Gordon Shumway
Banned
LMAO
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Michael Jackson to be played by a white actor.
- Thread starter torre_avenue
- Start date
- Status
Nose and also chin, cheeks, lips, jaw, forehead etc.
Gabotron ES
Member
ahahahahahahah
That...doesn't...work.
Do you realize that vitiligo consumes huge patches of skin, not just little dots? And darkening treatment usually leaves you looking more patchy, as the spots continue to grow?
Someone please post the pictures of MJ at shows and stuff obviously using dark make up to try and cover vitiligo spots, I'm on mobile.
Again, this what untreated vitiligo looks like. This model has chosen try to aND end the ignorance and stigma surrounding the condition. Others choose to hide it by bleaching the skin.
As for his nose, vitiligo has such a fucking stigma it leads to life long appeared center issues. He likely felt his nose looked horrible, and obsessively tried to fix it.
It's not about 'not looking black'. It's about not looking like the model I linked. (Who I personally think is beautiful)
So we blaming vitiligo for him not liking his nose now too? Lol I've heard it all now.
Dude didnt want to be black. People who knew, and loved him, admits as much. How a person doing an autopsy can look at a dead body, of a person who clearly manipulated their skin tone to an obvious degree, and say "Gee golly for sure this guy had vitilgo" is nothing more than feeding into the circus that surrounded this man in his life.
I've seen vitiligo up front a lot, and for African Americans his complexion Dihydroxyacetone has been used to allow people to maintain close appearances to their original complexion. Is it as perfect as their natural skin? Of course not, but it is a hell of a lot better than what he did to himself.
And in the end I am not blaming or pointing a finger at Mike for what he did. I am happy he was able to find happiness in himself.
RustyNails
Member
Joe Jackson, MJ's dad, abused him and called him "big nose" when he was a kid and he grew to hate it. Then he got hit by vitiligo and lupus.
RustyNails
Member
I can't even fathom what people with vitiligo face growing up. But MJ had a ton of other things in his life. In my opinion, Off the Wall/Thriller Michael was a beautiful man. He was not only diagnosed with vitiligo and lupus, he lost all his hair after the pepsi accident (autopsy revealed he was bald). Ton of medical conditions to fuck with your brain. On top of that, his childhood growing up was terrible. His dad really was and is an asshole. He abused the kids and especially MJ, making fun of his appearance and nose. Someone like that growing up being thrust to the center of world stage could be pretty hard. I dont fault him for making eccentric and at times surreal choices. He never had the luxury to make any growing up.
Nope, no vitiligo there.
I am not denying the dude had issues. What I hate is people going 'lol he just wanted to be white' when he had the same fucking condition that gets my kid teased at school, and he's not even black. My son is 12 and considering skin bleaching, I'm asking him to wait until he gets older to decide.
Forgot about the lupus, which *gasp* is also an autoimmune disease that vitiligo can be a symptom for.
He looks like any other African American right here fiction. Unless a guy is getting a tan, or is Wesley Snipes dark, he will usually have parts of his body that are lighter or darker than other parts.
Whether it is a hand, forearm, knee,, or more commonly an elbow. Melanin is not usually equally distributed in most people.
I agree.
I am sorry to hear about your son, and I definitely don't want you to think I am making fun of Mike. I love Michael Jackson, and he is by far my favorite singer. I look at him though, and I can't see it. I think he found an excuse to explain the extreme change in his look around the bad album, and ran with it.
The Albatross
Member
I don't really have much of a problem with a white guy playing him if the movie is set in 2001, when Michael Jackson -- from a skin pigment condition and/or his countless plastic surgeries -- had really pale skin and also didn't look like any other person on the planet at that time. The actor cast to play Marlon Brando is fat and old, resembling Brando when he was fat and old not Brando when he was young and handsome in On the Waterfront, so I don't have much of a problem with a the guy playing MJ looking white and odd in 2001. The lady playing Liz Taylor is a very average looking older woman, and when Taylor was in her prime she was one of the most striking women on Earth.
Because he's black and plot wise it matters.
Look at what the OP mentioned:
Like Fiction said, this was proven false in his autopsy and plagued him throughout his career. Many people (especially in the black community) thought he was a black man that wanted to be white (which wasn't the case AT ALL but nobody believed him).
