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[Die Squirrel Die]

Wow great post gakman. I have to add, I believe in adidtion to the stuff you said about square-enix they also where very mad at the redesign of the pstwo where they lost hard drive support basically rendering usless ps2s ability to play final fantesty XI. idunno if i threw all this money at a game and the one sytem that supports it revises its designa lowwing my game to not be played id be really angry.

God this whole thing was so overblown. Sales of the FFXI/HDD pak jad pretty much reached its peak. I doubt SE would throw away their relationship with Sony over that. Nevermind that probably more than 90% of PS2s can still work with the HDD. At this stage the PS2 is selling to the casualest users on the market. Not the sort of people who would pay extra for a HDD that lets them play a game where they have to pay a monthly fee. It is almost certain that any further FFXI PS2 users will come from the pool of 70 million odd HDD workable PS2s.

And not to sound negative, but gakman's post sounded spookily like that longstanding rather simplistic notion that really all third parties are just fooling around, and they really all are desparate to work for Nintendo again, if it weren't for those damn blasted money men.

 

[DrGAKMAN]

Wow...really...I didn't think anyone would read that post let alone like it...thanks.

While it was very conspiracy theory like, rumor riddled and Nintendo possitive I see some truth to it. I don't think developers want to be restricted, but (I think the major point of my post) the higher-up's at the companies they work for will eventually force them where the money is and lemme pound this statement out again...be subserviant to the market leader. I DO think Sony is putting some of these companies in check and I DO think it's causing some turmoil much like in the days when Nintendo did the same...thing is game makers have choices now.

Logically, why would game makers be making games for other systems when PS2 is still so dominant? Maybe 'cos they don't like Sony? Maybe 'cos they like the other systems better? Or maybe...just maybe...they don't want the old Nintendo days where everyone had to be subserviant to the market leader and want to "balance the scales" so that no one console maker is so dominant that they dictate rule over them?

Back on topic...I do think that the Bandai investment Nintendo made will grow, Konami is changing, Square-Enix will throw their weight around, Sonic Team MAY end up at Nintendo, CAPCOM will continue to lose talent, Clover (or at least Mr. Mikami) will end up at Nintendo and Team Ninja will continue to whine and make games with large breasts in them...of these things I am certain!

 

[Odnetnin]

Back on topic...I do think that the Bandai investment Nintendo made will grow, Konami is changing, Square-Enix will throw their weight around, Sonic Team MAY end up at Nintendo, CAPCOM will continue to lose talent, Clover (or at least Mr. Mikami) will end up at Nintendo and Team Ninja will continue to whine and make games with large breasts in them...of these things I am certain!

That Bandai investment is turning out to be a killer already. JSS is going to sell like a bazillion and one copies and that's before Nintendo begins milking their other franchises to good effect.

 

[Jonnyram]

Re: Square/Sony
SCE owned 8.63% of Square Enix as of 30 September
How did Sony fuck Square over? Continued dilly-dallying over the release of the HDD in America, forcing Square to a) release on the PC first and b) release with only 12 months' lead over killer MMORPGs WoW and EQ2. FFXI should have been released in the US a year earlier and Square probably lost a lot of money with Sony's fucking about. The PSTwo move just added salt to the wounds.

 

[citrus lump]

So anyone got any new hints on this or is it a dead thread?

 

[-SRV-]

Re: Square/Sony
SCE owned 8.63% of Square Enix as of 30 September
How did Sony fuck Square over? Continued dilly-dallying over the release of the HDD in America, forcing Square to a) release on the PC first and b) release with only 12 months' lead over killer MMORPGs WoW and EQ2. FFXI should have been released in the US a year earlier and Square probably lost a lot of money with Sony's fucking about. The PSTwo move just added salt to the wounds.

Great points, but one SCE is NOT a company, Sony is. You cannot buy SCE stock, but you can buy Sony stock. The ticker symbol is SNY. At least in the US that is true.

