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Hearthstone |OT2| Created by Unstable Portal
- Thread starter ZealousD
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Oh man if it still did that. Turn 3 Sludge Belcher. No thanks. D=
Edit: A 2/3 Pint-Sized with 1 mana discount might still be too strong, though. Unlike Mechwarper there is no build-around element, it would fit in too many decks.
That's nonsense. He might've said something stupid, but he is a good arena player.
I very much disagree that Mech Warper would not see play if it got reduced to a 2/2. It would still get run in Mech Mage decks (or really any Mech decks).
And you don't need just Kripp's opinion, he is not the only person who thinks this it's just he just posted this video and it was on my subs which was in line with what we were discussing.
And you don't need just Kripp's opinion, he is not the only person who thinks this it's just he just posted this video and it was on my subs which was in line with what we were discussing.
Kepow, pls. I thought you only read comics and played MH.
hehe I did, until I just tried Hearthstone two days ago. now I can chat with you here =P
wow hahha I thought you only played/posted in HOTS
Professor Lich
Member
What lore? I was pretty sure a good handful of these Mechs were only in Hearthstone.
I don't think it would. It would be a weak play on curve and I think it would be enough to kill most mech decks out of the meta. Mech decks are still a bit gimmicky outside of Mage and Shaman, so mech decks need these strong synergies and they need these strong cards to be viable.
Professor Lich
Member
But it's not doing that. It's just making a portal that other Mechs can use. There's not inverse Junkbot effect going on.
I also don't think Blizzard will ever use an effect like that. It punishes the player for using the minion for its intended use.
I also don't think Blizzard will ever use an effect like that. It punishes the player for using the minion for its intended use.
Mechwarper should be changed. I'm much more in favor of making it a 3 mana card than a 2/2 (which also isn't bad - it would then die to hnova/consecrate/explosive trap). Still useful, but doesn't allow it to be a turn 1/2 snowball monster. If you aren't sitting on spell removal to get rid of a coined warper against mech aggro you've probably lost the game, and that's just poor game design. It combos way too hard with cheap mechs, all of which are already high value into also being high tempo plays. Literally the only downside to mechaggro is that it is forced over-extension, and even then many aoe removal combos are turn 6+ and by then it may be too late regardless.
Blastmage should probably get knocked down to 3 damage split. Or 3 health. Or be able to hit all characters.
Mad scientist shouldn't immediately put the secret in play.
Blastmage should probably get knocked down to 3 damage split. Or 3 health. Or be able to hit all characters.
Mad scientist shouldn't immediately put the secret in play.
wtf. So I quit a game because it was acting weird every time it was my turn. I conceded and went to the main menu. Once I got there and clicked on Play Ranked, it told me it was reconnecting me to the match I left. It reconnects me, and I concede and close battle.net. I open battle.net and go back into Hearthstone 6 minutes later. Just as it boots up, it reconnects me to the same game on the same turn.
Mechwarper at 3 mana would be just awful. If you only get a discount of 1 mana then all you did was play a river croc off curve. You would be forced to play 2 subsequent mechs on the same turn just to get value. You just turned it from a staple of mech decks into a late game 3-card combo that does nothing but save you a single crystal in the late game (where mana is less important).
LostMyNarbles
Member
Just went 7/3 with a rogue in the arena. That's the best I've ever done and I was pretty surprised since I never really see rogues get picked and haven't considered using one before that run.
I'm ok with this.
I think Mechwarper is balanced.
But it creates "feel bad" moments when they get Mechwarper + Coin + Mechwarper + Clockwork + Snow Chugger + Annoy-o-tron, the dream and Blizzard hates "feel bad" gameplay, so that alone would justify its nerf.
But it creates "feel bad" moments when they get Mechwarper + Coin + Mechwarper + Clockwork + Snow Chugger + Annoy-o-tron, the dream and Blizzard hates "feel bad" gameplay, so that alone would justify its nerf.
Rogue arena probably makes me more mad than any other class. I had a few that seemed really damn good, then just got facerushed down with no real options. It always felt heavily dependent on having heals and taunts.
I do like picking it but it feels hard to get something that covers all of her bases well.
That's an interesting worst case scenario that ignores the fact that turn 2 coin warper clockwork is still possible, or turn 3 coin warper clockwork annoy-o (or turn 4 sans coin). If those are 'late game' combos then fuck me sideways, but watching it happen on turn 1/2 is obnoxious and often damning.
Actually I'm quite surprised Mechwarper doesn't have a cap of "1 mana" like Summoning Portal did. I know that they want Warlock cards to be as awful as possible but one of the first things I did in Hearthstone was try to make a Summoner's Portal + Knife Juggler deck work.
It didn't.
MEANWHILE, Mechwarper is pumping out amazing turn 3s and 4s every 10 games or something.
It didn't.
MEANWHILE, Mechwarper is pumping out amazing turn 3s and 4s every 10 games or something.
Which is the same as turn 2 coin river croc clockwork unless you can guarantee than the warper will get a 1 mana discount next turn. Which you can't, because 2 mana removals are extremely common.
Which requires that you have a very specific mulligan/draw in the early game. Not only do you need the warper, clockwork, annoy-o in your hand, but you also need 1 or 2 other early drops for your Turn1/2. Not to mention you basically just dumped your entire hand and you're basically in topdeck mode until you.draw arcane intellect.
There's a whole bunch of "dreams" out there that are much worse and are untouched. Double Hobgoblin + Echoing Ooze + Annoyotron? Ancestor's Call Malygos into Lightning Bolt + Double Crackle? OTK Warrior?
Yeah, I think if anything that's the biggest swing for mech warper. It also allows double mechwarper to drop free annoy-o-trons (which protects them) and snowchuggers.