A black actor playing this role is required because of the reason.
It took his death, autopsy and people how actually cared to read to see that what he was saying was actually true.
Twilight Gap
Member
maquiladora
Member
Actually, the right answer is : don't hire a white actor to play the role of someone who was black. It's not that complicated really.
SliceSabre
Banned
I honestly cannot believe what I'm reading:
"Nah autopsy lied! I'll believe the truth I invented in my head rather than the actual facts."
You're batting .000, just stop now.
hipbabboom
Huh? What did I say? Did I screw up again? :(
That's enough internet for me today.
Twilight Gap
Member
In all fairness, the movie in question is based on a rumor which is linked to a conspiracy theory that MJ predicted the 9/11 attacks and illuminati killed him or something. So crazy isn't exactly off the table.
No. He had self esteem issues regarding his nose because his father made fun of him all the time as a kid. Had nothing to do with not wanting to be black.
Am I the only one that thought this lady was going to play him?
Haha no, I just saw the picture at first and I was like wait what the fuck?
Everything his sister also had, and nobody says she wants to be white
I didn't realise they shared a brain?
FeenixRising
Banned
I mean, look at this video of MJ rehearsing for Captain Eo(you have to start at 4:36) and that should pretty much tell you he had vitiligo.
TheOohChild
Member
He should ask his brother about the artist who did his Voldemort nose
Cindi Mayweather
Member
Are you being willingly obtuse?
Ninja Scooter
Member
That's too much fuckkery even for me.
If you are talking about what each one wanted and mentioned, you should provide then sources with each of them talking about it, because if your basis for "he wanted to be white" is doing surgery, she also did it and nobody ever mentiones this to her =P
gamerMan
Member
Michael had problems with his image just like anyone with vitiligo. As someone with a rare skin condition, it's upsetting when people say Michael Jackson wanted to be white or make fun of the color of his skin. Vitiligo is a terrible skin condition. People need to stop judging people and being ignorant. It's not funny.
Here is what it is like:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhIn4zHRaCI
As someone who has had vitiligo for the past 16 years, I find the ignorance on display in this thread kind of irritating and offensive. Jackson wasn't trying to "be white," or "look European." He had a skin condition that left white splotches on his skin, and there are no known treatments for it beyond removing all pigmentation from your skin, or just walking around with white splotches on your skin for the rest of your life. The de-pigmentation is very risky, and leaves you incredibly vulnerable to UV light from the sun, opening up a risk of skin disease among other things. I was offered the very expensive option to remove the pigmentation from my skin, but that would require me to have to walk around covered from head to toe, and I'd more than likely have to limit my activities to night time only. I'd have been a vampire, essentially, minus the cool powers and sex appeal. Living in Los Angeles, having to be completely covered wasn't the best option for me, so I didn't go through the de-pigmentation process. So yeah, I walk around with white splotches against my brown skin, and I'm stared at, pointed at, called names when I walk by, etc, etc. It's awful. It's taken a long time for me to regain the little bit of self esteem I had pre-vitiligo, and lost post-vitiligo. My wife and close friends/family have been a blessing in that regard. Unfortunately, the outside world is not as kind or accepting. I can go on for ages with various stories about how inhuman I've been made to feel because of my vitiligo.
Interesting, that Michael would often walk around with masks to protect his de-pigmented skin. But no, that's just "Wacko Jacko!" Let's all point and laugh at him, and call him a freak! Good times! :/
Living with vitiligo is not fun. People treat people with vitiligo like shit. Michael already had a shitty upbringing, and being in the public limelight meant everything he did was scrutinized. The sad thing is that when he tried to come out and talk about his vitiligo, people didn't believe him, and said he was lying about it to cover up his secret desire to be white (as if that's all black people aspire to be...). Even before I got vitiligo myself, I pitied him.
I don't like the idea of this shitty comedy casting Joseph as Michael, but I hate even more the snarky "jokes" at Michael's expense. Yes, he was weird, eccentric, and strange, but he was still a human being that despite his talents and musical lifestyle, had horrible hand after horrible hand dealt to him throughout his life.
EDIT: Winnie Harlow is so gorgeous. There is another model, a Suicide Girl, I believe, that also has vitiligo, and she is stunning as well. I wish I looked half as good as they do, and wore it with as much confidence as them.
