Support NeoGAF

[scy]

With Rogue, if the stars align and I get off sweet combos and fancy plays I win for sure, but how often can you make those plays happen in Arena where your combos are never guaranteed.

I mean, it's not like the combos are hard: Play a card and then play another card. The only requirement is actually getting things like Deadly Poison, Backstab, and good cheap cards in the draft but that's not necessarily all that rare. Playing a Rogue is about making better board presence plays for 2-3-4 mana than any other class in the game can ever do. And, on top of that, they have the only Hero Power that can impact two turns in a row (and with charge) for only two Mana invested.

Rogue isn't really all that different from what most classes will do but they just have better ways of dealing with your opponent's early plays. Like, Bomber killing the opponent's two drop for free? That's the level of tempo Rogue cards try to add at the cost of card advantage.

But as a hunter at higher ranks (low teens) there have been PLENTY OF matches where I never had a chance to use it effectively. I'm actually thinking about removing it after getting past the noobs this time around as I'm thinking there will be better options for both control and aggrieved decks as most mid-level skill and higher players at this point run low minion counts on their side to not open themselves up to it. Or run high minions as long as the are 4 hp or higher.

There's like nothing more effective than it even at just a two dog summon. That's still two cards drawn, up-to 2 minions killed or two targets that need to be removed. Waiting for massive UtHs is just bad play generally. Take the incremental advantages as you can.

Piloting Hunter is a lot harder than most people give it credit for, especially when you get to the high ranks. There it's a test of seeing how well they know their deck and draws and how the match-up plays out. Like, how to squeeze out 30+ Damage given X mana and planning the turns out accordingly.

Like I said I don't think it's op, but you seem to forget that UTH often does one or more of the things I listed. And if the opponent is playing around it every turn it's already acting as an exceptionally strong card.

Every class has something you're playing around basically every turn. Hunter's thing is an entire chain of gimmicks around UtH as a piece.

Really, if anything of Hunter is really powerful to their gameplay, it's that their Hero Power lets them get away with this kind of play. Geting to ping guaranteed two damage every turn while waiting for a combo to deliver gives them a lot of leeway in terms of draws. As good as UtH can be seen as a multi-function draw, removal, and damage tool, what actually lets them do this is the inevitability that their Hero Power provides.

Edit: Not to say to nerf their Hero Power (because uh... how?) but just that having consistent reach like that is what makes things like this work. Besides that, the strength of their traps / the fact that every class just has to facecheck them really benefits Hunter immensely.

 

[AaronB]

Nice to see some discussion of potential hero powers. I think a hero power that summons a 2/1, even if it dies at the end of the turn, would be really broken. It can trade with most 2-drops, which is something no other hero power can do. A deathrattle that summons a plain 1/1 skeleton would still have some advantages over the Paladin ability, because it would leave something on the board after an AoE. Think of how annoying Harvest Golem is to deal with. The downside compared to Paladin is that you can't use it if there are no minions, and you can't attack with them until the original minion dies. If it was a 1/1 with taunt that died at the end of the turn, that would be another option.

By the way, the two other classes are Death Knight and Monk; but from what I understand there are several different varieties of each class (not to mention races). There could be another rogue with a very different special ability. How about "Deal 2 damage to a wounded minion"?

 

[zoukka]

Everyone is basically beating around the bush here, fine by me I have no problems admitting UTH is superstrong.

 

[scy]

I mean, it's really strong and a pretty big part of Hunter. Is it grossly overpowered and broken and has to be gutted for the sake of the game? Eh, not really. I'm not even entirely on board of it needing any kind of nerf, really, and would rather see ways to interact with Hunter traps besides "trigger it and Harrison the extra card draw."

 

[partyphone]

I think innervate is a bigger problem than UtH. some days I just want them to delete the card.

 

[Myomoto]

Honestly I think a lot of the more problematic class cards will settle down once we actually get more cards to choose from. Right now the individual class card pools are so small that a lot of class cards easily just become auto-includes in every single deck for that class, since the general design philosophy is that class cards should be better than common pool cards.

