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[From The Dust]

The higher performance will allow them to blur the distinction between overworld and dungeons and villages.

I don't see what hardware has to do with this. It's a design issue, not a hardware one

 

[Father_Brain]

Has this been posted?


http://www.develop-online.net/news/37732/Develop-Source-Wii-2-pad-adds-camera-system

More of this?

I have to believe that there's a crucial piece of the controller picture that we're not getting, and that Nintendo hasn't abandoned motion control as an out-of-the-box standard, because if they have after how the last generation turned out, they've lost their fucking minds. Period.

 

[From The Dust]

I'll be more sad about the loss if pointer controls andthe two-piece controller.

 

[Nirolak]

More of this?

I have to believe that there's a crucial piece of the controller picture that we're not getting, and that Nintendo hasn't abandoned motion control as an out-of-the-box standard, because if they have after how the last generation turned out, they've lost their fucking minds. Period.

I'm actually far more concerned about this stylus thing on a dual analog controller...

 

[swerve]

I'll be more sad about the loss if pointer controls and the two-piece controller.

This. This. 1000 times this.

But I don't think they'll abandon free-handed two-handed control. The Wii is so cheap to buy now - including motionplus controller and nunchuck in the box - that it's not likely to be a big cost to include them or similar in Cafe. Production costs for the Wii Remote Plus must be tiny.

 

[Peru]

I'm one of those who hope we HAVE seen the last surprise reveal about the controller. If it's a screen - ok, it's a gimmick to sell consoles and differentiate it from others - I don't see that it will be used in very interesting ways, but I don't really see the harm either. What I want to see is a system where the gimmicks don't take control. Let there be a screen, but have the rest be a regular dual stick controller, and have the console push some serious visuals, and I'm in.

 

[From The Dust]

I'm one of those who hope we HAVE seen the last surprise reveal about the controller. If it's a screen - ok, it's a gimmick to sell consoles and differentiate it from others - I don't see that it will be used in very interesting ways, but I don't really see the harm either. What I want to see is a system where the gimmicks don't take control. Let there be a screen, but have the rest be a regular dual stick controller, and have the console push some serious visuals, and I'm in.

So far, the rumors are doing exacly what you're saying.

I hope for a redesign of the Wii's two-piece. But with the screen, it makes it hard to design one logically

 

[Graphics Horse]

I'm actually far more concerned about this stylus thing on a dual analog controller...

Was that article the first time a possible stylus was mentioned? It's definitely a good thing for drawing, writing and mouse-like precision.
I'm still wondering about a motion/pointer capable stylus which docks into the controller.

 

[Father_Brain]

I'm one of those who hope we HAVE seen the last surprise reveal about the controller. If it's a screen - ok, it's a gimmick to sell consoles and differentiate it from others - I don't see that it will be used in very interesting ways, but I don't really see the harm either. What I want to see is a system where the gimmicks don't take control. Let there be a screen, but have the rest be a regular dual stick controller, and have the console push some serious visuals, and I'm in.

I'm not arguing based on my personal taste, though. What I'm saying is that, from a business standpoint, it would be beyond insane for Nintendo to abandon what made Wii so successful, and would make me seriously question whether Iwata et. al still have the necessary acumen for the console business.

 

[Nirolak]

Was that article the first time a possible stylus was mentioned? It's definitely a good thing for drawing, writing and mouse-like precision.
I'm still wondering about a motion/pointer capable stylus which docks into the controller.

Well, if it also works well with fingers, then that would be fine, but if it doesn't, Nintendo needs to recount how many arms humans have.

 

[From The Dust]

I'm not arguing based on my personal taste, though. What I'm saying is that, from a business standpoint, it would be beyond insane for Nintendo to abandon what made Wii so successful, and would make me seriously question whether Iwata et. al still have the necessary acumen for the console business.

Iwata has been making some good decisions. To make this mistake would be very unlike him. Iwata isn't stupid.

 

[Nirolak]

I'm not arguing based on my personal taste, though. What I'm saying is that, from a business standpoint, it would be beyond insane for Nintendo to abandon what made Wii so successful, and would make me seriously question whether Iwata et. al still have the necessary acumen for the console business.

The impression Kotaku gave was that it was Wiimote compatible, and that some games would use them at the same time as the screen controller, but they didn't mention if one came in the box.

I do get the impression though that the main controller lacks motion control outside of perhaps gyros. I'm not sure if the Wiimotes come in the box either, since that didn't seem to be implied.

This wouldn't be the first time they did something like this though. The 3DS's design basically makes the bottom touch screen irrelevant.

