Support NeoGAF

[Devolution]

Guess what. I wouldnt wear the shirt either, but I wouldnt bitch at anyone for wearing it either.

Do you ever stop to think there are people who routinely deal with being called "faggot" or other such slurs? And that they don't need or want to hear/see such language outside the confines of a racist moment? Barring all acceptable contexts like civil discussions, I don't see why people have to accept other people using the terms still insultingly, then defending it with "but I'm not using it in the gay way." If one has to put that disclaimer on their language, why not just choose different words that don't have such a stigma or hurt others indirectly.

 

[Joates]

No one's implying that. But that doesn't mean people shouldn't be called out upon it. And where the HELL is faggot NOT an insult? Where the hell do you live?

Oh bubble boy, last I checked Europeans had at least one different meaning for it...

 

[Dr. Malik]

I AM OUTRAGED!

Spoiler

THAT THEY BEAT THE SPURS

But seriously it is disappointing that the word 'faggot' is still thrown out as loosely, but n-word hasn't totally disappeared either so I shouldn't be surprised.

 

[Devolution]

Oh bubble boy, last I checked Europeans had at least one different meaning for it...

Yeah people run around calling people "faggots" when they mean "cigarettes." Stop being a troll.

 

[blame space]

Webster's defines "power-bottom" as..

 

[Ollie Pooch]

Ben Cohen <3

Oh, it's Koodo. Hey man.

 

[ZephyrFate]

Oh bubble boy, last I checked Europeans had at least one different meaning for it...

Oh yeah, I'm sure it's still SOLELY a term for cigarettes and/or bundles of sticks in Europe. I highly doubt anyone calls a bundle of sticks 'faggot' over there. There's a such thing as globalization and with that comes shared definitions for words.

 

[Joates]

as of yet, the homosexual word has not morphed into something of an actual double meaning. It is very much intrinsically tied to its dialogue about sexuality and masculinity. When it does, then yes, it can and will morph.

Isnt it more important the meaning be understood between the speaker and the recipient. Who gives a fuck if Zephyrfate or anyone for that matter knows what I mean besides the person im saying it to?

Yeah people run around calling people "faggots" when they mean "cigarettes." Stop being a troll.

Oh yeah, I'm sure it's still SOLELY a term for cigarettes and/or bundles of sticks in Europe. I highly doubt anyone calls a bundle of sticks 'faggot' over there. There's a such thing as globalization and with that comes shared definitions for words.

Why the fuck did you guys ask the question if you already had an answer in mind. Youre right it cant POSSIBLY mean the other thing.

 

[IsntChrisL]

It doesn't remove the fact that it is a slur if a bunch of people use it for a different reason. If that were true, then white people would be able to say the word nigger, as long as they invented another definition for it.

It's language and it's used every single day. The indignation I'm seeing here would leave me to believe half of this place puts themselves in a bubble full of people that never say anything mean, so long as it fits their standards for insults.

White people can say whatever word they want, as can blacks (and any other race for that matter). What he said was a slur (whether or not it was directed towards gays). That's reason enough to fine him, if you must. But to take this as an opportunity to call him homophobic is outrages. The word is used in different ways and several people are refusing to acknowledge that.

 

[Devolution]

Isnt it more important the meaning be understood between the speaker and the recipient. Who gives a fuck if Zephyrfate or anyone for that matter knows what I mean besides the person im saying it to?

It's like you completely ignored what I just posted above.

 

[SolKane]

Oh bubble boy, last I checked Europeans had at least one different meaning for it...

By Europeans you mean British. Also keep in mind they don't use the word faggot as a slur. So it's a different context. American English only uses faggot in one instance, and that's as a a gay slur.

 

[Gaborn]

I AM OUTRAGED!

Spoiler

THAT THEY BEAT THE SPURS

But seriously it is disappointing that the word 'faggot' is still thrown out as loosely, but n-word hasn't totally disappeared either so I shouldn't be surprised.

I find it more mind blowing that people are actually DEFENDING using the word faggot because "language has changed." At least no one's trying that with "nigger"

 

[ZephyrFate]

Isnt it more important the meaning be understood between the speaker and the recipient. Who gives a fuck if Zephyrfate or anyone for that matter knows what I mean besides the person im saying it to?

Can I facepalm any more at your posts?

