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[Screaming Meat]

Ghost Babel tells a story. V lifts some of GB's beats, but still doesn't tell a story.
I think people got disappointed by the lack of structure in V's story, and then started picking apart it's gameplay. Had the game been focused enough to tell a story, I don't the hate would have been this strong.

While I see what you're saying, that's not really the point I was making. The poster said that TPP was a bad game partly because it doesn't impact the timeline. Ghost Babel doesn't either. That particular aspect (the lack of impact on the timeline itself) doesn't make TPP a bad game. That has nothing to do with it at all.

 

[Ashura_MX]

Ghost Babel tells a story. V lifts some of GB's beats, but still doesn't tell a story.
I think people got disappointed by the lack of structure in V's story, and then started picking apart it's gameplay. Had the game been focused enough to tell a story, I don't the hate would have been this strong.

I haven't hated on the gameplay past the fucking chopper and FOB being "optional".

I guess the most hardocore players miss difficulty settings.

 

[Ashura_MX]

While I see what you're saying, that's not really the point I was making. The poster said that TPP was a bad game partly because it doesn't impact the timeline. Ghost Babel doesn't either. That particular aspect (the lack of impact on the timeline itself) doesn't make TPP a bad game.

Just a bad MGS game, there's a difference.

The game is a few tweaks away from being a 12/10 game (Smaller open world, more bases, less parasites, proper mission structure), but because Kojima wanted to explain everything with tits and deeds, its fucked up and broken.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Just a bad MGS game, there's a difference.

Is Ghost Babel a bad MGS game because it doesn't impact the series timeline...? No, because the story's impact on the timeline has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the game or the narrative.

 

[KOMANI]

That's a pretty reductionist assessment.

Plus, the Eli story does have an ending: he gets away.

Done. Is it a satisfying conclusion? Clearly not for some, but that's an ending.... thinking about it, it is not too dissimilar to MGS2's cliffhanger.

Those previous cliffhangers came in a form of after credit scenes, and were intended. That mission is unfinished, the game is unfinished. Sometimes you can get away with it (mgs2) sometimes you can't (mgs4 act 3).
You're satisfied with an unfinished game... That's cool. Sincerely. But I find it disappointing.
And you can label my assessment of the game as reductive but... It's really one story mission, and a bunch of sub plots.
Game starts with prologue and ends with it
All story with quiet is optional since you can shoot her in the face.
Skullface shows up and dies
Eli shows up, bounces with a metal gear. (A cliffhanger that the game isn't allowed to have considering the tight space it resides in the timeline)
The virus gives us one nice moment, but otherwise it's wasted.
The only mission that matters in the game,besides the bookended prologue ,is the Phantom Limbs mission because you're rescuing someone you know...Kaz.

 

[Ashura_MX]

Is Ghost Babel a bad MGS game because it doesn't impact the series timeline...? No, because the story's impact on the timeline has absolutely nothing to do with the quality of the game or the narrative.

I player ghost babel a long time ago, don't rememer it to pass judgement. Discussing console versions of the games here, since that's what most people have played.

Is the narrative in Ghost Babel broken? or the game incomplete? or with 2hr timers to develop a rocket launcher?

 

[KOMANI]

While I see what you're saying, that's not really the point I was making. The poster said that TPP was a bad game partly because it doesn't impact the timeline. Ghost Babel doesn't either. That particular aspect (the lack of impact on the timeline itself) doesn't make TPP a bad game. That has nothing to do with it at all.

Then my apologies.
I don't think it's a bad game either. I don't think it's the greatest, like how some are yelling from the rooftops. It's a nice little game.
On a side note, the series should have taken the ghost Babel approach in telling stories in parallel universes to escape its convoluted canon.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Those previous cliffhangers came in a form of after credit scenes, and were intended.

Well, I was referring to Liquid escaping with RAY more than anything. That isn't resolved. But I take your point about intention. Again though, that brings up the issue of whether we would have known it was unfinished if they hadn't included the cut content on the Blu-Ray.

I'm not so sure we would. In the context of the game itself - meta-knowledge aside - Eli's escape seems almost like the set-up for a confrontation in a sequel... like the ending of MGS2.

