Mage has Duplicate now. It can bring you aggressive minions early on or insane value with Belchers and Mad scientists.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Hearthstone |OT2| Created by Unstable Portal
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
- Status
Mage has Duplicate now. It can bring you aggressive minions early on or insane value with Belchers and Mad scientists.
It's really not about any single instance of Arena, but how consistent you can get a high win rate over a long time. At least a few posters in this thread average 7-3. I average something like 5-3 so Arena is a good deal for me.
Oh, so it's not very fast I take it? When I was trying to build a secret deck, I modeled it off the old aggro mage decks.
Oh, so it's not very fast I take it? When I was trying to build a secret deck, I modeled it off the old aggro mage decks.
That was my first attempt too. But I've had a lot more success with a slower deck using 2 Azure Drakes, Loatheb, a Sludge Belcher, 2 Flamestrikes, and Ysera. Easy access to early secrets can force a lot of inefficient removal on Ethereal Arcanists which eventually leaves them wide open for Ysera.
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
My own-made secret deck that I made for the lolz a few days ago... tried it out online and this morning I got 8 wins in a row (at around rank 10).
I think it's time for me to take a longer break from Hearthstone again. Really not liking post-Naxx meta (though I know it'll still change and shift a lot before it settles).
I really hate secrets and powerful death rattles that depend on me drawing into silence (of which there aren't even that many of) to determine if a game is a win or a loss.
I prefer the Miracle meta over the current one. I'll sit back for now and just observe and see where it goes. Tournaments are still fun to watch.
I really hate secrets and powerful death rattles that depend on me drawing into silence (of which there aren't even that many of) to determine if a game is a win or a loss.
I prefer the Miracle meta over the current one. I'll sit back for now and just observe and see where it goes. Tournaments are still fun to watch.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
There is a lot of skill involved in arena. A good portion comes from the deck building side.
This is what I ended up with last week. It pretty quickly got up to rank 8ish when the more aggro one was only slowly moving up from 13.
I was trying to make Vaporize work but could never get value out of it, so instead I opted for three anti-spell secrets that almost always protect Ethereal Arcanists or Water Elementals on turn 4. Mirror Entity works reasonably well. I had a hard time making Duplicate work because you still have to spend mana to summon the minions again, but it might work instead of Arcane Intellect. Ice Block has been surprisingly useful, although you don't really want to see it get pulled by a Mad Scientist.
EnVy_CaLiBeR
Member
My Harrison Jones loves the smell of Doomhammer in the morning. Literally won me that match when I was close to losing.
That belongs in a museum!
Professor Lich
Member
I had someone Harrison my Doomhammer once, but they burned five cards. Have to be careful but it's probably one of the best top deck situations outside of a direct win.
Freyjadour
Member
Mulligan and card draw are just so much bigger in Arena. If Tempo starts leaning the other way and you didn't have a chance to draft into much in the way of combos or clears, you may as well concede.
Even though Kripp does well on average, you still see him run into the same Tempo problems. Mistakes and misplays are fairly magnified too.
I dunno. I like Arena in theory, but in execution I feel there's a lot of room for improvement.
Even though Kripp does well on average, you still see him run into the same Tempo problems. Mistakes and misplays are fairly magnified too.
I dunno. I like Arena in theory, but in execution I feel there's a lot of room for improvement.
MisterArrogant
Neo Member
Play priest. They have tons of silences.
I don't find Priest fun to play.
I'm not complaining about my win/loss ratio. It's fine and about the same as it has always been. I just don't find the current meta fun, just like I didn't find the 2 mana UTH meta fun (and also took a break then).
TheSadRanger
Banned
Duplicate works much better towards the mid game IMO, if you can drop Loatheb and bait a removal from your opponent with duplicate out they're basically screwed.
lawlohwhat
Banned
It's also tough because you can't rely on your opponent being limited to 2 of a card. Makes dodging removal much harder.
Its not salt, I just don't like the added RNG element. It generally always nets you a gain in gold as long as you can win a few games. But fun wise, I find it lacking. No fun to get garbage choices for cards and get matched against legends and epics, and no fun to draw insane impossibly good hands and steamroll people playing boars and whatnot.
Yeah that part I liked.
"FOR DOOMHAMMER!'
"You're fighting for a Hammer? Oooooookay...."
Yep, basically this. In a game so chock full of random elements anyway, it bothers me a bit to cede control to yet another thing like deck building.
EscapingJail
Member
RDU's rush pally deck RECKS hunter
link to list?
List?
Just got rekt by Kel'Thuzad for the first time. He resurrects at the end of every turn? I thought it was just on your own turn. I can see him being broken as fuck in the right deck.
Especially when the main conceit of Arena mode is that you are supposedly on a level playing field and that it is all about playing skill and not significantly dependent on access to better cards. I mean, I can't get mad when peeps are dropping Rag and Ysera on me in constructed because they put in the hours and earned those cards (or spent real world cash). But it sucks when it happens in Arena because those players did nothing but get a lucky card draw.
