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[hououinkyouma00]

The revisionism is off the charts. Ps5 pro support far superior to early 4 Pro.

I agree with this but I do think that the PS4 Pro upgrades were more easily noticeable to more people especially at the time.

When the PS4 Pro came out 4K tvs were just really getting popular and a lot of people didn’t have them so when they got the Pro or the One X and a 4K tv the difference was immediately noticeable most of the time even early on.

With the PS5 Pro we were already getting higher resolutions and 60fps for years. It’s mainly just combining the two and raising a few settings.

I would say the only game that I’ve played that is immediately noticeable in the same way as booting up your first 4K game on PS4 Pro was FF7R.

The upgrades for PS5 Pro are overall better but I don’t think most people would look at them and immediately notice the difference as much if you put a PS4/Pro side by side on a 1080p and 4K tv and a PS5/Pro side by side on two 4K tvs.

 

[Topher]

KCD 2 really looks good on the Pro. I'm impressed

 

[diffusionx]

KCD 2 really looks good on the Pro. I'm impressed

The launch round of PS5 Pro games was pretty suspect outside of Sony games but they were already much better by the second time around. It's a good piece of hardware and PSSR is a good algorithm.

 

[scydrex]

Uncharted Lost Legacy was bumped up to 4K60FPS

In fact just looking at the list of upgrades for games it's ranges from 4k60fps, Native 4K30fps
to improved polygon models, textures, draw distance, lighting, shadows (including increase Shadow map resolution) higher quality Anti-aliasing, increased particle effects, Tessellation(not present in PS4), motion blur.
List goes on
And some games have multiple of those upgrades at the same time.

PS5 Pro?
The shitty Performance mode upscaled to 4K with artifacts
Yes CB upscaling had artifacts too, but the other option available was 1080p or lower.
So the CB Upscaling was a massive improvement.
That's not the case for PS5 Pro.

How many games ran at 60fps on PS4 pro? Locked? I know there are some that runs at 60fps unlocked.
How many games had better graphics settings on the pro? I don't remember a lot.
All the things abut the PSSR they will continue to improve it and get better. Like Jedi Survivor it had been improve and still can.
The games having problems were or are using and old PSSR version. All the AI upscaling have problems DLSS, FSR, XESS and PSSR it comes with a price. If you don´t want that then native res.
I had a PS4 pro didn´t impressed me. Sold it after a couple of months. Then later got a ps4 slim and i was happier with the slim. Quieter, smaller and better power consumption in exchange of mostly a hit in res.
With the PS5 Pro i'm happy better IQ at 60fps that´s all i wanted. KCD 2 looks awesome on PS5 pro. It´s delivering what it promise to do. Can´t wait to finish KCD 1 and start KCD 2 right away.

 

[TGO]

How many games ran at 60fps on PS4 pro? Locked? I know there are some that runs at 60fps unlocked.
How many games had better graphics settings on the pro? I don't remember a lot.

You said

The PS4 Pro was just higher res still 30fps.

Which simply wasn't true.
Locked or unlocked makes no difference as the PS5 Pro ain't delivering locked 60fps or 120fps in all it's games either.
And many games had improved graphical setting.
There's a website full of all the improvements
Go have look
Increase AF, DOF, textures, LOD and shadows and lighting are amongst the features the Pro added.
My point is the PS5 Pro is just upscaling the performance mode of games and it should be better.
No game looked better on PS4 over the Pro, None.
The difference was big and noticeable even if you down sampled on a 1080p screen.
With PS5 Pro all you got is "it's 60fps and almost looks as good as the base PS5"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't know what to tell you if you can't see how shitty an upgrade that is.
Now I ain't saying all PS5 Pro games have a bad Pro Mode.
I've repeatedly said Stellar Blade & Horizon look fantastic.
There games where the resolution was lower on based PS5 and the Pro delivers 4k60fps.
This is also great.
But when they just throw PSSR on the performance mode and call it a day, especially when it's already hitting 4K on the base PS5 then that's a shitty upgrade whether it's 60fps or not.
I expect more and so should all of you.

