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[Napalm_Frank]

I think Osaka teams obviously has a lot of talent and I think they can see the flaws that were in DDD. I just hope they aren't a big bunch of yes-men bending over to everything Nomura comes up with.

It's fun to see which one will be the more fun to play ARPG, XV or KH3.

 

[aravuus]

Yeah, unfortunately DDD is beyond simple FM level fixing. The biggest problem is of course Flowmotion, and fixing that would force them to re-design the levels and so on, we'd get a fairly different game.

It's fun to see which one will be the more fun to play ARPG, XV or KH3.

XV already looks like a lot of fun, KH has been mostly (1, 2 and now, BBS are great) fun so yeah, I really wonder which one's gonna win.

 

[Seven Force]

Dream Drop Distance would need a full on Re:Chain of Memories/Re:Coded style overhaul for it's problems to be fixed. It's problems go beyond simply re-balancing the game or adding more content.

It's fun to see which one will be the more fun to play ARPG, XV or KH3.

Considering the team involved, I have no doubt in my mind that XV will have some amazing boss fights, at the very least.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Honestly it's not like I'd want them to waste time on remaking DDD in a big way. I had ok time with the game but I am not really looking foreward to playing it again or hoping for them to fix the game. The base story and, well, everything was fun and all for a quick handheld experience but I'd rather just let that particular game be as it is. Put those cutscenes on 2.5 and be done with it.

I'd rather have that Theatrythm or whatever for the appetizer after 2.5 and before KH3. Edit: Actually gimme a ridicilous full on Project Diva type rythm game for PS4 :lol With classic Disney songs included too!

 

[badcrumble]

Dream Drop Distance would need a full on Re:Chain of Memories/Re:Coded style overhaul for it's problems to be fixed. It's problems go beyond simply re-balancing the game or adding more content.

Yeah, this.

Honestly it's not like I'd want them to waste time on remaking DDD in a big way. I had ok time with the game but I am not really looking foreward to playing it again or hoping for them to fix the game. The base story and, well, everything was fun and all for a quick handheld experience but I'd rather just let that particular game be as it is. Put those cutscenes on 2.5 and be done with it.

Also, this.

 

[Blood Diamonds]

Wait the board game shit thing minigame is actually useful?

 

[WeaponKnight]

Wait the board game shit thing minigame is actually useful?

There are some good commands there and you can use it to level your commands if you are crazy enough to think that it's more fun than killing unverseds.

 

[Meccanical]

Wait the board game shit thing minigame is actually useful?

Yeah bro.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Another question, can you disable subtitles in the first game in the HD set? Was is it added to Final Mix? I don't like subtitles in games. First thing I turn off.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Another question, can you disable subtitles in the first game in the HD set? Was is it added to Final Mix? I don't like subtitles in games. First thing I turn off.

You can't. Unless it's some super secret thing the localization team suddenly decided to do on their own.

Here is a new official screenshot to cheer you up:

 

[RPGCrazied]

You can't. Unless it's some super secret thing the localization team suddenly decided to do on their own.

Bummer. I always wondered why they hardcoded them into the first game. Oh well, lived with it this long.

 

[Blood Diamonds]

You can't. Unless it's some super secret thing the localization team suddenly decided to do on their own.

Here is a new official screenshot to cheer you up:

omg that looks so good but... Halloween Town Sora? Was it even in the first game?

 

[Napalm_Frank]

omg that looks so good but... Halloween Town Sora? Was it even in the first game?

How could you forget Halloween Town and vampire Sora???

 

[aravuus]

omg that looks so good but... Halloween Town Sora? Was it even in the first game?

Of course it was. Geez dude, you even have a KH related avatar!

 

[Blood Diamonds]

I remember Halloween Town Sora in KH 2 lolol

All in all I loved KH 2 and KH 1 frustrated me often so I probably erased a lot of it from my memory. Honestly it's my fault because I played KH 2 first and everything felt smooth and then in KH 1 controls were kind of clunky, the camera was horrible, and I loved the flashy combat KH 2 had.

Sorry guise you can stone me now.

 

[Tenrius]

I'm playing through KH1 for the first time. I tried it a few years back, but didn't like it for some reason, thought the beginning was way too long and boring. So I got to Wonderland and just stopped. Randomly decided to resume it now and voila, I'm immensely enjoying the game.

