TetraxShards
Member
You both lose, unless it's an Arena game, which counts as a draw (you aren't credited a win or a loss for it).
Edit, from Hearthstone Wiki:
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Hearthstone |OT2| Created by Unstable Portal
- Thread starter ZealousD
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You both lose, unless it's an Arena game, which counts as a draw (you aren't credited a win or a loss for it).
Edit, from Hearthstone Wiki:
Undertaker nerf was warranted, and this is coming from a Hunter main. This nerf is extreme, though. Seems to be junk now. Would just shaving off 1HP not have been sufficient enough? I felt like it would have made it easier to react to Undertaker without completely nullifying its place in aggro decks. Ah well. Won't complain too much. I'll just disenchant my golden Undertakers for something more relevant. Golden Sludge or save for golden Loatheb.
x2 Golden Webspinner
x2 Golden Haunted Creeper
x2 Golden Undertaker
I'm slowly working my way to crafting all golden Naxx cards. I decided they would be the only golden cards I spend my dust on, since they are the only golden cards that are unobtainable otherwise.
x2 Golden Webspinner
x2 Golden Haunted Creeper
x2 Golden Undertaker
I'm slowly working my way to crafting all golden Naxx cards. I decided they would be the only golden cards I spend my dust on, since they are the only golden cards that are unobtainable otherwise.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
In deathrattle aggro decks, it'll probably still be the best 1 drop. Because even a 2/2 or 3/2 for 1 mana is strong. It just isn't brokenly strong and unremoveable without overdevoting resources and there are legitimate counters (clockwork gnome and zombie chow) rather than just cards that... barely but just about break even with it.
partyphone
Banned
coin+mechwarper will be strong
which means control warrior will still be a beast on ladder because of fiery war axe.
Fixed
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
HOLY SHITTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
Prediction: No one will run it once this nerf hits. It's basically Lightwarden now and no one runs that (Light of the Naaru notwithstanding).
Princess Carl
Member
Thats an interesting way to look at it, but healing most of the time is a 2 mana hero power compared to whatever synergistic death rattles you have in your deck, some of which are 1 drops.
So, a greedy Control deck is one that .has it all? Low and high cost cards to counter all situations? Or just high cost cards that have no low cost aggro counters?
A "greedy" control deck is one that can safely ignore early game control cards for more late game options. The worse aggro is, the less control decks will need to run early removal like Shadow Word: Pain, Holy Smite, Lightning Bolt, Fiery War Axe, Mortal Coil, Darkbomb, Wrath, Holy Nova, Hellfire, Consecrate, etc.
The only case when this doesn't hold is when the early game removal doubles as a late game win con (Frostbolt + Ice Lance + Antonidas, for example).
The only case when this doesn't hold is when the early game removal doubles as a late game win con (Frostbolt + Ice Lance + Antonidas, for example).
That's true. But Hunter ran a bunch of low-cost deathrattle cards not because they had great deathrattles but because they buffed Undertaker. Stuff like Leper Gnome, Haunted Creeper and even Webspinner aren't necessarily amazing cards but the tempo gained by playing them with UT on the board was too good to resist.
Mad Scientist, OTOH, is amazing on its own and will likely be the only card that remains relevant in the meta after this nerf.
Leper Gnome, Haunted Spider and Webspinner are all good cards for Hunter, Undertaker or no.
Leper Gnome is either 4 damage, or 2 damage and eating removal. Since their entire gameplan revolves around getting you from 30-kill range as fast as possible, Leper Gnome is a perfect fit.
Haunted Spider is 3/4 stats for 2 that's also a Beast half the time.
Webspinner filled a gap in their early game plan that used to go to worse 1 drops like Argent Squire, is also a Beast, cycles itself, and gives you a chance for total blowouts.
What made UT really nuts in Hunter was that it perfectly synergized with cards they already wanted to play.
Leper Gnome is either 4 damage, or 2 damage and eating removal. Since their entire gameplan revolves around getting you from 30-kill range as fast as possible, Leper Gnome is a perfect fit.
