Gameplay > everything else. And cover shooters are boring.
Oh yeah, sure. Now name 10 games from this generation with amazing and unique gameplay. No wait, why would I be so hard on you? Name 5 of them. I have time...
There's quite an ample area between unique and derivative.
I agree but please feel free to name a few even if it fits in the middle.
I'm looking at several instances of people trying to diminish their work.
1. Naughty Dog is overrated. Yet the millions who play their games including the majority of critics absolutely love their games, should we pander to the minority who do not love their games and give their games 7 and 8's to appease such a crowd.
2. Naughty Dog Games are walking simulators, yet I've never played a game so many times with such heavy action gameplay scenarios or in LOU where I approach my enemies in different ways every time, using different strategies, and that could be said with the very first game in Drake's Fortune.
3. Naughty is overworking Staff. Yet no one was forced to work OT and if you did, there was appropriate compensation relative to time and half, doubletime pay and further bonuses if the game is successful, which most ND games have been. Of course no employer would say they do not want the best and hardest working people, sometimes people have to understand that the best movies, games and art pieces you see takes lots of work, being earnest, lots of blood and tears....Having the best products are not usually cakewalks and people work hard and lose sleep behind the scenes. Having the best games is not putting It in a "best games generator simulator".....
4. Naughty and their directors are trying to push this SJW way of thinking on me: No they are not, you are not forced to buy, you are not forced to let your kids play their games if you think they will turn lesbian or gay after a playthrough. As if such people don't exist right in front of their faces everyday. Yet we have no issues with our boys allowing the main characters in GTA to plow through fields of prostitutes, working for gangs and gunning down innocents at random, at least the people you mow down in LOU and UC are bad guys trying to kill you.... So lets stop the hypocrisy. Games are fantasy, they tell stories, you love them or hate them, you buy them or not.....I have no problem with GTA or UC games.....Let the artists do their thing, the number of people who love their games will be the ultimate decider, yet people hate even when the games they don't love do well, because the game they love is only liked by 5 people including themselves, so they sit back and concoct this smear campaign. Why are millions playing these ND games? We really need to stop the witch hunts over a dev's vision, and why he made the story the way he did. It's his game and he's telling it, if you are so pressed, go do yours if you think it will take the world by storm and is such a superior piece......That way your game can go against ND's and be compared on all levels......It's also why I never understood all the Vitriol sent David Cage's way, some people absolutely love his games and it's not a template of everything else that's available. People call games garbage when they don't do well, with told ya's, but they still hate when a game is quality and super successful, there's no middle ground it seems....
Played it and it never ever felt like it was Uncharted to me and the story was engulfing and loved the combat.Here's the thing I keep being told by so many how great TLOU was, so I keep trying to get into it but it feels so much like an Uncharted game with zombies. Is that basically what this game/story amounts to?
The whole end of the world zombie apocalypse thing.....I've made moral concessions with things I considered stupid (zombies) and recently embraced the Walking Dead. TLOU feels like Uncharted: The Walking Dead. Am I right or does this game ever become something more?
Exactly.Do you like there games? yes well play them
do you think its a walking simulator? no you dont
do you think they are overworking their staff? no you dont
Do you think they are pushing SJW? no you dont
just play the game on your beloved PS4. Stop worrying that other people dont like walking simulators or think the staff are mistreated. you dont need to defend everything
agree with that, I never get why people post console sale or game sales either. its not like they have scars in the company or getting money of everyone sold. its a way of justifying their choice of what they bought. I buy a console and buy games I like simpleExactly.
It's like gaming is politics and some people have an urge to sway the public to buy the same console as them, and like the same games.
How come you never see this kind of loyalty and defence in movies, TV shows and cars where people watch and buy what they want, they discuss and have a good time, and nobody cares whether 50 people or 50 million people like the same thing?