 

[imastalker co.]

thinking it's Square isn't such a bad idea. i'll let you in on why.

things to take into consideration....

it is very possible that Square could be a tad bit annoyed with Sony. they did sorta fuck shit up for them here and there. im not saying it was enough to piss Square off to the point that they'd bail on Sony completely. but obviously, they also don't take it in the ass from Sony as much as they did before. i wouldn't say they're in bed with Nintendo (handhelds aside), but they've definitely warmed up to them a bit to say the least.

so here's what im saying will happen if hey, it goes down.

Square-Enix will become a second party Nintendo team. aside from being able to make whatever it is they please, Nintendo also pushes them to start making movies on the side. maybe even some animation.
obviously, this would work out just excellent for both companies. what would make Nintendo happier than releasing a Final Fantasy movie in theatres, that uses that DS connectivity they've been wanting to use with well, a Final Fantasy game. Square would totally have someone to fund their movies too.

as far as sales go, between Nintendo, Final Fantasy, and Dragon Quest. you're gonna have great amount of market share. so i don't feel that Square-Enix would be too worried about sales. not to mention the 3rd party support that would come with it.
although 3rd party support is pretty much a given next gen for any console. like i've said, due to rising cost of development, no more 3rd party exclusives. unless they're paid for by another company.

that'll also cover GameSpy's 'Nintendo will be cool again' prediction.

 

[Vashu]

So basically, whichever console gets the most support from Square Enix is the biggest over in Japan. At least, that's what everyone thinks reading through this thread. Of course, I think so too, and a defection from Sony to Nintendo could really shake things up in the benefit of Nintendo. They be fools to let that pass...

 

[The End]

I would be significantly less upset with a Nintendo-SE or Nintendo-Capcom/Clover transaction than a MS-SE or MS-Capcom one.

That said, i don't think SE is in any rush to get back into the movie business after how well it went for them last time. Advent Children aside, i think they're very wary of exceeding their "mandate" so to speak.

That said, it would be extremely wise for Sony to increase their stake in SE as much as possible. Even at 8%, they do hold some sway. Remember, there were supposed to be at least two SE games on the cube.

 

[jiggle]

Square-Enix will become a second party Nintendo team. aside from being able to make whatever it is they please, Nintendo also pushes them to start making movies on the side. maybe even some animation.

If Square-Enix becomes a second party of Nintendo, they will make whatever games Nintendo pleases.

One reason cited for their merger was to strengthen the two companies from the threats of takeover, iirc, or somewhere along that line.
Why would they be willingly give up their independence and submit to become a second party to another company? It's not as if their're in any financial trouble.

And Square is making movie, FF:AC. And if that's successful, there will be more. Doesn't Square own Fullmetal Alchemist also? They have the freedom to choose what to make, be it games or movies or whatever, with nobody there [pushing] them to do anything. Surely they wouldn't give that up?

that'll also cover GameSpy's 'Nintendo will be cool again' prediction.

The cool make over has more to do with the US and Reggie. When did Square become synonymous with cool in the west?

And what about the weapon through the head part of the rumor? The Sword of Erdrick?

 

[imastalker co.]

That said, i don't think SE is in any rush to get back into the movie business

you don't know that. give them full force funding and see what their answer is. they'd probably make multiple films given the opportunity, and encouragment.

 

[duckroll]

That said, it would be extremely wise for Sony to increase their stake in SE as much as possible. Even at 8%, they do hold some sway. Remember, there were supposed to be at least two SE games on the cube.

NO. Just NO. Those were NON-VOTING stocks. It's been said over and over. Sony has no sway over Square Enix. Why is there only one Square game on the Cube? Because it sold like shit that's why. Why is ToS on the PS2 now? Because it sold like shit that's why. Or does Sony have shares in Namco now too? Is it really so difficult to accept that 3rd parties hate putting games on Nintendo consoles because Nintendo first party games dominate the sales and the Nintendo fanbase doesn't really buy many 3rd party games? In the end it's all about sales because no matter how much you love making games, if you don't profit you're not going to be making games for long.

 

[jiggle]

So basically, whichever console gets the most support from Square Enix is the biggest over in Japan.

Or more precisely, which ever console that gets the main Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest.

But then again, it has been Enix's policy to release Dragon Quest exclusively to the console with the largest installment. So it's like a two way street.

