welp, bad card reveal is something, I guess.
reversing the stats could have made it much more usable
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Hearthstone |OT9| Our raid wiped in Icecrown Citadel
- Thread starter ZealousD
- Start date
welp, bad card reveal is something, I guess.
reversing the stats could have made it much more usable
Stats are fine, it's the mana cost that is an issue.
Could be a useful card in token decks, you run your crap minions into their and then refill up. You can think of it like a Soul of the Forest but for 2 mana you get 5/3. Obviously the Ghoul condition is harder to meet but board states can be set up well for it.
If you get 2 ghouls from it then the card did its job, beyond that is insane territory.
Could be a useful card in token decks, you run your crap minions into their and then refill up. You can think of it like a Soul of the Forest but for 2 mana you get 5/3. Obviously the Ghoul condition is harder to meet but board states can be set up well for it.
If you get 2 ghouls from it then the card did its job, beyond that is insane territory.
A 9 mana combo to generate 6 2/2 minions? Does hunter usually stay alive that long in arena?
Seems pretty bad, you have to punch in at least 2 of your minions to get any value from it and your board will still die to most AOE effects. Would probably be a win more card if there's ever a situation where it's useful. Cult Master has a better effect for 2 less mana, and it still barely sees play in constructed.
Karsticles
Member
You don't know what an ad hominem is if you think I've been committing them, lol.
I want the game to change all the time, but deleting a deck archetype isn't cool with me. How would you feel if Blizzard decided that Warriors really "shouldn't be playing control" all of a sudden?
By all means, stop responding to me. You have the same ridiculous habit you used to where you are obsessed with arguing with anyone about anything even if it doesn't involve you.
I think this kind of like Living Mana. Living Mana, for 6, gives you six 2/2 minions, but you also lose ALL of your mana crystals and spells like Devolve lose you the game. If you have a decent-sized board, this could give you a comparable board for 6 mana. I don't think it will see a lot of play, but it isn't a bad card.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
You have no insight and your commentary is frequently called out as erroneous in threads like these. Being tired of your ill-considered and ignorant rudeness isn't stanning, lol
It's basically soul of the forest attached to an aggressive body.
Just too expensive.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Name any 6 mana minion that is run in zoo?
Karsticles
Member
That's funny, I was thinking this all applies to you.
When people here are critical of Hearthstone balance you consistently pull this magical thinking nonsense. "Oh, there's a deeper process you're not aware of - just wait and see!" - and it never comes to fruition. I can actually back up what I say with reasons and explanations, but you have never once, on a single occasion, given more than "Nu uh you're wrong and everything Blizzard does is great!" I've talked with enough people 1 on 1 about how hard you stan to be confident in what I say. It's T_D levels of revolting devotion.
If there IS a problem with Dreadsteed from a balance perspective with the current card set, then Blizzard is failing as a communicator. The current reasoning that was given is that Dreadsteed breaks the game with the newly revealed card, and that has clearly shown to be bullshit. It is simply impossible to disagree with this upon the Grim Patron revelation coming forth.
But seriously, if you don't like what I say, then feel free to block me or ignore me. You're not obligated to whine about every call-out I make about something dumb, lazy - and in this case, also dishonest, that Blizzard does. I'd rather you not muck up honest discussion here, anyway.
Soul of the Forest has been falling out of play in Wild Egg Druid, though. I think that's why it might not see play. Why play a card for 6 mana that requires you to HAVE a board when you can play a card for 6 mana that GIVES you a board? Of course, other decks might enjoy this card. Maybe it could help bring back Zoolock? Eh...
One thing that Egg Druid has consistently demonstrated to me is how weak a bunch of 2/2s are in the midgame. So many things wipe them, and you usually lose half of them to a decently-sized taunt. For example, if I play Living Mana at 7 mana, my opponent can play a 5/10 taunt. I lose 5 out of 7 of my guys killing that single minion, AND I basically had to skip a turn because I had no active mana to work with.
