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[Red Scarlet]

You said 20+ years and all the games I mentioned are within the grand scheme of things, more recent than not. With more money being pumped into developing high production games, narrative is becoming more intense than ever.

The point is relatability is important, and people can relate on gender more than they can even relate to race.

I would much rather play as a male of any race than a female of my own race. It’s not even close.

Give me Marcus, Dom, Cole, Kim, whoever from Gears over Kait. I don’t even think about the ethnicity, I just think about how I’m playing as some cool, badass dude. Not so with a female… the only thing that goes through my head is, yeah, this is bullshit.

1-Narrative has hardly mattered in games. Other media has always been better overall.

2-Relatability is important if you have some inferiority complex. Did you play NES games? SNES/Genesis games? You played as who you were or you didn't play, and that would've been a laughable reason.

3-Ok that's great. Not everyone thinks like you now, or ever has. It's a crutch you have.

4-Sounds like you find being a female character emasculates you.

Ewww cooties!

 

[FalconPunch]

1-Narrative has hardly mattered in games. Other media has always been better overall.

This hasn't been true since the ps360 gen.

2-Relatability is important if you have some inferiority complex. Did you play NES games? SNES/Genesis games? You played as who you were or you didn't play, and that would've been a laughable reason.

Back to your predictable tactic of personal attacks. The playbook is so obvious that it's tiring to read. At least try and innovate or disguise you're personal attacks in a clever way.

3-Ok that's great. Not everyone thinks like you now, or ever has. It's a crutch you have.

The irony is palpable

4-Sounds like you find being a female character emasculates you.

Refence the comments made for point 2. Exactly the same garbage

Ewww cooties!

Now we're devolving to elementary school levels of intellect. Impressive.

 

[DoubleClutch]

This hasn't been true since the ps360 gen.

Back to your predictable tactic of personal attacks. The playbook is so obvious that it's tiring to read. At least try and innovate or disguise you're personal attacks in a clever way.

The irony is palpable

Refence the comments made for point 2. Exactly the same garbage

Now we're devolving to elementary school levels of intellect. Impressive.

I was going to reply but I couldn’t do a better job than you already did. Exactly that on all accounts.

 

[Red Scarlet]

This hasn't been true since the ps360 gen.

Back to your predictable tactic of personal attacks. The playbook is so obvious that it's tiring to read. At least try and innovate or disguise you're personal attacks in a clever way.

The irony is palpable

Refence the comments made for point 2. Exactly the same garbage

Now we're devolving to elementary school levels of intellect. Impressive.

Why? What amazing narrative games came out on the PS3/360?

You're just trying to bait me. I've been on this forum for almost 20 years and know better. Neither of you guys are worth anyone's time.

 

[Kacho]

Look what you did, F FalconPunch , he 404 errored out

 

[FalconPunch]

Why? What amazing narrative games came out on the PS3/360?

You're just trying to bait me. I've been on this forum for almost 20 years and know better. Neither of you guys are worth anyone's time.

Just gracefully bow out of this argument. You're doing a very poor job of representing yourself. Personally, I'd hope that someone who's been here for 20 years would be able to discuss a topic with proper etiquette. I would hope that there would be a certain level of maturity when engaging in discussions. Personally, I'm disappointed at the arguments you've put forward while being a 20 year veteran on here. You can disagree and do so respectfully. You don't need to resort to personal attacks or inflammatory terms to convey your point.

 

[DoubleClutch]

Look what you did, F FalconPunch , he 404 errored out

Are you saying… he FalconPunched him/her?

 

[Senua]

I've been on this forum for almost 20 years and know better.

 

[Duchess]

Don't mind playing as female characters.

If they're cute or hot (or both), then not only do I get to enjoy a great game, I get to stare at a beautiful woman for the duration. That's a win in my books.

 

[Big Baller]

you got it fam

 

[winjer]

My generation grew up with female characters such as Sarah Connor and Ripley. And because these are well written and developed characters, we never cared about them being women. They were just great, cool characters.
In recent years, female characters, both in games and movies, are under developed, shallow, obnoxious, characters. So no wonder there are so many people now hating female leads.
But it's not because they are women, but rather because they are poorly written. So people can't relate to them.