Had Square not talk Enix out of developing for N64, I wonder how the 32bit war would've turned out.

 

[duckroll]

Doesn't Square own Fullmetal Alchemist also? They have the freedom to choose what to make, be it games or movies or whatever, with nobody there [pushing] them to do anything. Surely they wouldn't give that up?

Square Enix owns the Fullmetal Alchemist franchise because the manga runs in Enix Gangan which well became Square Enix Gangan after the merger. There's already a Fullmetal Alchemist movie coming but it's by BONES. Square Enix trusted them to produce the TV anime series and Square Enix isn't going to be stupid enough to do FMA movies themselves. They'll focus actual development on maximumizing fan appeal and profits, which is pushing out C-grade FMA games which fans will snap up anyway while developing more Compilation of FFVII crap which will get them enough $$$$$ into the 6th millennium. :lol

 

[imastalker co.]

If Square-Enix becomes a second party of Nintendo, they will make whatever games Nintendo pleases.

well, i'd imagine if Nintendo ever owned a big chuck of a big developer again, they'd let them do as they liked for the most part. my only example being Rare, but in their case, Nintendo totally hooked them up with a super studio (for the time), and didn't really tell them what to do. Rare was free to do as they wished for the most part. atleast that's what Rare claims.

One reason cited for their merger was to strengthen the two companies from the threats of takeover, iirc, or somewhere along that line.
Why would they be willingly give up their independence and submit to become a second party to another company? It's not as if their're in any financial trouble.

And Square is making movie, FF:AC. And if that's successful, there will be more. Doesn't Square own Fullmetal Alchemist also? They have the freedom to choose what to make, be it games or movies or whatever, with nobody there [pushing] them to do anything. Surely they wouldn't give that up?

as for the merger benefiting Square for films, well, Nintendo's funds would allow them to do more. alot more.

 

[jiggle]

well, i'd imagine if Nintendo ever owned a big chuck of a big developer again, they'd let them do as they liked for the most part. my only example being Rare, but in their case, Nintendo totally hooked them up with a super studio (for the time), and didn't really tell them what to do. Rare was free to do as they wished for the most part. atleast that's what Rare claims.

Uh, didn't Nintendo make Rare turn Dinosaur Planet into a Star Fox game?

And at this point, does Squarenix really need Nintendo's hook up? Maybe back when Square was more vulnerable post TSW. With the big success of DQVIII, and likely success of FFXII and KHII, Squarenix is a very financially stable company. It's not some small talented development studio that can be bought out to acquire funding for their projects

as for the merger benefiting Square for films, well, Nintendo's funds would allow them to do more.

It would be wise for them to get other companies to jointly fund a movie project. But I don't see them selling themself into a 2nd party just to make more movies. Making game is still their bread and butter afterall.

Even for movies, I'm sure they can manage that by themself, and smart enough to not make another 150 million movie ever again. :lol

 

[duckroll]

Actually to be specific, Fullmetal Alchemist is one of Square Enix's MOST profitable licenses. They don't even NEED to make games out of it to make a fortune. It's hot property right now as far as merchendising, manga, anime, etc are concerned. It should be noted that while Square always rode on the profit of their hottest selling games, Enix never needed to. They were a publishing in their own right releasing games from other developers as well as dabbling very well into the manga and magazine industries. With the merger the amount of money in the house would make a buyover at this point VERY unlikely.

 

[radioheadrule83]

NO. Just NO. Those were NON-VOTING stocks. It's been said over and over. Sony has no sway over Square Enix. Why is there only one Square game on the Cube? Because it sold like shit that's why. Why is ToS on the PS2 now? Because it sold like shit that's why. Or does Sony have shares in Namco now too? Is it really so difficult to accept that 3rd parties hate putting games on Nintendo consoles because Nintendo first party games dominate the sales and the Nintendo fanbase doesn't really buy many 3rd party games? In the end it's all about sales because no matter how much you love making games, if you don't profit you're not going to be making games for long.

To be fair Crystal Chronicles was a connectivity game funded by the Q fund, developed by Game Developers Company - not truly a subsidiary of Square-Enix. And it sold well for what it was. And Tales of Symphonia... don't I recall reading it's been the best selling Tales game in the States?