Just because you call someone a faggot but don't mean it in the gay way doesn't mean people aren't gonna turn and look at you and wonder "well shit he called that guy a faggot!", ESPECIALLY people who are gay or who are just generally offended by slurs. Living in a society means it's more than just you, or the person you talk to.

 

[Mumei]

I find it more mind blowing that people are actually DEFENDING using the word faggot because "language has changed." At least no one's trying that with "nigger"

On the contrary - that's probably the only reason they don't use it.

So inspiring in many other ways too.

Didn't know you were an Apple fan.

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

No one's implying that. But that doesn't mean people shouldn't be called out upon it. And where the HELL is faggot NOT an insult? Where the hell do you live?

He should be called out on it but not this harshly. And some people don't consider that word to be an insult depending on how its said.

 

[Joates]

Can I facepalm any more at your posts?

Just because you call someone a faggot but don't mean it in the gay way doesn't mean people aren't gonna turn and look at you and wonder "well shit he called that guy a faggot!", ESPECIALLY people who are gay or who are just generally offended by slurs. Living in a society means it's more than just you, or the person you talk to.

I guess the globalization you speak of only works one way right?

 

[Devolution]

He should be called out on it but not this harshly. And some people don't consider that word to be an insult depending on how its said.

I'm glad you're here to remind us that some people aren't offended by derogatory terms. Oh wait, no, your schtick is tired and old.

 

[razielim]

Not sure how most of the people in here get any sleep at night knowing that f___ was probably said somewhere around the world by a person they've never nor will ever meet. I don't agree with using the word but have no problem with his non-apology. Get over yourself if you think he owes you anything. You owe it to yourself to not stress out over petty crap. And yes, some random person using a word in context other than how you view it is petty crap. From the reaction to this you would have thought he skinned a live puppy on TV.

 

[Synth_floyd]

He didn't mean "faggot." What he meant was "I am very frustrated right now and am venting that verbally using a powerful word." Obviously that wouldn't sound right, nor would calling the guy a "jerk" or "loser" or "douche bag," etc. so in his moment of emotions he happened to pick the word "faggot" because it's a strong word, not because he was trying to slur gay people.

OTOH, he is a role model for many people and that kind of language should be discouraged as much as possible. What if he was a white player, and said "nigger?" Or "jew" or any other racial epithet? Those are strong words and to have a famous pro basketball player use them on national TV should be strongly condemned.

So I guess it's just kind of bad luck for Kobe that he happened to use that word when he was pissed off. He should apologize (which he already did), just pay the fine, and use it as an example in the future for equality and as a teachable moment, etc, etc.

 

[Gaborn]

On the contrary - that's probably the only reason they don't use it.

Good point. Maybe it'll swing back around one day and they can start using it again!

SynthFloyd - Somehow when I'm frustrated with someone I manage to avoid attacking their sexuality race, or making it personal in any way.

 

[Joates]

Can I facepalm any more at your posts?

Just because you call someone a faggot but don't mean it in the gay way doesn't mean people aren't gonna turn and look at you and wonder "well shit he called that guy a faggot!", ESPECIALLY people who are gay or who are just generally offended by slurs. Living in a society means it's more than just you, or the person you talk to.

Stay out of other peoples business and youll be much happier.

 

[ZephyrFate]

He should be called out on it but not this harshly. And some people don't consider that word to be an insult depending on how its said.

So because these people you've invented who don't consider it an insult (which I can only assume is anecdotal) should lessen the reaction and severity the word entails... because these five people you know who aren't offended by it don't care.

It doesn't work that way.

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

I'm glad you're here to remind us that some people aren't offended by derogatory terms. Oh wait, no, your schtick is tired and old.

And I'm glad your here to remind me that I'm wrong by at least providing an explanation. Oh, wait.

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

Do you ever stop to think there are people who routinely deal with being called "faggot" or other such slurs? And that they don't need or want to hear/see such language outside the confines of a racist moment? Barring all acceptable contexts like civil discussions, I don't see why people have to accept other people using the terms still insultingly, then defending it with "but I'm not using it in the gay way." If one has to put that disclaimer on their language, why not just choose different words that don't have such a stigma or hurt others indirectly.

There is still a lot of subjectivity in how much that word bothers a gay person. If you routinely get called faggot as an insult against your sexuality then I can understand being angry if you hear some sports star using the word, since it shows that they're sheltered from understanding the effect of that word. Personally, if somebody that I know sees me being cheap and then calls me jewish I honestly wouldn't think twice about it.