 

[V1LÆM]

No boobs no buy

 

[Nickolaidas]

I agree. If I have the option of playing as a male, I'll play as a male. I don't remember if I EVER chose a female over a male in a 'create your character' situation. Sure, I love looking at Eve's ass and her boobs because she's attractive, and sure, I'll play as a female if there is no option, but if there IS, I'll always choose the male.

There are some situations where I'll pick both - like in Resident Evil 2 because I want to see the story with both characters. I guess where story is involved, I am far more willing to play ALSO as a female, even if there are two options.

But in a game where you create a character and your character doesn't affect the story in the slightest? I will ALWAYS pick a male. I never made a female character in a Souls game, for example. Never.

 

[GymWolf]

Almost nothing against them, some of my goty and gotg have a female protagonist.

Of course a male protagonist is gonna be more relatable but if the character is decently written i don't really give much fucks.

Most of my favourite vg characters are males tho.

 

[PeteBull]

a preference is one thing- you've played a lot of games.

this guy outright dislikes female protagonists and thinks that many fun games would be unfun if a simple gender swap were made. Pretty sure he couldn't stand to touch any of the games you listed.

on GAF? really?

Preference can also mean he just wants to play as that and nothing else, gay guys prefer men, u dont force women on them, are u? U dont tell them to change sexual orientation to straight or even bisexual?
When women(and many women do) prefer not to date asian men(including indian ones) thats their preference, aka choice, and no1 can force them to change their preference.

 

[PeteBull]

Hold up right there, chief.

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53 to 46 is not a 'majorly' difference.

Bro, they count players like candy crush players, which are mostly women, lets focus on big budget AAA players, here, us straight men are big majority

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

I’d be willing to bet that female gamers prefer male avatars, too.

There’s never been a problem with female protags as long as 1) their gender is completely indifferent to the story, and/or 2) they’re well written. OG Lara Croft, the heroines in Resident Evil, Princess Peach or Zelda, the girl in Ravenlok, Eri and Tarna in Metal Slug, and so many more. Who cares what gender they are? They kick ass, and they’re generally well written (hint: little dialogue, no preaching, and no pandering go a long way making the player not care if the character is male or female).

Never had a problem with female characters in fighting games, too. They’re nimbler and quicker, and it’s satisfying to beat the crap out of a battleaxe-wielding hulk with a girl. I’m sure that kind of power fantasy is completely acceptable.

Of course games like Uncharted work better with males, for the chemistry between dudebros is much more believable in the setting. But I’ve never played The Lost Legacy, and I’m willing to believe that two women work just as well.

It’s not that hard. Write women who belong in the story and who aren’t there to show men what a “real” woman is like, or to preach to men about the hardships of being a woman, equality, toxic masculinity and all that jazz. A few quips about dumb men when you kick bad dudes’ ass are perfectly fine and in line with the classic action movie banter. Just don’t make it everything the girl has to say in the game.

 

[DEAD ORIGINAL]

Kait on gear's if war did piss me off so boring

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

Hell, they replaced Solid Snake with Raiden who is semi-female and it almost ruined the game.

It’s almost like swapping a beloved character for another that doesn’t look like they’d fit the bill can spoil the audience’s enjoyment of a story. A very simple fact that the entertainment industry has somehow managed to not learn in so many years.
The problem with Raiden wasn’t his looks. It was that he’s not Snake. You didn’t hear people complain about Raiden in MG Rising, as that was his own show.

 

[TheTony316]

It's not that deep.

If the game is good, i don't care. Even if i'm not a fan of the character design.

 

[Radioskugga]

A well written character is more important than the gender. But if I have the option to choose, I generally go for a female protagonist.

 

[PeteBull]

No boobs no buy

Did u buy this modern audience masterpiece of a game tho?

 

[Wolfpact1983]

Gaygaygaygaygay!

 

[poppabk]

Same here OP and I‘m confused as why it’s supposed to be wrong to say this. I mean, we have no issue if a women says she won’t play with a male, do we?