 

[imastalker co.]

Uh, didn't Nintendo make Rare turn Dinosaur Planet into a Star Fox game?

i didn't think i actually had to make the "for the most part" bold. anyways, Nintendo rarely told Rare what to do. im sure they'd make suggestions and all, but if interviews with Nintendo and Rare are anything to go by. Nintendo acted like more of a business partner than anything else.

And at this point, does Squarenix really need Nintendo's hook up?

nope. just thought i'd point out the benefits.

It would be wise for them to get other companies to jointly fund a movie project. But I don't see them selling themself into a 2nd party just to make more movies. Making game is still their bread and butter afterall.

give them an opportunity to make more at no cost, chances are they'd love too.

With the merger the amount of money in the house would make a buyover at this point VERY unlikely.

indeed. but a partnership, or a huge investment is a whole other story. especially if movies are considered a big factor.

 

[jiggle]

give them an opportunity to make more at no cost, chances are they'd love too.

A joint venture, yeah. Something like Crystal Chronicles

But to actually sell the whole company? Nope

 

[duckroll]

To be fair Crystal Chronicles was a connectivity game funded by the Q fund, developed by Game Developers Company - not truly a subsidiary of Square-Enix. And it sold well for what it was. And Tales of Symphonia... don't I recall reading it's been the best selling Tales game in the States?

"The best selling Tales game in the States" is akin to saying "the best selling Splinter Cell game in Japan" pretty much. ToS is only the 3rd Tales game in the US and the previous two didn't do so hot at all. In Japan Tales averages at about 800k to 1 million per game. ToS did like 300-400k in Japan for the GC, obviously Namco wasn't pleased. Doesn't help that Baten Kaitos then proceeded to do like 70k in Japan too. US sales don't look so hot either.

 

[imastalker co.]

But to actually sell the whole company? Nope

selling the whole company? never crossed my mind.

 

[Jonnyram]

Great points, but one SCE is NOT a company, Sony is. You cannot buy SCE stock, but you can buy Sony stock. The ticker symbol is SNY. At least in the US that is true.

What are you talking about? You don't need to be a company to buy stock. It's not like Hiroshi Yamauchi is a company either. The Square Enix stock is owned by SCE, not Sony.

 

[jiggle]

selling the whole company? never crossed my mind.

so here's what im saying will happen if hey, it goes down.
Square-Enix will become a second party Nintendo team.


Forgive me if I got the meaning of "2nd party" wrong, I'll apologize in advance. But doesn't being 2nd party entail the selling of your company?

Oh right, you didn't say selling the whole company, and 2nd party doesn't have to sell the whole company. Gotcha.

So let me rephrase,

But to actually sell their own company? Nope

 

[Afro Thunder]

Think about the word "Perhaps". It means that may be a hint or may be not a hint. So stay tuned. Confused?

 

[jarrod]

"The best selling Tales game in the States" is akin to saying "the best selling Splinter Cell game in Japan" pretty much. ToS is only the 3rd Tales game in the US and the previous two didn't do so hot at all. In Japan Tales averages at about 800k to 1 million per game. ToS did like 300-400k in Japan for the GC, obviously Namco wasn't pleased. Doesn't help that Baten Kaitos then proceeded to do like 70k in Japan too. US sales don't look so hot either.

Don't discount western sales for Namco RPGs. If not for strong western sales on Xenosaga (since it missed targets in Japan by about 400k) the series would've ended. Same could be true for Tales on GameCube, Symphonia's more than tripled Namco's expectations here.

And Tales games don't average a 800k to 1M in sales, TOD2 was by far the best selling game in the series and was the only one reaching the figures you're suggesting. Rebirth's only on track to sell about half that. Worldwide, Symphonia GC will mange those numbers though, and will be the 2nd Tales game to do so.

 

[duckroll]

Don't discount western sales for Namco RPGs. If not for strong western sales on Xenosaga (since it missed targets in Japan by about 400k) the series would've ended. Same could be true for Tales on GameCube, Symphonia's more than tripled Namco's expectations here.

