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Hearthstone |OT5| Corrupted Deeprock Salt
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
BananasWithGuns
Member
I've only dabbled in MTG so I'm not 100% familiar with all the mechanics but don't you usually have to expend resources to move your cards to the graveyard? I have to imagine it's a bit different than just holding it in your hand anyway.
On that thought though, I wonder if a mechanic where you can bring back demons/minions from the dead would work in Warlock. Sort of like Resurrect except maybe restricted to demons or a certain mana cost or whatever. Although it would be way too strong if you're able to consistently bring back stuff like Doomguard or Mal'Ganis or something so it would have to be designed around that.
I'll miss it. Game doesn't feel the same without the quality BM emote right as I defeat them
Usually you use a combination like this:
Generally early on, if there's even anything in the opponent's graveyard, it's endlessly less scary then what you're pulling out.
You get to pick which card you're getting as well so you don't have to worry about suctioning something like Jaraxxus or a Flame Imp to the board when you want Mal'Ganis.
There are more expensive options however letting both players pull is a problem, where you can even take your opponent's card:
The Mango Sentinel
Member
So I just fought 2 people in a row who were using nothing but taunt minions. I pretty much crushed them both, but I was wondering if this is some kind of legit strategy but they were just doing it wrong, or were they probably new to the game and figured this might be the way to go since they may have been struggling against taunts?
It was easy to beat but it was annoying as fuck.
It was easy to beat but it was annoying as fuck.
It's actually pretty common that new players gravitate towards taunts as they feel they die too fast playing their first, shoddy decks. It's the only explicit defensive mechanic in the game so adding taunts seems like the right move when you get overwhelmed often. But unless you have prior CCG experience you don't fully grasp concepts like value and tempo (or in fact how stupidly tempo-based the entire game is), so you don't realize that most taunts straight up suck and will actually put you behind even further.
That or it was a Bolster Warrior (a garbage deck).
Super Nothing
Member
There are three decks that all inexperienced players build when they first start playing Hearthstone: All taunts, all spell damage, and buff decks (particularly Buff Priest). They're all terrible decks, and it takes a while to actually learn why unless you read up on card games.
While the game does a nice job of on-boarding people to basic mechanics, it doesn't really do anything to explain concepts that win you matches.
You play cards that have high value for their mana costs, which makes it harder for your opponent to effectively deal with those minions the turn they come out.
Most often, these come in the form of minions with Deathrattles that summon other minions. Haunted Creeper, Sludge Belcher, and Piloted Shredder are good examples of this. Other times they can be cards that spawn multiple bodies like Living Roots or Muster for Battle. Or cards that have high stats for their cost but come with a drawback, such as Zombie Chow or Flame Imp.
Happy Feast of Winterveil!
call_kotaku
Member
playing freeze mage is such a guilty pleasure, especially the reno variation
it takes longer to win and doesn't have as overwhelming a win condition as secret paladin, but I want them to wallow in their frustration for as long as I can
fuck loatheb, though
it takes longer to win and doesn't have as overwhelming a win condition as secret paladin, but I want them to wallow in their frustration for as long as I can
fuck loatheb, though
This christmas tree is never going down
GwyndolinCinder
Member
What streamer played freeze mage and can they not fucking do that.
Dragon priest vs free mage not so strong
The Freeze Mage players never learn.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
I'm about to do an arena run and my choice of hero is between Shaman, Priest, or Druid.
This is the first time I've been offered all classes that I barely play at all. I mostly play Mage, Rogue, and Paladin.
Any suggestion on which class might give me the smoother run. I know it's all random and shit, but I figure one class has to be easier to play than the others.
This is the first time I've been offered all classes that I barely play at all. I mostly play Mage, Rogue, and Paladin.
Any suggestion on which class might give me the smoother run. I know it's all random and shit, but I figure one class has to be easier to play than the others.
WesternHeretic
Member
Priest pretty much considered the worst in arena. The other two are mid tier. Your 3 are the 3 obvious top tier of arena.
Shaman or Druid is fine. I usually have an easier time with Shaman myself. They have generally better removal options than Druid.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
Ha. Had no idea actually. No wonder I always do solid with them.
Guess I'll go with Druid.
Edit: since ZealousD mentioned better removal options, I might have to rethink this.
I don't expect to get very far anyway. Meh.
Rogue is actually pretty tough to play in arena, regardless of how strong it actually is. I usually find myself taking too much face damage, so I've steered away from picking stuff like Tinker's that the tier lists like to encourage me to pick.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
I used that HearthArena site for the first time and I wasn't really feeling some of the choices it wanted me to make. Especially the last choice. It wanted me to choose Echoing Ooze over Doomhammer and I couldn't quite understand why. It said it fit the deck archetype better but I just feel I'll get way more out of Doomhammer. It was the only choice that I decided to override. Hopefully I don't regret it.