I especially dislike games with choices as female. Tried ME2 once as femshep and just could not do it.

There as a few exceptions like Tomb Raider and female only RE where I don’t mind but usually I don’t bother with these games.

This kind of thinking directly leads to the current Sweet Baby mess we have now. I mean that is their exact argument - that people only want to play as someone that they identify with so we need more female characters, more black characters, more transgender characters, more fat characters etc.
You are saying they are right?

 

[IDKFA]

Although I personally prefer to play as a male if given the choice, I think it's important that the game industry is inclusive and has games that feature female protagonists.

I would never not play a game because it has a female protagonist. Some of the best games I've played had only female protagonists.

You'd need to be a real beta male to ignore a game just because the protagonist is female.

 

[xrnzaaas]

If we go back 10 years or more it's very clear that the protagonists were written primarily to make them cool and interesting (and often attractive - it simply sells), not to be able to send some message, please some minority or tick some checkboxes. I have no problem playing as females or black/minority characters in most older games, because in the vast majority of cases no one was pushing to notice their gender, skin color or sexuality. The characters themseleves also weren't trying to preach anything.

Now? If I see a manjaw female or a character with a shaved head I can already guess it's probably not going to be a game for me. And that's even before I watch videos from the game to see them talking and interacting with the world.

 

[MMaRsu]

Weird as hell, but you do you.

Some of the best games ever made have female protags. But if you want to deprive yourself of awesome experiences because you cant relate (???) to the main character?

What dumb shit, we used to play games for fun, not to relate to the characters.

I cant relate to CJ either but I had an awesome time with GTA San Andreas

I cant relate to Mario

I cant relate to Lara Croft

Doesnt mean the games arent awesome

 

[MMaRsu]

A well written female character will have female issues.

What a crock of shit fuck off with this bullshit man.

What a topic , Holy fuck balls

 

[MMaRsu]

A big part of being a good game are the characters in it.

If Kratos wasn’t a man it wouldn’t be a good game.

If Nathan Drake wasn’t a man it wouldn’t be a good game.

If Sam Fisher wasn’t a man it wouldn’t be a good game.

Hell, they replaced Solid Snake with Raiden who is semi-female and it almost ruined the game.

 

[Strategize]

When did so many gamers become such snowflakes?

 

[Filben]

My wife prefers to play with male protagonists, I prefer playing a female one. I've played like 30 years with mostly male protagonists so I like a change. Also I find women more attractive.

However, if the story is any good it's about human interactions and emotions and crisises I can relate to and identify myself with no matter the sex or gender. If something's well-written and touches your heart, than it does so. So gender is not something I put too much weight into it. But if I have the choice, I'd go for female and if it's pure gameplay... gotta be honest, if Stellar Blade hadn't had such a beautiful woman I wouldn't have finished it.

 

[Fess]

So much truths spoken in here. I don’t hate female protagonists but I agree in your overall points.

Indiana Jones is the most fun I’ve had in a long time in an action adventure and I think it’s because I got to pretend to be Indiana Jones, one of the best male action heroes in movie history.

What would be the upside for me as a player if it was a lady protagonist? It’s just a limitation really. I have no interest to roleplay as a woman, don’t want first person immersion and see female hands and hear a woman’s voice when talking, and if it’s a rpg I’m not interested in some lbtq romance and don’t want to romance men.

So what’s the actual upside?

But if the lady is hot and it’s a third person game not aimed at immersion and I’m just following her story. Then sure, bring it. Just don’t go on erasing all the interesting male protagonists like Joel and Arthur Morgan etc.

 

[rofif]

I play a game as eve and experience her story. Not everything has to be about me

 

[W11d]

If there's a female in porn I'm not watching it

 

[freemandos]

The relatability and characters issues depens on the story and the writing. A female protagonist doesn't have to necessarily fight against "female issues". Themes of a game can be universal Also, I don't agree about a character being relatable as a must to have any appeal. She can be just interesting, funny and/or having a cool design. And there are lots of games where story doesn't even matter, so in these cases why care about it? I don't think gender is everything.