So kobe is wrong to say this but whether he is homophobic or not you can't tell from this one case.

 

[Devolution]

SynthFloyd - Somehow when I'm frustrated with someone I manage to avoid attacking their sexuality race, or making it personal in any way.

Stop being such a decent person and expecting others to do the same Gaborn, gosh, elitist.

 

[Joates]

You PCers realize the loss youre at right?

You cant control what other people say and never will.

But you can control how you react to those things. And you fail.

 

[Devolution]

There is still a lot of subjectivity in how much that word bothers a gay person. If you routinely get called faggot as an insult against your sexuality then I can understand being angry if you hear some sports star using the word, since it shows that they're sheltered from understanding the effect of that word. Personally, if somebody that I know sees me being cheap and then calls me jewish I honestly wouldn't think twice about it.

So kobe is wrong to say this but whether he is homophobic or not you can't tell from this one case.

No there isn't. You have gay posters in this very thread telling you how upset it makes them, and yet you and Cupcakes are pulling this shit.

 

[theDeeDubs]

This thread reminds me of Clerks 2 and how he's taking the slur back.

 

[ZephyrFate]

You PCers realize the loss youre at right?

You cant control what other people say and never will.

But you can control how you react to those things. And you fail.

I know, how dare we react strongly to people using incredibly offensive words, especially when they're role models for younger generations.

Maybe we should just bite our tongues. Surely that's how progress will happen.

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

So because these people you've invented who don't consider it an insult (which I can only assume is anecdotal) should lessen the reaction and severity the word entails... because these five people you know who aren't offended by it don't care.

It doesn't work that way.

No because you want some huge change and it doesn't work that way. Trying to change society's views takes time and patience and you can't force people into it or the effects can be negative.

 

[Devolution]

You PCers realize the loss youre at right?

You cant control what other people say and never will.

But you can control how you react to those things. And you fail.

lol PCers.

We can tell people all the time what they're saying is wrong. What do you think you get when you decide to just leave everyone alone who's espousing hate speech?

 

[Crumpet Trumpet]

You PCers realize the loss youre at right?

You cant control what other people say and never will.

But you can control how you react to those things. And you fail.

Why do you care so much about what the "PCers" are saying just wondering

makes you look sensitive

 

[Joates]

No there isn't. You have gay posters in this very thread telling you how upset it makes them, and yet you and Cupcakes are pulling this shit.

Gayming Age: Indicative of All Gays Viewpoints

I know, how dare we react strongly to people using incredibly offensive words, especially when they're role models for younger generations.

Maybe we should just bite our tongues. Surely that's how progress will happen.

Maybe parents should teach their kids morals instead of professional athletes :gasp:

 

[Synth_floyd]

Somehow when I'm frustrated with someone I manage to avoid attacking their sexuality race, or making it personal in any way.

How did he make it personal with the ref?

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

No there isn't. You have gay posters in this very thread telling you how upset it makes them, and yet you and Cupcakes are pulling this shit.

You're telling me there is not one gay person that is not bothered by this when a few people have said they are not offended in this very thread?

 

[ZephyrFate]

No because you want some huge change and it doesn't work that way. Trying to change society's views takes time and patience and you can't force people into it or the effects can be negative.

I don't know how anyone's being 'forced' here. And if anything, why is it such an issue to make people realize they're being ignorant with their usage of slurs? Are we that afraid of making people expend the smallest amount of effort to change their vocabulary?

Status quo indeed. Why even bother?

Joates: Maybe you don't realize how much pull professional athletes have on kids. If a kid likes basketball, and loves Kobe Bryant, his actions will no doubt set standards his parents couldn't hope to compete with.

 

[Ollie Pooch]

SynthFloyd - Somehow when I'm frustrated with someone I manage to avoid attacking their sexuality race, or making it personal in any way.

He wasn't saying he was attacking someone's sexuality, he was saying that in the heat of frustration Kobe chose a word he knew was offensive for maximum impact. Doesn't excuse it, and he appropriately made a statement about it - but fuck, people are making it into a huge thing.

 

[Gaborn]

How did he make it personal with the ref?

He didn't. He made it personal with the fans by resorting to a slur that was utterly unnecessary.

Seriously. I never use those types of words no matter how angry I get. Why should Kobe get a pass just because it's the heat of the moment. If a non-star had said it he would have been suspended.

 

[Joates]

lol PCers.