It's not at all normal for the tops of your fingers to look that different, though. Michael Jackson very well may have had major issues with his own racial identity, but he clearly had vitiligo as well. That really can't be denied.
SomedayTheFire
Member
my god how did this thread get even worse. so much ignorance.
andthebeatgoeson
Junior Member
Oh, you right, now that I see that it's from the UK, I can know it's not racism. It's art oriented. It's high brow. Now I see.
As someone with mild vitiligo, seeing people dismiss it drives me up the wall. I am self conscious as all hell about my patches, and mine aren't even on my face (mostly arms and legs, which can be covered).
Seeing those pictures i feel for the man. And can only imagine what he, as a huge pop star might have thought about his image to the world. I had another friend i bonded with in college who had vitiligo, and it covered most of her body. She actually got her skin bleached to even out the remainder of her dark spots. And she gets shit about trying to "look white"
Seriously, have some fucking empathy for conditions other people have.
Seeing those pictures i feel for the man. And can only imagine what he, as a huge pop star might have thought about his image to the world. I had another friend i bonded with in college who had vitiligo, and it covered most of her body. She actually got her skin bleached to even out the remainder of her dark spots. And she gets shit about trying to "look white"
Seriously, have some fucking empathy for conditions other people have.
The Hermit
Member
Nope, no vitiligo there.
I am not denying the dude had issues. What I hate is people going 'lol he just wanted to be white' when he had the same fucking condition that gets my kid teased at school, and he's not even black. My son is 12 and considering skin bleaching, I'm asking him to wait until he gets older to decide.
Forgot about the lupus, which *gasp* is also an autoimmune disease that vitiligo can be a symptom for.
Whoa, this is the first picture I see him with the classic aspect of the disease. I honestly wasnt sure before.
This is bizzare. Have you ever seen someone with the disease before? You can't possibly mistake one with the other.
and apparently its my fault that I didn't saw that before, there are tons of picture of him:
https://all4michael.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/v2.jpg
https://cappuccinokiss.files.wordpress.com/2012/07/mjskin51.jpg
http://www.fatosdesconhecidos.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2015/04/1711.jpg
Michael really did have vitiligo, it was confirmed in autopsy (I'll trust the trained forensic pathologist over internet rumor), and you can find the rare pictures where it shows. He did a lot to try and hide it.
I think a combination of growing up in showbiz without a real childhood, an abusive father, and his vitiligo are what made him so weird and eccentric. It all completely warped his self-image and he hated how he looked as a black man. The plastic surgery was a way to match what he saw himself as in his head. He probably adopted all white children because of this warped sense of self.
I think a combination of growing up in showbiz without a real childhood, an abusive father, and his vitiligo are what made him so weird and eccentric. It all completely warped his self-image and he hated how he looked as a black man. The plastic surgery was a way to match what he saw himself as in his head. He probably adopted all white children because of this warped sense of self.
You are disgustingly fucking ignorant about vitiligo.
Darkening your skin is not an option. The problem with attempting to darken your skin is that vitiligo doesn't just magically go away if you darken the skin. The condition is persistent. The white splotches would eventually return, and you'd have to undergo darkening treatments again, which not only adds up financially, but can potentially have adverse affects to you undergoing the treatment. Not to mention that matching the skin tone of a dark skin person is insanely difficult to do. You'd more than likely end up with hyper-pigmentation, where the "matched" spots would be darker than the unaffected areas, or you'd never quite get the color dark enough, so you're screwed either way.
One of the treatments I considered was PUVA. It was basically the equivalent of chemotherapy, in that I'd have take the medication, then spend a few hours in what was essentially a tanning bed, getting doused with UV light, in an attempt to stimulate re-pigmentation. After the treatment, I'd then have to shroud myself and stay indoors for the rest of the day, and each treatment would leave me quite ill for a bit afterwards. Failing to cover up properly after the treatments could be fatal. The physical risks, not to mention the treatment being crazy expensive, just wasn't worth the risk.