About majority, I tell you this: why the popularity of Jill Valentine, Samus Aran, Lara Croft, female commander Shephard and more then? Why female protagonists like Heather Morris, April Ryan, Joanna Dark or Cate Archer were so beloved?Just by women and a minority of men? Why so many graphic adventures and survival horror games with female protagonists? I see facts saying a different thing. Also, how do you know women only want to play as female characters and they're not interested in playing as men? It's not that simple.

A different thing is the "modern" female protagonist trend, or the use of her. Homogeneization is always bad, the bald jacked male protagonist trend of seventh gen was veeery mocked for good reasons. Or the dull "relatable" male protagonist design like the bounty hunter of the cancelled Prey 2 or nuDante of the dmc reboot, they were memes. The trend of nowadays with (bad) female protagonist is even worse, because now it's using "moral reasons" as an excuse. And the same boring and tiring kind of woman, and not for women, because, among other things, reducing femenity is antiwomen. Being ok with violence and gore but no with sex appeal is nonsense and not even a "modern sensibility" (that bullshit is very old, specially on USA). Making everything about identity politics is tiring. Preaching the audience like they're stupid is insulting. Doing that and using women as a (bad) replacement of men and not leaving place to the later is even more insulting. And I'm not even talking about doing it in established franchises.

Yes, in the past there were more male characters than women, but there wasn't any wish or try to eradicate female protagonists, nobody wanted changing genders or race on Metroid, Fatal Frame, Tomb Raider and others. And I'm not even talking about most of crpgs, where you can choose gender since...always! Nothing like nowadays, where playing a man without being emasculated or sided and femenity are "taboo" now, specially on western videogames. Not the "same as before but on reverse", and not more "empaty", "diversity" and "relatability" than before.

All of this are real problems to me, not just playing as a female. And if you think in this way...well, I think the modern state of the industry is affecting you (and I'm not blaming you). And if it's not, just "a man wants to play always as a male characters because more relatable stories "...well, I don't agree with you and, sorry, I think you'll miss a lot of great videogames.

 

[Gaiff]

I play a game as eve and experience her story. Not everything has to be about me

Until we’re talking about hating 30fps, motion blur, graphics settings, or Forspoken. Then, it’s all about you.

 

[64bitmodels]

Preference can also mean he just wants to play as that and nothing else, gay guys prefer men, u dont force women on them, are u? U dont tell them to change sexual orientation to straight or even bisexual?
When women(and many women do) prefer not to date asian men(including indian ones) thats their preference, aka choice, and no1 can force them to change their preference.

I couldn't easily change a preference even if I wanted to. We'll just stick to critiquing that preference.

He has it, he can do what he likes with it. We're just saying that (evidenced by the long list of female protag games you listed) he's kind of missing out

 

[Sophist]

90% of female characters i came across in various MMO's and online games were dudes playing them including myself, so give the people a character creator and they instantly go for what they are "attracted" to or find visualy pleasing.

those dudes who create a female avatar for themselves are one step away from becoming the bad guy in The Silence of the Lambs.

 

[Zathalus]

I don’t have a problem with it. I can read a book with a female protagonist as well as watch a movie starring one. Playing a game is about the same for me. I’d generally pick a male if I have the option but if it’s a RPG I’d probably do a male and female run.

 

[rofif]

Until we’re talking about hating 30fps, motion blur, graphics settings, or Forspoken. Then, it’s all about you.

me = you
Our brains can't be that different

 

[JimmyRustler]

This kind of thinking directly leads to the current Sweet Baby mess we have now. I mean that is their exact argument - that people only want to play as someone that they identify with so we need more female characters, more black characters, more transgender characters, more fat characters etc.
You are saying they are right?

Dev can make whatever they want. Just don’t be angry at me for not wanting to play it. I‘m not angry at you not wanting to play what I don’t want to. It’s ok.

 

[Balducci30]

I think some people like to insert themselves into the game, and others are more observing it.

