Why would you do this? Just be respectful and call her by her preferred gender. It isn't hard.
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Miss Universe Canada DQs Transsexual Contestant
- Thread starter soultron
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I want to delve into your mind. Why do you feel it necessary to use male pronouns? I'm genuinely curious, no baiting here.
Deified Data
Banned
Gorgeous.
...
Sigh. That's not the point, and I won't belittle the issue. She's competing in a contest of feminine beauty. She possesses feminine beauty. What's the issue? The finer rules of these competitions will have to change with the times.
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Sigh. That's not the point, and I won't belittle the issue. She's competing in a contest of feminine beauty. She possesses feminine beauty. What's the issue? The finer rules of these competitions will have to change with the times.
It's a refusal to recognize her for what she is. It's an almost bratty expression of passive-aggression.
SouthernDragon
Member
I agree with the sentiment that if this garners a DQ, so should any sort of surgery.
Sorry, ladies who have work done, but if she's "fake" so are you. She's just as much woman as you are.
Sorry, ladies who have work done, but if she's "fake" so are you. She's just as much woman as you are.
charlequin
Banned
What's the point in having a contest where you judge people for how they happen to look purely as a result of genetic factors? Or a contest that judges people in how well they dress that has a "you must be this genetically hot to play" sign up front? Beauty contests are inherently absurd events to start with; this kind of genetic-purity angle on them honestly strikes me as taking the concept way too creepily seriously.
GraveRobberX
Platinum Trophy: Learned to Shit While Upright Again.
Damn this thread keeps going in a cycle
The person that was disqualified is a she, in front of me, her picture that is shown my brain goes oh a female
Most of you read/heard ZOMG a Trans Post Op, has to be a dude forever, so it's still a he, not a she, if they went through the process and want to be referred as a female, then they're female
The person that was disqualified is a she, in front of me, her picture that is shown my brain goes oh a female
Most of you read/heard ZOMG a Trans Post Op, has to be a dude forever, so it's still a he, not a she, if they went through the process and want to be referred as a female, then they're female
Sheesh. He is born with a penis. Is that so hard to get?
Sheesh, she was born with A-cups, is that so hard to get?
it's truly a miserable thing.
Basically this.
I believe every one has the right to attain whatever sex they perceive themselves to be if they want to get it through surgical means. They deserve to be recognized by their preferred sex.
But like the other regarding dating and disclosure (which shouldn't be mandatory on the first date but if it has potential to be something serious) , I don't think I could date a transsexual woman. Worst thing is that I realize my hangups make me a hypocrite.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Yes. Stop trying to stir shit up.
I have learned through my good-natured travels into the TransGAF thread what the correct pronoun is. I doubt anyone is genuinely trying to offend any of you good people, which you are, in my opinion at least.
And this news is maddening. She is stunning.
mescalineeyes
Banned
No, but mainly because you pass.
I'd have been too shy due to my ignorance to refer to you as either if you didn't.
The Miss America Organization gives more scholarship money to women than any other charity or organization in the US. And the Miss Universe organization helps keep Donald Trump from roaming the streets for fuck pieces. I think both have shown their merits to society.
Immaturity, ignorance, and short-sightedness... and I doubt they would refer to you as a male if they had not read the thread before hand. you're very pretty.
anyways, dumb people are dumb. best thing that can be done is try to educate and lead by example. look forward and all that...
But so does this Canadian girl right?
I apologize though, my posts can get quite acerbic and nasty, I'm pretty passionate about this topic as is patently obvious.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Heck, I don't even know if "passing" is really much to do with anything. There are a few people I know who identify with a gender most people probably wouldn't mentally assign them at first glance.
In my experience, I've generally said "he" or "she" based on what I could gather from the person. If I got it wrong, I apologize and switch to what they prefer, simple as that. There are lots of people who think pronouns are wrong, period, but there are so many people in the world who do identify on a binary that it's hard to give up the habit. I just try and avoid people who have that slightly malicious tendency to "call them as they sees them" despite what someone might prefer to be called.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Of course she passes, come on. As I said, it probably stems from ignorance. Just let people know that it is deemed The Right Thing to call transgendered people by their "current" sex and know you've done your best to let them know what's what.
If they keep being a dick about it after then you have a good tool to weed out people you don't want to deal with, no matter what gender/race/sexuality you are.
And no need to apologize. I will also not back down on calling out people who are still waiting for the iPhone 5.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Which is your prerogative, people have the right to be attracted to different things.
...but the condescending quotes around "she" are a little much, dontcha think? Just call her what she's clearly asking to be called. It's a matter of respect.
Reality is what our perception tells us, so in the end everything that exists is superficial.
If you never knew you never knew but now you know it and your mind changes the perception.
mescalineeyes
Banned
Now this is the point where I'd be going all-out ballistics.
Sometimes you can only feel pity for such people.
Oh I didn't know that. I just hope that their criteria involve a little more than just good looks.
Snkfanatic
Banned
Very pretty woman, as another has said looks a lot like Trumps daughter. She should really be able to compete....
Jedeye Sniv
Banned
Side-thought -
in the judgmental, cutthroat playground of the internet, a TS girl getting the comment 'would' is perhaps the highest endorsement possible.
Not saying it's right, but in this case, this woman has acheived what she was after - to be objectified and lusted after just like any other woman who posts pics on the internet. Awesome! It's certainly a lot better than idiots writing "she" complete with quotation marks.
Disclaimer - I'm not saying women want to be lusted after on the internet, but just observing that they are.
The contest is for the prettiest female figure presented before the judges. She was the prettiest female body, so she won. It wasn't 'who's vagina is most authentic'.