We can tell people all the time what they're saying is wrong. What do you think you get when you decide to just leave everyone alone who's espousing hate speech?

In most context its not "hate speech". But way to pretend.

 

[Londa]

Not sure how most of the people in here get any sleep at night knowing that f___ was probably said somewhere around the world by a person they've never nor will ever meet. I don't agree with using the word but have no problem with his non-apology. Get over yourself if you think he owes you anything. You owe it to yourself to not stress out over petty crap. And yes, some random person using a word in context other than how you view it is petty crap. From the reaction to this you would have thought he skinned a live puppy on TV.

You will come to identify certain users who are always on a brigade to defend and make noise.

I HOPE they aren't really this disturbed, after he apologized.

 

[nVidiot_Whore]

There's no reason this should upset anyone either way.

Kobe Bryant shouldn't be powerful enough to upset anyone's community, gay or not.

But it's also perfectly fine to believe that "faggot" isn't an acceptable generic curse word, or at the very least to not feel comfortable with it being said on an NBA broadcast.

So really.. relax.. it's not like he raped someone.

 

[Souldriver]

You PCers realize the loss youre at right?

You cant control what other people say and never will.

But you can control how you react to those things. And you fail.

People can still point out the ignorant use of slurs to others so that perhaps they won't use it in the future if they're considerate people, which I think Bryant is. That's what happened tonight. And like many employers, Bryant's doesn't like the use of slurs at the office, so the employee got a fine for using it.

I'd say the PC'ers won, if you really want to make this into a petty win/lose game.

 

[Red Blaster]

lulz at Kobe being a role model. Terrible in the clutch and had to be bailed out by fat Ron Artest in the playoffs, hates gays and raped a white girl in a Colorado hotel room.

Suspend his ass.

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

I don't know how anyone's being 'forced' here. And if anything, why is it such an issue to make people realize they're being ignorant with their usage of slurs? Are we that afraid of making people expend the smallest amount of effort to change their vocabulary?

Status quo indeed. Why even bother?

By force I don't mean beating them over the head with it but you are asking some people to change their views that they might have grown up on and thats not easy.

Its not an issue to say that its ignorant its how you go about it. If he actually lost his career because of this do you know how many people would be angry and possibly blame gay people for it?

 

[Joates]

People can still point out to others who use slurs ignorantly so that perhaps they won't use it in the future if they're considerate people. That's what happened tonight Bryant. And like many employers, Bryant's doesn't like the use of slurs at the office, so the employee got a fine for using it.

I'd say the PC'ers won, if you really want to make this into a petty win/lose game.

Yes, this is nothing new PCers have been winning for years now. God forbid we ever offend anyone. Happy holidays everybody.

 

[Devolution]

You're telling me there is not one gay person that is not bothered by this when a few people have said they are not offended in this very thread?

Why are you using them as a measurement of what is acceptable language? There are some words that target women that I don't necessarily have a problem with, but I don't let my preferences dictate how other women should feel about gendered language. And if those women are offended I could see why. I shouldn't be used as a cutoff point just because I happen to be a woman not offended. If anything you're just appealing to the people who want to use said language with "express permission" of part of a minority group. It's still not cool, I'm sorry. Use it around those friends but don't use their opinion on the word as a justification to use it everywhere.

 

[ZephyrFate]

By force I don't mean beating them over the head with it but you are asking some people to change their views that they might have grown up on and thats not easy.

Its not an issue to say that its ignorant its how you go about it. If he actually lost his career because of this do you know how many people would be angry and possibly blame gay people for it?

With how much of a douchebag Kobe is on and off the court, I don't think many would.

 

[Souldriver]

Yes, this is nothing new PCers have been winning for years now. God forbid we ever offend anyone. Happy holidays everybody.

Offending anybody is fine, but don't cry when you get called out for it.

 

[Joates]

Offending anybody is fine, but don't cry when you get called out for it.

lol. Thats a funny one. And if someone doesnt care that you take offense to something and goes harder on you, dont go crying, grow some thicker skin.

With how much of a douchebag Kobe is on and off the court, I don't think many would.

If people hate the gay populace as much as you guys know they do, it wouldnt matter who lost their job. Its the fact that the gays caused it, thats the issue.

 

[ChocolateCupcakes]

With how much of a douchebag Kobe is on and off the court, I don't think many would.

You would be surprised how many fans he has. He isn't making that much money based only on his talent.