So far beat Wonderland and the Cerberus (took several attempts and a trip back to Traverse Town for potions), going through the Deep Jungle now. One thing I don't really like is the "you have to go to a particular area after this cutscene, but you don't know which one, so you have to go check all of them" design philosophy. Like with that thing where you have to save gorillas, I saved the one in the treehouse and I don't have a clue where to go next (got to save the hunter, according to Jane). But the atmosphere, interactions between the characters and the gameplay in general are otherwise really neat! First steps of becoming a fan, I guess.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I'm playing through KH1 for the first time. I tried it a few years back, but didn't like it for some reason, thought the beginning was way too long and boring. So I got to Wonderland and just stopped. Randomly decided to resume it now and voila, I'm immensely enjoying the game.

So far beat Wonderland and the Cerberus (took several attempts and a trip back to Traverse Town for potions), going through the Deep Jungle now. One thing I don't really like is the "you have to go to a particular area after this cutscene, but you don't know which one, so you have to go check all of them" design philosophy. Like with that thing where you have to save gorillas, I saved the one in the treehouse and I don't have a clue where to go next (got to save the hunter, according to Jane). But the atmosphere, interactions between the characters and the gameplay in general are otherwise really neat! First steps of becoming a fan, I guess.

The sequels are way more streamlined when it comes to progression.

 

[Seven Force]

The sequels are way more streamlined when it comes to progression.

This, though in Kingdom Hearts II's case, it's arguably to the game's detriment.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I guess somebody in the team really didn't like the dolphin part.

 

[RPGCrazied]

Sorry about all the questions. Heres another, does ReMix support 1080p? Is it on the back of the box? Not many games can do this, but they look so fantastic in 1080p on my set.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Sorry about all the questions. Heres another, does ReMix support 1080p? Is it on the back of the box? Not many games can do this, but they look so fantastic in 1080p on my set.

AFAIK not native 1080p but it is nicely upscaled or some shiat.

 

[Seven Force]

Back of the box says something about 1080p, but I'm almost certain it's upscaled instead of native.

 

[aravuus]

Not native 1080p? That's a bit disappointing seeing how it's just a PS2 game inside.

Well whatever, it's not like my TV is full hd anyway so it doesn't matter that much.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Not native 1080p? That's a bit disappointing seeing how it's just a PS2 game inside.

Well whatever, it's not like my TV is full hd anyway so it doesn't matter that much.

Most of the PS2 collections unfortunately don't. I think Ico collection is one of the few. Okami might be one too?

 

[badcrumble]

I played KH 2 first.

It all makes sense now.

 

[badcrumble]

I'm playing through KH1 for the first time. I tried it a few years back, but didn't like it for some reason, thought the beginning was way too long and boring. So I got to Wonderland and just stopped. Randomly decided to resume it now and voila, I'm immensely enjoying the game.

So far beat Wonderland and the Cerberus (took several attempts and a trip back to Traverse Town for potions), going through the Deep Jungle now. One thing I don't really like is the "you have to go to a particular area after this cutscene, but you don't know which one, so you have to go check all of them" design philosophy. Like with that thing where you have to save gorillas, I saved the one in the treehouse and I don't have a clue where to go next (got to save the hunter, according to Jane). But the atmosphere, interactions between the characters and the gameplay in general are otherwise really neat! First steps of becoming a fan, I guess.

This is especially the case in Deep Jungle and Atlantica (though there are often dialog and/or camera clues to indicate where you ought to go next). That, combined with the fact that those worlds are more troublesome to get around in, goes a long way toward why people dislike those worlds especially.

Deep Jungle is less bad than Atlantica in terms of world design and controls, but it's also sort of a frustration point because at that point in the game you don't have the Warp Gummi, you don't have Cure yet (both of those things are obtained *after* beating the Deep Jungle boss), and the fight with Clayton and the Chameleon Heartless is actually pretty damn tricky (thanks in large part to Clayton's gunshots coming from offscreen).

 

[Tenrius]

This is especially the case in Deep Jungle and Atlantica (though there are often dialog and/or camera clues to indicate where you ought to go next). That, combined with the fact that those worlds are more troublesome to get around in, goes a long way toward why people dislike those worlds especially.

Deep Jungle is less bad than Atlantica in terms of world design and controls, but it's also sort of a frustration point because at that point in the game you don't have the Warp Gummi, you don't have Cure yet (both of those things are obtained *after* beating the Deep Jungle boss), and the fight with Clayton and the Chameleon Heartless is actually pretty damn tricky (thanks in large part to Clayton's gunshots coming from offscreen).

I actually finished it yesterday, the battle didn't seem to be too tough after the Cerberus battle (which taught me to diveroll a lot). Cure in conjunction with MP Haste is indeed great, as is the Warp Gummi (no more tedious shopping trips!). In Agrabah now. By the way, was particularly glad to see that Merlin is in the game, — The Sword in the Stone is probably my favorite Disney movie ever.