The problem with Doomhammer is that 2 damage per hit is really weak and bad if you're using it for board control and hitting minions. 2 damage kills nothing by turn 5. HearthArena leads you to creating tempo decks, while Doomhammer is mainly for hitting face. It even isn't that great for that purpose if you don't have any Rockbiters.
Paladin, Mage and Rogue are the best. Paladin is the easiest to get a godlike unbeatable deck with and Rogue's style fits arena the best these days (tempo) but is harder to play. Mage is the middle of the road of the two.
Druid is probably 4th. Just a very consistent overall class.
Next up are Warlock, Hunter and Shaman. A bit inconsistent than the others.
Priest second last, Warrior still last but it's not a huge gap anymore
Warrior would be higher on my list if Paladin didn't dominate Arena so hard. It's a horrendous match up where as Warrior does decent against Mage and Rogue.
Priest really struggles in a tempo driven Arena meta.
If you had stuff like Flametongue Totems, Defender of Argus etc. in your deck then it probably made sense to pick the Echoing Ooze. Or if you had more weapons in the deck then the value of Doomhammer probably went down.
Druid is probably 4th. Just a very consistent overall class.
Next up are Warlock, Hunter and Shaman. A bit inconsistent than the others.
Priest second last, Warrior still last but it's not a huge gap anymore
Warrior would be higher on my list if Paladin didn't dominate Arena so hard. It's a horrendous match up where as Warrior does decent against Mage and Rogue.
Priest really struggles in a tempo driven Arena meta.
It's hard to know without looking at your list. When in doubt pick a 2 drop in Arena because those win you more games.
If you had stuff like Flametongue Totems, Defender of Argus etc. in your deck then it probably made sense to pick the Echoing Ooze. Or if you had more weapons in the deck then the value of Doomhammer probably went down.
WesternHeretic
Member
I've came to the conclusion that the funniest deck for me to play is anything with fucking Malygos in it. God that card is <3.
The Mango Sentinel
Member
I have two rockbiters and that's the reason I went with Doomhammer
I do have flametongues and I think because I have frostwolf warlord is the reason it wanted me to go with echoing ooze.
Sometimes, HearthArena is just wrong -- it's not unusual for players to make different choices at least a couple of times every draft.
You should also make sure to look at the scores it gives to each choice. If they're reasonably close, just go with your gut.
Most players will differ from HearthArena on at least a few picks. It's a very good tool but it isn't perfect. Sometimes it overvalues certain synergies, or has weird explanation text, or pushes your "deck archetype" too heavily in early picks, etc.
One thing to remember is that if picks are within like 5 points of each other, the differences between the two cards is basically meaningless. Just go with your gut on those.
One of my strongest rules of thumb is that you want to push for 5-6 of each on 2-drops, 3-drops, and 4-drops. You don't necessarily want to fill those drops early in the draft and HearthArena is usually pretty good about pushing those slots itself, but if the scores are even remotely close and I still have empty slots in those areas I'll generally prefer my early curve, even over a solid big drop like Boulderfist Ogre or something, as long as the early drop isn't garbage tier.
One thing to remember is that if picks are within like 5 points of each other, the differences between the two cards is basically meaningless. Just go with your gut on those.
One of my strongest rules of thumb is that you want to push for 5-6 of each on 2-drops, 3-drops, and 4-drops. You don't necessarily want to fill those drops early in the draft and HearthArena is usually pretty good about pushing those slots itself, but if the scores are even remotely close and I still have empty slots in those areas I'll generally prefer my early curve, even over a solid big drop like Boulderfist Ogre or something, as long as the early drop isn't garbage tier.
My rule of thumb is that you want to have your peak be at the 2 drop range, dip a bit for the 3 drop slot and then dip slightly back up for the 4 drop slot (especially for Mage and Paladin) and then slope all the way down from there.
Nowadays you want a few 1 drops in there as well for the tempo. Zombie Chow is still god tier.
And if given a choice and you are unsure + there are no synergies to account for... pick the card with the highest early game tempo impact.
Nowadays you want a few 1 drops in there as well for the tempo. Zombie Chow is still god tier.
And if given a choice and you are unsure + there are no synergies to account for... pick the card with the highest early game tempo impact.
I think there's still only a few 1-drops worth picking. Definitely Zombie Chow and Worgen Infiltrator but I'm skeptical about much else that isn't those two or a 1/3. Webspinner I guess...
Kotetsu534
Member
Argent Squire is god tier in Paladin in Arena. Avenge and buff synergy is amazing. Uldaman made it even stronger.
call_kotaku
Member
honestly I think all the 2/1s are worth picking, and "mage/druid/rogue get to kill it for free!" isn't as big of a deal as it was when the game first launched. Spending your turn 2 or a coin on turn 1 to just hero power is a pretty bad opening for an arena match now
Trump's free to play decks are built around value and tempo. They'll only be good to around rank 20 or so, but that's true of a lot of much better decks too, if the meta turns against them. Probably the best starter decks are Hunter and Mage because they have a lot of high value basic cards.
