ChuckeRearmed
Member
Yeah, it is hilarious that some people believe that USA needed NATO help. Well I guess it makes europeans feel important.
But I think there will be a lot of interesting events happeniing in the next couple of years.
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Monitoring the situation in Iran
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But I think there will be a lot of interesting events happeniing in the next couple of years.
9 days ago:
US says Trump ‘interested’ in asking Arab countries to pay for war on Iran
White House's Karoline Leavitt says passing the conflict's costs off to regional states is 'an idea' Donald Trump has.
I guess they didn't agree to pay so now this is his idea. I bet they didn't agree to the iran invasion either so now he's threatening the Arab states with this to do as he says. As if the new Greenland threats aren't evidence enough that coercion is his MO.
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AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
The US just wanted to fly over nato ally countries and that should really never be denied. But the US military is still the greatest military in the world. Much of the European countries come to the US for defense hardware.
Buggy Loop
Member
That was from a time where US seemed like a sane ally. Can you guess what happened since?
It's also a ponzi scheme. It's a channel for US military equipment sales. They twist arms and play hard if you even think about buying something else than an F35 and so on. Of course it comes also with the whole massive lobbying game with rent a general in each countries to always simp for US solutions. Pretty much only France is the most sovereign in all of NATO's.
Europe is veering towards rapidly ramping up their military complex and thanks to Trump, shying away peoples from US military complex likely for the next 5 decades. Never been a better person in the world to unite countries in aiming to be sovereign from now on.
Unknown Soldier
Banned
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
SirKicksalot
Member
Yeah I remember Madeline Albright's "3Ds" - no decoupling of European defense from NATO, no duplication of NATO capabilities, no discrimination against non-EU NATO members. The Americans always complained when NATO countries ramped up their capabilities.
Madflavor
Member
I mean it's kinda funny, but ridiculing an unhinged psycho on an international level for being too chicken to decimate an entire civilization sounds like a bold strategy Cotton.
"I don't know how much the rest of you know about Asian culture (I'm an expert), but honor and shame are huge parts of it. It's not like it is in America where you can become successful by being an asshole..."
Wait a minute.
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AJUMP23
Parody of actual AJUMP23
Europe should look into more internal solutions. Germany still makes great tanks.
It would actually be beneficial for nato if Europe contributed more military support in the alliance.
What Europeans don't have is the missile defense the US does. Missile defense is basically owned by the Americans.
ScHlAuChi
Member
This is a typical bullshit myth peddled by US republicans - but repeating it endlessly doesnt make it true!
Europe wanted to spend alot of money on defense and create an EU Army since the 1990s!
Now guess who didnt want that to happen in fear of losing influence in Europe and vetoed it every single time?
Yes, the good old USA, even under democractic presidents:
https://www.americanprogress.org/article/case-eu-defense/
Unknown Soldier
Banned
You can pretend that all cultures are the same and everyone is the same but that won't get you anywhere in geopolitics
Unknown Soldier
Banned
We're seeing decoupling and duplication now. There are at least 3 sixth-generation fighters being built by different NATO countries now. The US is probably not too happy about that if those 3Ds still apply. I'm not sure if Trump was mad about lack of military spending in Europe due to an actual concern for its safety or because he wanted them to spend on US weapons technology to help his deficit goals.
I think you missed the very direct reference to a neogaf meme (almost literal quote of it). I'm not pretending all cultures are the same and I don't know what in my post gave you that idea.
Unknown Soldier
Banned
This is going around at the moment. If it's true, the US Government better be first in line to buy a copy of the data. Imagine if we had the specs and stealth profile data for the J-20 stealth fighter. That would completely negate the last 20 years of Chinese military research instantly if we could adapt our radars to detect the J-20
Raven117
Member
lol. You think this is a better reason do you?
Either way (regardless of the current spat), NATO is critical and I hope it continues. It only strengthen the west and western values. Which… will be very needed as this century marches on.
Critical Hit
Member
It seems more likely that he's on putin's payroll. Schroder definitely was.
I'm not sure if Trump is acting this way for that reason, but based on my experience interacting with less secular muslims, this is actually how they naturally behave in everyday life.
Atomicfear
Member
If a hacker just got it, the US has been in for years.
Mr Reasonable
Completely Unreasonable
I suspect that claims that Mr Trump is able to tailor his demeanor to his audience are generous.