EscapingJail
Member
Deck revolves around divine favor. Keep one if you have a good starting curve.
EDIT: To be completely honest RDU's deck is a very hard counter to the current hunter meta. But it's not as well rounded as reynad's version here http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/92631-reynads-op-pally-avenge-rush
That surprised me and my opponent when I first played him too. He killed off a few of my little guys to prevent the trades and... they came back anyways.
I'm not sure quite how I feel about Kel'Thuzad yet. He's expensive, and NEEDS some board presence to go along with his ability otherwise he doesn't do much. But if he isn't dealt with immediately he completely takes over the game.
It's a bad joke card
Maybe earlier in the games life people may have let it live so that the user got some value out of it. But the first time that sucker pulls some 8 mana card on to the field because you ignore it... you will forever prioritize killing it immediately. So I think you may have missed the boat on that cards usefulness. I rarely see them ever, but when I do, I kill it immediately, letting it live is so risky it could cost you the game, and everyone knows it.
Bel_Air_Jeff
Banned
http://www.twitch.tv/belairjeff
I'm streaming some hearth! I'm kind of new! But I got some okay cards..
Come help me out
I'm streaming some hearth! I'm kind of new! But I got some okay cards..
Come help me out
BananasWithGuns
Member
I swear to god I'm the unluckiest person in arena.
Rogue plays a Dancing Swords on turn 3. Then Cold Blood on turn 4. I have Starfall waiting for turn 5 but then he puts stealth on the Dancing Swords on his turn 5.
Seriously, why me?
Rogue plays a Dancing Swords on turn 3. Then Cold Blood on turn 4. I have Starfall waiting for turn 5 but then he puts stealth on the Dancing Swords on his turn 5.
Seriously, why me?
Professor Lich
Member
I think any deck that has board control late game will really benefit from him. A few games now I've been able to get a Sludge Belcher rolling back every turn and it's amazing. I think in those games people used their removal on Stalagg / Fuegen so there was nothing left for KT. I've got some refinements but I've gotten some good matches with him.
SuperSonic1305
Member
I can't get into this on iPad. It's so much slower. PC version is far superior.
Minsc
Gold Member
Older iPad? It's really only the iPad Air that runs it well, and the mini retina. The 2 through regular retina struggle a bit iirc.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Runs well on ipad 2 based on my experience using it.
ShinNL
Member
I think Cairne is actually too slow for Shaman. With only 4 damage it usually won't save my life. So I opted only for the most valueable cards for the Shaman combos:
2x Earth Elemental*
2x Faceless
1x Sylvanas
1x Baron Rivendare
1x Kel Thuzad
2x Ancestral Spirit
2x Reincarnation
* Debatable, but by far the best value minion when it comes to dying and reviving.
I think this is the staple for mass duplication. How the rest of the deck should look like is still quite hard to figure out. I've tried a mass taunt version, giants version, deathrattle version, mass AoE removal version and now I'm on a more balanced taunt, draw, removal version.
Doomsayer turn 2 helps quite a bit with delaying, definitely keeping that one golden version in my deck.
2 Loot Hoarder, 1 Manatide and 1 Azure Drake seems to help a lot with filling the curve, putting some sort of threat and still keeping my hand with options.
The giants version seems to lack healing, so I think I have to get Alexstrasza before I try that again. Or maybe having all those necessary cards AND giants AND giants-managing cards (like taunt givers) will cut too much of the deck for me to be able to play anything in the first 4 turns.
Mass removal, including Forked Lightning, was not such a good success. While it usually keeps your board clean, having only 1-3 cards left in your hand starting from turn 5 doesn't allow much room to actually to do the death combos. And with almost every spell giving overload, it often delays or blocks the combos and you just end up being more and more behind with the lower mana availability.
Next time I'll try a Loot Hoarder, Acolyte of Pain with Abusive Sergeant, Flametongue Totem and Dark Iron Dwarf, Azure Drake version. Maybe instead of trying to play catch up removal on the first few turns, 'faking' aggression while drawing cards might be better. As long as you can get to 5+ mana with enough cards and then slam some Earth Elementals and Belchers (or maybe Sunwalker?) the board should swing your way.
Another interesting option would be putting the 2 stealth wolves, Faerie Dragon and Spectral Knight. They all can serve as trade removal, hard to be removed by spells and creates a board, which in a way also works well with Kel Thuzad. Won't have much room for taunts and card draw that way though.
I didn't like Feugen and Stalagg that much with the combos, probably because it doesn't taunt by itself. To use those cards, you probably need a very aggressive opening, but then you'll be hurting for card draw even more, making it even harder to do Reincarnate combos.