Any 2/1 that does a thing is worth picking in Arena.
It used to be that you didn't pick the 2/1s because of the hero powers but nowadays if you play a 2/1 and they kill with hero power, you get to put your 2 mana minion uncontested giving you board initiative.
By that I mean stuff like Abusive Sergeants, Clockwork Gnomes, Leper Gnomes etc. That Murloc 2/1 is still shit.
toddhunter
Member
Kripp talked about this at length today. 1 drops are an absolute must in arena at the moment, so you just pick them.
dip....up...?
accel
Member
Hi there, new player coming (from the Steam thread).
I am looking for some thoughts / have some questions. I like card games. I had a chance to play HS briefly about a year ago, plus I've been watching tournaments and streams, so I know what it's about, etc - I like it.
Yesterday I started my own account. I want to stay F2P (apart from maaaaybe paying for adventures, and that's a big maybe), so I was thinking about whether to play mainly constructed or mainly arenas, and decided to go mainly arenas. I understand I won't get infinite any time soon, but since the break-even point compared to buying packs is just 3/3, that seems reachable - after some time, anyway.
So, questions:
1. What resources would you recommend for learning the arenas? I know about streamers like Ratsmah / Trump / Kripp, I am going to watch them as I grind gold for my initial bank (ideally, I'd like to do an arena run every two days plus a daily every day, I have to stash some gold to keep this going smoothly) - but there is a limit to how useful the streams can be, they are just naturally long, the density of the information isn't great (although there's a lot of entertainment value). Maybe there are some essays / blogs? To my regret, everything written regarding arenas I've been able to find so far was seriously outdated, but I can totally be missing some gems that you know about.
2. I know about sites like heartharena that help you build decks. I guess right now decks built by these sites are going to be much better than decks I'd have built myself, so I am going to use them - but I think it's important to start building decks pretty soon without any external help, because a good player can probably build decks much better than a site can. Am I right? How good are the arena decks built by sites, compared to decks built by seasoned arena players in your opinion - 99% as good / 80% as good / maybe just 50%?
3. Finally, on streams, I saw tools that display your deck and highlight the cards that you have already played - at the side of the screen. Are these custom tools made by / for streamers or are there public tools like that which everyone could use? Are you using any, and if so, which ones?
Thanks a lot. (Ton of salt incoming in the future, guaranteed. I won't disappoint.)
I am looking for some thoughts / have some questions. I like card games. I had a chance to play HS briefly about a year ago, plus I've been watching tournaments and streams, so I know what it's about, etc - I like it.
Yesterday I started my own account. I want to stay F2P (apart from maaaaybe paying for adventures, and that's a big maybe), so I was thinking about whether to play mainly constructed or mainly arenas, and decided to go mainly arenas. I understand I won't get infinite any time soon, but since the break-even point compared to buying packs is just 3/3, that seems reachable - after some time, anyway.
So, questions:
1. What resources would you recommend for learning the arenas? I know about streamers like Ratsmah / Trump / Kripp, I am going to watch them as I grind gold for my initial bank (ideally, I'd like to do an arena run every two days plus a daily every day, I have to stash some gold to keep this going smoothly) - but there is a limit to how useful the streams can be, they are just naturally long, the density of the information isn't great (although there's a lot of entertainment value). Maybe there are some essays / blogs? To my regret, everything written regarding arenas I've been able to find so far was seriously outdated, but I can totally be missing some gems that you know about.
2. I know about sites like heartharena that help you build decks. I guess right now decks built by these sites are going to be much better than decks I'd have built myself, so I am going to use them - but I think it's important to start building decks pretty soon without any external help, because a good player can probably build decks much better than a site can. Am I right? How good are the arena decks built by sites, compared to decks built by seasoned arena players in your opinion - 99% as good / 80% as good / maybe just 50%?
3. Finally, on streams, I saw tools that display your deck and highlight the cards that you have already played - at the side of the screen. Are these custom tools made by / for streamers or are there public tools like that which everyone could use? Are you using any, and if so, which ones?
Thanks a lot. (Ton of salt incoming in the future, guaranteed. I won't disappoint.
)Oil is for finishing the game, not trading. The best Rogue you can draft is aggro-control, where you use Rogue's plethora of tempo options to take the board early, spread spread spread while having the tools to easily deal with a few big drops. Face damage is rarely an issje because by turn 6 you're already pushing for lethal.