 

[partyphone]

Honestly I think a lot of the more problematic class cards will settle down once we actually get more cards to choose from. Right now the individual class card pools are so small that a lot of class cards easily just become auto-includes in every single deck for that class, since the general design philosophy is that class cards should be better than common pool cards.

this is one of the reasons why I think UtH is fine. it already has a lot of synergy with buzzard, wolf, hyena and kill command. but cards like innervate and ice block are going to effect all the new cards in some way. it's why they changed charge because any big card they added would be effected by it.

 

[Haunted]

Speaking of good Hunter cards.

 

[Q8D3vil]

Speaking of good Hunter cards.

You already have one to gain stats when they die, might as well have one when they played. Just like every other freaking card in his deck.

 

[Haines]

As a newbie I'm finding a lot more fun in casual mode lvling everyone up to 10.

Do you just get dupes after 10?

If you go in arena and lose 3 win 0 do you get anything?

 

[scy]

Just to note, Darkspear Hunter was an old Hunter card. It was replaced with Highmane, if I recall.

As a newbie I'm finding a lot more fun in casual mode lvling everyone up to 10.

Do you just get dupes after 10?

If you go in arena and lose 3 win 0 do you get anything?

Correct, after 10 it's just Golden versions of their Free Basic Set.

0-3 in Arena is a pack and some minor reward (small amount of dust, a common card, or a small amount of gold).

 

[ZZMitch]

I just want to say that playing against Priests is the most un-fun thing possible in a game. Mind control, infinite health buffs, thought steal...

I'm gonna go play a card game I can actually win, like solitaire.

I love this view, because for me Priest is the most fun class to play as! I never really thought about how my opponent feels about it heh.

 

[Haines]

Just to note, Darkspear Hunter was an old Hunter card. It was replaced with Highmane, if I recall.



Correct, after 10 it's just Golden versions of their Free Basic Set.

0-3 in Arena is a pack and some minor reward (small amount of dust, a common card, or a small amount of gold).

Hey the for the info.

Are the golden ones able to be crafted?

Also I've been using the gold to buy a pack in the shop but by sounds of it I was supposed to be going to arena. I had no idea I would get stuff even for losing

 

[scy]

Golden versions of the Basic (i.e., the free cards you don't get from packs) cannot be crafted; they're unlock only. You can craft golden versions of the other cards though.

 

[Beelzeboss]

I've been playing this game on and off and I finally rage uninstalled it today.

Some of the legendary cards people have are unbelievable. I lost close games today to a legendary that takes off 15 health when played and another that turns a hero into another character with 20 health and 8 attack.

My poor stars

 

[scy]

I've been playing this game on and off and I finally rage uninstalled it today.

Some of the legendary cards people have are unbelievable. I lost close games today to a legendary that takes off 15 health when played and another that turns a hero into another character with 20 health and 8 attack.

My poor stars

Alexstraza is usually in Control decks so she's the gimmick to set up lethal since they tend to not get Hero pressure on early. Jaraxxus is 15 Health and 3 Attack, not 20 and 8 :x He's actually been cut from a lot of Warlock Giants lists I think since he's usually so slow. Which is a shame since he's like the most awesome Legendary ever.

 

[Hydranockz]

I really like the pacing that this game offers in terms of a f2p model. I usually play maybe 8 matches in a row. I try to do the quests and then if I scrape enough for Arena I try my hand at that. If I forget about the game for a day it's nice to come back to some quests to really push me to get that gold, especially when being 10/20g off 150 makes me just wanna win more games.

I play as much as I find enjoyable and sometimes a break makes the game that much easier to come back to. I haven't spent a penny and I feel like if I could just drop some cash for some packs or arena runs I'd have an instantly more 'fun' time but I am also enjoying the slow, almost natural, grind to getting legendaries and other cards.

Sitting on 995 dust atm. I'm saving up for a legendary but I don't even know which one I'd even get hah. Currently only have Cairne and Harrison.

 

[wakajawaka]

Eu servers down, right?