 

[swerve]

What I'm saying is that, from a business standpoint, it would be beyond insane for Nintendo to abandon what made Wii so successful

What if what made Wii successful was being inclusive, quirky, local-multiplayer/family focused, surprising and not like the other guys?

 

[NeonZ]

Iwata has been making some good decisions. To make this mistake would be very unlike him. Iwata isn't stupid.

Well, they've just made a mistake regarding the 3DS launch, with the 3d and expanded reality minigames failing to be system sellers.

 

[Father_Brain]

Well, they've just made a mistake regarding the 3DS launch, with the 3d and expanded reality minigames failing to be system sellers.

They also adopted a hardware design with 3DS that drastically reduced the potential for touch-centric games, and ending the Wiimote standard would be the same kind of decision, albeit much greater in impact.

Beaten by a mod, oh well.

 

[swerve]

The 3DS's design basically makes the bottom touch screen irrelevant.

Hmmm. For many games, perhaps. But not for the OS or the other functions of the system.

The touchscreen could be primarily there as a communications tool between the system menu and the user's living room.

I reckon there will be a vga screen and vga camera on the controller. Basically, 480p gaming in your hands, or 1080p on the big screen of doom.

 

[Lonely1]

I don't know what resolution a .3MP camera supports, but I would hope that Nintendo would use a camera that supported 1080p resolution since that is resolution the system supports.... unless the camera stuff will only be displayed on the controller (but that would be incredibly short sighted).

.7 like the iPad 2.

 

[Graphics Horse]

Well, if it also works well with fingers, then that would be fine, but if it doesn't, Nintendo needs to recount how many arms humans have.

I'm sure it would work also with fingers, and hopefully better than a DS does! It's likely a single touch resistive screen though, unless they've got something more unconventional but still cheap planned. I also like the idea of the cheap electrostatic feedback that Toshiba has, I have no idea if that still works via a stylus.
I definitely wouldn't expect dual analogs and stylus use in the same game, it's all about options.

 

[Nirolak]

They also adopted a hardware design with 3DS that drastically reduced the potential for touch-centric games, and ending the Wiimote standard would be the same kind of decision, albeit much greater in impact.

I have to say, Nintendo's strategy with the 3DS is quite fascinating in retrospect.

After watching the PSP completely bomb in the West, Nintendo:

-Used the PSP's launch price.
-Used the PSP's one screen focus for games.
-Used the PSP's most derided feature, its singular analog stick.
-Used the PSP's early software strategy of depending heavily on third parties, releasing old console ports, and focusing on console like games.

I'm still trying to figure out at what point they went "Yes, this is a brilliant strategy, let's do it."

I'm sure it would work also with fingers, and hopefully better than a DS does! It's likely a single touch resistive screen though, unless they've got something more unconventional but still cheap planned.
I definitely wouldn't expect dual analogs and stylus use in the same game, it's all about options.

I was hoping for more of a focus on using thumbs quickly on the touch screen and then jumping back to the analog sticks, but yeah, this could work too.

Essentially it could be like a single touch tablet that has some buttons instead of letting you use multiple fingers, and they're designing around that. Though it would seem for that you would pretty much need to focus on the controller screen instead of the TV.

 

[Father_Brain]

What if what made Wii successful was being inclusive, quirky, local-multiplayer/family focused, surprising and not like the other guys?

So... you're saying that it's reasonable for Nintendo to abandon the enormous and proven audience for motion-controlled gaming, because Move and Kinect exist and because they might be able to pull some totally awesome and innovative feature no one has ever seen before out of their hat at E3?

That seems ridiculous to me. Nintendo isn't infallible, and they can't catch lightning in a bottle with every "innovative" attempt to court casual/non-gamers. (See: Wii Music; 3DS launch, Face Raiders, AR Games.)

 

[swerve]

So... you're saying that it's reasonable for Nintendo to abandon the enormous and proven audience for motion-controlled gaming, because Move and Kinect exist and because they might be able to pull some totally awesome and innovative feature no one has ever seen before out of their hat at E3?

That seems ridiculous to me. Nintendo isn't infallible, and they can't catch lightning in a bottle with every "innovative" attempt to court casual/non-gamers. (See: Wii Music; 3DS launch, Face Raiders, AR Games.)

I'm just saying that Wii's success was more than motion controls. If they believe - rightly or wrongly - that they have something more or equally as compelling to offer us for the next five years with Cafe, then there is no reason for them to cling to the Wii Remote just because it was a success in 2006.

In fact, if they believe people might think 'oh, but I already have a Wii' (as may be happening with DS -> 3DS) then there is more reason to separate themselves from the past.