Well, Dr. Boom used to be standard at 7. Depending on your board state, a 5/3 for 6 that gives all of your minions a deathrattle to become 2/2s is similar-ish to the value Dr. Boom provides (mana-relative).
I think it's cool how Blizzard has been able to avoid this expansion being a Naxx Redux.
This is also true. I just went through the 6-drop list, and the closest thing to a card worth playing at all in a Zoolock list is Cairne, and he's too low value and tempo without N'Zoth these days (even then, most decks seem to skip him).
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
The minute they get one worth running.
Argent commander used to be ran in some zoo decks btw.
cartographer
Member
I really like this. I can't see myself putting this into any of the decks I play but I like the "when your minion dies" effects and it's something to play around at least.
Take your own advice and ignore him then. Or just keep being rude and telling people to ignore you if they don't like it. Super mature response.
SonicXtreme
Member
i like soul of the forest in wild; i use a deck that focuses on the wide board mostly with dragons egg, fireflies, and creepers, and my thing about egg druid is your board can't be too sticky in wild. slamming out a wide board and innervating SOTF early to sometimes even make double death rattles makes your board borderline invincible, otherwise i get pissed when a late game AOE basically shuts down my entire game, or shaman gets me with all the cheap early AOEs
its only for the deathrattles and stickyness tho i wouldn't consider that new card, but it could be nice for ppl who are deck building on a budget. i wanted to build a token druid for my new friend but living mana is 800 dust for two that makes it rough for them
its only for the deathrattles and stickyness tho i wouldn't consider that new card, but it could be nice for ppl who are deck building on a budget. i wanted to build a token druid for my new friend but living mana is 800 dust for two that makes it rough for them
Arena usually lasts a few more turns than the average constructed game. Minion quality is lower and there's a lot more trading than Hunter would normally be comfortable with. So yeah, Hunter can easily get to 9 turns..
Karsticles
Member
Look, I pointed to how Blizzard was clearly LYING about why Dreadsteed got changed, and if someone tells me I'm ignorant for pointing out the obvious I'm not going to leave that be. I'm not the antagonist here - that's why I'm letting HIM know that he doesn't have to go out of his way to attack me for pointing out simple facts.
Don't butt into a conversation you don't even understand.
Living Mana has to be among the most powerful cards in the game right now.
Your overstatted aggro card went 1 to 1 with a board clear... that's a great trade in most cases when aggro decks can lose 2-3 cards easily on a board wipe.
Half of them used to kill taunt? So that means that the card basically went 2 for 1 despite being an aggro card. Again proving how strong it is.
Living Mana against Ancient of War? So a 5 mana card competes against a 7 mana card (which is one of the best 7 mana cards in the game since the beginning of the game)... right.
This card is the ultimate "I am in top dick mode and I have no board, time to throw this down" comeback card. You lose the board hard early on then you get it back. The opponent still has to respect it because in two turns a Savage Roar could be lethal, you just can't let a bunch of 2/2s sit on the Aggro Druids board.
If they cleared all of your board and then had a board wipe remaining for your 2/2s then you probably deserved to lose that game anyway. No class has access to that big of a comeback tool.
Your overstatted aggro card went 1 to 1 with a board clear... that's a great trade in most cases when aggro decks can lose 2-3 cards easily on a board wipe.
Half of them used to kill taunt? So that means that the card basically went 2 for 1 despite being an aggro card. Again proving how strong it is.
Living Mana against Ancient of War? So a 5 mana card competes against a 7 mana card (which is one of the best 7 mana cards in the game since the beginning of the game)... right.
This card is the ultimate "I am in top dick mode and I have no board, time to throw this down" comeback card. You lose the board hard early on then you get it back. The opponent still has to respect it because in two turns a Savage Roar could be lethal, you just can't let a bunch of 2/2s sit on the Aggro Druids board.
If they cleared all of your board and then had a board wipe remaining for your 2/2s then you probably deserved to lose that game anyway. No class has access to that big of a comeback tool.
cartographer
Member
I followed the conversation, don't you worry about that.