The only option that is a "permanent" fix for vitiligo is de-pigmentation. Removing all pigment means that the vitiligo can't lighten anymore skin, but you still have the condition. Since it's a physically harmless and non-contagious disease, many sufferers of vitiligo often go the de-pigmentation route, because they can then go about their lives in a seemingly normal fashion. The problem with a black person such as myself having vitiligo is that characteristically "black" features look very strange when your skin is completely white. I'm black and samoan, so I'm on the light brown skin spectrum range, but the vitiligo patches are a noticably stark contrast to my brown skin. My nose is wide, and I have full lips (I forgot it was real pic January, or I'd have changed my avatar to my actual face. I may still do that). Having all white skin with my features would make me feel even more self conscious, so yeah, I'd consider plastic surgery, which is something I'm not personally interested in ever doing.
As it stands, I just accept that I have vitiligo, and that I look different than everyone else, and hope that the ignorance surrounding the condition, and the treatment of the people living with it changes over time. As evidenced by this thread, however, the ignorance outweighs the acceptance by a large fucking margin. If someone that was as iconic and well known as Michael Jackson can't help open up discourse over vitiligo, I don't know what will. I guess because it's a non-fatal, not contagious condition, people just don't give a fuck.
Twilight Gap
Member
Thanks for this post.
I'd imagine it's easier for people to just dismiss MJ as being a freak than to consider that he'd have any medical abnormalities.
FallingEdge
Member
get the actress who played Jessica Jones to play Michael Jackson in his later years.
lol @ darkening your skin.
Also, since you don't think MJ's kids were his own. Here's a picture of Prince showing signs of Vitiligo like his father.
There are tons of photos online of him with the same spots.
I didn't know his son also had vitiligo. It can be hereditary. Nobody in my family has it, and I wasn't born with it (I didn't start showing symptoms of vitiligo until I was about 20-21, I'm 36, going on 37 now).
It's unclear what causes vitiligo later in life, but one of the widely considered causes is stress. My life was certainly going through an upheaval at the time I got the first white mark on my face, just under my eye. I feared it was vitiligo, but didn't get diagnosed until a few months later, when the splotches started to spread.
A few more famous people with Vitiligo:
John Hamm and Holly Marie Combs.
They have centrilized vitiligo that affect only their hands. You can sometimes see it during episodes of Mad Men and Charmed.
Oh man, I'm crying so hard.. with laughter.
I also got it when I was 20, I'm 23 now.
For me it started with a tiny spot in my hairline, actually, I guess it started when I was 18 or so with that spot. It only started to spread when I was about 20 to all of my forehead. I wouldn't mind it too much expect for all the white hair I now have.
Not me but
http://imgur.com/O3GrbFs
I also have something like that on my left and right eyebrow.
TouchMyBox
Member
Use an Asian actor since they don't have a dog in the Michael Jackson racewars fight.
Iorv3th
Member
That...doesn't...work. seriously, fake tanner? When everyone's skin tone is just a bit different?
Do you realize that vitiligo consumes huge patches of skin, not just little dots? And darkening treatment usually leaves you looking more patchy, as the spots continue to grow?
Someone please post the pictures of MJ at shows and stuff obviously using dark make up to try and cover vitiligo spots, I'm on mobile.
Again, this what untreated vitiligo looks like. This model has chosen try to and end the ignorance and stigma surrounding the condition. Others choose to hide it by bleaching the skin.
As for his nose, vitiligo has such a fucking stigma it leads to life long self esteem issues. He likely felt his nose looked horrible, and obsessively tried to fix it.
It's not about 'not looking black'. It's about not looking like the model I linked. (Who I personally think is beautiful)
Again, I know a lot about this shit cause my son has it.
I know a couple people that have it. One just on the arms and another on arms/face. One's white ones native american.
They should get the guy that does MJ live in vegas to play the role, he's Brazilian.
The definitive Michael Jackson bopic has already been made:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUCDr8qqo5U
And as far as I'm aware this is at least 98% accurate?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUCDr8qqo5U
And as far as I'm aware this is at least 98% accurate?
lol @ darkening your skin.
Also, since you don't think MJ's kids were his own. Here's a picture of Prince showing signs of Vitiligo like his father.
There are tons of photos online of him with the same spots.
Wow, I didn't know this.
That's insane.
Interesting enough, the hair thing is incredibly minimal. Despite having vitiligo on my head and face, my moustache, goatee, and hair are still mostly black. Just a few bits of white here and there. But again, I'm 36, it's hard to tell how much of the little bit of white in my hair is from vitiligo, or just me getting older.
Here's two of me:
- Status