And you can label my assessment of the game as reductive but... It's really one story mission, and a bunch of sub plots.

Can't every single MGS game be reduced to that though?

I player ghost babel a long time ago, don't rememer it to pass judgement. Discussing console versions of the games here, since that's what most people have played.

Is the narrative in Ghost Babel broken? or the game incomplete? or with 2hr timers to develop a rocket launcher?

Sorry, I'm not explaining myself very well.

You said:

...for Metal Gear standards is on the bad side of things with the story, especially since nothing that happens on screen has any actual impact in the timeline.

I'm saying that the bolded has nothing to do with the quality of the narrative or game. I used Ghost Babel as an example of a good quality Metal Gear game that has no impact on the timeline to make my point.

Then my apologies.
I don't think it's a bad game either. I don't think it's the greatest, like how some are yelling from the rooftops. It's a nice little game.
On a side note, the series should have taken the ghost Babel approach in telling stories in parallel universes to escape its convoluted canon.

None necessary, sir! I don't think I explained myself very well.

I certainly hope that's the direction they take it in future... if they do.

 

[KOMANI]

The series needs a reboot at this point. Don't touch the Boss, don't bother with Big Boss's journey during MGSV. Just focus on telling a good story because the game mechanics are there. They've been there since 4. Slightly evolving. It's time for the Story to catch up.

 

[Ashura_MX]

Sorry, I'm not explaining myself very well.

I'm saying that the bolded has nothing to do with the quality of the narrative or game. I used Ghost Babel as an example of a good quality Metal Gear game that has no impact on the timeline to make my point.

I get what you are saying, you seem to think I hate MGSV (I don't), I just don't think its THE metal gear of all metal gears because the story happens in the main timeline, unlike Ghost Babel.

Or well, its not the ultimate metal gear

 

[Screaming Meat]

The series needs a reboot at this point. Don't touch the Boss, don't bother with Big Boss's journey during MGSV. Just focus on telling a good story because the game mechanics are there. They've been there since 4. Slightly evolving. It's time for the Story to catch up.

I'm not even sure I can get behind a Metal Gear without Kojima involved.

Whatever you may think about his narrative capabilities, the guy is a world class game designer capable of weaving thematic concerns into mechanics with a skill few others possess (only one I can think of off the top of my head is Myazaki). He also has a very distinct authorial voice that veers between the absurd, the serious, and the melodramatic that I'm not sure another director could infuse the game with.

I'd happily eat crow if they do find someone that can, but with Konami's clear change of focus, I'm not sure they'll put the effort in to do that.

I get what you are saying, you seem to think I hate MGSV (I don't), I just don't think its THE metal gear of all metal gears because the story happens in the main timeline, unlike Ghost Babel.

Or well, its not the ultimate metal gear

Honestly, I didn't know whether you liked it or not. I wasn't saying anything about that. I'm trying to explain that the narrative not having an impact on the main timeline has nothing to do with the narrative's quality, that's all. It doesn't matter whether it does or doesn't impact on the timeline, the story can still be good, it can stil be Metal Gear (like Ghost Babel).

 

[Ashura_MX]

Honestly, I didn't know whether you liked it or not. I wasn't saying anything about that. I'm trying to explain that the narrative not having an impact on the main timeline has nothing to do with the narrative's quality, that's all. It doesn't matter whether it does or doesn't impact on the timeline, the story can still be good, it can stil be Metal Gear (like Ghost Babel).

Is TPP story good? I dislike the tapes because there is no emotion, the acting is flat. Maybe if snake was not a mute mother fucker, or if Diamond Dogs took a side. I felt a sense of urgency when my men were dying in chapter one so I "rushed" the story so I could find the cure. I have yet to reach Mission 43 so can't comment on that.

You spend the game kidnapping people but there is no real connection with anybody, Quiet is the only buddy you form a visible (cutscenes) bond with. D-Horse is a vehicle with shit. D-Dog only has the puppy cutscenes, and everyting (even your soldiers) go to the ether by the end of the game (Quiet photos are removed from the chopper for example).