Haunted Spider is 3/4 stats for 2 that's also a Beast half the time.
Webspinner filled a gap in their early game plan that used to go to worse 1 drops like Argent Squire, is also a Beast, cycles itself, and gives you a chance for total blowouts.
What made UT really nuts in Hunter was that it perfectly synergized with cards they already wanted to play.
Not at all. There is a big gap between Heals vs Playing more minions. Playing more minions is way easier and better for aggro builds.
Undertaker is now a better Murloc Tidecaller. Which is one of the best murloc cards in the game, one of three cards that actually gives murloc decks some juice.
@Haly
Totally agree.
Undertaker still fulfills the goal those decks try to accomplish, more damage as soon as possible. It still requires removal quickly or it will deal obscene damage. It is still cheap enough to combo with other cards. It will be around for awhile.
I will probably take it out of my Rattle & Roll priest deck. Losing the body to use your hero power on hurts it's usage as a board presence. I'm ok with that.
I disagree. Leper Gnome was already phased out for Clockwork Gnome in many Hunter decks post-GvG. Haunted Creeper doesn't threaten face or the board enough by itself and the Hunter doesn't run reliable ways to buff the tokens unlike Druid or Zoo. Webspinner may still be run in a beast-focused mid-range hunter build, I'll give you that. Although I've tried a build like that before and it is missing some good mid-game beasts, so not sure it will be dominating the ladder any time soon.
You are right, that is a better comparison. Of course, even the best murloc card in the game is still a shitty card.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Why does no one run lightwarden, oh because if you run aggro priest, you run undertaker
Maybe not now? Will aggro priest be a thing? Probably not. Anyway, my point is that why run lightwarden when you have undertaker. Also I actually did recently see lightwarden in an aggro priest deck.
Bomber story:
I played Madder Bomber who had six targets he could assign his six damage to. Both players and three enemy minions and one of my own, a fully shielded Silvermoon Knight (3/3 with divine shield). Six targets, six randomly assigned points of damage, and he fucking kills my knight (and hits me in the face once for good measure).
Moral of the story:
I am never picking a bomber again.
I played Madder Bomber who had six targets he could assign his six damage to. Both players and three enemy minions and one of my own, a fully shielded Silvermoon Knight (3/3 with divine shield). Six targets, six randomly assigned points of damage, and he fucking kills my knight (and hits me in the face once for good measure).
Moral of the story:
I am never picking a bomber again.
Yup I always pick way lower value rares over Madder Bomber, fuck that noise
The problem is you can't always avoid his shitty brother when it's a 3/2 vs Wisp and Magma Rager
partyphone
Banned
the super aggressive build of mech mage plays cogmaster. undertaker isn't so different from that.
True, though I feel cogmaster's jump to 3 gives him solid burst and response to any 2 drop. Doesn't matter if it's a 3/2 or a 2/3, a turn one cogmaster atleast puts in the threat of what you drop after if they end up having mechwarper, annoy-o-tron, etc. as a followup. Undertaker in this iteration still builds up, so a 2/3 will shut him down pretty hard.
call_kotaku
Member
It's a more extreme nerf than I was expecting for undertaker, but I feel like it's absolutely necessary to avoid power creep at low mana counts. Hunter will still be fine, though.
BlackBuzzard
Banned
Mage really does not love Troggzor! Its so damn funny to watch them when it drops and they cant play their precious skillstrike.
Officerrob
Banned
Couldn't be happier with that Undertaker nerf, it needed to happen
You could have received two packs instead of the golden common + pack and opened them up for 40 dust each.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
So I said this yesterday (early this morning my time). 10 hours later UT is announced to be nerfed. What timing.
Yeah, gold commons aren't so bad since they are 50 dust.
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
Jesus Christ, lost to a Shaman within lethal range in Arena because he pulled taunt totem 3 times with a Vitality totem in a row and slowly built up a strong board.