Here's the president meeting some children at an Easter event.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Clueless post. I have Danish friends and work colleagues from different companies i work with. We had teams calls where they were legit looking to buy rifles and defend Greenland themselves. They were PISSED at the US and said they would legit fight for it. This wasn't little empty threats they were actually going ahead with actual planning. I dont think the US or its citizens have a clue about europe and its people.
Your post is exactly why some of these people are fed up with the US. the sheer nerve to talk like that.
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DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
If america tried to take Europe or Canada in 2026 it would be the majority of the world vs America.
People are fed up and rightfully so.
Why are we even doing these types of conversations.
My dad can beat up your dad. Its immature.
Zathalus
Member
The exact opposite actually.
Opinions of the EU remain mostly favorable across 25 countries
A median of 62% of adults across 25 surveyed countries say they have a favorable opinion of the EU. Another 32% have an unfavorable view of the organization.
www.pewresearch.org
European Parliament Autumn 2025 Eurobarometer
Discover how SCOs and FNLC are reducing administrative burdens and enhancing 2021-2027 fund management.
-2.png){kind=icon}
www.veriangroup.com
EU Earns Steady, High Approval Across the Bloc
Approval of the EU's leadership among its member states remained high at 60% in 2025.
news.gallup.com
Turns out being threatened by both the USA and Russia makes people nervous. Even some of the right-wing populist groups are becoming more pro-EU and they have slowly come to realize that they can actually influence EU policy if they gain power. Euroscepticism has changed from let's leave the EU (which will just weaken Europe as a whole) to let's change the EU from within.
It was something to rally against while they were fringe and slowly gaining power, but now that some of this parties have a shot of gaining actual power they realize the EU is a powerful tool they can leverage. And the geopolitical reality makes it pretty clear as well.
Unknown Soldier
Banned
LMAO your Danish friends are apparently clueless about their own country's gun laws
They couldn't buy rifles even if they wanted to, and certainly if they had less TDS and more awareness of their own nation's restrictions they might have realized this
Americans can buy any guns they want at any time and they already own 46% of the world's guns. The Danish are slightly outnumbered and outgunned. If we really wanted Greenland, we could just take it. Period.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
What does Trump not understand about NATO being a defensive alliance? In what way did the US need defending here, in a war they started?
Forsete
Member
Pretty sure hunting is allowed in Denmark.
I know a few danish hunters but I am sure you are correct. Guns are outlawed in Denmark.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
If you wanted to fight most of Europe for it, and alienate most of the world even more, sure. Denmark would not be left to defend Greenland alone.
StueyDuck
Member
Nor does anyone parroting IRGC propaganda and sympathizing with them
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I know what i heard and whay they were discussing. I live my life. Who cares about legal guns in this situation.
But yes. Your dad is well hard. You should be proud but dont think for a second you actually understand what these people were discussing to do.
You dont even undertand how insane it is to be talking like you are about an ALLY to America.
If America tried to take Greenland or Canada I think the US would be up to a rude awakening.
I bet if this war wasn't happening you would all be talking about how you could wipe out irans regime in a week and yet here we are.
Unknown Soldier
Banned
Obviously. No one with above a room temperature IQ seriously thought the US was going to invade Greenland. At least no one here in America actually thought it would happen, because I guess we're used to how our President speaks after being around him for over 4 decades first as a bombastic real estate developer, than as a TV show personality, and finally as a politician
StueyDuck
Member
Its not strange whataboutism
Its a pattern im noticing from many on here, especially eurogaf of completely refusing to criticise or put any blame in the IRGCs hands. In your world view everything is perfect until bad man trump. When the truth is that fucked up regime killed 40000 innocent civilians and europe sat and sucked their thumbs and had a party in davos.
I need to start seeing just as much criticism levied at murderous, extremist fuckheads who've literally fucked up the world for 47 years, because trump is not ENTIRELY to blame for anything, anyone who believes that is a terrorist sympathizer.
The US pulls back, agrees to a cease fire and iran continues to shoot rockets at my friends and family, literal civilians, in the UAE. How are they literally not the ultimate villain?
They are literally doing cartoon nazi stuff and bombing civilians, killing civilians but many people here dont want to recognize that they are the MAIN cause behind this war and are absolutely the villains.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
First one is funny too.
Unknown Soldier
Banned
Well obviously the Wikipedia entry is wrong then, so maybe you should correct it with your extensive knowledge of Danish gun lawsPretty sure hunting is allowed in Denmark.