 

[TehGoomba7s]

You said

Which simply wasn't true.
Locked or unlocked makes no difference as the PS5 Pro ain't delivering locked 60fps or 120fps in all it's games either.
And many games had improved graphical setting.
There's a website full of all the improvements
Go have look
Increase AF, DOF, textures, LOD and shadows and lighting are amongst the features the Pro added.
My point is the PS5 Pro is just upscaling the performance mode of games and it should be better.
No game looked better on PS4 over the Pro, None.
The difference was big and noticeable even if you down sampled on a 1080p screen.
With PS5 Pro all you got is "it's 60fps and almost looks as good as the base PS5"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't know what to tell you if you can't see how shitty an upgrade that is.
Now I ain't saying all PS5 Pro games have a bad Pro Mode.
I've repeatedly said Stellar Blade & Horizon look fantastic.
There games where the resolution was lower on based PS5 and the Pro delivers 4k60fps.
This is also great.
But when they just throw PSSR on the performance mode and call it a day, especially when it's already hitting 4K on the base PS5 then that's a shitty upgrade whether it's 60fps or not.
I expect more and so should all of you.

There are no games that look better on base PS5 compared to Pro. None.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

You said

Which simply wasn't true.
Locked or unlocked makes no difference as the PS5 Pro ain't delivering locked 60fps or 120fps in all it's games either.
And many games had improved graphical setting.
There's a website full of all the improvements
Go have look
Increase AF, DOF, textures, LOD and shadows and lighting are amongst the features the Pro added.
My point is the PS5 Pro is just upscaling the performance mode of games and it should be better.
No game looked better on PS4 over the Pro, None.
The difference was big and noticeable even if you down sampled on a 1080p screen.
With PS5 Pro all you got is "it's 60fps and almost looks as good as the base PS5"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't know what to tell you if you can't see how shitty an upgrade that is.
Now I ain't saying all PS5 Pro games have a bad Pro Mode.
I've repeatedly said Stellar Blade & Horizon look fantastic.
There games where the resolution was lower on based PS5 and the Pro delivers 4k60fps.
This is also great.
But when they just throw PSSR on the performance mode and call it a day, especially when it's already hitting 4K on the base PS5 then that's a shitty upgrade whether it's 60fps or not.
I expect more and so should all of you.

The issue is your demand comes for the manufacturer when their games cover what was promised. Also, having an expectation is fine, but trying to revise history and make the PS4 Pro seem like it was faultless or flawless at launch is simply disingenuous. A LOT of gripes about it being incapable of a constant 4K/60fps were levied on it, for example. Only since the 5 Pro released is it suddenly remembered as this complete upgrade to the 4.

Now, I got what I expected out of the 5 Pro already. Perhaps you didn’t, but that’s less a Sony or Pro fault. The hardware and tools are there and plenty of games have seen substantial improvements. That some 3rd Party devs have chosen to either be lazy or premature with their updates is a sidestep to that.

 

[TGO]

There are no games that look better on base PS5 compared to Pro. None.

Really

I wonder what they're on about
Thing is, we've heard the complaints about a some titles while others are praised.
But FFVII Rebirth it, The Last of Us has it.
Its easier to count the games that doesn't look like a YouTube video, but hey teh 60fps is so awesome!

The issue is your demand comes for the manufacturer when their games cover what was promised. Also, having an expectation is fine, but trying to revise history and make the PS4 Pro seem like it was faultless or flawless at launch is simply disingenuous. A LOT of gripes about it being incapable of a constant 4K/60fps were levied on it, for example. Only since the 5 Pro released is it suddenly remembered as this complete upgrade to the 4.

Now, I got what I expected out of the 5 Pro already. Perhaps you didn’t, but that’s less a Sony or Pro fault. The hardware and tools are there and plenty of games have seen substantial improvements. That some 3rd Party devs have chosen to either be lazy or premature with their updates is a sidestep to that.

The promise was 60fps with Quality Mode graphics, not 60fps via PSnow.
And as I said, not all games have bad Pro modes.
This can be fix and they can put more effort in.
But not if people pretend it's okay.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

The promise was 60fps with Quality Mode graphics, not 60fps via PSnow

Yeah, the games I play offer that. Sorry yours don’t.

