That's true, I was only thinking of the standard ole midrange Shaman. For that I'd say you don't necessarily need any legendaries to be fine until about rank 10, and then AA and Sylvanas to go all the way to legend. You do need a bunch of rares and epics, though.
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Hearthstone |OT2| Created by Unstable Portal
- Thread starter ZealousD
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Haunted
Member
I recommend watching the various "basic/F2P to legend" videos floating around out there.
Trump did several of these with Rogue, Shaman, Warlock and Mage. https://sites.google.com/site/trumpdecks/freetoplay
The best way to get cards is doing your dailies and getting good at arena. No matter if you drop 200 bucks on packs or don't spend a dime you'll be collecting for a long, long time until you're able to build any deck you want. It's a CCG after all.
^ The f2p vids are still good for general strategy but the lists of Trump and his opponents are very outdated post-Naxx. I'm not sure if he's planning to do a new series anytime soon.
^ The f2p vids are still good for general strategy but the lists of Trump and his opponents are very outdated post-Naxx. I'm not sure if he's planning to do a new series anytime soon.
I've been playing an awesome anti-aggro Control Warrior recently, it shuts down Hunters and Zoo beautifully.
http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/110522-legend-hunter-zoo-killer-control-warrior
I posted that more to show that it can be done with enough skill and experience, not necessarily to copy Trump's decks.
The value proposition of this game is very simple. To get anywhere in Hearthstone, you need to invest something. Either it's money, or time.
Bingo. I have been playing since closed beta and only recently (never spent a penny) have I got a decent spread of decks, all the good neutral legendary's and 2 of the class ones (Tirion and Cenarius).
You actually get more value from the solid neutral rares and epics, Leg's can be pretty gimmicky and silence magnets.
partyphone
Banned
when they did their very first ladder season only a few of the top 100 players has spent real money on the game. i'm trying to find the quote but it was only something like 3 out of the top 50 had spent money.
you're either going to have to invest time playing arena or invest money buying packs. and really, even if you spent a ton of money and get all the cards you still have to invest a lot of time learning how to play.
i started out watching trump and kripp and hafu stream arenas on twitch and got good enough to get most of the cards aside from a few legends and epics. and then when i was sufficiently hooked on the game i just bought 40 packs to fill in the gaps.
Thanks! Deck is doing really good so far (4-0).
RumblingRosco
Member
Undertaker, Coin, Leper Gnome is a gross opener against a Priest.
ftfy
11 at 10 mana unless you already have a beast on board.
ShinNL
Member
I don't get it, almost every card you listed actually suck if they don't get their value off. What's there to BGH if you're as poor as you say you are? (yet you bothered crafting double Doomguard?) Faceless Manipulator what (same dust price as Doomguard btw)? BK on your non-existant Earth Elemental?
The biggest problem with Zoo-only players is that they never learn the game beyond their hand. Learning not to overextend, or when to keep removal. Trading intelligence is also extremely limited.
The funny thing is, Shaman has the kit to deal with every card you listed without a single Legendary.
Not trying to be personal, but I believe if someone has the dust to create the full Zoo experience, I'm quite confident that you could have created an equal awesome deck with almost every other class.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Decks don't need big cards like cairne, sylvanas, bk, or rag. In fact, my shaman deck doesn't run a single one of those...
Yeah, Leeroy is still somewhat viable for burst damage. But running two Buzzards is inexcusable really. His turn 5 play of a Buzzard onto an empty board was backbreaking for him.
Kotetsu534
Member
I mean, it's possible that I'm just too stuck in my Zoo ways and playing badly. I can easily get to high ranks as Zoo but I get dumped on with every other deck playing at that level (except pre-nerf Hunter, the other deck I invested dust in crafting). I own one Legendary (Al'Akir) and a few epics/rares. I think the problem is my other decks suck - there's no point in me playing control warrior, Druid or Handlock without the cards for them.
People say Shaman is great against decks that use big guys (like Handlock and some Druids), but I'm not too sure that's the case, and I've seen commentators in tournaments agree with me. Sure, you have two Hexes, two Earth Shocks, an Owl, your Lightning Bolts and Storms. But if you're going against two Druid of the Claws, at least one Ancient of War, a Faceless, and three legendaries your removal can be outlasted. Druid has better card draw engines than Shaman too so simply trading card for card hurts you.
I don't think I'm too bad at the game though - I get to rank 5 with ease spamming Zoo and made rank 2 last month. I can go deep in Arena frequently as a number of classes (by far best record is with Mage though). In the fullness of time I'll complete the deck lists for other classes and see how I do with them on the ladder, but till then I'm sticking with Zoo.
People say Shaman is great against decks that use big guys (like Handlock and some Druids), but I'm not too sure that's the case, and I've seen commentators in tournaments agree with me. Sure, you have two Hexes, two Earth Shocks, an Owl, your Lightning Bolts and Storms. But if you're going against two Druid of the Claws, at least one Ancient of War, a Faceless, and three legendaries your removal can be outlasted. Druid has better card draw engines than Shaman too so simply trading card for card hurts you.
I don't think I'm too bad at the game though - I get to rank 5 with ease spamming Zoo and made rank 2 last month. I can go deep in Arena frequently as a number of classes (by far best record is with Mage though). In the fullness of time I'll complete the deck lists for other classes and see how I do with them on the ladder, but till then I'm sticking with Zoo.
lawlohwhat
Banned
If you're hitting rank 2 then you're pretty good at the game regardless of what you're playing. Zoo doesn't force decision making on the level of most control decks but there are nuances to it like positioning, knowing when to gamble on a life tap, when to fire off your soul fire or doom guards, etc. I find it pretty boring compared to control but I feel like it's often the best option for laddering since the ranking system is so dumb.
partyphone
Banned
yeah zoo can actually pretty hard to play at a really high level where the slightest mistake means defeat. anyone not playing zoo at rank 5 or higher is going to have anti-zoo tech as well as a ton of experience combatting zoo. it is, far and away, the deck i have the most experience playing against and I only play for maybe an hour a day.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Well, you should know from playing zoo that you don't need to deal with their entire deck. When they drop a 6-7+ mana minion and you deal with it for 3 mana like hex, that is a tempo advantage that cannot really be matched by anything other than perhaps hunter's mark on a non-deathrattle, non-divine shield minion.