Speaking of Merlin, does destroying his furniture give or anything or is it just an endless training exercise? Also, will I be okay if I just stick to the default gummi ship? The ship designer look really confusing and I'd just rather skip it.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I actually finished it yesterday, the battle didn't seem to be too tough after the Cerberus battle (which taught me to diveroll a lot). Cure in conjunction with MP Haste is indeed great, as is the Warp Gummi (no more tedious shopping trips!). In Agrabah now. By the way, was particularly glad to see that Merlin is in the game, — The Sword in the Stone is probably my favorite Disney movie ever.

Speaking of Merlin, does destroying his furniture give or anything or is it just an endless training exercise? Also, will I be okay if I just stick to the default gummi ship? The ship designer look really confusing and I'd just rather skip it.

Furniture is just for training. Merlin does give you bonus stuff if you do some things so talk to him for example when you have obtained all 7 spell types.

Default Gummi ship should be ok, the gummi ship parts aren't that hard. There are designs you collect in the game tho so you don't need to build a ship from nothing if you want to use a new ship (if you got the neccessary blocks that is).

Also the most important thing: Sword, Shield, Staff. What did you choose?

 

[Tenrius]

Furniture is just for training. Merlin does give you bonus stuff if you do some things so talk to him for example when you have obtained all 7 spell types.

Default Gummi ship should be ok, the gummi ship parts aren't that hard. There are designs you collect in the game tho so you don't need to build a ship from nothing if you want to use a new ship (if you got the neccessary blocks that is).

Also the most important thing: Sword, Shield, Staff. What did you choose?

I think it was Staff, although I'm not 100% sure since it was three years ago, when I initially started the game. How does it work, anyway?

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I think it was Staff, although I'm not 100% sure since it was three years ago, when I initially started the game. How does it work, anyway?

You are most welcome in these parts my friend.

You gain different abilities in different levels depending what you choose. For example you get MP Haste faster with staff.

Also the stats you get with level ups differ. With staff you get more MP and AP than the other two, shield gives you defense and item slots and sword gives you strenght.

 

[badcrumble]

You are most welcome in these parts my friend.

You gain different abilities in different levels depending what you choose. For example you get MP Haste faster with staff.

Also the stats you get with level ups differ. With staff you get more MP and AP than the other two, shield gives you defense and item slots and sword gives you strenght.

Sword is basically the worst choice in vanilla KH (though it's evened out significantly in Final Mix, which severely nerfs MP Rage and MP Haste, IIRC, and adds a bunch of new and awesome combo starters and finishers, not to mention adding the essential Leaf Bracer which the Shield path gets pretty early on) because at level 99 it hasn't really gained you anything that can't be compensated for with stat up items, whereas item slots and MP are irreplaceable.

In the long run, Staff is still the best choice in Final Mix as far as Lv99 Sora is concerned, IMO. But if you're just doing a normal playthrough, it's actually a pretty balanced set of choices in Final Mix.

 

[Reyne]

Back when I was a brat in 2003, I always used to pick the sword because swords are cool. And I gave up the shield because defense is for pussies. And I didn't really like grinding for levels either... The result was a tedious trial and error against practically every boss in the game, who would slap me dead in two or three hits. Every defeated boss was an achievement. Good times.

Well, being too old for that shit now, I just take the staff and give up the sword, grind a little bit in each world and that will usually get me through most bosses without dying more than once.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I always picked Staff, even as a kid. One other friend too <3. Most of my other buddies picked sword tho .

Then one of the last buddies of mine to pick up Kingdom Hearts picked Shield, what a hipster.

Tho I do remember everyone besides the shield guy having trouble with Riku at Destiny Islands. I wonder if it was luck or if Shield really is just dat good :lol.

 

[badcrumble]

I can't remember; does the sword/staff/shield choice in KH2 affect more than simply giving you a +1 to a given stat upon making your choice? I know that you get the vast majority of your abilities in that game by getting bonus levels rather than by leveling Sora up.

Maybe it only affects the abilities Roxas learns?

 

[Napalm_Frank]

I can't remember; does the sword/staff/shield choice in KH2 affect more than simply giving you a +1 to a given stat upon making your choice? I know that you get the vast majority of your abilities in that game by getting bonus levels rather than by leveling Sora up.

Maybe it only affects the abilities Roxas learns?

I think the choice you have when picking the struggle weapon only gives you one time stat bonus, the choise you get when picking sword/shield/staff does affect abilities gained from normal level up like second chance and whatever.

 

[badcrumble]

I think the choice you have when picking the struggle weapon only gives you one time stat bonus, the choise you get when picking sword/shield/staff does affect abilities gained from normal level up like second chance and whatever.