Kripp actually has Warrior at 3/4 now and I tend to agree. It plays similar to Rogue except that a low curve is insanely important, on the other hand you get more burn on average mostly through weapons. I've been wrecking Paladins left and right too, sometimes you get outvalued of course but the matchup is not even close to constructed levels of awful. Kripp even said Warrior counters Paladin, I don't think it's a hard counter but on average he could be right.
Hi there, new player coming (from the Steam thread).
I am looking for some thoughts / have some questions. I like card games. I had a chance to play HS briefly about a year ago, plus I've been watching tournaments and streams, so I know what it's about, etc - I like it.
Yesterday I started my own account. I want to stay F2P (apart from maaaaybe paying for adventures, and that's a big maybe), so I was thinking about whether to play mainly constructed or mainly arenas, and decided to go mainly arenas. I understand I won't get infinite any time soon, but since the break-even point compared to buying packs is just 3/3, that seems reachable - after some time, anyway.
So, questions:
1. What resources would you recommend for learning the arenas? I know about streamers like Ratsmah / Trump / Kripp, I am going to watch them as I grind gold for my initial bank (ideally, I'd like to do an arena run every two days plus a daily every day, I have to stash some gold to keep this going smoothly) - but there is a limit to how useful the streams can be, they are just naturally long, the density of the information isn't great (although there's a lot of entertainment value). Maybe there are some essays / blogs? To my regret, everything written regarding arenas I've been able to find so far was seriously outdated, but I can totally be missing some gems that you know about.
2. I know about sites like heartharena that help you build decks. I guess right now decks built by these sites are going to be much better than decks I'd have built myself, so I am going to use them - but I think it's important to start building decks pretty soon without any external help, because a good player can probably build decks much better than a site can. Am I right? How good are the arena decks built by sites, compared to decks built by seasoned arena players in your opinion - 99% as good / 80% as good / maybe just 50%?
3. Finally, on streams, I saw tools that display your deck and highlight the cards that you have already played - at the side of the screen. Are these custom tools made by / for streamers or are there public tools like that which everyone could use? Are you using any, and if so, which ones?
Thanks a lot. (Ton of salt incoming in the future, guaranteed. I won't disappoint.
Hearthstone Deck Tracker is a common UI overlay that keeps track of your played cards and the opponent's hand.
Hi there, new player coming (from the Steam thread).
I am looking for some thoughts / have some questions. I like card games. I had a chance to play HS briefly about a year ago, plus I've been watching tournaments and streams, so I know what it's about, etc - I like it.
Yesterday I started my own account. I want to stay F2P (apart from maaaaybe paying for adventures, and that's a big maybe), so I was thinking about whether to play mainly constructed or mainly arenas, and decided to go mainly arenas. I understand I won't get infinite any time soon, but since the break-even point compared to buying packs is just 3/3, that seems reachable - after some time, anyway.
So, questions:
1. What resources would you recommend for learning the arenas? I know about streamers like Ratsmah / Trump / Kripp, I am going to watch them as I grind gold for my initial bank (ideally, I'd like to do an arena run every two days plus a daily every day, I have to stash some gold to keep this going smoothly) - but there is a limit to how useful the streams can be, they are just naturally long, the density of the information isn't great (although there's a lot of entertainment value). Maybe there are some essays / blogs? To my regret, everything written regarding arenas I've been able to find so far was seriously outdated, but I can totally be missing some gems that you know about.
2. I know about sites like heartharena that help you build decks. I guess right now decks built by these sites are going to be much better than decks I'd have built myself, so I am going to use them - but I think it's important to start building decks pretty soon without any external help, because a good player can probably build decks much better than a site can. Am I right? How good are the arena decks built by sites, compared to decks built by seasoned arena players in your opinion - 99% as good / 80% as good / maybe just 50%?
3. Finally, on streams, I saw tools that display your deck and highlight the cards that you have already played - at the side of the screen. Are these custom tools made by / for streamers or are there public tools like that which everyone could use? Are you using any, and if so, which ones?
Thanks a lot. (Ton of salt incoming in the future, guaranteed. I won't disappoint.
You pretty much figured it out already, arena absolutely is the way to go, both in terms of variety and new player friendliness.
1. Check out Kripp and ADWCTA on Youtube, those give more condensed information on specific topics than just from watching their streams. ADWCTA also writes some nice articles on Hearthstoneplayers.
2. I haven't used Heartharena after LoE but I'll assume that, despite the drama, it's still close to as accurate as it used to be. In that case I'd say its decks are around 80-85% as good as those of an infinite player.
I'll plug ADWCTA again here, especially the "Arena Co-ops" on his channel, where he, his buddy Merps and often another top arena player draft with their tier list open (used to be Heartharena before they split) and discuss where and why their picks differ. It's really insightful, especially when they've got Shadybunny or Hafu over.
3. Hearthstone DeckTracker is the best one, yup