But in gaming, some people have this mental breakdown:
1 million gamers play the same thing as me = I feel like shit
10 million gamers play the same thing as me = OK, I feel better. But not there yet
100 million gamers play the same thing as me = Yee-ha! Trophy time boys!
Movies with occasional player input is not true. There are long shooting and platforming sections and some cutscenes. Heavy Rain is a movie with occasional player input1,2, and 4 are 100% in my personal opinion
- Overrated in my eyes, for sure
- idk about walking sims, ala Death Stranding, but they are definitely movies with occasional player input
- sure you dont have to buy their product but that doesnt mean they arent pushing a narrative
I have never seen in life anyone buying a car and then going around trying to compare and sway people their car in the class is the best. People just buy what they like and nobody cares.agree with that, I never get why people post console sale or game sales either. its not like they have scars in the company or getting money of everyone sold. its a way of justifying their choice of what they bought. I buy a console and buy games I like simple
I get it with films as they get pretty cultish but defending mega companies and bashing mega companies who both produce devices aimed for people to have fun on is stupid. just buy what you buy and have fun with it, if somebody doesn't buy the same as you dont bash them just do what you doI have never seen in life anyone buying a car and then going around trying to compare and sway people their car in the class is the best. People just buy what they like and nobody cares.
Lets say a Camry, Accord, Maxima and Ford Fusion are all the same class. I don't know which car gets rated highest but lets say for sake of argument most sites say the Camry is best.
I have never seen anyone with a new Camry go around bitching they got the best car for the money. Or anyone go on the defence crying the car they bought (rated middle of the pack) is supposedly much better than criticized and people should give it a shot next time, and that car review sites are biased.
But for $60 video games, here we are.
This is what happens when instead of delivering your message indirectly, as any proper form of art, you get political and throw your views directly on people's faces.
Yup.I get it with films as they get pretty cultish but defending mega companies and bashing mega companies who both produce devices aimed for people to have fun on is stupid. just buy what you buy and have fun with it, if somebody doesn't buy the same as you dont bash them just do what you do
I know I have asked this many times but besides gay and strong woman characters existing in the game how is the game woke? I have not seen anything whatsoever that directly addresses any hot button political issues. I have not seen Ellie give any sermons on gay rights or feminism. I fail to see how it is shoving anything down people's throats.
Probably not the right thread to ask as leaks get permabanned. Your question is better suited in the spoiler/leak therad.I know I have asked this many times but besides gay and strong woman characters existing in the game how is the game woke? I have not seen anything whatsoever that directly addresses any hot button political issues. I have not seen Ellie give any sermons on gay rights or feminism. I fail to see how it is shoving anything down people's throats.
It was not my intention and if this does count then delete it. I apologize if that is what it came across as.Probably not the right thread to ask as leaks get permabanned. Your question is better suited in the spoiler/leak therad.
Not from you directly. But anyone wanting to write a detailed response to you might go accidentally overboard with details.It was not my intention and if this does count then delete it. I apologize if that is what it came across as.
Probably not the right thread to ask as leaks get permabanned. Your question is better suited in the spoiler/leak therad.
When you're at the top of the mountain people will do anything to knock you off, even when it doesn't make sense.
As long as critical reception stays high, Naughty Dog will always be fine because that's what their entire reputation is based upon, it's why they crunch so much, to wow critics and win awards. Which in turn gets parroted around by their fans as "See, this is why they're the best." which both gets them more haters but also more fans.
This is why alot of the groups attacking them such as...
1) Anti-SJWs
2) Fans of Nintendo or Xbox
3) Weebs
4) Fans of certain characters being mad that the narrative doesn't idealize them.
None of these people hold enough power to ever truly damage ND's reputation. Normal people don't care that Ellie likes girls, or that a female character is buff or some shit Druckmann said about a feminist over 5 years go, they care about the game being perceived lower quality. So long as Naughty Dog are critical darlings, they're untouchable.
There's no need, just boycott them.