Wait, there's a point where you make that choice that *isn't* the Struggle? Wow I've really forgotten a lot about that game.

 

[Napalm_Frank]

Wait, there's a point where you make that choice that *isn't* the Struggle? Wow I've really forgotten a lot about that game.

When you are at station of awakening, yes.

 

[Seven Force]

I can't remember; does the sword/staff/shield choice in KH2 affect more than simply giving you a +1 to a given stat upon making your choice? I know that you get the vast majority of your abilities in that game by getting bonus levels rather than by leveling Sora up.

Maybe it only affects the abilities Roxas learns?

When you choose the struggle weapon? Yeah, you only get +1 to the weapon's corresponding stat. When you do the KH1 style selection during Day 3 or so, it does affect when Sora learns certain abilities, but it's nowhere near as intricately designed as KH1's respective ability lists, and the abilities learned earlier are negligible at best.

 

[Seda]

When you choose the struggle weapon? Yeah, you only get +1 to the weapon's corresponding stat. When you do the KH1 style selection during Day 3 or so, it does affect when Sora learns certain abilities, but it's nowhere near as intricately designed as KH1's respective ability lists, and the abilities learned earlier are negligible at best.

The KH1 weapon selection is one thing I wouldn't mind returning for Kingdom Hearts 3. It made replays just a little more interesting due to significantly different skill sets and stats as you progress through the game.

 

[badcrumble]

This is one thing I wouldn't mind returning for Kingdom Hearts 3. It made replays just a little more interesting due to significantly different skill sets and stats as you progress through the game.

Yeah, I think my ideal KH3 combat system would be able to have the melee-fighting of KH1/2, an AP-free but leveling-based passive ability system, lots of passive modifiers to combos (i.e. combo starters and finishers), but actual in-combat abilities would still use the Command Deck and reload time rather than MP (because the Command Deck allows for far more diversity than just 8 magic spells).

 

[aravuus]

This may be a bit dumb thing to say, but I'm so fucking addicted to leveling up shit that if I was presented the option, I'd probably take even the shitty DDD battle system if it had a lot of sub-systems. Leveling equipment, skills, passive skills, finishers, magic spells, characters themselves, everything.

I don't know if any of you have played Tales of Graces F, but it had a ridiculously addictive title system. Every character had around a hundred different titles, and every title had 5 levels, each level granting a skill, an attribute bonus or anything in between. Sure, the battle system itself was very good but I spent waaaay too much time just grinding titles.

Leveling up shit is just fucking addictive.

 

[Seda]

This may be a bit dumb thing to say, but I'm so fucking addicted to leveling up shit that if I was presented the option, I'd probably take even the shitty DDD battle system if it had a lot of sub-systems. Leveling equipment, skills, passive skills, finishers, magic spells, characters themselves, everything.

I don't know if any of you have played Tales of Graces F, but it had a ridiculously addictive title system. Every character had around a hundred different titles, and every title had 5 levels, each level granting a skill, an attribute bonus or anything in between. Sure, the battle system itself was very good but I spent waaaay too much time just grinding titles.

Leveling up shit is just fucking addictive.

Progression systems (good ones) are one of my favorite things about RPGs. It's not dumb at all.

 

[Seven Force]

Yeah, I love a good progression system. Commands, D-Links, etc. in BBS, Sphere Grid in FFX, Titles in Graces f, etc.

It can make an otherwise boring RPG into a decent time waster for me. (see: Re:Coded)

 

[badcrumble]

Yeah. I think the Ratchet & Clank series is a good example of that (and one that feels in many ways structurally similar to Kingdom Hearts). You level up Ratchet, you level up weapons, you collect currency, all kinds of good shit. You are always less than five minutes away from unlocking *something* in that game - it's that kind of addiction that (for better or for worse) ended up being adapted to Call of Duty multiplayer.

Birth By Sleep was a good example of doing that pretty well, between story progress/bonus level, actual character level, leveling/melding commands, obtaining passive abilities, and collectathons for keyblades and Shoot Locks - and the fact that you get to do it three times over. The only real problem there was that there were too many Shoot Locks in the game and it was difficult to tell which ones were better than others.

FFXIII is a good example of something that didn't handle it too well, because it was basically just about dumping points (crystarium experience or equipment experience) into assorted buckets in order to make numbers go up.

 

[WeaponKnight]

The KH1 weapon selection is one thing I wouldn't mind returning for Kingdom Hearts 3. It made replays just a little more interesting due to significantly different skill sets and stats as you progress through the game.

It would be great, as long as it's tied to Bonus LV a la KH2 instead. I'm not even going to try a lv1 challenge on KH1 because of the lack of abilities. It would be boring.