The only compelling reason - looking at Nintendo developed games aside from Skyward Sword - for Nintendo to put in a Wii Remote is backwards compatability. Wii Sports and Sports Resort have done their jobs. Mario Kart, Galaxy and NSMBWii all work with just a flick of the wrist with the sole exception of star-bits. Rhythm Heaven Wii will only use buttons....

...seems like Nintendo are pretty well done with the Wii Remote.

 

[Graphics Horse]

So... you're saying that it's reasonable for Nintendo to abandon the enormous and proven audience for motion-controlled gaming, because Move and Kinect exist and because they might be able to pull some totally awesome and innovative feature no one has ever seen before out of their hat at E3?

That seems ridiculous to me. Nintendo isn't infallible, and they can't catch lightning in a bottle with every "innovative" attempt to court casual/non-gamers. (See: Wii Music; 3DS launch, Face Raiders, AR Games.)

On the other hand, the 3DS didn't abandon anything from its proven predecessor, its design is so conservative that much of the public can't even understand why they would need to get another one. If Nintendogs 2 didn't sell new hardware, would Wii Sports 3?

 

[BY2K]

So... you're saying that it's reasonable for Nintendo to abandon the enormous and proven audience for motion-controlled gaming, because Move and Kinect exist and because they might be able to pull some totally awesome and innovative feature no one has ever seen before out of their hat at E3?

Nintendo: Hey, those guys are copying us, time to do something else!

 

[From The Dust]

I'm just saying that Wii's success was more than motion controls. If they believe - rightly or wrongly - that they have something more or equally as compelling to offer us for the next five years with Cafe, then there is no reason for them to cling to the Wii Remote just because it was a success in 2006.

I cling to the Wiimote because it was a great fucking controller. I like the two-piece setup and pointer controls is the best thing to happen to controllers since the analog stick

 

[Father_Brain]

I'm just saying that Wii's success was more than motion controls. If they believe - rightly or wrongly - that they have something more or equally as compelling to offer us for the next five years with Cafe, then there is no reason for them to cling to the Wii Remote just because it was a success in 2006.

If they believe they can draw in casuals with a Spruce Goose iPad/DualShock hybrid, regardless of whatever other bells and whistles it has that we don't know about yet... well, I've been wrong about these things before, but I'm just not seeing it.

 

[Nirolak]

On the other hand, the 3DS didn't abandon anything from its proven predecessor, its design is so conservative that much of the public can't even understand why they would need to get another one. If Nintendogs 2 didn't sell new hardware, would Wii Sports 3?

I think the box art is problematic on that front as well.

Having a system design and a box art design that look really similar to the previous system was probably not the best decision.

 

[swerve]

I cling to the Wiimote because it was a great fucking controller. I like the two-piece setup and pointer controls is the best thing to happen to controllers since the analog stick

I agree. But I don't see any first party games outside of the now-quite-long-in-development Zelda title which make good use of it. EDIT ok, there is Wii Play 2 and Wii Party... They are still giving it a little outsourced love.

The Wii Remote has many things it is great for, and I love it dearly. I am merely speculating about - not endorsing - the idea that they might have moved on from it and have lots of new ideas for their newer controller.

 

[swerve]

If they believe they can draw in casuals with a Spruce Goose iPad/DualShock hybrid, regardless of whatever other bells and whistles it has that we don't know about yet... well, I've been wrong about these things before, but I'm just not seeing it.

Me either. But that might be because we *haven't seen it*.

 

[Taker666]

I'm sure it would work also with fingers, and hopefully better than a DS does! It's likely a single touch resistive screen though, unless they've got something more unconventional but still cheap planned. I also like the idea of the cheap electrostatic feedback that Toshiba has, I have no idea if that still works via a stylus.
I definitely wouldn't expect dual analogs and stylus use in the same game, it's all about options.

Is a resistive touchscreen really a good idea?

It's an obvious choice for the DS as the screen is small and it's protected by a clam shell design...but I'm not sure it's wise for a controller that's going to be exposed.

I'd much rather have a stronger capacitive screen that's harder to scratch/easier to clean. I'd never leave my DS open to the elements..so I'd be concerned if the controller uses the same screen tech.

 

[Graphics Horse]

If it's aimed for fingertip use it could be capacitive, but I'm not sure what that would mean for the cost of the controller. It could be something new like quantum tunneling but don't count on it!