At this point any praise towards TLOU2 will not be sincere, since the gaming industry and especially game journalists are SJW's themselves. If this game's story gets any praise for its narrative then it proves that journalists have absolutely no credibility left.
Or you know, it's actually good and well executed.At this point any praise towards TLOU2 will not be sincere, since the gaming industry and especially game journalists are SJW's themselves. If this game's story gets any praise for its narrative then it proves that journalists have absolutely no credibility left.
Some of the people the people that actually care about the game will.If it actually is great will any of the outrage mob admit they were wrong?
Some of the people the people that actually care about the game will.
Not the anti-SJWs though, they'll just call games journalism a bunch of corrupt lefts again, proceed to try and start Gamergate 2 and fail miserably.
Story isn't even that woke either. It's literally about violence and hate, and it's rendered the most realistic way we've ever seen in a game.It's weird they say the journalists won't be able to admit the game is bad due to their stance on SJW politics but couldn't we equally say these people could never admit the game would be good? They've clearly dug in on their positions, who would trust most posters here to view the game objectively when it releases?
We were talking about innovation, not gameplay that "feels good". Uncharted wasn't the first to make vertical shooting or semi-open levels or quick shooting mechanics.
And the examples you're giving of what i assume you consider "innovative" are merely scripted events.
Jumping from car to car to kill enemies and going back to your own? Only happens at that exact same very controlled instance every time you play.
The mechanics related to it also only work at that time. Its not a game mechanic like it is on Just Cause.
No, absolutely not.n just cause Same goes for sinking ships
I mean, compared to the cruise, sure there's not much physically simulated here, but still, while controlling Drake (even when fucking flying in the air), you went from a gunfight inside of an airplane, to the sand of the desert on the ground, all while playing.or falling airplanes, all scripted.
Nah man. Just a ilttle bit different.If you want a comparison, its like if i said Forza Horizon's races against airplanes and boats are "innovative" for allowing you to race things other than cars. In reality, all the movement of these other special vehicles are scripted, and in practice its only a glorified time attack event.
Sure, QTE and unskippable real time cutscene here and there can hurt further playthroughs. That's why people saying U2 is the best Uncharted (written/paced by guess who? Druckmann) while at same time complaining about cinematic games while at same time saying Drake's Fortune is the worst Uncharted crack me up, given DF is just a pure TPS with light action adventures elements here and there.Talking about scripts, thats probably the closest thing to "innovation" Uncharted brought, weaving scripted events directly onto the game.
It wasn't the first to do it but it was the first i remember doing on such a large scale, and its also the main reason for the criticism of their game. It looks awesome at first but it kills player agency and replayability.
What toxicity are you talking about? Are you saying ND is pushing toxicity, what exactly are you talking about? It would seem like they've committed the cardinal sin.
They're going to have one of the highest reviewed games this yearI think they are doing a pretty good job of tearing themselves down.
If its a great story and fun to play the game will speak for itself
Uncharted 4 was mind blowing and that released in 2016
TLOU Part II looks to be mind blowing and it's coming out next month
They're the same Naughty Dog
Uncharted 4 was the worst in the franchise and a major departure from what Amy Hennig originally envisioned for the sequel. Lost Legacy was also pretty damn bad.
People want to play Indiana Jones. Not "Mid Life Crisis Simulator 2016".
Uncharted 1 was the worst in the franchise, Uncharted 4 won over 100 awards and has a 94 metacritic
Also Amy Hennig's Uncharted 4 sounded bad if the rumors were true, they had to have Neil and Bruce step in to save it
Sure blame it on whatever but Uncharted 4 is a success, a great game and it sold 16 million units. Nothing will change thatTwilight has won awards. Last Jedi has won awards. Dragon Age II has won awards.
Winning awards does not indicate the media is good. The review industry has been a fucking shit show for decades.
Also fix your quoting unless you are purposefully trying to remove the quote.
