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Hearthstone |OT9| Our raid wiped in Icecrown Citadel

R

RedZaraki

Banned
Here's how to fix Hearthstone:

Innervate -> Wild
Jade Idol -> 3 mana

Take the word "Random", never print it on a card again.

Easy peasy.
 
H

Hycran

Banned
Got a golden tinkmaster overspark from my brawl pack, and 100 free dust for a bloodknight. Good days work.

Take the word "Random", never print it on a card again.
Click to expand...

This is a bad idea. Making it not random at all just makes it a magic ripoff. The digital space has flexibility for this mechanic and it should be in the game. As Reynad has said though, it shouldn't be at a low level as it often determine the outcome of games. The new priest spell which is 6 mana is a good example of randomness done right. You can high roll or low roll, but it doesnt determine the fate of the game and gives players plenty of time to counteract it.
 
F

Familienoberhauptvogel

Banned
Hycran said:
This is a bad idea. Making it not random at all just makes it a magic ripoff. The digital space has flexibility for this mechanic and it should be in the game. As Reynad has said though, it shouldn't be at a low level as it often determine the outcome of games. The new priest spell which is 6 mana is a good example of randomness done right. You can high roll or low roll, but it doesnt determine the fate of the game and gives players plenty of time to counteract it.
Click to expand...

Terrible example.
 
C

cartographer

Member
Hycran said:
Got a golden tinkmaster overspark from my brawl pack, and 100 free dust for a bloodknight. Good days work.



This is a bad idea. Making it not random at all just makes it a magic ripoff. The digital space has flexibility for this mechanic and it should be in the game. As Reynad has said though, it shouldn't be at a low level as it often determine the outcome of games. The new priest spell which is 6 mana is a good example of randomness done right. You can high roll or low roll, but it doesnt determine the fate of the game and gives players plenty of time to counteract it.
Click to expand...
Definitely chose the wrong spell to try to make a point.
 
T

Tomcat

Member
Got legend in wild with out even trying. Jade druid got me to rank 1 with a 12-1 streak. Too much aggro made me use aggro druid to finish the job.
 
H

Hycran

Banned
Familienoberhauptvogel said:
Terrible example.
Click to expand...

cartographer said:
Definitely chose the wrong spell to try to make a point.
Click to expand...

I'd say its the perfect example. The variance is so high that some people will be dissuaded from using it. The time it takes to cast the spell is lengthened from something with high variance like madder bomber. It has a variety of outcomes (getting a statute is good, barnes is bad, priest of the feast in the middle)

I'm not going to take any heat for late game random cards being far more acceptable than early game random cards. If anything, lack of randomness should probably be blamed for some of the issues the game is having, given that there is nothing random about the top decks and they are far too good.
 
F

Familienoberhauptvogel

Banned
Hycran said:
I'd say its the perfect example. The variance is so high that some people will be dissuaded from using it. The time it takes to cast the spell is lengthened from something with high variance like madder bomber. It has a variety of outcomes (getting a statute is good, barnes is bad, priest of the feast in the middle)

I'm not going to take any heat for late game random cards being far more acceptable than early game random cards. If anything, lack of randomness should probably be blamed for some of the issues the game is having, given that there is nothing random about the top decks and they are far too good.
Click to expand...
The variance is determined by you with that card is why it's a bad example. In the deck it sees actual play it has like a 2/3rds hit rate.
 
S

Sande

Member
Terrible day of Hearthstone. Everyone who isn't still playing jade druid has gone back to aggro apparently. The few days of warlock and co. sure were nice.

I don't know if I can stand this meta.
 
Arjen

Arjen

Member
Made a quest dragon priest, that new deathrattle dragon synergizes very well, also dragon op into mage DK is pretty bonkers.
 
H

Hycran

Banned
Familienoberhauptvogel said:
The variance is determined by you with that card is why it's a bad example. In the deck it sees actual play it has like a 2/3rds hit rate.
Click to expand...

So randomness that you can control is a bad thing? Would you prefer every random effect to be like madder bomber? The trade off is that you can only have a few strong minions in your deck. In classes with hard removal like rogue, that means you stand no chance. Once again, i fail to see how this is a bad thing.
 
T

The Mango Sentinel

Member
Anyone with Kun the Forgotten King, how much use do you get out of him right now? Is just nice to have as an additional win condition or does it feel like a necessary part of the deck like Fandral?

I have enough dust for 4 legendary's and I'm on the fence about him.
 
W

wiibomb

Member
The Mango Sentinel said:
Anyone with Kun the Forgotten King, how much use do you get out of him right now? Is just nice to have as an additional win condition or does it feel like a necessary part of the deck like Fandral?