RNG suxxx
RNG suxxx
Well,it's at least it's more dust than a terrible pack would give you.
EnVy_CaLiBeR
Member
Damn right. It was often impossible or just incredibly difficult to come back from a good Undertaker start.
It'll be interesting to see if he pops up in the meta post-undertaker nerf. He's a serious pain in the ass for control decks that rely on spells for removal.
They're still not in the same ballpark. Lightwarden is bad because it uses a control action (healing) to improve an aggressive card. If you play Lightwarden on Turn 1, and then heal on Turn 2, then you're working with two fundamentally different philosophies. Your deck doesn't have a strong gameplan. You can't split between control and aggro in the same deck, it doesn't work.
The new undertaker doesn't have this problem. It's still an aggressive card that is improved by other aggressive plays.(playing other cards).
Professor Lich
Member
There was a Total Biscuit video where he was playing the anti-Mage Mage deck. Said the best part was getting Troggzor up with a Counter Spell, and to a lesser extent Spell Bender, and people would cast a spell, have it countered, then face a board with a 6/6 and a 3/5 on the board. Sounds great in theory but it'd be hard to do consistently.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I think I want to try slow aggro rogue I've played in the past when aggro wasn't so prevalent. Slow tempo is probably a more fitting archetype name.
But now I have more fatties to put into the deck and sword oil.
That's right. Kidnapper, double sap, king mukla, cold light oracle.
I call it slow aggro because it doesn't open up til turn 3 or later but it opens up pretty big. I'll probably end up cutting some cards for new gvg cards (maybe anubar ambusher for shredder, although ambusher is so good on turn 4 and trades with sludge belchers clean) and this recreation is largely off recall from around naxx before hunter's became powerhouses. Instead of cold blood I have sword oils, not sure which will be better. I could cut 2x deadly poisons for 2x cold blood as well.
I just love when this deck works and one of its fun points is sapping or kidnapping a minion to death. And people never expect a third sap that leaves a high attack minion like a 6/3.
I also used to run argent commanders, despite sludge belcher but right now south sea deckhand will be the charge minion to get buffed.
But now I have more fatties to put into the deck and sword oil.
That's right. Kidnapper, double sap, king mukla, cold light oracle.
I call it slow aggro because it doesn't open up til turn 3 or later but it opens up pretty big. I'll probably end up cutting some cards for new gvg cards (maybe anubar ambusher for shredder, although ambusher is so good on turn 4 and trades with sludge belchers clean) and this recreation is largely off recall from around naxx before hunter's became powerhouses. Instead of cold blood I have sword oils, not sure which will be better. I could cut 2x deadly poisons for 2x cold blood as well.
I just love when this deck works and one of its fun points is sapping or kidnapping a minion to death. And people never expect a third sap that leaves a high attack minion like a 6/3.
I also used to run argent commanders, despite sludge belcher but right now south sea deckhand will be the charge minion to get buffed.
I will be streaming in a few minutes, will be doing some constructed Rogue-action tonight!
http://www.twitch.tv/zealousdemon
http://www.twitch.tv/zealousdemon
BlackBuzzard
Banned
Okay i just had a match against Priest as Paladin i first play coin knife juggler, he kills it with Word of Pain. Next turn i play Trollwalker Cho he plays Lightwell+Power word Shield. Next turn i just use hero power, he does Divine Spirit+Inner Fire he kills my Cho, i use Aldor Peace Keeper on his 14/14 Lightwell. From that point on i was just toying with him even made a 3/10 Sludge Belcher.
Trollwalker Cho is just hilarious to play in a minimal magic card deck.
Trollwalker Cho is just hilarious to play in a minimal magic card deck.
Good. Dr Boom is next.
Officerrob
Banned
I agree, but it's probably another two to three months away going by Blizzards schedule
partyphone
Banned
I think on average you get 1 legendary per 18 packs or something? you can get lucky, obviously. but you shouldn't expect much more than that.
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