows the Lannisters' accounts better than anyone and Olenna hinted that the Lannisters are running out of money, I think Little Finger has spotted an opportunity somewhere and has brokered an alliance with the Tyrells, and perhaps the Tullies and the house of Dorne.
Little Finger has been completely out of the picture for too long and I'd be surprised if he wasn't pulling the strings somewhere. Given how he knows the Lannisters' accounts better than anyone and Olenna hinted that the Lannisters are running out of money, I think Little Finger has spotted an opportunity somewhere and has brokered an alliance with the Tyrells, and perhaps the Tullies and the house of Dorne.
I'm siding with the other guy. That look was "u wan this?" "ya... ya I do." "aight, u come get this"
I just rewatched the scene where Olenna is talking to Sansa and you can totally see her take the bead with some wicked sleight of hand. She plays with Sansa's hair, then picks up one of the beads, brings it closer to herself as if to examine it and closes her hand. The camera then cuts to Sansa and it's gone.
The one person who's family forged the bloody thing.
Dany haters frighten me.
They say Joffrey was a nut job partly due to the incest that created him. What's Ramsey Snow's reason for being a psychotic fuck?
Now that the King is dead we await the arrival of Our Beloved Rightful Queen Dany.
Can't wait for her to team up with the remains of House Lannister to rid Westeros of all the trash.
Finally a voice of reason in this thread....wait what? Work with those golden haired asshats?
Now that the King is dead we await the arrival of Our Beloved Rightful Queen Dany.
Can't wait for her to team up with the remains of House Lannister to rid Westeros of all the trash.
uwotm8
It can easily be taken the other way given that the Tyrells - (that being Loras' last name, and all) kill Joffrey like 5 seconds later. But whatever, I didn't read that as particularly sexy given Oberyn had a girl on his lap that second. The fingers in Oberyns mouth could have alluded to sex or choking - hindsight will prove perfect, but without its benefit and in the moment of first viewing, I didn't read it as sexy because the premonition for something horrible was building, and Oberyn had a chick on his lap.
I'll post whatever I want.
Oberyn is clearly bisexual if you watched the episode prior.
I'm sorry but you're deluded.
I confess I had also forgotten about Oberyn's being bi. Delusion might be a tad strong of a term, bro. Being a more casual fan who doesn't obsess over the show too much, that I'll admit to.
And that's why it's good to read the posts of others and take into account that maybe you misinterpreted or forgot about a detail instead of just posting "LOL - yeah, no." and condescending crap like this:
I mean, seriously. Not the best way to communicate with people.
Whether the Ellaria was on his lap at the time or not is irrelevant, since just an episode prior he had accosted and felt up a guy in front of her as well.
I also must admit to being a casual GAF poster who doesn't read all 3200 posts of a thread before joining. Sorry to make you so mad.
Kiddo. It's GAF. And Tyrell is Loras and Olenna's last name. There probably WILL turn out to be a conspiracy involving more than one Tyrell. That part has nothing to do with Loras being bi.
Maybe you need to get out more if me just deciding that's a reasonable conclusion without checking with you really rocked your world this much.
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