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Actually I think it does mean something...

the overworlds in the 3D Zelda's have been incredibly barren and desolate compared to the intricate and well designed maps of the better 2D games. I often think of all the cool touches in the overworld of A Link to the Past, and while nearly all of them are done in dungeons in the 3D games, they're not done on the overworld map:

• Dropping off of Death Mountain in dark world, to land on an otherwise inaccessible cave entrance... swapping between dimensions to get to inaccessible areas, draining waterways and flooding others...
• Other areas that are inaccessible until you get a certain power up
• Graves that roll back
• Prayer stones to find, that give you the Quake, Ether and Bombos medallions
• Unnecessary items to find such as the ice rod, the cane of Byrna, the magic cape
• Hidden heart pieces in more natural cave entrances - in hollowed out trees, behind vines, under waterfalls -- not just under giant rocks!

Of course, you could consider Kakariko Village, Lake Hylia and Death Mountain etc to be a part of the overworld in Ocarina of Time, but they're not... its not seamless, and Hyrule Field is just an overworld hub for them.

The higher performance will allow them to blur the distinction between overworld and dungeons and villages.

Now imagine that bigger, more joined up world having a physics system evolved from Wind Waker, realistic wind effects having a real influence on everything in the world, a truer lighting model (return of the mirror shield plz), actions having more visible consequences, destructible environments, procedurally animated enemies and NPCs... how you can wrap up all that new functionality in new puzzles and dungeon structures. If they use the extra power wisely, they can make the overworld innovative and seamless again, and maybe just maybe they'll hold a candle to the overworlds in the 2D games.

I like this alot. I want a seemless world, but one that looks and animates like pre-rendered CG, but completely realtime.

 

[Graphics Horse]

I think we should wait to see more of Skyward Sword before talking about Café Zelda, it seems like they might be aiming for something more seamless and LTTP-like already.

Is there anything stopping you from flying the beetle to Lake Hylia/Death Mountain? (yes, probably a time limit)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mL-adSSSmco

 

[ace3skoot]

I like this alot. I want a seemless world, but one that looks and animates like pre-rendered CG, but completely realtime.

You know what I want?

a Pony

life is a harsh bitch.

id settle for seamless world with skyrim level graphics for my zelda its more obtainable than a pony =( but at least it might happen

 

[WillyFive]

I think the box art is problematic on that front as well.

Having a system design and a box art design that look really similar to the previous system was probably not the best decision.

Yeah, I was walking down the aisle and saw 3DS games on the shelf upside down, because whoever put them there thought they were DS games.

It is Nintendo's biggest mistake in marketing the 3DS. Even Sony switched to initials for PS2 so that people wouldn't confuse it with PS1 games.

 

[Grampa Simpson]

You know what I want?

a Pony

life is a harsh bitch.

id settle for seamless world with skyrim level graphics for my zelda its more obtainable than a pony =( but at least it might happen

When I initiate a teleport in the next Zelda, I want it to start preloading all the places where I might warp to so that there is no discernable load time.

 

[lunchwithyuzo]

Actually I think it does mean something...

the overworlds in the 3D Zelda's have been incredibly barren and desolate compared to the intricate and well designed maps of the better 2D games. I often think of all the cool touches in the overworld of A Link to the Past, and while nearly all of them are done in dungeons in the 3D games, they're not done on the overworld map:

Play Majora's Mask. It's overworld is anything but barren and desolate, in fact it reminds me a lot of the intricate, puzzley overworlds in the Game Boy Zeldas.

 

[Jocchan]

I think the box art is problematic on that front as well.

Having a system design and a box art design that look really similar to the previous system was probably not the best decision.

I absolutely agree. Maybe Nintendo needs to pull a Sony and redesign their 3DS boxart templates on the go. Differentiating the 3DS from the DS is going to be a tough challenge for them.

 

[1-D_FTW]

I have to say, Nintendo's strategy with the 3DS is quite fascinating in retrospect.

After watching the PSP completely bomb in the West, Nintendo:

-Used the PSP's launch price.
-Used the PSP's one screen focus for games.
-Used the PSP's most derided feature, its singular analog stick.
-Used the PSP's early software strategy of depending heavily on third parties, releasing old console ports, and focusing on console like games.

I'm still trying to figure out at what point they went "Yes, this is a brilliant strategy, let's do it."

I think when they realized the 3D aspect would allow them to port N64 games one final time.

 

[Hiltz]

There's another image of the Project Cafe hardware. Of course, this is still a rumor.
Destructoid didn't provide a link to the source.

http://www.destructoid.com/is-this-a-genuine-photograph-of-project-cafe--201598.phtml#comment

 

[herzogzwei1989]

Why does it seem like there's so little hype for Skyward Sword compared to that for Twilight Princess? I find myself not at all hyped for Skyward Sword. I think it's the lack of epicness in the two trailers released so far. I hope E3 changes all that, but I cannot help but to think of the possibilities for Zelda Cafe in HD and get excited for that, even though I should be excited for Skyward Sword. Anyone here feel the same?