And Tales games don't average a 800k to 1M in sales, TOD2 was by far the best selling game in the series and was the only one reaching the figures you're suggesting. Rebirth's only on track to sell about half that. Worldwide, Symphonia GC will mange those numbers though, and will be the 2nd Tales game to do so.

Tales of Destiny PSX did 802,715
Tales of Phantasia PSX did 282,855 the year after it was released but I can't seem to find how much it did total
Tales of Eternia PSX did 703,904
Tales of Destiny 2 PS2 did 833,877
Tales of Phantasia The Best did about 88k

Ok so I was off with 800k to 1M, should have said 700-800k. It's still a far cry from ToS's 300-400k because being the 3rd Tales game released in the US, it would also be the lowest selling total of all the Tales games released worldwide. It doesn't matter how you play the figures, ToS being on the GC hurts its sales. The same game on the PS2 would have sold much more and would still have been released in the US and sold even more.

My point wasn't that the US sales are pointless, it's that the GC is not a very viable 3rd party platform (like any other recent-gen Nintendo console) and that's why 3rd party developers are not keen to develop for it. There's not moeny to show. RE was a multi-million selling franchise on the PS/PS2, look what the GC turned it into. Small wonder many, many 3rd party developers are more upset with Nintendo then they are with SCEA.

 

[CrisKre]

Just to put into perspective this argument, Im sure Namco is not delusional as to what they expect from sales of their games.

You cannot expect a game sell the same on a 80 million userbase than on a 17 million one. Its pure logic. Going by that, Id say proportionally TOS on gamecube did AMAZINGLY well, even incredibly well, wouldn't you?

There is a lot more to this than sales tough, and Im sure Nintendo and Namco are pretty pleased as to how Tales did on GC overall.

I guess the real test as to how GC does with exclusives will be RE4. This is the biggest exclusive yet for the cube, it has great media coverage, it is a relly anticipated title and it failing would be a bad sign. It HAS to top 1, 1.2 mill worldwide. The only things that may keep it from being a blockbuster are:

a- PS2 announcement
b- arguably bad launch window (january)
c- GC's stigma as a kids platform

 

[jarrod]

Tales of Destiny PSX did 802,715
Tales of Phantasia PSX did 282,855 the year after it was released but I can't seem to find how much it did total
Tales of Eternia PSX did 703,904
Tales of Destiny 2 PS2 did 833,877
Tales of Phantasia The Best did about 88k

Ok so I was off with 800k to 1M, should have said 700-800k. It's still a far cry from ToS's 300-400k because being the 3rd Tales game released in the US, it would also be the lowest selling total of all the Tales games released worldwide.

Well, I've only got numbers from this gen handy...

Title (JP 1st week) JP total (US total)

Tales of Destiny 2 (498,142) 762,861
Tales of Rebirth (372,767) 443,942
Tales of Symphonia PS2 (269,083) 374,759
Tales of Symphonia GC (183,527) 315,466 (255,240)
Tales of The World: Narikiri Dungeon 2 (86,587) 163,043
Tales of Phantasia GBA (55,970) 134,608

Seems Symphonia GC is actually the 2nd best selling Tales this gen total. And western sales will likely keep going, adding in Euro figures and a PC release, it'll probably surpass Destiny 2 as well. None of the Tales games have actually broken a million either, both Destiny and Eternia failed to break 100k in the US iirc (neither saw PAL release either iirc). Symphonia GC might be the first to pass that mark also if it has legs.

Oh and going off memory (so don't quote me) Phantasia SFC sold about 300k and Phantasia PSX sold about 500k.

It doesn't matter how you play the figures, ToS being on the GC hurts its sales. The same game on the PS2 would have sold much more and would still have been released in the US and sold even more.

I'd actually say the rapid succession of Tales releases hurt it more... look at Rebirth on PS2 for another example of this. Sure it likely would've moved more on PS2 initially, but coming 9 months after Destiny 2 still would've impacted it to the point where it likely would've missed targets and not come close to the 700-800k in Japan you're suggesting. Western sales would've needed to be the savior again... and on PS2, Symphonia would've been a little fish in an ocean comparatively, rather than the biggish name RPG it was on the genre starved GameCube base.