 

[TGO]

Yeah, the games I play offer that. Sorry yours don’t.

Thanks man
You don't know how it feels to switch back to quality mode because the Pro Mode looks like it's suffering from mpeg compression..

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Thanks man
You don't know how it feels to switch back to quality mode because the Pro Mode looks like it's suffering from mpeg compression..

Play better games or find a buyer okay with splurging on a used Pro.

 

[TGO]

Play better games or find a buyer okay with splurging on a used Pro.

I'm playing FFVII Rebirth at the moment and I'm sticking with Quality Mode, Stellar Blade looks fantastic as does the Horizon series.
I was actually happy with Dead Rising Deluxe Remaster.
And there are a few games that the resolution was shit before and this has improved them.
But it's the games that already look good, they add PSSR and it looks worse (better if you play exclusively in Performance mode with shit IQ) but compared to Quality Mode, it looks worse.
Btw I hit you up with a like because of this quote

Now, I got what I expected out of the 5 Pro already. Perhaps you didn’t, but that’s less a Sony or Pro fault. The hardware and tools are there and plenty of games have seen substantial improvements. That some 3rd Party devs have chosen to either be lazy or premature with their updates is a sidestep to that.

That is my problem.
But people only call it out when it's really bad, when it's present in a lot more games, even ones that are being praised

 

[viveks86]

I expect more and so should all of you.

Here's my take on all of this. May be this is why my expectation isn't as high as yours. The PS4 Pro doubled rasterization output with a butterfly design. The PS5 Pro did not. It's trying to get the same results via AI upscaling and RT upgrades. A raw doubling of output is simply not viable given that Moore's law is dead and we are hitting a ceiling with chip costs. Given that PSSR is an infant and knowing ML takes years of refinement, it's simply unrealistic to expect more at launch. We are, for better or worse, the early adopters funding this towards a mature PS6 solution. You can say "I don't care and as a consumer, I have the rights to be disappointed". But know that it is also your responsibility to make informed decisions with your money. If you bought it without knowing how long this will take to actually hit Cerny's goals, if ever, then you may have pulled the trigger too soon. Not here to tell you how to think or buy, but if you are asking me to expect something different than I do, you are inviting me to such an exchange.

 

[HeWhoWalks]

Here's my take on all of this. May be this is why my expectation isn't as high as yours. The PS4 Pro doubled their rasterization output with a butterfly design. The PS5 Pro did not. It's trying to get the same results via AI upscaling and RT upgrades. A raw doubling of output is simply not viable given that Moore's law is dead and we are hitting a ceiling with chip costs. Given that PSSR is an infant and knowing ML takes years of refinement, it's simply unrealistic to expect more at launch. We are, for better or worse, the early adopters funding this towards a mature PS6 solution. You can say "I don't care and as a consumer, I have the rights to be disappointed". But know that it is also your responsibility to make informed decisions with your money. If you bought it without knowing how long this will take to actually hit Cerny's goals, if ever, then you may have pulled the trigger too soon. Not here to tell you how to think or buy, but if you are asking me to expect something different than I do, you are inviting me to such an exchange.

Nailed it.

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

Here's my take on all of this. May be this is why my expectation isn't as high as yours. The PS4 Pro doubled their rasterization output with a butterfly design. The PS5 Pro did not. It's trying to get the same results via AI upscaling and RT upgrades. A raw doubling of output is simply not viable given that Moore's law is dead and we are hitting a ceiling with chip costs. Given that PSSR is an infant and knowing ML takes years of refinement, it's simply unrealistic to expect more at launch. We are, for better or worse, the early adopters funding this towards a mature PS6 solution. You can say "I don't care and as a consumer, I have the rights to be disappointed". But know that it is also your responsibility to make informed decisions with your money. If you bought it without knowing how long this will take to actually hit Cerny's goals, if ever, then you may have pulled the trigger too soon. Not here to tell you how to think or buy, but if you are asking me to expect something different than I do, you are inviting me to such an exchange.