You are absolutely the one continually antagonizing people, by the way. Blizzard and TankUp at this point. Calling people and teams lazy and incompetent isn't you being some noble truth teller. It's just you being rude.
Dude, calm down.
And what's this about Blizzard lying about why they changed Dreadsteed?
Karsticles
Member
I was more using Living Mana as an evaluation tool to gauge how useful getting 2/2s from the reveal card might be. Living Mana is undoubtedly a top tier card - I crafted both of mine and haven't regretted it yet. It has won me a ton of matches, and it's a big contributor to the typical Wild deck having to stack board clears.
Blizzard isn't "people", rofl. No, TankUp went out of his way to try and tell me I just hate "changes" - an enormous straw man.
Blizzard is being lazy and incompetent with this change. Just like they are cheap about the Patches problem, and they were cheap and lazy about Mysterious Challenger pre-Wild, and so on! It's not hard to see unless you're trying not to!
If I make a post about how Blizzard is deleting my favorite card and deck, no one has to go after me for that. I'm not antagonizing anyone but a fucking vague representation of a company. Anyone who tries to attack me for not being happy about my card getting ruined is the antagonist.
1) Blizzard claimed they had to change Dreadsteed because Dreadsteed caused Defile to loop endlessly and break the game.
2) Someone on Reddit made a thread saying that Grim Patron and Defile will break the game in certain situations, too, so they would have to change Grim Patron.
3) A Blizzard representative posted on Reddit and said that they programmed a casting limit to Defile so the Grim Patron interaction won't break the game.
4) But 3) invalidates the argument given in 1) - if there's a casting limit, then Dreadsteed wouldn't break the game, so Blizzard is being dishonest.
These are just simple facts and reasoning being put together, and instead of trying to say anything intelligent Chympocalpse does his usual gaslighting strategy.
Why should I pretend there aren't problems where problems exist?
If you want me to just call them deceitful, then fair enough!
SonicXtreme
Member
being able to use mark of the lotus , the most mana efficient board buff in the game, the next turn no matter what is insane too. +7/7 for 1 mana, goodbye
Mobius and pet octopus
Member
What is interesting is that if you actually manage to get it to live a turn, those 2/2 minions... when they die they become 2/2 minions again. RIP warsong commander.
cartographer
Member
And you don't have to call them lazy and incompetent. Get a grip.
One of the reasons why warsong commander needed that nerf.
(More like nuke out of the stratosphere)
Same as dreadsteed. Problematic card all around.
Karsticles
Member
Overload is specifically a Shaman mechanic - part of class design. They would never put it on a neutral card.
You know, I said I wasn't going to finish off the legend push this season but I decided to return to the controlling elemental shaman list I was playing previously. Performed very well after some more optimization. Placed ~1500 and my peak was ~450. Fun deck to play! Here's the list and stats after hitting legend:
Patches should only come out after you attack with a pirate. That would prevent him from coming out on turn 1 in most cases, because the opponent would have time to kill the pirate before it can attack. Would also prevent him from being played in every single aggro deck. This probably will never happen though, at this point Blizzard seems content with Pirate Warrior being top tier forever.
You've jumped the gun and you're being a bit of a dick about it. Consider the following.
1.) Blizzard is changing Dreadsteed now rather than at some other point in time. This is the first wild card they've ever nerfed. If the interaction with Defile isn't at least a contributing factor in why they're changing the card then the timing would seem odd.
2.) You haven't provided any sort of motive for why Blizzard would lie about the Dreadsteed nerf. You've simply assumed the worst from Blizzard rather than recognizing them as people who have reasons for why they do things.
So, even though you said it was simply impossible to disagree, I am going to disagree. And here's why.
The way that defile breaks with Dreadsteed is different from the way it breaks with Grim Patron.
1.) Defile enters into a loop with Dreadsteed any time defile is played when there is a Dreadsteed on the board.
2.) Defile only enters into an infinite loop with Grim Patron in the very specific instance where there are Grim Patrons with 3, 2, and 1 hp on the board at the same time. This is harder to set up and far less common than "Dreadsteed on the board".
