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Ghost in the Shell's ending spurs new accusations of even worse whitewashing
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She's named Mira Killian.
Wait, it also takes place in an Asian city? That's dumb.
Like the twist, it was probably an attempt to mitigate the whitewashing that ended up making things worse, just like when it came to light they'd investigated ways to make the white actors look Asian through CG. All that just tells me the people working on this movie didn't know what they were doing when trying to reconcile the whole issue.
I'd mostly forgotten about that. They came out and strongly denied that took place though.
There really is no guessing when it comes to GitS it is quite explicit, "At the edge of Asia, in a strange corporate-conglomerate-state, Japan..." is written on the very first page.
I haven't seen the movie yet, but I don't think I will (it comes out this Friday) so I don't know what they changed. But it hasn't looked at all interesting to me ever since I saw the first trailer.
Holundrian
Unconfirmed Member
Lol, I was already scratching my head when I read about them exploring CGIing Asian features on ScarJo but this ouch. Not that I'm upset it's kind of hilarious in a very weird and rather uncomfortable way.
Yeah, I've forgotten most of the circumstances surrounding on this, including that they admitted doing so for a minor character. IIRC the rumour was they were testing making Scarlett look more Asian and the statement you quoted is a pretty strong denial of that.
AmaterasuOni
Banned
Sexuality can't be racism. That fetish line is a sarcastic bait. I do love asian women, especially Japanese. They are not fetishes to me, like to many anime/manga freaks. I like my women to be alive, not fantasies. This was written to show hypocrisy surrounding the whole anime scene.
And if you don't have any high-profile asian-american actresses at the moment to star a blockbuster scifi-action movie, it's hard to cast anyone but a flavor of the month to bring in the bare minimum from the box office. It's so logical, but your agenda is blinding you (like always).
This out of context "copy-pasting" needs to stop. It's venomous and harmful. And mostly fucking childish bully behavior from insecure people with political agendas.
AgentOtaku
Member
I lost it at that DoubleToasted review
Yeah.... I'll eventually get around to watching this for all the great work Weta and the production team put into the presentation
...other than that, lol
Yeah.... I'll eventually get around to watching this for all the great work Weta and the production team put into the presentation
...other than that, lol
MugiwaraCole
Member
That wasn't just some rumor. There were pictures. They just lied about it.
Okay, I've never seen these pictures. But I'd like to!
Holy shit. This thread is so frustrating to read that it's making my head spin. Is this what Asian Americans go through?
There was actually a person who flat out said small eyes=Asian. Lmao
You can bet your asses that the CG work for making white actors look more Japanese would have been turning eyes into slits, and ridiculously high cheekbones
There was actually a person who flat out said small eyes=Asian. Lmao
You can bet your asses that the CG work for making white actors look more Japanese would have been turning eyes into slits, and ridiculously high cheekbones
ronaldthump
Member
Yeah, the "twist" is terrible.
I watched it and thought it was totally unnecessary and hokey as fuck.
Oh my fucking god.
It's written in to displace the casting and make it okay and in turn, made it worse.
also
the majority of the cast is white while the people in the city are asian (and they're either pimps or degenerates or people working in the slummy areas). It's bizarre.
+
I should also add: re: white washing and this filmic universe
Batou + Major are both white.
The majority of the people they mow down are asians as the city is predominantly asian (except for the leads)
This movie can be quite troublesome from a race politics angle. Basically, if you're asian, you're going to be shot and killed by 2 white characters.
I watched it and thought it was totally unnecessary and hokey as fuck.
That scene with the mother and the scene after the movie is over
Oh my fucking god.
It's written in to displace the casting and make it okay and in turn, made it worse.
also
the majority of the cast is white while the people in the city are asian (and they're either pimps or degenerates or people working in the slummy areas). It's bizarre.
+
I should also add: re: white washing and this filmic universe
Batou + Major are both white.
The majority of the people they mow down are asians as the city is predominantly asian (except for the leads)
The thugs in the first shoot out are all asian + the robots
The club they visit has all asian thugs who all got shot and killed
they go into the slum and the woman hacker is asian as are all the asian slum tech people. who also all get shot/blown up
the only 3 significant plot villians are white the 2 garbage truck men are white, the main villian is white and given ample screen time - with one being in the water area fight. Anyone with huge amounts of screen time is white.