Once again, some people are afraid that they're gay or just sexually insecure because they liked a woman (visually) with a penis or had a penis at one time, when they're judging the person by their external qualities anyway. I don't even know how these people would deal with CAIS persons.
Your binary definition of gender falls apart with CIAS (NSFW, frontal nudity). See this picture? (NSFW, frontal nudity) Those are both people with a Y chromosome, with no surgery or outside hormone treatment. Women with this don't even usually discover they are "male" until their period fails to show up.
What do you do with these people in your world? Just toss them into limbo?
Once again, some people are afraid that they're gay or just sexually insecure because they liked a woman (visually) with a penis or had a penis at one time, when they're judging the person by their external qualities anyway. I don't even know how these people would deal with CAIS persons.
Your binary definition of gender falls apart with CIAS (NSFW, frontal nudity). See this picture? (NSFW, frontal nudity) Those are both people with a Y chromosome, with no surgery or outside hormone treatment. Women with this don't even usually discover they are "male" until their period fails to show up.
What do you do with these people in your world? Just toss them into limbo?
Uhh... no. A general ignorant attitude that is more or less reinforced shouldn't surprise people.
I know its not on Talackova to use this as a platform to get a message across, but the stage is already set for it. I'd love to hear her talk about this type of situation rather than some random girl talk about ending world hunger with the power of love.
Everyone in this thread was banned for exactly that same reason sadly. No communication about how their views are wrong, no discussion about their views and no trying to change their views. Just a straight up ban.
Does more harm than good if you ask me.
You can call religious people idiots who believe in Faerytales without conssequences here on GAF but if you call a transgendered person by the wrong pronoun, you're outta here.
We're told GAF is a place that welcomes people with any conviction or belief, but for some beliefs there's a double standard that starts right at the top of the mountain. Zero tolerance for one set of beliefs, mods jumping in to degrade another set of beliefs. Sad, really.
mescalineeyes
Banned
ridiculing someone for their beliefs is one thing.
fucking with people who have it hard enough? yeah, that's ban-worthy alright.
I don't think that's what he's trying to say. The "No communication about how their views are wrong, no discussion about their views and no trying to change their views." thing is kind of an issue. I'm not gonna say that I'm the most patient person in the world and try to change the views of a guy that comes at me like "racism is over! get over it, black ppl" but the ones that come off as "I know that in my neck of the woods, x is like y - and i'm not sure how it is everywhere else... but that's what I know" are ones that are worth the discussion imo. Not saying that mentality and approach applies to everyone (because some are just subtle trolls with a history of BS), but the dialogue shouldn't always be thrown out the window.
Edit: And ridiculing people for their beliefs is better how?
freenudemacusers
Member
A ban is a pretty straightforward method of communication. And it's not like the "she", Frankenstein guy and 'born with a dick' posters could really claim naive ignorance.
Maybe not, but how many religionshitters can claim the same ?
You just made an ass out of yourself by condoning ridiculing one group and claiming it's wrong to ridicule another.
mescalineeyes
Banned
At this point, people should be smart enough to know how to address Transsexuals on here, especially knowing the moderation policy around these topics.
Hell, if I can find the time to research how to approach them on a respectable basis -- completely disregarding anyone's personal stance on it -- so should they.
One is holding a dogmatic belief based on the supernatural and no tangible evidence.
The other is being trapped in a body you don't feel comfortable in for the rest of your life.
Maybe I am wrong on this and I try not to ridicule anyone, except those still waiting for iPhone 5.
freenudemacusers
Member
What does this have to do with religion?
I was comparing the zero-tolerance that exists in these types of threads to the anything goes mentality in religious threads in the post you were reffering to.
If you claim to respect one groups beliefs, you must also respect another groups beliefs or else there is no basis for respecting anyone's beliefs.
I don't think ridiculing religious posters is tolerated, ridiculing the beliefs however...
FrontalMonk
Banned
okay, I was afk for most of the day yesterday and didn't have a chance to reply to this, but basically sex has to do with what the biological makeup is of your body, while gender has to do with the mental makeup is of your body.
like, if you were born male and know, mentally, that you are a man, then your gender and your sex match. That's called cisgendered, and that's what I am. If you were born male and know, mentally, that you are not a man, that you are in fact a woman, then your gender and your sex do not match. people who recognize this fundamental difference and take steps to change that, like HRT, and sometimes (but not always, shit's expensive) sexual reassignment surgery, are transgendered.
The fact that I was born in the right body and someone else doesn't doesn't give anyone the right to demean that other person just because they were "born with the wrong body". Telling someone who identifies as a woman that they are not a woman is demeaning. those are facts, and they are accurate.
Trans-GAF, feel free to point out if/where I'm wrong on any of these points, nobody's perfect
yes. seems like we have these threads on a bi-weekly basis and every single time it turns into a bloodbath of insults and banned posters.
How to address someone is one thing, understanding is entirely different.
Which is better though? Someone speaking to you with feigned respect caused by the fear of punishment or someone speaking to you with the respect that comes from understanding?
And research and lurking threads isn't going to make everything clear. Socially, there is a lot to be understood. Things that could definitely be better explained by a person that can address specific inquiries than an article. Its why I give shout outs to shidoshi and Dreams-Visions whenever I can. Their patience regarding those respective issues helps.
Hell, a lot of people genuinely believe that gender and sex are the same thing. Saying "you're so wrong. just go away" helps what? There isn't even an inclination to learn more.
Nobody here was ridiculing transgendered posters, some were ridiculing their beliefs however.....
Their beliefs are entwined with their identity.
Is it not the same for religious people ?
freenudemacusers
Member
What beliefs do trans people have?
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