3.) Dreadsteed is usually put into decks where people try to create full boards of Dreadsteeds. So compare those two loops. A single defile loop with a full board of Dreadsteeds will involve every Dreadsteed dying and having to play their respawn animation. Double that nonsense if it's a Dreadsteed vs Priest matchup where both players have full boards of Dreadsteeds. A single defile loop with Grim Patron will usually only get to a point where a single Grim Patron is spawned each turn. So the Grim Patron loop goes much faster and involves fewer animations.
So Blizz does a risk assessment (didn't have to be super formal) that says "okay, we know Defile breaks every single time with Dreadsteed and it breaks hard. Lots of animations, very long turns. It can break with Grim Patron but only in very specific circumstances. We can cap the number of casts on defile to some reasonable number as a measure against Grim Patron and other possible unforseen circumstances but even if we do that the interaction with Dreadsteed would be far more common and annoying. Let's go ahead and change Dreadsteed to be safe."
Patches only does 1 damage to face if he doesn't trade, his real strength is building up your board and killing early game minions to preserve your board.
Yes exactly. I use him because I can trade early with it and because it's 1 less card to draw when using the warlock hero power (I still mainly use warlock). Changing it to "can't attack heroes when summoned" wouldn't affect it much, would it?
I'm saying that it isn't a big enough nerf. He shouldn't fit in every single deck that is even somewhat aggressive.
Nice! I made it to rank 10 earlier this week too with my highlander/quest shadowpriest deck. Honestly i'm surprised I got this far, I'll try to get to 5 before the reset but I doubt it. Oh well I'm having fun anyway
So they're revisiting the Master Swordsmith mechanic, but this actually looks pretty damn good. That's a lot of stats it puts out on the turn you play it plus it's a recurring threat that can continue to add more power onto the board if your opponent leaves it alone.
I wouldn't say it's as good as Bonemare but this is still pushing the power level on midrange minions really hard.
I wouldn't say it's as good as Bonemare but this is still pushing the power level on midrange minions really hard.
New Analyze the pros episode from Jambre. He is mixing it up and only doing analysis on one player's perspective. Makes sense as it is a longer game and the video is fairly long already.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OS2cnrQV3Vs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OS2cnrQV3Vs
So Dragon priest plays this on 5 (and Priest has so many high health minions there's probably a target for its buff) and curves into Operative on 6. A solid replacement for Azure Drake in that deck, and more dragons means more consistency.
I was hoping Dragon Priest wouldn't get support because Drakonid is such a terrible card to play against, but this seems like a buff to that archetype.
It's also just a nicely statted minion that could fit into a lot of decks that don't care about Dragon synergy (or only care because of Curator) and the five slot is pretty flex in a lot of lists since Azure rotated.
Neat Card. I think it's pretty good. Going to likely be Arena cancer. Blizard seems to actually be printing quite a few strong neutrals this expansion.
SonicXtreme
Member
thats sik for wild kazreno dragon priest it can always use another dragon
nice that its a common for ppl too since most dragons r expensive
nice that its a common for ppl too since most dragons r expensive
Reupload since I can't see Twitter images:
Revealed by Jupanda and reniehour. Reference: http://www.hearthpwn.com/news/3100-new-card-revealed-cobalt-scalebane
I agree it looks quite strong with the likes of Tar Creeper. Can this be the free card for everyone like Volcanosaur last expansion, please?
Already seeing people theory-craft Dragon Mage because Sindragosa is the only Mage class dragon which means you have a very high chance of discovering her off of Netherspite Historian. If that deck is a real deck, this card would see play there just as a dragon synergy activator.
I don't think extra copies of a win-more legendary is a good enough reason to craft your whole deck around that idea, but hey, maybe there are more dragons to come.
I don't think extra copies of a win-more legendary is a good enough reason to craft your whole deck around that idea, but hey, maybe there are more dragons to come.
Too slow. Pirate Warrior loses board by the midgame so the effect is a non issue.