My point wasn't that the US sales are pointless, it's that the GC is not a very viable 3rd party platform (like any other recent-gen Nintendo console) and that's why 3rd party developers are not keen to develop for it. There's not moeny to show.

Using Tales is a bad argument for that though, I'd be like using Xenosaga to prove the same point for PS2. Their situations are almost identical actually. Plus both made money. :/

RE was a multi-million selling franchise on the PS/PS2, look what the GC turned it into.

Another bad example, RE's massive downturn actually started on PS1, before the Dreamcast detour. Sales have actually picked up slightly in the move to GameCube. RE's waning brand success can't really be attributed to anything other than Capcom's mismanagement. PS2's massive base is hardly any guarantee either, look what happened to DMC and Onimusha.

Small wonder many, many 3rd party developers are more upset with Nintendo then they are with SCEA.

I sort of doubt that honestly. SCEA is the new Nintendo basically.

 

[Broshnat]

Tales of Destiny PSX did 802,715
Tales of Phantasia PSX did 282,855 the year after it was released but I can't seem to find how much it did total
Tales of Eternia PSX did 703,904
Tales of Destiny 2 PS2 did 833,877
Tales of Phantasia The Best did about 88k

Ok so I was off with 800k to 1M, should have said 700-800k. It's still a far cry from ToS's 300-400k because being the 3rd Tales game released in the US, it would also be the lowest selling total of all the Tales games released worldwide. It doesn't matter how you play the figures, ToS being on the GC hurts its sales. The same game on the PS2 would have sold much more and would still have been released in the US and sold even more.

My point wasn't that the US sales are pointless, it's that the GC is not a very viable 3rd party platform (like any other recent-gen Nintendo console) and that's why 3rd party developers are not keen to develop for it. There's not moeny to show. RE was a multi-million selling franchise on the PS/PS2, look what the GC turned it into. Small wonder many, many 3rd party developers are more upset with Nintendo then they are with SCEA.

Well let's be complete:

Tales of Destiny 825k
Tales of Phantasia 550k
Tales of Eternia 700k
Tales of Desting 2 800k
Tales of Symphonia 350k GC, 400k PS2 750k total
Tales of Rebirth 575k total by the time it's done.

And as has been said, outside Japan:

Tales of Desting < 100k
Tales of Phantasia < 100k
Tales of Symphonia 300k +

 

[mashoutposse]

I doubt Gamespy has the scoop on an SE - Nintendo merger.

 

[Vashu]

I doubt Gamespy has the scoop on an SE - Nintendo merger.

They did merge with IGN....

 

[Broshnat]

RE was a multi-million selling franchise on the PS/PS2, look what the GC turned it into.

Well, I think RE4 could match RE3 in terms of sales on GC alone, never mind with a PS2 release as well.

 

[SolidSnakex]

They did merge with IGN....

Which is even more proof. We aren't seeing daily crazy posts by Matt going apesh!t and teasing fans about something massive about to happen.

 

[Hero]

When ToS hits Player's Choice in the US, I can see it easily doing at least another 100K by the end of the generation.

Isn't there another Tales of game coming to Gamecube? I forget, it's hard to keep up.

And also, Capcom was the one hurting the RE franchise, not Nintendo. You had three games on the PSX, then they jumped with Code Veronica on DC, back to PS2 with Code Veronica X, then to Nintendo. I'm sure Resident Evil fans were a little pissed by having to follow different systems. Not to mention that if you compare how much REmake and RE0 sold on the GAMECUBE user base as opposed to RE1-3 and CVX on the PSX/PS2 userbase respectively.

 

[SolidSnakex]

Isn't there another Tales of game coming to Gamecube? I forget, it's hard to keep up.

There never was another one confirmed. NAMCO registered 2 new Tales titles and people just assumed one was for the GC.

 

[Vashu]

Which is even more proof. We aren't seeing daily crazy posts by Matt going apesh!t and teasing fans about something massive about to happen.

True true.... But then again... Matt these days...

 

[jarrod]

Isn't there another Tales of game coming to Gamecube? I forget, it's hard to keep up.