I prefer FPS to Third Person cus it feels more like I’m in the game, and if there’s a character creator I usually try to make a version of myself - sort of like I’m putting myself in the situation in the game. I don’t mind female protagonists really - I used to when I was a child, but if there’s an option I choose playing as a guy.

 

[mansoor1980]

fps with a female protagonist can be wierd..........

 

[rofif]

It's OK.
I will just drop this here.... from my last playing session at 3am this morning.
Eve says hi

To anyone thinking it's just boobs. This game got fantastic combat and exploration. The world is very well done and lore is great.
I would say - if there was not a single boob in this game, it would be just as good.

Spoiler: also stellar blade

It's a proper scifi game

 

[Gaiff]

It's OK.
I will just drop this here.... from my last playing session at 3am this morning.
Eve says hi

Is there a bust slider in this game? Her boobs in the last pic are enormous whereas they seem more medium size in the default outift.

 

[rofif]

Is there a bust slider in this game? Here boobs in the last pic are enormous whereas they seem more medium size in the default outift.

Every costume got it's own boobs and ass size. Depends on costume
And there are like 70 outfits if not more

 

[The Cockatrice]

I have not much to add to this topic as I don't play as female characters when theres an option to create one and even to this day I still havent played Stellar Blade and it took me years to finally try Nier Automata. Was never a huge fan of TR even tho I played them all and the modern ones are average as fuck. Ultimately I agree that male protagonists are miles ahead of female ones. Drake, Kratos, Joel, Male Shepard, Male V, Doom Guy etc. are all in my top dudes of all time. Theres not a single female one in my top 50. That being said, females are the best as companions/romance in which case Panam, Liara, Tali, Yen, etc. are all amazing female companions. Would I play as them? Nope.

 

[SF Kosmo]

I never self-insert with games. Games aren't about literally imagining ME, the dumpy idiot holding the controller, in the game universe. So the gender and appearance of the character don't matter to me, or at least it doesn't matter if it aligns with my own.

For me it's just about the story. In create-a-chatacter games I pick whatever seems most interesting and appropriate to the world and story. In Mass Effect, female felt right, in Fallout generally male. Other games it's a coin toss. I just want an interesting character who feels like they belong in the world.

 

[NeoIkaruGAF]

If we go back 10 years or more it's very clear that the protagonists were written primarily to make them cool and interesting (and often attractive - it simply sells), not to be able to send some message, please some minority or tick some checkboxes. I have no problem playing as females or black/minority characters in most older games, because in the vast majority of cases no one was pushing to notice their gender, skin color or sexuality. The characters themseleves also weren't trying to preach anything.

Now? If I see a manjaw female or a character with a shaved head I can already guess it's probably not going to be a game for me. And that's even before I watch videos from the game to see them talking and interacting with the world.

Yeah, it’s been so overdone and for well-known reasons not related to the actual gaming that the reactions are justified at this point.

Nobody ever gave a shit that Samus was a woman in Super Metroid. Literally nobody. Never. And no, nobody fapped to pixelated bikini Samus, either.
If Metroid was a new IP introduced today, though? All hell would break loose. And you’d have good reason to expect a pandering, horribly written character. Even if the game we got was Metroid Prime as we know it, many would be biased against the game long before release. This is the result of almost a decade of female characters introduced, written and designed in the worst of ways and for all the wrong reasons. All people want is a credible character who does cool, fun stuff and makes you feel badass while controlling them. Then it really doesn’t matter what genitals they have.

What makes Samus, OG Lara, Aya Brea, Lenneth the Valkyrie, Jill Valentine, Claire Redfield, etc good female characters?
Easy. They have a purpose, they go their own way, they can handle themselves, and they can kick ass. And they do all of this without blabbering about smashing the patriarchy, or being offended about “microaggressions”. They have some serious macroaggressions to deal with after all, and they do so without breaking a sweat. And no, they don’t look or sound “masculine” for a second while doing all of this.

 

[N30RYU]

If you can relate with a white bar playing pong... you can relate with whatever you wanna relate.


Can you releate with a a women in a role lead in a movie? If you can't then you have a problem not the one making games/movies with female protagonists.