I wanted to make a deck for my brand new Malygos

I know it was discussed before, but I was thinking ofr making a Druid deck around him, I guess is should be a late game one with lots of taunts and cheap spells.

 

[TimeKillr]

I got a Captain Greenskin yesterday (incidentally he was the last Pirate I needed to complete the Pirate set and get the parrots, which is cute, I guess).

Any use of him outside Pirate decks? I'm assuming Warriors with Gorehowl, as it's a built-in Upgrade... Hell, a Gorehowl with 2 Upgrades and a Greenskin is kinda crazy, but it takes 2 turns to setup.

 

[scy]

Eu servers down, right?

I wanted to make a deck for my brand new Malygos

I know it was discussed before, but I was thinking ofr making a Druid deck around him, I guess is should be a late game one with lots of taunts and cheap spells.

I remember a version of Ramp Druid with Malygos instead of the FoN/SR combo. Basically turn Malygos -> Moonfire -> Moonfire for lethal with reach and just accept the -2 damage on it. Or Malygos, pray he lives, Faceless and Swipe for somewhere around all of the damage ever.

Incidentally, with the loss of some of the aggro decks / rise of pure Hunter in the aggro slot, Ramp Druid got a lot better. Does well in the Control mirror and Druid vs Hunter is essentially a good match-up for them regardless.

 

[ShinNL]

Now start listing other 3 and 4 card combos, I dunno... Leeroy + shadow step + shadow step + cold blood. Leeroy + windfury + rockbiter + rockbiter. Most 3-4 mid-late game card combos can be devastatingly good.

I think the normal UTH gain is 2 or 3, unless it's combo'd with Leeroy to get 4 or 5 out of UTH. Very rare do you see UTH played in to a board of 6 minions, because the other side is expecting that.

I don't know, you're mentioning Legendary combos vs common card combos, not to mention one of the strongest ones too. "Because Leeroy" really shouldn't be an argument, especially because it works with UTH + Timberwolf as well. Most classes can do something amazing with Leeroy, it's a legendary and there's only 1 of it in your deck... if you even own the card that is.

Eu servers down, right?

I wanted to make a deck for my brand new Malygos

I know it was discussed before, but I was thinking ofr making a Druid deck around him, I guess is should be a late game one with lots of taunts and cheap spells.

I recommend Shaman if you really want to test Malygos. It's the easiest to setup: 2x Earth Shock, 2x Lightning Bolt and 2x Forked Lightning allows you to use it the same turn you put it down. In comparison Druid only has Moonfire which are way worse draws in the early game. Sure you could theoretically have 2 Innervates and a Swipe, but then you were probably already winning hard if you didn't have to use any of those cards pre-turn 9-10.

Once you 1 shot Earth Shock Tirion you can't really go back...

 

[inky]

I know it was discussed before, but I was thinking ofr making a Druid deck around him, I guess is should be a late game one with lots of taunts and cheap spells.

Pretty much, this is mine if you care:

If I had Thalnos I'd put it in for sure. Some people think 2 Drakes and 2 Auctioneers is overkill (some use Taz Dingos instead) but I find it works well for me. I used to have 2 Sunfury Protectors and no Pyromancers, but I've found it gives me better early game options this way. Same deal with Starfires vs Starfalls. Some people like 1 of each, other like 2 of one and none of the other. Other people like Ancient Watchers instead of Earthen Ring Farseers, etc.

It depends on your playstyle, but this is what I use. It's fun, but it can be weak to very early game.

 

[wakajawaka]

Thanks guys

I remember a version of Ramp Druid with Malygos instead of the FoN/SR combo. Basically turn Malygos -> Moonfire -> Moonfire for lethal with reach and just accept the -2 damage on it. Or Malygos, pray he lives, Faceless and Swipe for somewhere around all of the damage ever.

The Faceless option sounds interesting. I have none unfortunately.