I do agree with Zealous that double mechwarper isn't really the type of thing that the card is going to be balanced around though. You can do a lot of messed up stuff with two copies of a card from the start.
Whenever I draw mage and a seemingly good deck I do awful in arena and sometimes when I get a really odd paladin/druid/hunter/priest deck I seem to do way better.
Still usually get my ass handed to me by mages in arena tho
It's not about "feel bad" more like having an opening hand that practically guarantees a win. It's like when people considered having Undertaker plus 2-3 Deathrattles a "dream" when just like Mech Warper that happens way too often for it to be considered a "dream".
Blizzard still nerfed Undertaker despite some proponents of UT saying stuff like "but you can get a 2 mana removal out and remove it before it gets out of control". I feel that Mech Warper enables a very similar kind of snowballing although obviously not as bad.
Or they don't nerf Mech Warper but take out the Stealth token from the Spare parts pool which I am ok with.
That is what I meant by "feel bad" gameplay.
Hunter survived the nerf to Undertaker. They just packed up and moved their threats to mid game instead of early game.
I'm confident that Mech Mage would survive any nerfs to Mechwarper, because what makes that deck really work is the curve of Chugger/Scientist -> Spider/Tinker -> Blastmage/Pilot. Mechwarper, occasionally, pushes Mech Mage "over the top", but it still has an extremely solid foundation without it. That is the whole point of the deck. Not that the strategy relied on any single card, but that every card has multiple substitutes that would be fine if you drew them in place of the others.
The Undertaker nerf wasn't to make Hunters less competitive, but to make them less frustrating to play against. Ditto the Leeroy nerf. Ditto the Miracle nerf. Ditto the original OTK Warrior nerf. It is the most important part of their balance philosophy, post-Beta, that no one gets put off by what certain decks are capable of. They balance for experience first, and competition second.
TimeEffect
Member
So I was thinking of some card effects that could be created. Obviously, they would need the right balance, but here is what I was thinking:
-Invisibility: Card is invisible
-Disable enemy Hero ability
-Look at opponent's hand and discard card/take card
-Taunt Order (if you have multiple taunt minions, you can set the order at which they need to be targeted)
-Penetrate Hero Armor (direct attack health)
-Hero Power costs 0 mana
-Limit maximum number of placeable minions for enemy
-Block an opponent from drawing a card next turn
-Activate minion battlecry during play (as opposed to instantly during play-- could be a new ability type)
-Suck hit points from minions to give health to yourself
-Attacking the hero with a minion does damage to minion equal to value of equipped weapon
-Certain minion types doing +2 damage to certain other minion types
-Certain minion types doing -2 damage to certain other minion types
-For certain classes, a spell/secret could be used to steal a corresponding enemy minion type (for example, when playing as a hunter, if the opponent plays a beast with 3 attack or less, it is automatically converted to the Hunter's side)
-Invisibility: Card is invisible
-Disable enemy Hero ability
-Look at opponent's hand and discard card/take card
-Taunt Order (if you have multiple taunt minions, you can set the order at which they need to be targeted)
-Penetrate Hero Armor (direct attack health)
-Hero Power costs 0 mana
-Limit maximum number of placeable minions for enemy
-Block an opponent from drawing a card next turn
-Activate minion battlecry during play (as opposed to instantly during play-- could be a new ability type)
-Suck hit points from minions to give health to yourself
-Attacking the hero with a minion does damage to minion equal to value of equipped weapon
-Certain minion types doing +2 damage to certain other minion types
-Certain minion types doing -2 damage to certain other minion types
-For certain classes, a spell/secret could be used to steal a corresponding enemy minion type (for example, when playing as a hunter, if the opponent plays a beast with 3 attack or less, it is automatically converted to the Hunter's side)
MetroidPrimeRib
Banned
A lot of those seem kinda anti-fun but I could see armor piercing, card draw blocking (maybe), 0 mana hero power and minion damaging weapon working. Granted they would need to work right, because card draw blocking and 0 mana hero power could easily be broken as hell.
Warlock Life Steal already suck hit points from minions. Or are you talking an AoE?
So power creep (sprint?) is a-okay and we should live it.
It really doesn't - there are plenty of 2 and 3 drop mechs, mullying into a decent 1/2/3 curve is not unlikely, I just used those particularly as an example. As for the ladder half of the argument - how is that any different than what already occurs, if only a turn later?
Double hobgoblin echoing ooze annoy-o is an interesting 10 mana play that is in no way comparable, as is the OTK shaman/warrior.
The point is that mechs individually are already value cards, and get insane value AND tempo with mechwarper.
TimeEffect
Member
Haha oh yeah definitely broken but I figured that they could be balanced in. I imagine future updates will utilize some of these variations.
I forgot about life steal
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
So, how does one handle Priest's double Northshire Cleric opening with a billion buffs? I always seem to lose to it. I'm Paladin right now but its the same with every class it seems.
Mechwarper is strong but I still don't even think it's the strongest 2-drop in the game. Mad Scientist is currently the best and is absolutely better than Mechwarper. Shielded Minibot, Knife Juggler, Wild Pyro, Flametongue Totem, and Nerubian Egg are also all in the same tier as Mechwarper imo.
By "billion buffs" do you mean just power word shields? Or are you talking about cheesy inner fire decks?
A random dude
Member
Does anyone wanna play randomly generated decks with me? guitarshred #1250
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thepotatoman
Unconfirmed Member
Power Word Shield into Velen's Chosen into Temple Enforcer, but it's mainly the first two that are annoying me.
In a vacuum all of those comparisons are certainly true, but as a turn 1c/2 drop, only the mad scientist is comparable, and even then, in terms of tempo gain, only for hunter.
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