On the flipside, dem phantom pain is real and I'm burning uuuuup.

 

[Golnei]

Is TPP story good? I dislike the tapes because there is no emotion, the acting is flat. Maybe if snake was not a mute mother fucker, or if Diamond Dogs took a side. I felt a sense of urgency when my men were dying in chapter one so I "rushed" the story so I could find the cure. I have yet to reach Mission 43 so can't comment on that.

Some of the tapes are really well done, the hamburger and Truth ones in particular. But I do agree that a few too many tend towards bland exposition, especially where Code Talker and Ocelot are concerned. Code Talker in particular could have been expanded a lot more as a character rather than serving as a monotone font of exposition if they went a little further into his personal history and the institutional violence directed towards and cultural erasure of Native Americans in the US; strengthening the game's attempt at tackling themes of cultural imperialism and ethnic cleansing.

 

[Ashura_MX]

Some of the tapes are really well done, the hamburger and Truth ones in particular. But I do agree that a few too many tend towards bland exposition, especially where Code Talker and Ocelot are concerned. Code Talker in particular could have been expanded a lot more as a character rather than serving as a monotone font of exposition if they went a little further into his personal history and the institutional violence directed towards and cultural erasure of Native Americans in the US; strengthening the game's attempt at tackling themes of cultural imperialism and ethnic cleansing.

The tapes don't reflect what is happening on the screen at all lol (not arguing with you here, just saying you're right)

I have tried unsucessfully 5 times to listen to Code Talker tape uhh 4 or 5, my brain just shuts down halfway. The burger tapes are great however.

 

[j0hnny_385]

Don't know if posted, but Threedogg of OHN will do another full story playthrough of MGS V:TPP soon.
He finished GZ again. He's listening to tapes now before starting.
http://www.twitch.tv/uknighted

 

[tariniel]

When I get home from work I usually have a strong desire to play this game, but then I realize that the only things I can really do are try to get S ranks or complete mission tasks, and those sound so exhausting.

Maybe I need to start a new save instead?

Don't know if posted, but Threedogg of OHN will do another full story playthrough of MGS V:TPP soon.
He finished GZ again. He's listening to tapes now before starting.
http://www.twitch.tv/uknighted

They always do these when I'm at work! Ugh, I'd love to watch them play some of the missions I had a hard time with and see how they make it look trivial. My works internet is much too slow to watch them here.

 

[Ashura_MX]

Don't know if posted, but Threedogg of OHN will do another full story playthrough of MGS V:TPP soon.
He finished GZ again. He's listening to tapes now before starting.
http://www.twitch.tv/uknighted

Thanks for the tip.

 

[Johndoey]

Is TPP story good? I dislike the tapes because there is no emotion, the acting is flat. Maybe if snake was not a mute mother fucker, or if Diamond Dogs took a side. I felt a sense of urgency when my men were dying in chapter one so I "rushed" the story so I could find the cure. I have yet to reach Mission 43 so can't comment on that.

You spend the game kidnapping people but there is no real connection with anybody, Quiet is the only buddy you form a visible (cutscenes) bond with. D-Horse is a vehicle with shit. D-Dog only has the puppy cutscenes, and everyting (even your soldiers) go to the ether by the end of the game (Quiet photos are removed from the chopper for example).

On the flipside, dem phantom pain is real and I'm burning uuuuup.

The early region history tapes are okay and the burger chronicles are fun, everything else is whatever. The Code Talker tapes about the parasites are horseshit tho. Mostly enjoyable overall. Nothing was done with the child soldiers or torture beyond existing within the story which is unfortunate. I don't know if race was going to be a focus originally but of course it really isn't in the final product. Code Talker as an elderly Native American man could've been something but eh. I feel like rape was supposed to get some focus but didn't. Though maybe that was for the best.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Amongst others, Code Talker and Skullface's 2nd tape is a genuinely brilliant bit of radio play. If the punishment were a little less convoluted it could happily stand up on its own as a short story.

I wonder who wrote it.

 

[Amirnol]

Can anyone recommend a really good Peace Walker playthrough on Youtube?