Pretty much, this is mine if you care:

If I had Thalnos I'd put it in for sure. Some people think 2 Drakes and 2 Auctioneers is overkill (some use Taz Dingos instead) but I find it works well for me. I used to have 2 Sunfury Protectors and no Pyromancers, but I've found it gives me better early game options this way. Same deal with Starfires vs Starfalls. Some people like 1 of each, other like 2 of one and none of the other. Other people like Ancient Watchers instead of Earthen Ring Farseers, etc.

It depends on your playstyle, but this is what I use. It's fun, but it can be weak to very early game.

I just made a 5 min draft, it's not very different from yours. I have no Ragnaros but I have cenarius, figured should use it. I don't have Cairne and it's included, but it's the next legendary I'm getting.

The Kobolds will probably be replaced by something else, maybe Bombers or Pyros. Bomber seems a good idea with a deck that will have few creatures and pretty much all of high vitality.

 

[ShinNL]

And here is some Malygos entertainment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_mIJZWNPgE

 

[wakajawaka]

And here is some Malygos entertainment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_mIJZWNPgE

Disgusting ;D

 

[Hydranockz]

And here is some Malygos entertainment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_mIJZWNPgE

That's glorious!

 

[Lyng]

EU down yet again??

 

[jblank83]

I've finally grown tired of the game myself. Too many gimmick decks, too many legendary decks, not enough utility in normal cards. I'm playing to build up a large gold reserve and then I'll quit until an expansion.

Not bad for several months of free entertainment, though.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I've finally grown tired of the game myself. Too many gimmick decks, too many legendary decks, not enough utility in normal cards. I'm playing to build up a large gold reserve and then I'll quit until an expansion.

Not bad for several months of free entertainment, though.

I got bored a bit myself. I didn't play ranked much last season because of it. But now after sparsely playing I am kinda getting into it again. I think taking a bit of break was a good idea.

 

[Interfectum]

Seems the hunter hate is reaching peak levels. I've had two auto quits while playing a hunter in ranked. I've also had several quits upon playing unleash the hounds.

 

[Professor Lich]

Man, some people have all the luck.

Two Blade Masters with Ancestral Healing one turn after another. Followed up by a Doomhammer with a double Rockbiter. There were a few turns between these two events, but I was just saying.

And then there's me, waiting for any of my 20 card draws and getting nothing, haha.

 

[borghe]

I've finally grown tired of the game myself. Too many gimmick decks, too many legendary decks, not enough utility in normal cards. I'm playing to build up a large gold reserve and then I'll quit until an expansion.

Not bad for several months of free entertainment, though.

eh... you're just burned out TBH. The base release is way over 6 months old at this point. Even if you came in on the open beta it's still over 3 months old. Most supported CCGs would either have an expansion out already or at least one on the near horizon.

Everyone keeps insisting that HS won't see expansion updates like a traditional CCG... but honestly your post is the EXACT reason they NEED expansion updates like a traditional CCG. Eventually you get tired of playing the same 10 or so decks over and over and over again (an exaggeration of course, but one that doesn't entirely miss the mark)

 

[LifeIsLife]

And here is some Malygos entertainment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_mIJZWNPgE

I would be so mad to see that happen.

 

[Xater]

eh... you're just burned out TBH. The base release is way over 6 months old at this point. Even if you came in on the open beta it's still over 3 months old. Most supported CCGs would either have an expansion out already or at least one on the near horizon.

Everyone keeps insisting that HS won't see expansion updates like a traditional CCG... but honestly your post is the EXACT reason they NEED expansion updates like a traditional CCG. Eventually you get tired of playing the same 10 or so decks over and over and over again (an exaggeration of course, but one that doesn't entirely miss the mark)

Yup. Duel of Champions has a new set of cards every quarter and I think that keeps a game very fresh. It's also less likely to see lots of repeated decks this way because if there is a larger card pool there are more possible combinations that can work well.

 

[Interfectum]

eh... you're just burned out TBH. The base release is way over 6 months old at this point. Even if you came in on the open beta it's still over 3 months old. Most supported CCGs would either have an expansion out already or at least one on the near horizon.