Alarm-o-bot is too often a dead card or dead drop unfortunately.
Another concept I want to try is having mass minion summoning along with Cult Master. That way you can open aggressively and still end up with a lot of cards. Will be hard to fit everything in a 30 card limit though.
I haven't tried super early taunt style yet though. Maybe that will work as well: Ancient Watchers, Ancestral Healing, Sunfury Protector, Deathlord and Injured Blademaster to provide some early taunt pressure so you can follow up with card drawers like Manatide Totem and Nat Pagle.
So much to try, so little time!
2x Earth Elemental*
2x Faceless
1x Sylvanas
1x Baron Rivendare
1x Kel Thuzad
2x Ancestral Spirit
2x Reincarnation
* Debatable, but by far the best value minion when it comes to dying and reviving.
I think this is the staple for mass duplication. How the rest of the deck should look like is still quite hard to figure out. I've tried a mass taunt version, giants version, deathrattle version, mass AoE removal version and now I'm on a more balanced taunt, draw, removal version.
Doomsayer turn 2 helps quite a bit with delaying, definitely keeping that one golden version in my deck.
2 Loot Hoarder, 1 Manatide and 1 Azure Drake seems to help a lot with filling the curve, putting some sort of threat and still keeping my hand with options.
The giants version seems to lack healing, so I think I have to get Alexstrasza before I try that again. Or maybe having all those necessary cards AND giants AND giants-managing cards (like taunt givers) will cut too much of the deck for me to be able to play anything in the first 4 turns.
Mass removal, including Forked Lightning, was not such a good success. While it usually keeps your board clean, having only 1-3 cards left in your hand starting from turn 5 doesn't allow much room to actually to do the death combos. And with almost every spell giving overload, it often delays or blocks the combos and you just end up being more and more behind with the lower mana availability.
Next time I'll try a Loot Hoarder, Acolyte of Pain with Abusive Sergeant, Flametongue Totem and Dark Iron Dwarf, Azure Drake version. Maybe instead of trying to play catch up removal on the first few turns, 'faking' aggression while drawing cards might be better. As long as you can get to 5+ mana with enough cards and then slam some Earth Elementals and Belchers (or maybe Sunwalker?) the board should swing your way.
Another interesting option would be putting the 2 stealth wolves, Faerie Dragon and Spectral Knight. They all can serve as trade removal, hard to be removed by spells and creates a board, which in a way also works well with Kel Thuzad. Won't have much room for taunts and card draw that way though.
I didn't like Feugen and Stalagg that much with the combos, probably because it doesn't taunt by itself. To use those cards, you probably need a very aggressive opening, but then you'll be hurting for card draw even more, making it even harder to do Reincarnate combos.
Alarm-o-bot is too often a dead card or dead drop unfortunately.
Another concept I want to try is having mass minion summoning along with Cult Master. That way you can open aggressively and still end up with a lot of cards. Will be hard to fit everything in a 30 card limit though.
I haven't tried super early taunt style yet though. Maybe that will work as well: Ancient Watchers, Ancestral Healing, Sunfury Protector, Deathlord and Injured Blademaster to provide some early taunt pressure so you can follow up with card drawers like Manatide Totem and Nat Pagle.
So much to try, so little time!
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
@sonett
I personally think earth elemental is too all in of a minion to really play in a competitive deck. Vs control they'll often have BGH or another removal and vs aggro a simple death knight or silence is just gonna lead to a loss. I actually think that deathlord is a better minion than earth elemental.
The sylvanas/reincarnate thing is pretty crazy though. If you can make that work out consistently, I wouldn't mind checking that deck out myself. I haven't been wrecked by sylvanas like in a long time before naxxramas. I have learned my lesson though recently lol. But my current rogue deck is running 2 saps AND 1 kidnapper so I am not so afraid of it, at least with that deck
Also, I am not entirely sure why people haven't fit at least 1 cult master into paladin/shaman decks since the token hero power. I guess it is more viable in paladin since all their tokens start with the ability to attack and die unlike shaman which would require a FTT.
I personally think earth elemental is too all in of a minion to really play in a competitive deck. Vs control they'll often have BGH or another removal and vs aggro a simple death knight or silence is just gonna lead to a loss. I actually think that deathlord is a better minion than earth elemental.
The sylvanas/reincarnate thing is pretty crazy though. If you can make that work out consistently, I wouldn't mind checking that deck out myself. I haven't been wrecked by sylvanas like in a long time before naxxramas. I have learned my lesson though recently lol. But my current rogue deck is running 2 saps AND 1 kidnapper so I am not so afraid of it, at least with that deck
Also, I am not entirely sure why people haven't fit at least 1 cult master into paladin/shaman decks since the token hero power. I guess it is more viable in paladin since all their tokens start with the ability to attack and die unlike shaman which would require a FTT.