I personally went in knowing early adopters would be beta testers for PSSR and PS6 wide spread usage

I expected growing pains

 

[HeWhoWalks]

That is my problem.
But people only call it out when it's really bad, when it's present in a lot more games, even ones that are being praised

I look at it from the perspective of totality (and, again, maybe this is just based on the different games we play). Right now, the only true letdown in my collection is Silent Hill 2 (made worse by the fact that I also own it on a monstrous rig and it’s light years ahead of both console versions).

That said, I also got a solid upgrade in most games that mattered (stuff like both Last of Us titles, both Horizons, all three Spider-Man games, Callisto, GT7, Until Dawn, and quite a few more). Growing pains and all.

Not that I think you are without validity, quite the opposite, but I do think some perspective is needed.

 

[Topher]

You said

Which simply wasn't true.
Locked or unlocked makes no difference as the PS5 Pro ain't delivering locked 60fps or 120fps in all it's games either.
And many games had improved graphical setting.
There's a website full of all the improvements
Go have look
Increase AF, DOF, textures, LOD and shadows and lighting are amongst the features the Pro added.
My point is the PS5 Pro is just upscaling the performance mode of games and it should be better.
No game looked better on PS4 over the Pro, None.
The difference was big and noticeable even if you down sampled on a 1080p screen.
With PS5 Pro all you got is "it's 60fps and almost looks as good as the base PS5"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't know what to tell you if you can't see how shitty an upgrade that is.
Now I ain't saying all PS5 Pro games have a bad Pro Mode.
I've repeatedly said Stellar Blade & Horizon look fantastic.
There games where the resolution was lower on based PS5 and the Pro delivers 4k60fps.
This is also great.
But when they just throw PSSR on the performance mode and call it a day, especially when it's already hitting 4K on the base PS5 then that's a shitty upgrade whether it's 60fps or not.
I expect more and so should all of you.

Eh....I'm not going to tell you what your expectations should be. That should be the case both ways. Too bad. Not much to discuss with that attitude really.

 

[viveks86]

I personally went in knowing early adopters would be beta testers for PSSR and PS6 wide spread usage

I expected growing pains

But you are the wisest around here. I would expect no less from you!

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

But you are the wisest around here. I would expect no less from you!

Did you just politely call me old???

 

[viveks86]

Did you just politely call me old???

Not this time

 

[Topher]

Here's my take on all of this. May be this is why my expectation isn't as high as yours. The PS4 Pro doubled their rasterization output with a butterfly design. The PS5 Pro did not. It's trying to get the same results via AI upscaling and RT upgrades. A raw doubling of output is simply not viable given that Moore's law is dead and we are hitting a ceiling with chip costs. Given that PSSR is an infant and knowing ML takes years of refinement, it's simply unrealistic to expect more at launch. We are, for better or worse, the early adopters funding this towards a mature PS6 solution. You can say "I don't care and as a consumer, I have the rights to be disappointed". But know that it is also your responsibility to make informed decisions with your money. If you bought it without knowing how long this will take to actually hit Cerny's goals, if ever, then you may have pulled the trigger too soon. Not here to tell you how to think or buy, but if you are asking me to expect something different than I do, you are inviting me to such an exchange.

I personally went in knowing early adopters would be beta testers for PSSR and PS6 wide spread usage

I expected growing pains

I get that PS6 will be building on what is done here with PS5 Pro, but personally I think Pro has turned out pretty damn good standing on its own. Previously I had PS5 for exclusives only. Now Pro has made console a viable system for all games. The two standout games I've played so far are KCD 2 and Space Marine 2. Great looking/performing games that I would absolutely be playing on PC if not for Pro. Biggest disappointment has been Helldivers 2 and I've expressed that here. But that is a problem with the game Arrowhead and Sony need to address. That isn't a problem tied to the hardware or the upscaling tech. The problem I have with a lot of the criticism here is that it wants to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Nothing wrong with folks pointing fingers at games with issues and saying it needs to be fixed. But summarily suggesting the hardware isn't what it should be because of that makes zero sense to me when we already have seen what it can do.