 

[aravuus]

Progression systems (good ones) are one of my favorite things about RPGs. It's not dumb at all.

Haha yeah, maybe not indeed. I understand people have come to dislike all kinds of level systems thanks to Call of Duty but then again, I guess it doesn't have anything to do with RPGs.

FFX's sphere grid is also another example of a system done very well. It was the only system around but it was done so well, I ended up with max hp, damage and so on for most of the characters way before I could get my hands on limit breaking equipment. Grinding sphere levels was just too fun.

FF XIII's system is the complete opposite, a progression system gone horribly bad. There's nothing good about it. XIII-2 improved slightly, but it wasn't very good even then.

I also love the systems in the R&C games. I don't think there's a single weapon in the whole series I haven't maxed out at least once.

e: I want to play BBS and I want to keep on reading Dangan Ronpa, but I can only choose one for today cause they're both time consuming, and tomorrow morning I'm leaving for a weekend-long music festival. Such a tough life!

 

[badcrumble]

FFX's sphere grid is also another example of a system done very well. It was the only system around but it was done so well, I ended up with max hp, damage and so on for most of the characters way before I could get my hands on limit breaking equipment. Grinding sphere levels was just too fun.

FF XIII's system is the complete opposite, a progression system gone horribly bad. There's nothing good about it. XIII-2 improved slightly, but it wasn't very good even then.

I think what's interesting about the gap between FFX and FFXIII is that the leveling systems are visually very, very similar, but play out very, very differently.

In both of them, you get enough experience in general to level up pretty often and proceed through a generally-linear pathway with some divergences (though FFX's becomes less linear over time and is drastically less so on the Expert Grid).

However, FFX's sphere level approach (as opposed to FFXIII's set-cost crystarium points approach) makes it a lot easier to know when and how much you can level up.

Also, and this is much more crucial: the sphere grid is set up so that each stat boost you get is *immediately* noticeable, even if each one is smaller than a full level up. Str +4 makes an immediate and extremely tangible difference in how a character plays. FFXIII, however, doesn't let your actual leveling up feel like it makes a big difference until *very* late in the game (the Ark level, basically, is where the stat boosts from leveling actually become significant). This means that late-game FFX is fairly broken, balance-wise - because each point of a stat needs to really make a difference, 255 AGI (for example) is pretty bonkers and utterly broken. But it also means that the leveling up process is actually rewarding.

 

[badcrumble]

Sorry, Seda, I'm starting to stray off topic. I've been meaning to put together a discussion thread for the main gaming forum on what constitutes a good progression/ability system and got kinda carried away discussing that stuff ITT.

 

[Seda]

Sorry, Seda, I'm starting to stray off topic. I've been meaning to put together a discussion thread for the main gaming forum on what constitutes a good progression/ability system and got kinda carried away discussing that stuff ITT.

I'm fairly certain other community threads get way more off-topic than this lol.

That's definitely a cool thread idea though. Progression systems can make or break a game for me.

 

[badcrumble]

I'm fairly certain other community threads get way more off-topic than this lol.

Heh, true.

Anyhow, pretend I'm talking about what I specifically want KH3 to be like when I say this stuff it wouldn't be entirely off the mark.

I think an ideal progression system is also, very specifically, not just one that constantly gives you the short-term gratification "ping" of "yay! you leveled this thing up!" but also one that rewards focus.

What I mean, in this sense, is that although you might be leveling up 10 totally different meters (abilities, level, bonus level, obtaining new abilities, etc), you should be able to be making progress toward all of them simultaneously through the main thrust of the game.

What this means is that simply by playing more, you should also be unlocking/leveling more of everything (though obviously you should be playing correctly/intelligently/well). If you have to resort to a Water Barrel minigame to level up one specific thing and ignore all of the other meters you're filling up, the game has failed. What works in R&C is that everything is constantly leveling up as long as you're engaged in combat. I'd argue that a big problem in Birth By Sleep is precisely those goals that require you to play the Command Board or the racing minigame at the Mirage Arena specifically, because stuff like that feels like a divergence from the main path instead of continuing momentum on that main path.

BBS and DDD both have tons of subsystems, but they work much better in BBS for the most part because they're actually integrated with each other rather than distracting from each other; in practice, what this means is that if you just keep battling and making story progress, you'll get plenty of positive reinforcement (i.e. reward) in the form of constant "yay! you leveled something up!" popups. In DDD, you kinda keep needing to switch into the Water Barrel minigame or otherwise spend tons of time in the menu in order to make progress. This is directly the result of the difference in their progression systems and the integration thereof.