Professor Lich
Member
Lightning Storm hit everything for 2 when they were all x/3 minions. I died inside.
Speaking of Shamans, does anyone know what the popular deck for them are?
Speaking of Shamans, does anyone know what the popular deck for them are?
ShinNL
Member
Yeah, I'm trying a few things without Earth Elemental.@sonett
I personally think earth elemental is too all in of a minion to really play in a competitive deck. Vs control they'll often have BGH or another removal and vs aggro a simple death knight or silence is just gonna lead to a loss. I actually think that deathlord is a better minion than earth elemental.
The sylvanas/reincarnate thing is pretty crazy though. If you can make that work out consistently, I wouldn't mind checking that deck out myself. I haven't been wrecked by sylvanas like in a long time before naxxramas. I have learned my lesson though recently lol. But my current rogue deck is running 2 saps AND 1 kidnapper so I am not so afraid of it, at least with that deck
Also, I am not entirely sure why people haven't fit at least 1 cult master into paladin/shaman decks since the token hero power. I guess it is more viable in paladin since all their tokens start with the ability to attack and die unlike shaman which would require a FTT.
I ran a test with the super early heavy taunts version (Ancient Watcher, Injured, Deathlord) and it's really bad on the cards. They are usually removed before you can safely put a card draw engine behind one. Not very successful.
Having a lot more success with this curve efficient card-draw minion version though. Unfortunately those minions require so many slots in the decklist that I had to play with less deathrattle combos, hence why I call it Death Light.
Those spell immune minions do some crazy work and against burn decks they have saved me quite a lot of times once I Argus them. You can see those Rogues trying to Sap them but nope, that red arrow won't be doing anything against it. It plays more like a ramp Druid, with Flametongue Totem being a reverse Innervate, adding that extra unexpected power when needed. The card draw engine seems plenty this time around.
Somehow every game I played with this deck, I ended up with a healthy overwhelming one sided board control and still having enough life and cards. Pretty easy to get Kel Thuzad value as well, either by seeing an opportunity to trade or just to make a double 6/8 with 10 mana.
partyphone
Banned
I feel like shaman and druid are in really bad places right now. Everyone is playing hunter/warrior/zoo on ladder with a healthy dose of paladin and priest. but mostly hunter and warrior.
and, of course, miracle rogue is still broken. it just doesn't really run any naxx cards and I think people are bored of it.
and, of course, miracle rogue is still broken. it just doesn't really run any naxx cards and I think people are bored of it.
Okay, KT is pretty fun. I dropped him into my Mage secrets deck and just destroyed a handlock since I could suicide charge everything at his giants every turn. The only downside is that Ethereal Arcanists self-buff before KT's revival, so they're 3/3s for the next turn after coming back. Probably not a keeper, but it was a fun match.
The upside of KT mage is that Counterspell and taunts make KT untouchable.
The upside of KT mage is that Counterspell and taunts make KT untouchable.
Amen to that. If theres a Spellbender and Counterspell up, not even a flaring hunter can do much to get a KT down. It feels a little broken but its DAMN fun. I suspect at least a change to make him only res at the end of the players turn though, right now it just grinds the other player to a halt if you have Counterspell and a Taunt on the board. They cant even clear your minions to have a shot at KT the next turn. Its surreal. They you just suicide everything into clearing their board and your whole board comes back.... crazy.
Are there any tauntadin decks running Kelthuzad right now? I've kind of been running a redemption version of control paladin to sort of do the same thing. Kind of debating whether I can swap the redemptions for keltuzad or if I should have both (double Kelthuzad?)
Professor Lich
Member
Another thing about Thaddius, it's amazing / sucks horribly when you or your opponent can 'use' the death of Stalagg/Fuegen to their advantage. Of course, it can lead to amazing combos.
This Amaz game from today is hilarious. I was crying laughing while watching it on his stream.
http://youtu.be/t-4p6w1w5Sw
http://youtu.be/t-4p6w1w5Sw
RumblingRosco
Member
I will say, getting all the Naxx Legendaries certainly helped me towards having an all-Legendary deck. Still a few shy, but close.
Freyjadour
Member
Hah. Dropping 2x Rockbiter and Flametongue is always entertaining.
I personally wouldnt use it over counterspell, but I do run one in conjunction. Spellbender is just another way to interrupt the other players spell casting. Its amazing how freely people are willing to use Mark of the Wild or Blessing of Kings or similar minion buffs once both counterspells are down. They assume its safe and end up adding a minion to your side of the board with lots of Attack and HP that you can use against them. It also still intercepts removal like Hex, Polymorph, Execute, Shadow Word: Death/Pain, and throws off spells like Swipe and Explosive shot and more. Its just a really nice secret IMO if you are also running 2 counterspells. Makes for a nice 3rd secret.
Its also fantastic when they use Mind Controls. 10 mana for a 1/3. GG.
- Status