I have enough dust for 4 legendary's and I'm on the fence about him.
Click to expand...

as a person who has played a ton of jade druid, I can say that I can perfectly win without it.
 
T

TankUP

Member
The Mango Sentinel said:
Anyone with Kun the Forgotten King, how much use do you get out of him right now? Is just nice to have as an additional win condition or does it feel like a necessary part of the deck like Fandral?
Click to expand...

There are two reasons to run KUN. There is the tempo of playing a 7/7 and UI or a bunch of jade cards on the same turn. There's also the option to gain armor, which is sometimes relevant now that Druids have cut feral rage and earthen scales.

I don't think it's a "must-have", but KUN is very good in the mirror where you have to have tempo to win.
 
M

Mobius and pet octopus

Member
Lyng said:
I play several who are much more strategic. Star Wars LCG, Netrunner, Dominion, Arctic Scavengers, Gwent, heck even mtg is much less random than hearthstone. So maybe I should ask you how many card games you play.
Click to expand...

I wasn't being that serious. But if you want more "deterministic" games, card games are not where it's at.
 
L

Lyng

Member
Mobius and pet octopus said:
I wasn't being that serious. But if you want more "deterministic" games, card games are not where it's at.
Click to expand...

More determanistic than hearthstone at the moment. Random draws is part of card games and I don't mind that, but the idea of magically pulling an answer out of a hat that you didn't even have in your deck is too much for my taste.
 
T

The Mango Sentinel

Member
wiibomb said:
as a person who has played a ton of jade druid, I can say that I can perfectly win without it.
Click to expand...

TankUP said:
There are two reasons to run KUN. There is the tempo of playing a 7/7 and UI or a bunch of jade cards on the same turn. There's also the option to gain armor, which is sometimes relevant now that Druids have cut feral rage and earthen scales.

I don't think it's a "must-have", but KUN is very good in the mirror where you have to have tempo to win.
Click to expand...

Ok thanks. I think I'll hold off for the moment because I'm looking to craft Lyra, Raza, Y'shaarj, and Lich King or maybe Wickerflame
 
F

Familienoberhauptvogel

Banned
Hycran said:
So randomness that you can control is a bad thing? Would you prefer every random effect to be like madder bomber? The trade off is that you can only have a few strong minions in your deck. In classes with hard removal like rogue, that means you stand no chance. Once again, i fail to see how this is a bad thing.
Click to expand...
Anything that has odds better than the flip of a coin has no place in discussions about RNG, that's better odds than to start the game or go second.

Rogue has no trouble killing the first lich king or the second or the third, the 4th becomes an issue and that's not speaking of the other threats these decks run.

Not to mention that miracle rogue runs a limited amount of threats and big priest isn't filling their deck with card draw but ALL the removal.
 
N

Nirolak

Mrgrgr
M

Mobius and pet octopus

Member
Lyng said:
More determanistic than hearthstone at the moment. Random draws is part of card games and I don't mind that, but the idea of magically pulling an answer out of a hat that you didn't even have in your deck is too much for my taste.
Click to expand...

To be fair, and this comes with downsides and upsides, hearthstone is really consistent in a lot of areas where they try to reduce by having more RNG affects on cards. I am talking about 30 card decks, no lands/resource management because it's all done automatically, and the bane of this is curve stone of course and the problem with RNG cards is being too much and it feels bad. Also mulligans being card by card make for a lot more consistent opens compared to other card games, like MTG.

They walk a delicate line imo. Sometimes they step over it. Right now, I don't think RNG is a problem, I think the curvestone is a bigger issue.

I think gwent has the curvestone problem, not that they curve out or anything, but at least too consistent gameplay wise leads to repetitive scenarios too often. That was my criticism of that game at least when I played it.
 
L

Lyng

Member
Mobius and pet octopus said:
To be fair, and this comes with downsides and upsides, hearthstone is really consistent in a lot of areas where they try to reduce by having more RNG affects on cards. I am talking about 30 card decks, no lands/resource management because it's all done automatically, and the bane of this is curve stone of course and the problem with RNG cards is being too much and it feels bad. Also mulligans being card by card make for a lot more consistent opens compared to other card games, like MTG.

They walk a delicate line imo. Sometimes they step over it. Right now, I don't think RNG is a problem, I think the curvestone is a bigger issue.

I think gwent has the curvestone problem, not that they curve out or anything, but at least too consistent gameplay wise leads to repetitive scenarios too often. That was my criticism of that game at least when I played it.
Click to expand...

This I agree with. Curvestone would be horrible to have again. I do think that some cards are too swingy though. Maybe removing secrets from the cards that generate spells? This would prevent the "endless" ice block issue for example.
 