/rant

 

[Topher]

But you are the wisest and oldest around here. I would expect no less from you!

ftfy

 

[HeisenbergFX4]

I get that PS6 will be building on what is done here with PS5 Pro, but personally I think Pro has turned out pretty damn good standing on its own. Previously I had PS5 for exclusives only. Now Pro has made console a viable system for all games. The two standout games I've played so far are KCD 2 and Space Marine 2. Great looking/performing games that I would absolutely be playing on PC if not for Pro. Biggest disappointment has been Helldivers 2 and I've expressed that here. But that is a problem with the game Arrowhead and Sony need to address. That isn't a problem tied to the hardware or the upscaling tech. The problem I have with a lot of the criticism here is that it wants to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Nothing wrong with folks pointing fingers at games with issues and saying it needs to be fixed. But summarily suggesting the hardware isn't what it should be because of that makes zero sense to me when we already have seen what it can do.

/rant

Well said and I too am very pleased with it

ftfy

I take back the compliment of that previous post being well said

 

[LectureMaster]

What my man Topher claimed:

but personally I think Pro has turned out pretty damn good standing on its own. Previously I had PS5 for exclusives only. Now Pro has made console a viable system for all games.

What really happened:
He deleted his PC by accidentally dragging it to recycle bin, and now he's only stuck with PS5 Pro.

 

[Topher]

What's my man Topher claimed:


What really happened:
He deleted his PC by accidentally dragging it to recycle bin, and now he's only stuck with PS5 Pro.

 

[TGO]

Eh....I'm not going to tell you what your expectations should be. That should be the case both ways. Too bad. Not much to discuss with that attitude really.

Honestly opinion, which is which

You can post "there the same picture" if you want
But there is a difference, but which is the Base PS5 and which is the Pro

 

[scydrex]

Thanks man
You don't know how it feels to switch back to quality mode because the Pro Mode looks like it's suffering from mpeg compression..

If you aren't happy with what the PS5 Pro offers sell it and get a PS5 slim. That's what did with the PS4 Pro. Had a PS4 fat from 2014. Bought the PS4 Pro in december after release. I had the PS4 Pro until november the year after. Got on Black Friday a PS4 Slim bundle for 199 with horizon, gow and tlou remastered. Why i did it? Wasnt happy with the PS4 pro. Clearly you feel the same.

 

[Topher]

Honestly opinion, which is which

You can post "there the same picture" if you want
But there is a difference, but which is the Base PS5 and which is the Pro

I have no idea. What's the point?

 

[TGO]

I have no idea. What's the point?

The left is base PS5, The Right is Pro

Look at the create next to the two women in the shadows
The stone texture, Clouds hair
And don't know what's going on with the foliage in the back.
That's my point, people keep saying the Pro looks better when it doesn't.
People can say that's an okay compromise to achieve 60fps and I'm okay with that, but people telling me that it better?

S scydrex
It plays PS5 games, if the games were locked to the PS5 Pro outputs I may have considered that.
Luckily it's a choice, but I just don't people telling me my eyes are wrong.

 

[vkbest]

The left is base PS5, The Right is Pro

Look at the create next to the two women in the shadows
The stone texture, Clouds hair
And don't know what's going on with the foliage in the back.
That's my point, people keep saying the Pro looks better when it doesn't.
People can say that's an okay compromise to achieve 60fps and I'm okay with that, but people telling me that it better?

S scydrex
It plays PS5 games, if the games were locked to the PS5 Pro outputs I may have considered that.
Luckily it's a choice, but I just don't people telling me my eyes are wrong.

Now post a comparison image in motion

 

[scydrex]

The left is base PS5, The Right is Pro

Look at the create next to the two women in the shadows
The stone texture, Clouds hair
And don't know what's going on with the foliage in the back.
That's my point, people keep saying the Pro looks better when it doesn't.
People can say that's an okay compromise to achieve 60fps and I'm okay with that, but people telling me that it better?

So DF and everyone that said FF7 Rebirth is better on PS5 Pro they are wrong. Is that performance mode on PS5 base and PS5 Pro? What mode are those?