 

[heringer]

Ghost Babel tells a story. V lifts some of GB's beats, but still doesn't tell a story.
I think people got disappointed by the lack of structure in V's story, and then started picking apart it's gameplay. Had the game been focused enough to tell a story, I don't the hate would have been this strong.

Huh? It absolutely tells a story. You might hate the story or think it's poorly structured, but there's a story with beginning, middle and end. Especially if you consider GZ as part of MGSV, which I do.

 

[KOMANI]

Huh? It absolutely tells a story. You might hate the story or think it's poorly structured, but there's a story with beginning, middle and end. Especially if you consider GZ as part of MGSV, which I do.

Tell me the main story. Tell me the beginning, middle, and end. No sub plots, the actual main story.

Here's the story of Metal Gear Solid V:

Prologue.

Ok, we can go home now.

 

[Johndoey]

Tell me the main story. Tell me the beginning, middle, and end. No sub plots, the actual main story.

Here's the story of Metal Gear Solid V:

Prologue.

Ok, we can go home now.

As much as I dislike MGSV you're being ridiculous, the Skull Face and rebuilding of Mama Base 2 are clearly the main thrust of the game. The game clearly has a entire story. You're getting hung up on disliking how it ties into the overarching plot of the series.

 

[KOMANI]

As much as I dislike MGSV you're being ridiculous, the Skull Face and rebuilding of Mama Base 2 are clearly the main thrust of the game. The game clearly has a entire story. You're getting hung up on disliking how it ties into the overarching plot of the series.

No. You're assuming. I've never once mentioned about disliking how it ties into the plot of the series.
Don't plop my critiques with someone else's if you're uncertain.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Tell me the main story. Tell me the beginning, middle, and end. No sub plots, the actual main story.

I'd say:

Beginning:
Prologue/Rescue Miller/Investigate Cipher (culminates in 2nd Skulls fight)

Middle:
Tracking down Skullface/Uncover his plans/Fight the infection/Destroy Metal Gear

End:
Skullface's Legacy/Internal strife/Sabotage/Uncover the traitor (this is the climax of the story)

Epilogue:
Learn the Truth.

 

[The Omega Man]

Those truth tapes as cinematics would have been glorious, would have loved to see how Zero looked like in the 80's.
Also for a man (Zero) that was supposed to be the major asshole of the whole Metal Gear Universe, he has always seemed to be very likeable, in MGS3 he wasn't an evil bastard and in MGSV while he became an ambitious man with a plan, he still cared for Big Boss, can't say the same for Big Boss who returned the favor to Zero in a very different way.

 

[KOMANI]

I'd say:

Beginning:
Prologue/Rescue Miller/Investigate Cipher (culminates in 2nd Skulls fight)

Middle:
Tracking down Skullface/Uncover his plans/Fight the infection/Destroy Metal Gear

End:
Skullface's Legacy/Internal strife/Sabotage/Uncover the traitor (this is the climax of the story)

Epilogue:
Learn the Truth.

For me, these all are sub plots. They are the beginning, middle, and end of the game, not the story.
First, you need to identify what is the story. Whose story is it? It's Venom's story, right?
Ok, so what is the purpose of V? What is it trying to convey?
It's primarily the ramifications of living a lie, and continuing that lie for a purpose. But the game never touches on it, and instead cops out and tells you that you're (the player) Big Boss. The exact oppositional message that MGS2 tells you.
There are sub plots in this game, some that go places, others that don't... But there is no meat, just a whole bunch of potatoes.
In fact, it indirectly invokes that a much interesting stealth game is happening elsewhere, with the real Big Boss. I just can't see someone being fulfilled with the story (or lack of) of the game. Sure, I get the satisfaction in playing the game, but not sitting through its story.

 

[DrunkShogun]

I just realised we didn't have the traditional one vs one final fight. Would of been good seeing venom facing off against someone in particular and coming up short.

 

[Oldest Snake]

I just realised we didn't have the traditional one vs one final fight. Would of been good seeing venom facing off against someone in particular and coming up short.