The club they visit has all asian thugs who all got shot and killed
they go into the slum and the woman hacker is asian as are all the asian slum tech people. who also all get shot/blown up
the only 3 significant plot villians are white the 2 garbage truck men are white, the main villian is white and given ample screen time - with one being in the water area fight. Anyone with huge amounts of screen time is white.
This movie can be quite troublesome from a race politics angle. Basically, if you're asian, you're going to be shot and killed by 2 white characters.
Lol basically, unless they're shot by Aramaki, Togusa, or Ishikawa (edit: or Saito!), who possibly kill more people in the movie than the two leads do. But, details, the important part is that you feel right.
ronaldthump
Member
it is what it is. The body count in the club and tower alone is pretty high. And that's Batou and Major.
"it is what it is", especially when it isn't.
Doctoglethorpe
Member
I loved it. My fiancee​ loved it. It's very very true to the anime and very well made. I really don't give a shit about the Major being white, they had to get as big a western recognized lead they could to have a chance at convincing the general pop to see it. As big fans of the anime, we thought it was fuckin great despite that reality. She's a minority and thinks the race issue is completely overblown. I would agree and see it as just the typical way people try their hardest to find any reason to hate Hollywood remakes, but I'm white so I must be racist.
Here's a couple videos from Max Landis that's a great explanation why Hollywood makes these decisions:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=747cvo8Lkjw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwDqbDp6SGc
I find it interesting how there's a lot of similarities with the movie and gaming industry. Both seem to not want to take too many risk with big projects so that's why we get the same type of products regurgitated every year.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=747cvo8Lkjw
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwDqbDp6SGc
I find it interesting how there's a lot of similarities with the movie and gaming industry. Both seem to not want to take too many risk with big projects so that's why we get the same type of products regurgitated every year.
Lion Heart
Banned
Agreed on all fronts, plus this movie had a lot of Asians in it so those actors are getting work at least. It could have had a few more like Pits character and the main bad guy but I liked ScarJo as Major. Fun movie and visually well produced.
Regarding major being"perfect", she is considered so because her expirament was successful, melding human brain in a cybernetic core, not because of her face is white.
The movie doesn't handle it perfectly but there are much worse examples of movies whitewashing their cast.
DarthMasta
Member
No, I said Hollywood thinks that. Me, seeing how the movie is doing with a "bankable" star think it wouldn't do better with a lesser known Asian lead.
Blockbusters usually require a movie star attached to get made, especially ones thought of as risky. It's as simple as that, and no Asian actress is a ScarJo level movie star, not internationally. Truth be told the amount of female stars the studios would even consider for this sort of expensive blockbuster is probably less than 5, if these last few years are any indication...
The movie could have been done in Japan, with an Asian lead, but it wouldn't be a Hollywood movie.
MistakenMobius
Member
Some thoughts:
All GITS takes place in Japan, except the 1995 movie that takes place in a Hong Kong like place.
In the manga, they go to Hokkaido to check on soviet activities
In Innocence, there are clear references to the Yakuza.
SAC has a very Japanese esthetic and there is plenty of location referenced ( the smart tank trying to go to his parents)
I always wondered how connected it was with Appleseed as Japan become Poseidon.
I have a potentially additional stupid explanation of the dumbfound behavior of the studio:
Everyone on GAF says Asian but could it be more linked that from what we can see , us movie studio court the Chinese market and to put it lightly relationship between Japan and China are not that nice to put it lightly: remember how japan reacted to memory of a Geisha?
Or when Asian American students petitioned to ban white people from wearing kimono at an expo and the Japanese government thought it was Chinese anti Japanese demonstrations?
I'm also wondering how China would have accepted a movie putting Japan has a triumphant nation.
The movie was bound to be insensitive from the start. The only way they could have salvaged it would have been to make it in the same way as Edge of tomorrow.
All GITS takes place in Japan, except the 1995 movie that takes place in a Hong Kong like place.
In the manga, they go to Hokkaido to check on soviet activities
In Innocence, there are clear references to the Yakuza.
