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Missouri proceeding w/ execution despite new DNA results clearing him (up: stayed)
- Thread starter Joe
- Start date
NHarmonic.
Member
I mean, the same logic could be applied to the hiroshima/nagasaki bombs and even then people fiercely defend it as the only/best option, how many innocent deads for "just" ones?
This is awful.
GrizzleBoy
Banned
Can't sue for wrongful imprisonment.
If dead from lethal injection.
Smartguypointingtobrain.jpg
If dead from lethal injection.
Smartguypointingtobrain.jpg
KarneeKarnay
Member
This is god damn bullshit and if the Police Officers and Judge don't go down for attempted murder I will have no faith in the US system.
Correction the Judge may have done nothing technically wrong, but ethically he is a bankrupt and he should be brought up on it and punished.
The Police Officers should be charged with Attempted Murder. They are responsible his incarceration, every bad thing that has happened to him and his murder if he is killed.
Correction the Judge may have done nothing technically wrong, but ethically he is a bankrupt and he should be brought up on it and punished.
The Police Officers should be charged with Attempted Murder. They are responsible his incarceration, every bad thing that has happened to him and his murder if he is killed.
Please call, people, especially if you live in Missouri.
It's sickening that places that we normally think of as progressive have yet to get rid of the death penalty, as they should be pushing hard to remove it. The blue states are the only ones that have made the death penalty illegal. There is far too much red on that map.
This is true. Our justice system fucks everyone. However, as an addendum, I'll add that the death penalty, as with all elements of our justice system is inherently racist. It's just another reason it needs to be gone from this country.
It's sickening that places that we normally think of as progressive have yet to get rid of the death penalty, as they should be pushing hard to remove it. The blue states are the only ones that have made the death penalty illegal. There is far too much red on that map.
Code:
[IMG]https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a2/Death_penalty_in_the_United_States.svg/1024px-Death_penalty_in_the_United_States.svg.png?1502957697701[/IMG]
MisterFalcon
Member
http://missourideathrow.com/2008/12/Williams-Marcellus/
Items belonging to to victim were found in his posession or were sold on by him.
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
The voice mailbox is full - what more should we do? Not in the state or I'd just go to the Governor's offices to speak against this injustice. Because this is murder.
UberTag
Member
If you're black in Nazi-led America, the rules in place to protect the rest of society don't apply to you.
You can be executed by the state, shot by a cop while unarmed, incarcerated and forced to plea to a crime you did not commit... all while being innocent.
bonesmccoy
Banned
Heard about this via Sister Helen Prejean (one of the few out and out Catholic civil rights leaders left in the West). The death penalty is evil when there is beyond a shadow of a doubt - but this? This is something far worse.
Clockwork
Member
This case has haunted me ever since I read the original piece on him. The man was murdered.
bigmit3737
Member
Tried calling but the phone kept ringing --here is what I planned to say " I've read about the Marcellus Williams case , and it seems DNA evidence has exonerate him. Despite this, the state is Missouri plans to execute him . If this execution goes through you are killing an innocent man.
Please put this execution on hold until we find the real killer"
Please put this execution on hold until we find the real killer"
godofcookery
Member
made a call, but it kept ringing for me as well. how has this not gotten more traction here? I'll keep trying though.
There is evidence that point towards him being guilty. And evidence pointing to him not being guilty. I am not sure he is innocent, but if someone is to be executed then there should be without any doubt he is guilty. It seems he was involved somehow in the murder but he was not the murderer himself. I don't know enough about the laws in USA to know if that is enough for the death penalty.
Mechanized
Member
Knew he would be black. This is fucking disgusting. If this goes ahead there is NO justice in america.
Kyleripman
Member
I was able to get through just now - had to hold for six or seven minutes and then got to speak to someone.
CountAntonius
Member
My first reaction was "unbelievable" then I thought about it and it's completely believable. Disgusting.
Fulminator
Member
Fuuuuck
Holy shit
Fuck
This is so fucked up, what the fuck
Holy shit
Fuck
This is so fucked up, what the fuck
n64coder
Member
There have been people who were convicted of first degree murder even though they didn't actually kill the person because they plotted the crime or were at the scene. He's not innocent because he had some of the victim's possessions.
In any case, I'm against death penalty and feel that his sentence should be reduced to life or similar sentence if he was involved with the murder.
Laevateinn
Member
Governor should get the death penalty for being a heartless murderer.
DeviantBoi
Member
Can you imagine the money they would have to pay him if they let him free?
Can't have that, of course, so they have to kill him.
Fuckers.
Can't have that, of course, so they have to kill him.
Fuckers.
xcharles718
Member
Nope, Teaching/Social Services. Oh well, I'll keep at it.
HomerSimpson-Man
Member
So everyone knows that he is without a doubt innocent, and they know everyone knows. Yet they can do this? JUST FUCKING HOW. I want this motherfucker judge into a chair with a gun pointed to his head and forced to reveal the truth behind this shitshow. Someone is being covered for, or someone is getting paid, or then it's done in order to avoid having to pay him large sums of money.
Earthstrike
Member
There's another thing being glossed over here. If we are executing him for the murder he didn't commit, that means the case is going to be closed and we aren't going to search for the actual murderer. In this case, a murderer essentially got to walk free.
Emperor_Uriel
Member
They are, quite literally, making murderers out of themselves while simultaneously covering for the real killer.
Absolutely batshit.
Absolutely batshit.
Khaos Kontrol
Banned
Figured he was black when reading the thread title
Waldo Lydecker
Member
Shouldn't we reach out to more influential people or the press or something?? This can't happen.