Would you say you have a phantom pain for a 1v1 fight? 10/10 Bravo Kojima

I really wish Venom as a total asshole in this game, I think it would have made for a much better message of morality than another "hey I guess sometimes legends about bad guys aren't true funny that eh?" story. He should have been completely black/white when it comes to enemies and allies, slightly sadistic in wanting to punish those he felt were responsible for destroying Mother Base, he should have put the child soldiers to work etc. All that stuff we thought Big Boss had done (you know, because the games said he did)

Firstly I think it would have distracted from the twist itself by playing into what the players expected from the Big Boss's "true" origins (as in finally connecting the personalities of MGS3/PW Big Boss to the MG1/2 Big Boss). We'd have been able to feel the sense of anger and lust for revenge

Spoiler

whhhhoooooooo?

that Kojima just assumed we'd all feel anyway because we'd be playing as a character who actually seemed like he gave a shit about what was going on. The Medic has just as much reason as anyone from Mother Base 1.0 to hate Cipher/Skullface, why is Kaz the only one who seems to care?

I mean, his name was 'Venom' Snake, yet he feels completely defanged.

Throughout the entire game we'd get to see who agreed with the choices Venom made because they thought they were seeing under the hood of the real Big Boss, who we all naturally have a fondness for after being with him for so long. We'd see who thought it was justified for him to do whatever it takes to get back at Skullface, who agreed that it was necessary or the right thing to do etc. only for them to discover that Venom was nothing more than BB lashing out at the world for wronging him.

I feel like that reveal would have had more of an impact than what we got.

 

[heringer]

For me, these all are sub plots. They are the beginning, middle, and end of the game, not the story.
First, you need to identify what is the story. Whose story is it? It's Venom's story, right?
Ok, so what is the purpose of V? What is it trying to convey?
It's primarily the ramifications of living a lie, and continuing that lie for a purpose. But the game never touches on it, and instead cops out and tells you that you're (the player) Big Boss. The exact oppositional message that MGS2 tells you.
There are sub plots in this game, some that go places, others that don't... But there is no meat, just a whole bunch of potatoes.
In fact, it indirectly invokes that a much interesting stealth game is happening elsewhere, with the real Big Boss. I just can't see someone being fulfilled with the story (or lack of) of the game. Sure, I get the satisfaction in playing the game, but not sitting through its story.

Huh, absolutely nothing you said disqualifies a story.

1 - It doesn't have to be about one person to be a story. Where did you come up with that?
2 - Venom, or any other character, doesn't need to have a purpose (though they obviously have) to constitute a story.
3 - If the game doesn't touch on the ramifications of living a lie, it's because of poor narrative, not because there isn't a story. The story is not even about living a lie, that's just a theme the story touches upon.

Main characters get attacked, lose everything.
Main characters want revenge.
Main characters uncover evil plans and continue to pursue bad guy.
Main characters defeat bad guy and get their revenge.
Epilogue

How is this a sub plot? It's the overarching narrative of the game.

Chapter 1 is the main narrative game while chapter 2 is a playable epilogue that ties the sub plots.

You may say the story is dry and unsatisfying, but to say there's no story is objectively wrong.

 

[Edzi]

Would you say you have a phantom pain for a 1v1 fight? 10/10 Bravo Kojima

I really wish Venom as a total asshole in this game, I think it would have made for a much better message of morality than another "hey I guess sometimes legends about bad guys aren't true funny that eh?" story. He should have been completely black/white when it comes to enemies and allies, slightly sadistic in wanting to punish those he felt were responsible for destroying Mother Base, he should have put the child soldiers to work etc. All that stuff we thought Big Boss had done (you know, because the games said he did)

Firstly I think it would have distracted from the twist itself by playing into what the players expected from the Big Boss's "true" origins (as in finally connecting the personalities of MGS3/PW Big Boss to the MG1/2 Big Boss). We'd have been able to feel the sense of anger and lust for revenge

Spoiler

whhhhoooooooo?

that Kojima just assumed we'd all feel anyway because we'd be playing as a character who actually seemed like he gave a shit about what was going on. The Medic has just as much reason as anyone from Mother Base 1.0 to hate Cipher/Skullface, why is Kaz the only one who seems to care?