Project Melfes... the platform's currently tba. It could be PS2 (most likely imo), GameCube (less likely imo), PSP (least likely imo) or some combination of the above.

 

[jarrod]

There never was another one confirmed. NAMCO registered 2 new Tales titles and people just assumed one was for the GC.

Namco actually registered 4 titles iirc.

-Tales of Rebirth (turned out to be a PS2 game)
-Tales of Tactics (turned out to be a FOMA game)
-Tales of Justice
-Tales of Honesty

...then there was the big multiplatform Tales rumor...

-Tales of Truthia (2D PS2 Eternia sequel, might've become Rebirth)
-Tales of Legendia (3D GC Symphonia sequel, might've become Melfes)
-Tales of the World: Narikiri Dungeon 3 (GBA game, just released)
-Tales of Fandom Vol. 2 (PS2/PS1 game)

...Namco also trademarked the Truthia and Legendia titles too.

 

[NWO]

Which is even more proof. We aren't seeing daily crazy posts by Matt going apesh!t and teasing fans about something massive about to happen.

Duh! Matt has been too busy playing RE4.

 

[Guns N' Poops]

Namco actually registered 4 titles iirc.

-Tales of Rebirth (turned out to be a PS2 game)
-Tales of Tactics (turned out to be a FOMA game)
-Tales of Justice
-Tales of Honesty

...then there was the big multiplatform Tales rumor...

-Tales of Truthia (2D PS2 Eternia sequel, might've become Rebirth)
-Tales of Legendia (3D GC Symphonia sequel, might've become Melfes)
-Tales of the World: Narikiri Dungeon 3 (GBA game, just released)
-Tales of Fandom Vol. 2 (PS2/PS1 game)

...Namco also trademarked the Truthia and Legendia titles too.

Pushing that BS rumor as always? Namco hasn't trademarked Truthia and Legendia.

Namco
- Tales of Rebirth (12 November)
- Tales of Justice (12 November)
- Tales of Honesty (12 November)
- Tales of Tactics (6 November) - a FOMA-based game
- Namco Rehabilitainment (7 November)
- Quiz de Quest (6 November)
- Medal no Tatsujin (12 November)
- The Medal Game Master (12 November)

Those where the trademarks they trademarked at the same time, no freaking Legendia there.

 

[Pimpwerx]

The defection talk shouldn't include Japanese companies. Sony owns Japan handily. Of all the territories, Japan is the most spoken for right now. Squeenix? Namco? Capcom? Konami? How have these companies faired on US or EU soil? Ignoring the fact that the GC has done miserably in all three territories, why would these companies take a chance jumping ship to a platform that has no pull in their homeland and diminishing returns elsewhere. As I've said before, and the reason a lot of other people keep saying it, at least the Xbox is a legit system in some part of the world. Say what you will, but you can make money off the Xbox in the US, period. It's done even worse in Japan, and is sucking in EU, but at least there's a region where some semblance of success has taken place. But whatever. There were these same, lame rumors back before the Xbox and GC launched, and the only defection worth a damn was a series that had stagnated on the PS1 (RE) and Team Ninja's juggies (which actually garnered some success). That's about as major as it's likely to get. I expect the Xbox2 and PSP 3rd party games lists to tell the full tale. The games usually tell you where the companies are going. PEACE.

EDIT: As in, the Team Ninja defection was telegraphed with their DC work.

 

[jarrod]

Pushing that BS rumor as always? Namco hasn't trademarked Truthia and Legendia.

Truthia was trademarked along with Symphonia back in 2002 iirc. Legendia was trademarked a few months later. Those 4 later trademarks came at the end of 2003 iirc. And about half that "BS rumor" already came true in some form.

Those where the trademarks they trademarked at the same time, no freaking Legendia there.

Where did I say it was fanboi?

 

[Odnetnin]

...Namco also trademarked the Truthia and Legendia titles too.

here?

 

[Guns N' Poops]

Truthia was trademarked along with Symphonia back in 2002 iirc. Legendia was trademarked a few months later. Those 4 later trademarks came at the end of 2003 iirc. And about half that "BS rumor" already came true in some form.