 

[Cosmonaut X]

I absolutely agree. Maybe Nintendo needs to pull a Sony and redesign their 3DS boxart templates on the go. Differentiating the 3DS from the DS is going to be a tough challenge for them.

I was quite surprised that the box designs were so close in the first place. I could understand wanting to stick with the hardware design but to just flip the box template and use slightly slimmer cases?

It doesn't help that none of the shops here in the UK have separate 3DS sections - DS and 3DS games are all just slotted into one area. I wonder if it's a deliberate strategy on Nintendo's part, but I can't really see the benefit.

 

[DragonKnight]

There's another image of the Project Cafe hardware. Of course, this is still a rumor.
Destructoid didn't provide a link to the source.

http://www.destructoid.com/is-this-a-genuine-photograph-of-project-cafe--201598.phtml#comment

Old picture is old. An can we lock this thread? I keep on thinking that a new promising leak has...leaked

 

[DragonKnight]

Here: don't know if this is a banned site but:

http://www.develop-online.net/news/37732/Develop-Source-Wii-2-pad-adds-camera-system

Edit: Oh the irony lol

 

[Dystify]

Old picture is old. An can we lock this thread? I keep on thinking that a new promising leak has...leaked

If there was a 'promising' leak there would be a new topic anyways.

 

[Jocchan]

There's another image of the Project Cafe hardware. Of course, this is still a rumor.
Destructoid didn't provide a link to the source.


http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v244/Hiltz/201598-header.jpg[IMG]


[url]http://www.destructoid.com/is-this-a-genuine-photograph-of-project-cafe--201598.phtml#comment[/url][/QUOTE]
This time with different color, and differently positioned/sized extra-tacky etched-for-some-reason Nintendo logo.
Also, is it me or does the camel toe micro-DVD tray keep getting smaller with each "leaked" picture?

[QUOTE=Cosmonaut X]I was quite surprised that the box designs were so close in the first place. I could understand wanting to stick with the hardware design but to just flip the box template and use slightly slimmer cases?

It doesn't help that none of the shops here in the UK have separate 3DS sections - DS and 3DS games are all just slotted into one area. I wonder if it's a deliberate strategy on Nintendo's part, but I can't really see the benefit.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, quite puzzling honestly.

 

[DragonKnight]

Okay at this point I think the 6 inch touch screen is in. It's in everybody's report now.

I'm saying 6 inch touchscreen, graphics on par with 360/ps3 (wanna let myself down easy on this one)

 

[NEO0MJ]

Why does it seem like there's so little hype for Skyward Sword compared to that for Twilight Princess? I find myself not at all hyped for Skyward Sword. I think it's the lack of epicness in the two trailers released so far. I hope E3 changes all that, but I cannot help but to think of the possibilities for Zelda Cafe in HD and get excited for that, even though I should be excited for Skyward Sword. Anyone here feel the same?

I blame the lack of SS on how disappointing TP is, and how SS doesn't seem to add anything new other than motion plus.

Old picture is old. An can we lock this thread? I keep on thinking that a new promising leak has...leaked

This pic should be added to the OP of every Cafe' thread, and have the title of each thread include "see OP first".

 

[DragonKnight]

This time with different color, and differently positioned/sized extra-tacky etched-for-some-reason Nintendo logo.
Also, is it me or does the camel toe micro-DVD tray keep getting smaller with each "leaked" picture?


Yeah, quite puzzling honestly.

Nope. I've seen this before on this very forum. Same color and same speculation about the logo. I just wish nintendo would say "FINE!!!Here's the damn thing!"

 

[Krowley]

If they believe they can draw in casuals with a Spruce Goose iPad/DualShock hybrid, regardless of whatever other bells and whistles it has that we don't know about yet... well, I've been wrong about these things before, but I'm just not seeing it.

Maybe they think they can draw casuals with future peripherals once the price of the system drops.

In this way they could go at the casual market in a more traditional way. Instead of getting them during initial release, they'll wait till the console is cheap enough for them to easily afford it, while focusing on grabbing a larger demographic of bigger spending core gamers during the early release.

 

[DragonKnight]

I blame the lack of SS on how disappointing TP is, and how SS doesn't seem to add anything new other than motion plus.




This pic should be added to the OP of every Cafe' thread, and have the title of each thread include "see OP first".

I don't wanna get banned but it's time for nintendo to get off OOT's (and more accurately ALTTP) dick. Maybe the Galaxy team should handle the next Zelda.

Zelda in space. Make it happen and i'm there day one.