I mean, his name was 'Venom' Snake, yet he feels completely defanged.

Throughout the entire game we'd get to see who agreed with the choices Venom made because they thought they were seeing under the hood of the real Big Boss, who we all naturally have a fondness for after being with him for so long. We'd see who thought it was justified for him to do whatever it takes to get back at Skullface, who agreed that it was necessary or the right thing to do etc. only for them to discover that Venom was nothing more than BB lashing out at the world for wronging him.

I feel like that reveal would have had more of an impact than what we got.

I hadn't thought of that, but I kinda like it and think you're right that it would have worked better. It would have been neat if at the end, you get to play as the real BB, who after waking up from his coma finds out about Zero's insane plan to use one of his old soldiers to impersonate him and then decides to "put down" the phantom, who at this point is a complete demon and no longer the man he once was (or Big Boss for that matter).

 

[Roni]

I just realised we didn't have the traditional one vs one final fight. Would of been good seeing venom facing off against someone in particular and coming up short.

Really? Think back to a certain ship in Africa. Hint:

Spoiler

you had a rematch on Mother Base.

In true MGSV fashion, it's in the middle of chapter 1. Just like the game's Mech fight is in the middle of the game.

 

[Johndoey]

No. You're assuming. I've never once mentioned about disliking how it ties into the plot of the series.
Don't plop my critiques with someone else's if you're uncertain.

Edit: I saw your others post clearly you have a rather narrow definition of story so any more talk on that would be pointless.

 

[Ratrat]

Opinions man opinions! I did like MGS4 (not as much as 1, 2 and 3 but still) but MGSV is just bad. Gameplay is good the rest is just meh....

Peace Walker lacked a single good boss fight and had an atrocious story imo. Hated most of the supportig cast as well.

Don't know if posted, but Threedogg of OHN will do another full story playthrough of MGS V:TPP soon.
He finished GZ again. He's listening to tapes now before starting.
http://www.twitch.tv/uknighted

I know they were terribly disappointed, but has their opinion changed much now that the dust has settled?

 

[KOMANI]

Edit: I saw your others post clearly you have a rather narrow definition of story so any more talk on that would be pointless.

Nice, an insult. Considering I tell stories for a living, maybe replying to you is pointless. Cheers.

 

[Screaming Meat]

For me, these all are sub plots.

Does that mean they are sub plots though? I'm not sure they are. Like, how is Skullface a sub-plot? He's in the whole game, even after he's died! Or destroying Metal Gear? It's in the title! XD

The story is basically that of a group of people brought together by a stoic and enigmatic leader to get revenge on a guy with a skull for a face... and what happens to that group after it's "purpose" has been fulfilled.

First, you need to identify what is the story. Whose story is it? It's Venom's story, right?

I'd argue it's closer to a TV ensemble piece.

Ok, so what is the purpose of V? What is it trying to convey?
It's primarily the ramifications of living a lie, and continuing that lie for a purpose. But the game never touches on it, and instead cops out and tells you that you're (the player) Big Boss. The exact oppositional message that MGS2 tells you.

Is it about the ramifications of living a lie? I don't think so. That interpretation didn't even pop into my head. Like you said, we only find out right at the end and it's not really dealt with, so how can it be...?

The story is (in part) about forgotten people, those erased from history and their part in shaping the larger myth. That includes the player. This doesn't come out of nowhere, either, it is there from the beginning but we don't realise it. The twist, like all good twists, reframes that which preceded it. While we aren't lead to it very deftly, the twist isn't out of left-field.

(In coming, off point rant)

Thematically, the "cop out" twist is very consistent, particularly with the game mechanics. Kojima gives the player unprecedented freedom. He let's us choose everything, gives us free reign on what missions to tackle and how to tackle them, what to research, our level support, our base, our buddies, who goes out etc. and then right at the end he acknowledges our part in the Metal Gear mythos and all but says outright thank you for the relationship.