Everyone keeps insisting that HS won't see expansion updates like a traditional CCG... but honestly your post is the EXACT reason they NEED expansion updates like a traditional CCG. Eventually you get tired of playing the same 10 or so decks over and over and over again (an exaggeration of course, but one that doesn't entirely miss the mark)

Yeah I've been playing pretty hardcore for maybe over a month (?) and I'm pretty much seeing the same card combos across arena, casual and ranked. I don't know if it's lack of cards or just everyone is using almost the exact same setup now. I'm almost happy when I see an unusual card.

 

[Phreaker]

I love this view, because for me Priest is the most fun class to play as! I never really thought about how my opponent feels about it heh.

I get SO many more early concedes as Priest than any other class I play. Sometimes they do it as soon as I Thoughtsteal. I'm like what do you expect, I have shit early-mid game cards and I need yours. Of course, maybe they don't like me thanking them...priest does sound a bit snarky when he says it.

 

[Minsc]

Expansions? What is it 2015 already?

Probably take the next six months to get adventure mode and Android/iPhone ports in order, and Blizzard doesn't want to overwhelm new players with too much content, so I'd be shocked to see expansions before the game is fully released on all platforms.

 

[borghe]

Expansions? What is it 2015 already?

Probably take the next six months to get adventure mode and Android/iPhone ports in order, and Blizzard doesn't want to overwhelm new players with too much content, so I'd be shocked to see expansions before the game is fully released on all platforms.

you can't look at it like a PC game. It's a CCG, and a f2p micro-transaction dependent CCG to boot (as opposed to MTG Planeswalker which is just a $10 release every year).

My guess is to support new players, they will eventually move some commons (and maybe some rares as well) to basic. This will kind of head start new players who come in, say, 1-3 months before the next expansion hits where the long time players have nearly complete collections. I am also guessing that when a new expansion does hit, you will have an option of either buying core packs, which will contain cards from both the basic set and the expansion(s), expansion packs, and/or maybe mega pack bundles with like one pack from each set.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

you can't look at it like a PC game. It's a CCG, and a f2p micro-transaction dependent CCG to boot (as opposed to MTG Planeswalker which is just a $10 release every year).

My guess is to support new players, they will eventually move some commons (and maybe some rares as well) to basic. This will kind of head start new players who come in, say, 1-3 months before the next expansion hits where the long time players have nearly complete collections. I am also guessing that when a new expansion does hit, you will have an option of either buying core packs, which will contain cards from both the basic set and the expansion(s), expansion packs, and/or maybe mega pack bundles with like one pack from each set.

I think it is much more accurate to call it a digital collectible game. Doesn't matter what you call it tbh. I doubt we'll get expansions every 6 months. Probably an expansion a year and 1 (or if lucky 2) content updates a year.

Calling it 2015 is probably accurate with the way blizzard handles expansions.

But who knows at this point, they haven't really revealed how they will be handling new content updates and when.

 

[Haines]

eh... you're just burned out TBH. The base release is way over 6 months old at this point. Even if you came in on the open beta it's still over 3 months old. Most supported CCGs would either have an expansion out already or at least one on the near horizon.

Everyone keeps insisting that HS won't see expansion updates like a traditional CCG... but honestly your post is the EXACT reason they NEED expansion updates like a traditional CCG. Eventually you get tired of playing the same 10 or so decks over and over and over again (an exaggeration of course, but one that doesn't entirely miss the mark)

Do they typically cost money? I'm new to ccg

 

[The Lamonster]

Why is Blizzard so quiet about the iPad release date?

Is something still up in the air? Or do they have something to gain with keeping it a surprise?

 

[borghe]

I think it is much more accurate to call it a digital collectible game. Doesn't matter what you call it tbh. I doubt we'll get expansions every 6 months. Probably an expansion a year and 1 (or if lucky 2) content updates a year.

Calling it 2015 is probably accurate with the way blizzard handles expansions.

But who knows at this point, they haven't really revealed how they will be handling new content updates and when.

the problem with what you and minsc are suggesting is that, what happens when IAP sales fall off a cliff, like they do for every collectible game? your expected frequency of expansions would basically mean they have to go (numbers from my ass) like 6-9 months without any major revenue once those sales fall off. Hence why CCGs see fast updates.