SAC has a very Japanese esthetic and there is plenty of location referenced ( the smart tank trying to go to his parents)
I always wondered how connected it was with Appleseed as Japan become Poseidon.
I have a potentially additional stupid explanation of the dumbfound behavior of the studio:
Everyone on GAF says Asian but could it be more linked that from what we can see , us movie studio court the Chinese market and to put it lightly relationship between Japan and China are not that nice to put it lightly: remember how japan reacted to memory of a Geisha?
Or when Asian American students petitioned to ban white people from wearing kimono at an expo and the Japanese government thought it was Chinese anti Japanese demonstrations?
I'm also wondering how China would have accepted a movie putting Japan has a triumphant nation.
The movie was bound to be insensitive from the start. The only way they could have salvaged it would have been to make it in the same way as Edge of tomorrow.
Except this about leader need to be a star is.... a myth
Check this post from
No it is not. They are different (and Scorsese is a better director). The departed earned 4 majors oscars. So many people disagree with you.
Looking at the current controversy, Scorsese was right to move the story in Boston. And of course, he wanted to act with De Caprio.
ronaldthump
Member
DR2K
Banned
It made sense(in the context of the movie), wasn't racist in the slightest, and made for some great moments.
It's very true to the anime.
It's very true to the anime.
And not the same budget.
Elegant Weapon
Member
out of curiosity, what "minority" is she?
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
You don't really need to try hard to find fault with the race issues in this movie, especially when they make it such a key part of the film. I guess it's hard to disagree with people without downplaying their opinions though.
Particle Physicist
between a quark and a baryon
So they either wrote this script before casting fully intent on casting a non-Asian actor, or they added it on after the casting controversy in a failed attempt to make it okay. Don't worry guys, she is Asian on the inside but her white body is now more evolved.
CloudyTuba
Member
I havent seen the new movie so I cant comment in depth, but if rich white folk are the bad guys and their whitewashing robots are demonstrated to be a bad thing, then I dont really think it makes things worse in the movie either. In the context of the story I guess it maybe helps?
It is funny though because it reflects back on the filmmakers themselves. They kind of shot themselves in the foot with that one, didn't they? It's pretty embarrassing outside the context of the story and taking into account the actual production process. They made themselves out to be the bad guys in their own movie. I dont think they really thought this through haha
Is it time to assess how true a scotsman she is?
Corronchilejano
Member
Is this the new "I'm not racist but"... ?
I'm going to agree. It's not a great movie but it was, and still is, visually stunning and the races were pretty rad.
more like "i have a [insert minority] friend/SO"
OG Shaka Zulu
Member
This is hilariously sad.
Harken Raiser
Banned
I just wanted to say that as a kid, the animated Batman and Superman were absolutely Asian as far as I was concerned, or at least mixed like me. Same goes for Lois Lane and the Robins. That was a major contributing factor to me being a D.C. fan; I interpreted these cartoons as having large casts of non-stereotyped Asian characters. Nowadays I know that these casts are super white, but it meant a lot to me as a kid to indetify with characters that I at least perceived as being like me.
P.S. Anime characters don't look white.
Gully State
Member
This is a satire post right? I mean it checks all the most blatant excuses perfectly...All that's needed is some rant about Japanese and honor and shame...
Elegant Weapon
Member
I was thinking more, don't you know what race/ethnicity your finance is? Why refer to her background but omit it?
and why does being a "minority" give weight to her opinion on this subject, specifically? Is she from a religious, racial, ethnic or other social minority, and why does that make her opinions more relevant to the topic?
Mostly, it's a strange and frankly bullshit way to refer to yourself or another person, imo. You know what background she's descended from, why exclude that detail but specify that she's a "minority"?
Really, it's much less true scotsman and more like "I have a black friend"
Elegant Weapon
Member
When I was a kid, I was convinced Tony Stark was latino in some unspecified way. He always reminded my of Desi Arnaz.
To this day, in my head cannon, Iron Man is Cuban, B
Sweeney Tom
Banned
yes.gif
CadetMahoney
Member
wow, they actually considered that. The lengths they would go.
not sure if hilarious jokepost or worrying serious question
Because the artists don't look at themselves the way Mickey Rooney looked at Asian people.
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