Now, being oppositional to the theme of a previous game has nothing really to do with whether this one has a story or whether that story is any good. MGS2 was a punky fuck you to an audience trapped in a degenerating, recurring android dream (and it was awesome for it). TPP is a fond farewell where the creator basically gives us the keys to the car as a parting gift and then thanks us for driving it (and it is awesome for it). One doesn't impact on the other.

In fact, it indirectly invokes that a much interesting stealth game is happening elsewhere, with the real Big Boss.

More like a management sim by the sounds of it. XD

I just can't see someone being fulfilled with the story (or lack of) of the game. Sure, I get the satisfaction in playing the game, but not sitting through its story.

How do you sit through a non-existent story...?

 

[KOMANI]

I don't like thinking about it as a twist. It cheapens the reveal by calling it that.
It is very much a tv assemble.chapter 1 is very much season 1, and even has its sneak peak into chapter 2. But I don't think it's a well told season. If metal gear solid v was a season, it would be canceled after chapter 1.
How can you ask me "why I sat through it?". C'mon. I don't have an agenda, these are just my thoughts. As to why I platinumed the game, I'll tell you if we play MGO together again.

I agree with you in that we have total freedom to make the most of the gameplay and the story. I'm not certain how wise that is though. Also, that could be seen as a cover up for the unfinished parts of the game... But considering how many enjoyed it, I can see it was a success.

I feel a game where youre Big Boss, hiding from the world, is a more exciting stealth game than this. You also have essential characters revisited as well: Frank Jaeger, Naomi Hunter, Sniper Wolf, maybe Raven. one of the biggest crimes of this game is You shouldn't invoke that there's a better game within your game.

 

[DrunkShogun]

I don't like thinking about it as a twist. It cheapens the reveal by calling it that.
It is very much a tv assemble.chapter 1 is very much season 1, and even has its sneak peak into chapter 2. But I don't think it's a well told season. If metal gear solid v was a season, it would be canceled after chapter 1.
How can you ask me "why I sat through it?". C'mon. I don't have an agenda, these are just my thoughts. As to why I platinumed the game, I'll tell you if we play MGO together again.

I agree with you in that we have total freedom to make the most of the gameplay and the story. I'm not certain how wise that is though. Also, that could be seen as a cover up for the unfinished parts of the game... But considering how many enjoyed it, I can see it was a success.

I feel a game where youre Big Boss, hiding from the world, is a more exciting stealth game than this. You also have essential characters revisited as well: Frank Jaeger, Naomi Hunter, Sniper Wolf, maybe Raven. one of the biggest crimes of this game is You shouldn't invoke that there's a better game within your game.

I arrived to the same thinking post reveal of where big boss was. What you described was what I was hoping mgs v was going to be. Burnt enough hours on mgs v to not complain.

 

[ginger ninja]

His bodies are interchangeable, they're designed to be swapped out - since his only remaining organic parts are his spine and head above the jaw, switching between combat and civilian bodies would just require detaching his head/spine from one and placing it in the other.

Somehow seems even more complicated than rebuilding big boss with skin grafting and external organs.

Yeah, unlike the rest of GAF I don't actually think TPP is "awful". Flawed? Sure as shit! Not awful though, not by any stretch. At least TPP was consistent.

Totally agreed. There's some important content missing here and there and obvious pacing problems but it's so absurd hearing it's awful. Especially in comparison to mgs4's story which is so over the top and unnecessary. I think a lot of the fans have fallen victim to Kojima syndrome, as in everything needs to be over explained in excruciating detail and ham fisted as it was in MGS4 or they just refused to accept its mgs

 

[PensOwl]

Somehow seems even more complicated than rebuilding big boss with skin grafting and external organs.




Totally agreed. There's some important content missing here and there and obvious pacing problems but it's so absurd hearing it's awful. Especially in comparison to mgs4's story which is so over the top and unnecessary. I think a lot of the fans have fallen victim to Kojima syndrome, as in everything needs to be over explained in excruciating detail and ham fisted as it was in MGS4 or they just refused to accept its mgs

I don't understand this narrative that's popped up recently that anyone disappointed in mgsv somehow loved mgs4 as a way to cheapen the validity of their opinion. How's this for a change: they're both awful.