The other thing I don't understand from you guys is that the reason PC/console games SEE new content at a snail's pace, is because there is usually considerable programming and design aspects that have to happen not to mention a ton of technical QA.. much of which is largely absent from updates to a game like this. You have art (which I am sure there's a TON of existing 2D art at blizzard), maybe a new mechanic or two, and then a ton of cards all working within the existing mechanics (plus the new ones). Nowhere near the hurdles your typical DLC has to clear before seeing release.

I'm not saying you guys are wrong. On the contrary, if you are right I'm simply saying I don't see how blizz will be able to keep this service profitable. they need money coming in, and frankly it comes from guys like me. Well, after $500 so far, I'm done, and that's an outrageous amount I know. Which means people paying less are more likely to be done paying even quicker. Not sure how yuo guys see money continuing to come in at a rate to keep the game/service afloat based on how often you expect new paid content to be released.

 

[scy]

I think their expectations are based off the expectations the Hearthstone team has made it sound like they plan to do big updates. I think it'll end up like you're thinking of where there will be stuff more frequently just due to it'll end up being necessary that way for the sake of purchases.

Meh, we'll see. This first year or so is going to be a bit awkward, I imagine.

 

[depths20XX]

You had to spend $500 to get every card? Wow

 

[Card Boy]

iPad version will be economical if you think about it, iTunes cards always go on sale and you can get like 2 $20 iTunes cards for $30 (meaning cheaper Hearthstone boosters)

 

[Haly]

I think Hearthstone needs new expansions too. Every new card game out there, so far, has already added new expansions with more on the way. Duels of Champion had two already, they're on their third. Solforge's first is forthcoming. Hex is still in alpha but their cardpool is much times larger than Hearthstone's. These games are all following Magic's lead with regular content updates.

However, I don't think Blizzard will come anywhere close to matching WOTC's 3-4 sets a year release schedule. It's hard to say why, exactly, but it's clear that a regular release schedule for new cards is low on their priority list. The development team would have to undergo a drastic shift in attitude and I'm not expecting that out of the Hearthstone team at all. Nothing they have done so far shows they're capable or even willing to make such a change.

And I think you're wrong in that their core customers are the ones spending $500-$1000. It's true that your purchases alone covers the server cost for supporting many entirely free players, but when establishing a F2P business model, you cannot rely on these outliers who are willing to spend hundreds on your digital product. Really, the bulk of their profit, like other games such as League of Legends, are the players who spend maybe $5-$10 consistently every few weeks or so.

 

[Ennoia]

Why is Blizzard so quiet about the iPad release date?

Is something still up in the air? Or do they have something to gain with keeping it a surprise?

It is said that the iPad version will be released TODAY but limited to Aus/New Zealand/may be Canada region. China always being the eye of rumor storm so I'm staying up all night and waiting for this.

I personally think the server is down for this. But I can be played by the rumor anyway.

 

[scy]

I think Hearthstone needs new expansions too. Every new card game out there, so far, has already added new expansions with more on the way.

Hell, since Beta started we've seen at least one other Magic set :x

 

[borghe]

You had to spend $500 to get every card? Wow

my luck is horrible. horrible. I would guess the average buyer could do it for a little less. I am also still missing 12 legendaries. but honestly, I would strongly suggest taking that as like "worst. possible. scenario."

It is said that the iPad version will be released TODAY but limited to Aus/New Zealand/may be Canada region. China always being the eye of rumor storm so I'm staying up all night and waiting for this.

I personally think the server is down for this. But I can be played by the rumor anyway.

I'm assuming you mean tomorrow The only thing that would be weird about that is that usually it would already be available in new zealand if this were the case..

Now a canada release tomorrow would make sense. Not to mention be CRAZY annoying. Will have to look up how to make a canada account.

 

[Xater]

I hope Hex will have it's open beta soon. I definitely want to check that out if Blizzard continues to drag it's feet with the expansions.