Where did I say it was fanboi?

You know, your IIRC is not a proof at all, handheld-nintendrone.

 

[jarrod]

You know, your IIRC is not a proof at all, handheld-nintendrone.

The only working link I can find is a hardcore Tales fansite, which specifically mentions everything I just said. The site manager doesn't seem too keen on Nintendo either, so no slant there. Anyone know how to search for JP trademarks?

Though feel free to continue with the garbled english fanboi, I'm off to get a haircut in 5 minutes.

here?

Not here, in Japan.

 

[Mrbob]

Team Ninja = Xbox 2

The way this guy is talking, it sounds like this is going to be a huge move. Yes, Team Ninja has made a name for themselves on Xbox, but I don't think them moving back to Sony or Nintendo would be considered an enormous move.

 

[DrGAKMAN]

Another couple of rumblings in the force I've felt is the whole Factor 5 thing and NEC situation. In Factor 5's case I think they're done with Nintendo 'cos they want to do online games. Nintendo used to have a good hold on Star Wars games in the N64 days, but that "honor" goes to X-BOX currently...next generation who knows, but if Nintendo doesn't make some kind of online splash the defection of Factor 5 to MS is a give-in.

The NEC situation, I see, is this...they've been wanting back into games for a while now. They worked with Sega on DC and wanted to produce the core of GCN, but instead ended up with just producing chips designed by Art-X/ATi & IBM. NEC started up game production again too. Then NEC (along with Toshiba) are heading up HD-DVD, which, who knows, may play a role in the future of gaming. NEC is, I'd say, closest to Nintendo, but alot of the old NEC (Turbo Graffix 16-Bit) supporters (Hudson, Takara, etc.) are under Konami who's aligence is not so much Nintendo. However, doesn't mean Nintendo couldn't help fund or partner with NEC games in exchange for HD-DVD and/or exclussive content. It's been rumored for a while that BR will be in PS3 and Toshiba/NEC should want HD-DVD in major competing platforms to keep Sony from having an edge...the "obvious" choice is MS's Xenon as it launches sooner and alot beleive it has a good chance of competing with PS3 in the west, but what about the homeland...what about Japan? Having HD-DVD in Xenon *and* Revolution means two major platforms in all major regions would be a good strategy against Sony's BR in PS3. And if say BR doesn't do as well as HD-DVD then this backs Sony more into a corner as the other two competing platforms would be using the competing format making Sony the odd-man out maybe? Who knows...but hopefully Nintendo & NEC see the potential in each other and run with it...bring back Bonk & Cosmic Fantasy please...

The whole Square-Enix "back with Nintendo" situation is getting really dreamy. It's fun to speculate, but realistically unless Nintendo basically makes Revolution Square-Enix's dream (online, HD built-in, high-capacity format, lower licencing, etc.) they won't leave potentially the largest userbase in the PlayStation brand. But, on the other hand, maybe Square-Enix see's PC gamers as their biggest userbase for online gaming and therefore the console userbase may not matter as much? If Sony is pissing Square-Enix off, then that would explain certain delays and little to no PSP support...if Sony makes mistakes, then maybe Square-Enix MIGHT go to a catering Nintendo & PC stance. A new Nintendo/Square-Enix franchise in the Kingdom Hearts vein would be AWESOME...

As far as what GameSpy (or IGN) knows...GameSpy *was* suppossedly working with Nintendo on their online structure...maybe they heard some things and that's why they feel this major defection is happenning *and* that Nintendo is suppossedly making major steps in becoming cooler? The first 2005 big thing they mention is Nintendo is doing something major to improve their image...then they give Reggie/better advertising as explainations of what they did in 2004. So to me, Nintendo is doing something BEYOND just better advertising to become cool and buying a company or causing a defection would be a good way to do so as it would show Nintendo is serious about next generation. To me, this centers on Revolution's unveiling and the announcements that come with it (around E3?) as it really is sorta "too late" for GCN to suddenly become cool.

 

[imastalker co.]

E3 will more than likely be were they bust out any super announcements, but don't be suprised if we hear something in march. something will go down in march for sure though.