 

[Complistic]

The left is base PS5, The Right is Pro

Look at the create next to the two women in the shadows
The stone texture, Clouds hair
And don't know what's going on with the foliage in the back.
That's my point, people keep saying the Pro looks better when it doesn't.
People can say that's an okay compromise to achieve 60fps and I'm okay with that, but people telling me that it better?

If FF7 were a power point presentation I would agree.

 

[Killer8]

Yeah it’s only the first 5 minutes
Everything after is fine

The game looks good regardless of whether it’s optimally enhanced or not.

I’m not holding my breath for another Bloober team update of any significance

I preferred 60fps on pro

I would go with the 30fps quality mode. It's a game heavy on atmosphere and there are too many cut backs to the lighting in 60fps for my liking.

The reflections also got even worse than the already low quality found in quality mode.

It's a game that doesn't really need 60fps either. Combat consists of hitting blobby sacks of meat a few times and occasionally pressing circle to dodge obviously telegraphed vomit attacks. Not exactly Ninja Gaiden.

 

[Markio128]

TGO has spent too long on the hype train and the fumes have gone to his head I reckon.

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Biggest disappointment has been Helldivers 2 and I've expressed that here. But that is a problem with the game Arrowhead and Sony need to address. That isn't a problem tied to the hardware or the upscaling tech. The problem I have with a lot of the criticism here is that it wants to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Nothing wrong with folks pointing fingers at games with issues and saying it needs to be fixed. But summarily suggesting the hardware isn't what it should be because of that makes zero sense to me when we already have seen what it can do.

I get people's frustrations with Helldivers 2 since it is such a big game for Sony, but the success of the game doesn't really change the parameters of it.

Arrowhead is still a small team that has bigger fish to fry. They have to balance upgrades to this game while working on new games. It also has an archaic engine.

If I'm Sony/Arrowhead my goal would be to do Helldivers 3 in Decima and have it on PS5, PS5 Pro, PS6, PS Handheld, PC, and Mobile.

Sony's relationship with Arrowhead is also complex. Is Helldivers 3 their next game? Does Sony have to go to a different studio for Helldivers 3? If Arrowhead won't sell it makes working for Sony long-term pretty perilous. Unless they create a joint venture that will spearhead Helldivers into the future, you're always going to have this publisher-developer relationship, which is frot with issues on a game like this.

Arrowhead needs to like double in size at the minimum to make Helldivers 3 the game it should be from a revenue/profit standpoint, but their leadership seem to want to take that chance on their own. Insomniac had similar feelings and it didn't work out well, but other studios like Mojang had worked with Sony and get a bigger pay day later.

 

[viveks86]

I get people's frustrations with Helldivers 2 since it is such a big game for Sony, but the success of the game doesn't really change the parameters of it.

Arrowhead is still a small team that has bigger fish to fry. They have to balance upgrades to this game while working on new games. It also has an archaic engine.

If I'm Sony/Arrowhead my goal would be to do Helldivers 3 in Decima and have it on PS5, PS5 Pro, PS6, PS Handheld, PC, and Mobile.

Sony's relationship with Arrowhead is also complex. Is Helldivers 3 their next game? Does Sony have to go to a different studio for Helldivers 3? If Arrowhead won't sell it makes working for Sony long-term pretty perilous. Unless they create a joint venture that will spearhead Helldivers into the future, you're always going to have this publisher-developer relationship, which is frot with issues on a game like this.

Arrowhead needs to like double in size at the minimum to make Helldivers 3 the game it should be from a revenue/profit standpoint, but their leadership seem to want to take that chance on their own. Insomniac had similar feelings and it didn't work out well, but other studios like Mojang had worked with Sony and get a bigger pay day later.

Will there even be a Helldivers 3 though? The fight for democracy may never end!

 

[Mibu no ookami]

So DF and everyone that said FF7 Rebirth is better on PS5 Pro they are wrong. Is that performance mode on PS5 base and PS5 Pro? What mode are those?

He's comparing the 30 fps fidelity mode on the base PS5 to the 60 fps Pro mode on PS5 Pro. Massively disingenuous but hey, why not right?