Rosenskjold
Member
Only got 5 win with Tirion ://
First game I meet someone with a legend cardback who runs me over, and second game I just meet someone who has perfect cards, still got 5 wins in a row after that but :/ Goodbye Tirion :'(
First game I meet someone with a legend cardback who runs me over, and second game I just meet someone who has perfect cards, still got 5 wins in a row after that but :/ Goodbye Tirion :'(
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
Oh man, I accidentally queued up my terminator rogue deck in ranked when I meant to be playing shaman... almost had a heartattack lol... I ended up winning against a handlock though. Thank god I recognized which of the 4 rogue decks I have built atm. That seriously could have gone way worse than it did.
I haven't even tested the deck since I put alexstrasza and 2 earthen ring farseers in it. This guy was probably like wtf... preparation AND anu'bar ambusher in the same deck? Sprint!? lol
I haven't even tested the deck since I put alexstrasza and 2 earthen ring farseers in it. This guy was probably like wtf... preparation AND anu'bar ambusher in the same deck? Sprint!? lol
I don't think there's any other deck in the game that requires as much thinking about positioning as zoo. Even Shaman can't compete. Especially if you're running Void Terror.
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
I think shaman has as much if not more. While you could argue that flametongue is like the alpha wolf and both run DOA, shaman runs feral spirit which you can't place so you must always play knowing where your feral spirits must land. And the same thing with their hero power.
I guess void terror levels out the difficulty, although that little fad seems to have largely passed. I haven't seen that in a while now tbh. I guess people were catching on to the inherent weakness of sacrificing minions to bulld one strong one, or seeing the fact that void terror often gets you nothing when you're already losing.
Also about zoo, while I agree there is a skill to positioning and ordering your moves, I don't think they are that difficult to master. Occasionally people do make small mistakes though.
KingKiller
Neo Member
I keep trying to build a shaman deck using the naxx cards as I often get spanked by shamans and so far they've all been terrible. Anyone recommend one one on hearthpwn?
partyphone
Banned
this is what i've been running:
greensheep's deck seems pretty good, too: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/106165-greensheeps-everything-has-changed-blizzcon-2014
although i built that deck back when there wasn't so much zoo and hunter on ladder and haven't play it for awhile. i think greensheep's might be better against those rushier decks.
you could always go to the dark side and use undertaker: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/105823-kolentos-undertaker-shaman-viagame-update
edit: there's also chakki's double doomhammer shaman. been meaning to try it: http://www.hearthstonetopdecks.com/decks/chakkis-blizzcon-2014-na-qualifier-midrange-shaman/
partyphone
Banned
I feel they're about the same. spirit wolves and totems always come down in the same place. so once you learn the general theory behind placement there isn't much to think about when you play. and the same goes for zoo, really. once you get comfortable with a deck placement becomes a matter of muscle memory.
but that's, of course, where you make mistakes because you play too fast and don't think things through for the next 3-4 turns.
zoo has the reputation of being braindead because if you curve out well on draws and your opponent doesn't it almost never matters how well you play. but you're not taking the deck to the top without thinking because you have to be consistent over a very large number of games and you're not always going to curve out well.
I opened a Millhouse and dusted him instantly - however I kept my King Crush - he is a great finisher if you play Hunter at all
partyphone
Banned
i think leeroy would still be better to have in there than king krush. even if you don't have a beast on the board you can do 11 damage for 10 mana.
but most hunter builds don't have that kind of burst anymore except for the occasional double kill command. it's more about controlling the board early and forcing your opponent to make trades while you whittle them down with your hero power.
but most hunter builds don't have that kind of burst anymore except for the occasional double kill command. it's more about controlling the board early and forcing your opponent to make trades while you whittle them down with your hero power.
Aquavelvaman
Banned
Twitch chat can only talk about the handsome caster in the seat story cup
RumblingRosco
Member
What the hell just fell on Lothar?
Gaara one of the big boys noww
Rosenskjold
Member
Seriously this game has the weirdest mechanics :// Mage plays a secret after playing priestess of Elune, almost sure it's a duplicate. So I play snipe which kills a bounty bay he plays and the secret isn't triggered so I'm thinking, it's not a duplicate and kill the priestess and THEN the duplicate is triggered :/ So random.
Haunted
Member
Secrets don't activate on the owner's turn (the small colourful (?) turns grey on active turns to indicate this).
Your snipe killing his BBB didn't trigger his duplicate because it was his turn.
Rosenskjold
Member
Thanks, this has confused me several times.
Haunted
Member
Hasu is outclassed, pretty much the opposite from when they were SC2 players.
That was actually a fairly recent change (a couple months ago, just before final release I think), it didn't use to be like this.
No problem.
That was actually a fairly recent change (a couple months ago, just before final release I think), it didn't use to be like this.Definitely my favorite deck in the game. In every single matchup good or bad, you get to play a game of hearthstone rather than just saying, 'welp, I / they had that hand so I guess its over.' No real gimmicks itself, not really susceptible to gimmicks. You're just always playing hearthstone.
I always enjoy when trump tries, he can be brilliant. Sometimes though he just doesn't care and it annoys me soooo much when he misplays.
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