Correction. You haven an illusion of control. Or did you never noticed, say, how there are always corrections on the trajectory and speed of the character when you're jumping from one boat to another, or from one vehicle to another. Or how unless you do a series of certain steps, its impossible to destroy a certain tank in a chapter of Uncharted 2, or kill a certain sniper in a part of TLoU? The game leads you into certain developments.No, i consider them innovative because you always have control during these sequences, unlike real scripted sequences previously seen in set pieces of series like Modern Warfare. It was a BIG deal. Looking at videos of course it seems scripted, but you're always in control of the character, these sequences will never play the same.
Same as the above answer. Just illusion of control.It's absolutely false, talking specifically about U3, you could approach any truck you wanted, from every side you wanted, at the speed you wanted. You can decide to just surpass them (necessary on speedruns) decide to slow down, decide to kill occupants without even leaving the horse, staying on one truck for as long as you want and after dealing with stuff go back on your horse from any direction you want (the horse just tries to follow you), with a jump or in a more careful way, and continue on. All of this feels and looks super fluid and of course looks scripted but as i said you're always in full control of your character and horse.
Nothing like this outside of it's sequels, and if there is, please bring it up.
So you can ride horses whenever and wherever you want in U3? Or jump from car to car whenever and wherever you want as long as there are cars? Or just in very specific sparts of the game? As i've been saying, illusion of control. All these things happen in extremely controlled scenarios. Being able to move your character around doesn't make them any less scripted.Gameplay mechanics during these sequences (during the whole game) are always the same, you always use the same buttons for the entire playthrough (outside of those very few QTE which are still totally absent from every sequence i'll talk about), from U2 convoys, to U3 caravan, to U4 chase sequence, to Lost Legacy ending. Out of these, only U2 one can look similar between one playthrough and the other being by far the most guided, but still, full control of the character always.
Mate, you either don't know what you're talking about or you're not explaining it properly. By "procedural ocean" you mean real time waves? I don't remember about then, but i know they were replicated fairly often. Even GTAV had them.No, absolutely not.
Devs always said they could have easily faked it, but said fuck it instead and just went with a real cruise ship on a real procedural ocean during a storm.
If you know something about programming, that is a literal nightmare no one ever attempted to replicate till this day.
Your moving a character which adjust himselft every second from huge waves rolling the ship while all kinds of object react physically to what's going on, while being on a real huge ship affected by real physics in a real, simulated ocean while having gunfights and boss battles while struggling with moving covers and enemies struggling as much as you do. Then the fucking ship rolls on one side while you're inside in full control of the character when the floor turns into walls, walls into floor, ceiling into walls. All of this without a single cut or load screen.
Now compare this to MW opening mission, and you're realizing the immense difference beetween the two. Both looks scripted on Youtube, but tecnically is like saying the Pokémon games on Game Boy are the same as RDR2 because you can go wherever you want on both games.
Cruise chapters were the very first started and very last completed, which means the sequence took them two years to build.
Scripted. Controlled scenarios. Yada yada.I mean, compared to the cruise, sure there's not much physically simulated here, but still, while controlling Drake (even when fucking flying in the air), you went from a gunfight inside of an airplane, to the sand of the desert on the ground, all while playing.
An aiplane explodes with you inside and you get sucked out while playing. Shit is nuts and still looks mindblowing.
The head writer was Amy Hennig. She was also one the directors. Neil Druckmann was one of the designers but no idea how much he had to do with the pacing.Sure, QTE and unskippable real time cutscene here and there can hurt further playthroughs. That's why people saying U2 is the best Uncharted (written/paced by guess who? Druckmann)
Don't forget, it had the most Goty awards in 2016. The link is in one of my recent posts. People like to rewrite history. You'd swear UC4 is some b tier 7/10 game. UC4 sailed in a sea of 10's and Goty awards that year and it's clearly one of the best games released this gen next to 2018's GOW.Sure blame it on whatever but Uncharted 4 is a success, a great game and it sold 16 million units. Nothing will change that