T

TankUP

Member
I played against a Jade Druid today at rank 7 wild who was still running the old "Cycle" Jade Druid list with none of the new cards. So Auctioneers, moonfires, Wild Pyromancers, Acolyte of Pain, feral rage, earthen scales--the idea is to draw your whole deck and go off with Auctioneer into infinite jades after you're "out" of cards.

The only problem is, the guy obviously wasn't running a deck tracker because he used his second jade idol to summon a jade instead of shuffling. I could tell he thought he still had an idol because he when he had only one card left in his deck, he played Wild Growth into Excess Mana to draw it--not a play you'd make if you knew you had no jade idols.

So, he's at fatigue vs a full health Shadowreaper Priest and his hand is pretty much all draw. He conceded pretty quick after that. I tried to add him to recommend he get a deck tracker but for some reason he wouldn't accept my friend request. ;)
 
O

Owzers

Member
Death knights should have been rewards alongside Arthas hero portrait for beating the Lich King. It shows the player turning into the death knight when you win each class. the cost of the expansion to get the knights is ridiculous...

Anyway, I was glad to beat the warrior vs Lich King, I kept failing with iffy decks until I came across the scaled dragon, lawyer taunt guy, thuzad cheese broken one, easy win and some relief.
 
T

The Mango Sentinel

Member
TankUP said:
I played against a Jade Druid today at rank 7 wild who was still running the old "Cycle" Jade Druid list with none of the new cards. So Auctioneers, moonfires, Wild Pyromancers, Acolyte of Pain, feral rage, earthen scales--the idea is to draw your whole deck and go off with Auctioneer into infinite jades after you're "out" of cards.

The only problem is, the guy obviously wasn't running a deck tracker because he used his second jade idol to summon a jade instead of shuffling. I could tell he thought he still had an idol because he when he had only one card left in his deck, he played Wild Growth into Excess Mana to draw it--not a play you'd make if you knew you had no jade idols.

So, he's at fatigue vs a full health Shadowreaper Priest and his hand is pretty much all draw. He conceded pretty quick after that. I tried to add him to recommend he get a deck tracker but for some reason he wouldn't accept my friend request. ;)
Click to expand...
Damn I wish I could use a deck tracker. I wonder if that would increase my win percentage. I mean I'm pretty decent at keeping track in my head, but it's a pain in the ass sometimes.
 
B

Blues1990

Member
I play a lot of Magic The Gathering, and I was wondering if there are Hearthstone equivalents to Aggro, Burn, or Token decks? I kind of created a Token deck for the Paladin, and it's okay, but I would love to hear any recommendations from you guys.
 
G

gutshot

Member
Blues1990 said:
I play a lot of Magic The Gathering, and I was wondering if there are Hearthstone equivalents to Aggro, Burn, or Token decks? I kind of created a Token deck for the Paladin, and it's okay, but I would love to hear any recommendations from you guys.
Click to expand...

Yes. They are generally some of the best decks in the game. Token Druid, Token Shaman, Pirate Warrior, Burn Mage are all decent to very strong decks right now.
 
Y

Yaboosh

Super Sleuth
gutshot said:
Yes. They are generally some of the best decks in the game. Token Druid, Token Shaman, Pirate Warrior, Burn Mage are all decent to very strong decks right now.
Click to expand...


Burn mage seems largely dead. The win condition of control/freeze mages at this point are Frost Lich grinding.
 
Z

ZeroX03

Banned
Tomcat said:
Got legend in wild with out even trying. Jade druid got me to rank 1 with a 12-1 streak. Too much aggro made me use aggro druid to finish the job.
Click to expand...

What's the aggro deck difference in wild?

Hit rank 5 in standard using primarily aggro Druid, something I haven't done in like a year because I tend to forget the end of the month is coming.

traveler said:
I was responding to the implication that a lack of rng is somehow catering to casuals.

I've never played VS and don't have any opinion on it. For all I know, it was as great a game as you suggest.
Click to expand...

That wasn't the implication. VS System's issue was the opposite. It had very little RNG, was extremely hard to play and one card shifted the meta so you could make complex decks that were very consistent. Made it so the best players always won and there was very little variance. Throw in that the most popular decks usually didn't involve the popular DC/Marvel characters (something they tried to change later on and with the new game) and it really had trouble staying alive when it was a purely high level competitive game.
 
K

Keyser Soze

Member
ZeroX03 said:
What's the aggro deck difference in wild?
Click to expand...

Murloc Druid is obscene in Wild IMO. I have had nightmares about it.