I think most people know that whether a game's pro mode is better than the base fidelity mode is largely going to depend on how far the fidelity mode is from 60 fps. To double the framerate and have the game look essentially the same as the fidelity mdoe in motion is a massive achievement.

The Base doesn't even have a 40 fps mode, that should tell you how far it is from 60 fps...

 

[Mibu no ookami]

Will there even be a Helldivers 3 though? The fight for democracy may never end!

I don't think Helldivers 2 can survive on the stingray engine. I think that if I'm Sony I want the game on mobile and with better resolution and framerate than it has right now.

I can see Helldivers 3 coming out as a launch title for PS6, but being cross-gen.

 

[TehGoomba7s]

Really

I wonder what they're on about
Thing is, we've heard the complaints about a some titles while others are praised.
But FFVII Rebirth it, The Last of Us has it.
Its easier to count the games that doesn't look like a YouTube video, but hey teh 60fps is so awesome!

The promise was 60fps with Quality Mode graphics, not 60fps via PSnow.
And as I said, not all games have bad Pro modes.
This can be fix and they can put more effort in.
But not if people pretend it's okay.

Yeah none of those in that video do.

 

[TGO]

Now post a comparison image in motion

If I could capture uncompressed footage I would, but I'm sure you don't want that illusion shattered.
I'm in the area with all the blue flowers and...damn, I knew instantly what to expect and switch it over to confirm

So DF and everyone that said FF7 Rebirth is better on PS5 Pro they are wrong. Is that performance mode on PS5 base and PS5 Pro? What mode are those?

This is why I get aggravated, I have said several times "sure it's better then the Vaseline Performance mode"
But people have been saying it's better then the base default Quality Mode and that's simply not the case.
I've said this several times

If FF7 were a power point presentation I would agree.

Don't know how to tell you this but most of your time you're spent look here

And it looks like this

 

[Topher]

The left is base PS5, The Right is Pro

Look at the create next to the two women in the shadows
The stone texture, Clouds hair
And don't know what's going on with the foliage in the back.
That's my point, people keep saying the Pro looks better when it doesn't.
People can say that's an okay compromise to achieve 60fps and I'm okay with that, but people telling me that it better?

Doesn't really have anything to do with what I said my man. I don't recall suggesting any of the points you made about specific games being necessarily wrong. Just seems to me that you want to elevate specific issues with specific games to problems at a system level meanwhile wagging your finger at others who don't see it the same.

 

[Skifi28]

I have no idea why we're comparing 30fps modes with 60 ones. The comparison should obviously be with the previous 60fps mode that is night and day difference and previously was nearly unplayable for some of us as the image quality was offensive. A ~1080p mode with PSSR looking even close to the native 4k30 mode is an achievement in itself. Not to mention despite the generally inferior image quality there are still improvements like no ghosting which Rebirth heavily suffered from.....on top of double the framerate. I can't comprehent how this is disappointing or why we're having this discussion.

 

[viveks86]

He's comparing the 30 fps fidelity mode on the base PS5 to the 60 fps Pro mode on PS5 Pro. Massively disingenuous but hey, why not right?

In his defense, I don't think he is trying to misrepresent the modes. He just expected it to be a no-compromise uplift from 30 to 60, given all the praise it received. Clearly, some compromise was made. Most of us don't think the compromise is noteworthy, but he does. Therein lies the disagreement.

 

[vkbest]

PS5 Fidelity



PS5 Pro PSSR



I don't know, but the 30fps looks pretty blurry to me.

 

[Topher]

I have no idea why we're comparing 30fps modes with 60 ones. The comparison should obviously be with the previous 60fps mode that is night and day difference and previously was nearly unplayable for some of us as the image quality was offensive. A ~1080p mode with PSSR looking even close to the native 4k30 mode is an achievement in itself. Not to mention despite the generally inferior image quality there are still improvements like no ghosting.....on top of double the framerate. I can't comprehent how this is disappoing or why we're having this discussion.