 

[pupcoffee]

Up to Chapter 2. Have to say that Eli, Airport Skull Unit, Man on Fire and Metal Gear were all great fights. (Eli is best fought with just the tranq pistol for balance but still). The laser ruins the Quiet fight, as does how easy tracking her movement is.

Honestly, the boss fight experience in this game is at least better than MGS2 and maybe MGS4. It has the best Metal Gear fight in the series. On the whole, the bosses are designed around MGSV's controls and mechanics and feel as new as the rest of the game.

 

[Screaming Meat]

How can you ask me "why I sat through it?". C'mon. I don't have an agenda, these are just my thoughts. As to why I platinumed the game, I'll tell you if we play MGO together again.

Sorry, I think I flubbed the delivery there. It was meant as a play on the fact you've consistently said the story is "non-existent" and then you said about "sit[ing] through it".

Yeah, that didn't quite come across as amusing or as pithy as I'd hoped...

I agree with you in that we have total freedom to make the most of the gameplay and the story. I'm not certain how wise that is though. Also, that could be seen as a cover up for the unfinished parts of the game... But considering how many enjoyed it, I can see it was a success.

Yeah, whether it worked or not (it certainly damages the game's momentum), I'm just glad he was willing to experiment. Having slept on the game for a while and got some distance, I think I see the shape of what he was going for, even if it does fall short in some areas.

I feel a game where youre Big Boss, hiding from the world, is a more exciting stealth game than this. You also have essential characters revisited as well: Frank Jaeger, Naomi Hunter, Sniper Wolf, maybe Raven. one of the biggest crimes of this game is You shouldn't invoke that there's a better game within your game.

I'm not sure there is much of a game there. Definitely a novella, comic etc.

TPP is, gameplay wise, the game I've always wanted Metal Gear to be.

I don't understand this narrative that's popped up recently that anyone disappointed in mgsv somehow loved mgs4 as a way to cheapen the validity of their opinion. How's this for a change: they're both awful.

One is, certainly!

I think it's cropped up because a few people after the last few pages said they'd prefer the shitstorm of MGS4 over something like MGSV, so I don't think it's a "new narrative" just a new rebuttal to a recent statement that's been bandied about.

 

[Syder]

Can someone explain to me why a Butterfly seems to be the symbol/emblem/representation/spirit animal(?) of both Paz and Quiet? Is this some reference to The Butterfly Effect?

 

[KOMANI]

No doubt Meat. I desperately want to get my hands in my PS3 again so that way I can see how I feel about MGS4. It would be my 10th time playing it.

 

[j0hnny_385]

I know they were terribly disappointed, but has their opinion changed much now that the dust has settled?

Don't know honestly.
I tried to rewatch the finale as they played it on the 500+ hrs stream for the first time but the actual final scene (mirror breaking, etc.) was muted because of copyright content on Twitch. :/
If someone could shed a light, I'd appreciate it. OHN guys are the best when it comes to MGS.

 

[bernardobri]

I like how MGSV inadvertently rules out the idea that Dr. Madnar turned Big Boss into a prototype version of a Snatcher, like MG2:SS and MGS4 made allusions into.

 

[Screaming Meat]

I like how MGSV inadvertently rules out the idea that Dr. Madnar turned Big Boss into a prototype version of a Snatcher, like MG2:SS and MGS4 made allusions into.

Slightly related: I always assumed the bio-whatsitcalled engineer you rescue in Over the Fence was Madnar.

No doubt Meat. I desperately want to get my hands in my PS3 again so that way I can see how I feel about MGS4. It would be my 10th time playing it.

As much as I harp on about how much I dislike IV, I did play the fuck out of it.

 

[Cyborg]

Why was Pazz not real? I didnt get that part. I got all the tapes and pictures but didnt get that scene.

 

[Houndi101]

Why was Pazz not real? I didnt get that part. I got all the tapes and pictures but didnt get that scene.

Manifestation of the Medics guilt for not finding the second bomb

 

[Cyborg]

Manifestation of the Medics guilt for not finding the second bomb

Thanx Arnold