AbsolutBro
Member
By law in most states you don't have to be the actual trigger man to be guilty of first degree murder, as long as someone dies during your commission of a felony. See: Dog the Bounty Hunter.
Of course, none of that shit matters because the death penalty is barbaric bullshit that has no place in a civilized society.
Of course, none of that shit matters because the death penalty is barbaric bullshit that has no place in a civilized society.
Emperor_Uriel
Member
I don't think that people who know the facts of the case are saying that Marcellus Williams is a good man, he was almost certainly an accessory to this crime, but I think we can all agree that he isn't the killer and shouldn't die for a crime he didn't commit.
What's really baffling is that the actual killer is someone clearly known to Williams, and yet their identity isn't being revealed by any of the parties involved (Williams is willing to die rather than snitch? The killer is willing to let his friend die rather than admit to his crime?)
ghostwritingduck
Member
I'm against the death penalty, but the original post is slanted in a way that makes it would like he is clearly innocent. For example, his girlfriend was is described by a drug addicted prostitute. Additionally, the OP states that DNA on the murder weapon didn't match the man convicted, but doesn't mention that he wa in possession of the murder victim's stolen items. There's a lot of injustice in this country, but the arguments being made in the OP is very biased.
ghostwritingduck
Member
I'd be curious to know more about the DNA, but I don't think it definitely clears him. For example, I imagine if a stranger broke into my house and stabbed me with a knife in my kitchen it could still have lingering DNA from someone else who used it previously. The found DNA doesn't sound like it was attached to bodily fluids related to the murder. I'm curious to know more.
AbsolutBro
Member
Let me say this up front: I am 100% against the death penalty even if he did pull the proverbial trigger himself (in case I believe it's actually a stabbing). In this particular case, we KNOW he did not, so if was possible to be more against the death penalty, I would be.
Even if he isn't the killer, IF he did commit some other crime during which the murder took place, he is just as guilty as whomever did the actual stabbing. Now, I put "IF" in caps because a quick reading of case details show that there is not one shred of physical evidence that even links Williams to the location. He had her stuff, true, but that could easily have been given to him by the actual killer, in which case the most he's guilty of is Receipt of Stolen Property.
AbsolutBro
Member
Chmpocalypse
Blizzard
This is murder. Don't let up.
When the only evidence is two testimonies and the person having possessions, that shouldn't even be enough to convict the person, much less give them the death penalty, especially when the DNA and other physical evidence does not match.
I put a higher stock in DNA evidence than eyewitness testimony always, as does law enforcement. However eyewitness testimony is far more easily manipulated and *seems* more reliable than it actually is, which is why it's a godsend for prosecutors.
ghostwritingduck
Member
The investigation went Marcellus cellmate was released from prison and Once free told police that Marcellus admitted to murder and provides details about murder not released to public. Police investigate, and his girlfriend says that Marcellus admitted to murder after she questioned bloody clothing/his possession of dead woman's things. Police then hunt down Marcellus' uncle who gives police permission to search car Marcellus allegedly drove that night. They find items belonging to the murder victim. They then find the murder victims laptop and the man who claims he purchased it from Marcellus.
Marcellus' defense argued that his cellmate and girlfriend made up their stories for award money, but what are the odds that you randomly accuse someone of murder and they just happen to have the victim's possessions?
The story saying the DNA came from underneath the victim's fingernails makes it sound like it could only have gotten there from defending herself, but I'd like to see the description of the DNA sample from a more direct source.
Only once a day??
ghostwritingduck
Member
I think it's a game of telephone. The article that the author cites from your source states that Marcellus' DNA wasn't found under her fingernails. Marcellus' girlfriend had testified that he had scratch marks on his neck the night of the murder.
The DNA not confirming Marcellus as the killer still leaves the other evidence. DNA is thought of a sure thing, and it some cases it is. But in cases with smaller samples, the results are very much open to interpretation. Additionally, the spread of DNA is not nearly as predictable as one would think.
From an interesting article in the Atlantic not related to this case. "And because we all shed different amounts of cells, the strongest DNA profile on an object doesnt always correspond to the person who most recently touched it. I could pick up a knife at 10 in the morning, but an analyst testing the handle that day might find a stronger and more complete DNA profile from my wife, who was using it four nights earlier. Or the analyst might find a profile of someone who never touched the knife at all. One recent study asked participants to shake hands with a partner for two minutes and then hold a knife; when the DNA on the knives was analyzed, the partner was identified as a contributor in 85 percent of cases, and in 20 percent as the main or sole contributor." https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theatlantic.com/amp/article/480747/
Jesus. That's worse than I imagined. Poor fucking guy.
Corronchilejano
Member
Yet no DNA of Marcellus was found anywhere.
ghostwritingduck
Member
How do you think Marcellus' cellmate knew to accuse him of murdering the person he did? Was it just luck that he named someone who was murdered, accused Marcellus, and Marcellus coincidentally had sold her stolen items and still in possession of others?
Check the Atlantic article above to see why his lack of DNA being collected doesn't clear him of being involved.
Again, when your only evidence is two testimonies (after posting a $10,000 reward), and a victims items, that's not much of a case. Testimonies are made to fit the crime by police interrogators all the time, and there is some speculation that this was the case even here. If you look at all the physical evidence, including multiple DNA sources and his footprints, and none of it points to him being the one to commit the murder (and rather an unspecified third party), that is not enough evidence to convict him.
Granted, that DNA testing wasn't available at the time, but if it was, I would have voted to acquit, because it absolutely does not constitute an overwhelming preponderance of evidence. Certainly, if we're going to kill someone at all (and I'm of the opinion the death penalty is never warranted), every bit of evidence has to show their guilt, and that isn't true in this case whatsoever.
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