Mark Cerny said the Pro performance mode would be "near" the quality mode of PS5 while targeting 60fps. So I don't have a problem necessarily with that comparison since that what the selling pitch of the Pro. At the same time, I get your point. I was only ever going to play games at 60fps on either system so the improved visuals from PS5 performance mode to Pro performance mode is what interests me the most.

 

[TGO]

Doesn't really have anything to do with what I said my man. I don't recall suggesting any of the points you made about specific games being necessarily wrong. Just seems to me that you want to elevate specific issues with specific games to problems at a system level meanwhile wagging your finger at others who don't see it the same.

Sorry Toph, I don't recall you actually saying anything in that regard.
I can just rely on you for honesty and that's why I asked you.
as I said before
If you can't see it or don't mind the compromise, that's fine
But I don't like people saying I'm imagining it when I'm clearly not.
That's all

 

[Skifi28]

Mark Cerny said the Pro performance mode would be "near" the quality mode of PS5 while targeting 60fps. So I don't have a problem necessarily with that comparison since that what the selling pitch of the Pro. At the same time, I get your point. I was only ever going to play games at 60fps on either system so the improved visuals from PS5 performance mode to Pro performance mode is what interests me the most.

I think the Cerny statement is taken a bit too literally by some. I don't think he meant that if you zoomed in 4x times it would always be identical, but it would generally be comparable which seems to be the case for most games. There is a compromise as there will always be with AI reconstruction, but it's a very easy one to make.

 

[diffusionx]

You said

Which simply wasn't true.
Locked or unlocked makes no difference as the PS5 Pro ain't delivering locked 60fps or 120fps in all it's games either.
And many games had improved graphical setting.
There's a website full of all the improvements
Go have look
Increase AF, DOF, textures, LOD and shadows and lighting are amongst the features the Pro added.
My point is the PS5 Pro is just upscaling the performance mode of games and it should be better.
No game looked better on PS4 over the Pro, None.
The difference was big and noticeable even if you down sampled on a 1080p screen.
With PS5 Pro all you got is "it's 60fps and almost looks as good as the base PS5"
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I don't know what to tell you if you can't see how shitty an upgrade that is.
Now I ain't saying all PS5 Pro games have a bad Pro Mode.
I've repeatedly said Stellar Blade & Horizon look fantastic.
There games where the resolution was lower on based PS5 and the Pro delivers 4k60fps.
This is also great.
But when they just throw PSSR on the performance mode and call it a day, especially when it's already hitting 4K on the base PS5 then that's a shitty upgrade whether it's 60fps or not.
I expect more and so should all of you.

I addressed your point about Lost Legacy being 4K/60fps on PS4 Pro which was just false. So I don't know what your frame of reference is but it seems incorrect.

Base PS5 is delivering 60fps modes in the vast majority of its games (something like 99% of games have a 60fps mode) and for the most part they are 60fps modes. The fact that the game goes down to 53fps in .00000001 second that you can only see in a DF video is not worth talking about. PS4 Pro had "performance" modes that were unlocked framerates but usually in the 40-50fps mode. Of course these modes were great when PS5 came out because you had locked 60fps in backwards compatibility. Here is an article on Sekiro that discusses the unstable "60fps" mode, which I played through on PS5 and it was great, perfect 60fps:

Does Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice improve over Dark Souls' performance issues?

Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice is a spiritual follow-up to the Souls series with a very different visual style and a range o…

www.eurogamer.net

We were not getting 60fps on PS4 Pro. We got it on PS5. So we didn't need a PS5 Pro to get 60fps because we already had it. What we did have with PS5 was often severe cutback to resolution/settings to get to 60fps. That is what the PS5 Pro seeks to fix and that is how it should be judged. I think, for the most part, it's delivered on that promise, especially with the patches that came out after the initial release.

 

[viveks86]

But I don't like people saying I'm imagining it when I'm clearly not.
That's all

Are you feeling gaslit? I think you are feeling gaslit. Your vision is fine. The issue is in perspective.

 

[TGO]

PS5 Fidelity



PS5 Pro PSSR



I don't know, but the 30fps looks pretty blurry to me.

Your PS5 is broken, go home.