  • # 2x (0) Innervate
  • # 2x (1) Bloodsail Corsair
  • # 2x (1) Fire Fly
  • # 2x (1) Living Roots
  • # 2x (1) Mark of the Lotus
  • # 2x (1) Murloc Tidecaller
  • # 1x (1) Patches the Pirate
  • # 1x (1) Sir Finley Mrrgglton
  • # 2x (2) Murloc Tidehunter
  • # 2x (2) Power of the Wild
  • # 2x (2) Rockpool Hunter
  • # 2x (3) Murloc Warleader
  • # 2x (3) Savage Roar
  • # 2x (4) Gentle Megasaur
  • # 2x (4) Jeeves
  • # 1x (4) Old Murk-Eye
  • # 1x (5) Finja, the Flying Star
Code: 
AAEBAZICBOAFhBeRvALjvgIN/gHbA/cD5gXQB+UHpwiOEOgVzbsCncICscIC68ICAA==
 
T

Tomcat

Member
ZeroX03 said:
What's the aggro deck difference in wild?

Hit rank 5 in standard using primarily aggro Druid, something I haven't done in like a year because I tend to forget the end of the month is coming.



That wasn't the implication. VS System's issue was the opposite. It had very little RNG, was extremely hard to play and one card shifted the meta so you could make complex decks that were very consistent. Made it so the best players always won and there was very little variance. Throw in that the most popular decks usually didn't involve the popular DC/Marvel characters (something they tried to change later on and with the new game) and it really had trouble staying alive when it was a purely high level competitive game.
Click to expand...

### Wild Egg Druid
# Class: Druid
# Format: Wild
# Year of the Mammoth
#
# 2x (0) Innervate
# 2x (1) Bloodsail Corsair
# 2x (1) Enchanted Raven
# 2x (1) Fire Fly
# 2x (1) Living Roots
# 2x (1) Mark of the Lotus
# 1x (1) Patches the Pirate
# 1x (1) Sir Finley Mrrgglton
# 2x (2) Golakka Crawler
# 2x (2) Haunted Creeper
# 2x (2) Mark of Y'Shaarj
# 2x (2) Power of the Wild
# 1x (3) Crypt Lord
# 2x (3) Savage Roar
# 2x (4) Jeeves
# 1x (4) Soul of the Forest
# 2x (5) Living Mana
#
AAEBAZICBP0ChBeRvAKR0AIN/gH3A+YF5Qf1DY4Q6BXBqwK2swLNuwKGwQLkwgLrwgIA
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
# Generated by HDT - https://hsdecktracker.net
 
K

Keyser Soze

Member
Pali is still king in this Brawl. It feels like you are doing so much in one turn so the FTK feels impressive. Druid is mostly just powering up your own face, which is great, but feels a bit less spectacular.

The best I got was 48 Turn 1 Damage with a windfury boar
 
W

wiibomb

Member
Keyser Soze said:
Pali is still king in this Brawl. It feels like you are doing so much in one turn so the FTK feels impressive. Druid is mostly just powering up your own face, which is great, but feels a bit less spectacular.

The best I got was 48 Turn 1 Damage with a windfury boar
Click to expand...

which is the OTK for paladin?

because druid just needs a single draw of any of its draw cards and it wins on the spot.
 
K

Keyser Soze

Member
wiibomb said:
which is the OTK for paladin?

because druid just needs a single draw of any of its draw cards and it wins on the spot.
Click to expand...
You just buff the hell of out one of your charge minions and hope for the best. Lots of the spells have draw, so that help. You are mostly looking for Lay on Hands or Divine Favor for the big draw. Small-Time Recruits helps thin the deck to achieve the OTK.


  • # 2x (1) Adaptation
  • # 2x (1) Blessing of Might
  • # 1x (1) Patches the Pirate
  • # 2x (1) Stonetusk Boar
  • # 2x (2) Dark Conviction
  • # 2x (2) Holy Light
  • # 2x (3) Divine Favor
  • # 1x (3) Small-Time Recruits
  • # 2x (4) Blessing of Kings
  • # 2x (4) Hammer of Wrath
  • # 2x (4) Silvermoon Portal
  • # 2x (5) Blessed Champion
  • # 2x (5) Holy Wrath
  • # 2x (6) Avenging Wrath
  • # 2x (8) Dinosize
  • # 2x (8) Lay on Hands
Code: 
AAECAaToAgKRvAK6vQIORvoBowKzA9IEiAWnBa8HlgnyC6S2AqrBAtjHAuXLAgA=
 
T

Triz

Member
Today marks the day I triggered "The Ancient One" in Arena. Mage with Blood of the Ancients and a Molten Reflection that came up after in the draft. Opponent did not have removal at 0-0. Feels good man.
 
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