I know a few danish hunters but I am sure you are correct. Guns are outlawed in Denmark.
What actually happened is you didn't even bother to click the link, which actually methodically lays out the various procedures that must be followed to legally obtain a firearm and the restrictions on use, category, and capacities, and just posted some bullshit about 'outlawed' without even thinking or reading so congrats on getting completely exposed
calico
Member
Your Danish work colleagues daydreaming about defending Greenland to the last staple will be very worrying to the US military I'm sure.
How on earth were they planning to cross the thousands of miles of ocean and overcome or bypass whatever US naval assets would be on station in the event of a US annexation?
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
I dont think you get it. This wasn't playtime conversations. This was real people. Really pissed at what the taco said.
You could try stop them and tell them they cant have guns, and how do they get therr to defend. I didnt take that angle.
That's not for me to think about. Im telling you about what I witnessed at the time and the sentiments even in Copenhagen from these young proffesionals.
I didnt fancy asking them about their gun laws and how they get there to defend it.
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Haint
Member
They literally did wipe out 95% of Iran's military in a week, the problem is nobody is willing to send platoons of teenage kids to get blown up by the remaining 5% of rockets, suicide drones, and IRGC insurgents. They're similarly unwilling to level Iranian cities, power plants, and water plants. So this is the result of those 2 realities.
The US and Israel almost certainly foresaw Iran launching missiles at everyone around them (including Turkey) and holding the strait hostage, which they assumed would involve NATO by default. As I pointed out many pages ago, Trump's expected role for NATO in all this was for them to just put on a show. They were intended to project an illusion of a united front with the US. He never expected any actual substance behind it, strictly political theater, announcements of announcements, and fog of war making glorified training drills portend great mobilizations against Iran. NATO was a deck strengthener intended to threaten Iran with a World Alliance, which the idea was, would have ended this weeks ago with Iran scrambling for deescalation with deep concessions.
NATO instead chose to do the complete opposite, support and embolden Iran by emphatically disavowing the US, actively close off access to military bases and airspace, and work out deals with Iran directly. Full throated betrayal of the US. They could not separate Trump's literal shitposting about taking Greenland from an actual real and meaningful threat. The comical levels of Grand Master Monstertard Certified Retardation required to even entertain for a second that the US military apparatus would actually roll up to Denmark and massacre your toy soldiers is so utterly preposterous it's beyond parody.
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Unknown Soldier
Banned
I mean, basically you were saying they were angry young liberals who aren't aware of how the world works and were angry about whatever the media told them to be angry about today and would soon forget about Greenland the moment the media pivoted to the next Current Thing™ to be angry about and that would have sufficed as a response
You should follow up at the next Zoom meeting and ask them if they are still ready to buy (nonexistent) guns and rush off to Greenland (how? by swimming there?) and see if they still even remember Greenland exists. My money is on they don't even remember what Greenland is by now, they are too busy being angry about the Current Thing™ (which is Iran)
Zathalus
Member
"NATO" did no such thing. Only three countries out of the entire NATO block had some restrictions on allowing military aircraft in their airspace, which is fully within their rights to do so. Countries like Germany, France, Greece, etc... allowed full use and even supported actions against Iran.
Now getting involved with the military action? No, nobody really wants to really step into this quagmire now, especially after zero consultation beforehand. If Trump wanted a world alliance, maybe he should have actually involved his allies, instead of expecting them to unilaterally support him when things went sideways.
DenchDeckard
Moderated wildly
Lets Just leave it. You have no idea. Where are you from?
I cant believe america supported and allowed a president where the American people can just say.
" you believed this guy, jokes on you"
The gaslighting from America and Americans is beyond belief and I legit am starting to believe its time to give another country a go at being the worlds super power. More and more evidence points to America being truly lost.
Its not the Americans people's fault either, its decades of influence from some of the worst people on the planet. And the love of power and all things seen to be powerful, like military might.
Its a mentality for the weak minded and unintelligent.
The American dream. Power over everything possible.
America and the world are just dealing with some serious hard truths about the grear land of the brave in recent months and years. I think the world is fed up with this president and the America that allowed it to happen.
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Forsete
Member
So guns are allowed you just need to get permits?
But you said:
So which is it?
It works the same way in my country. It's a few extra steps but it is worth it if you take it seriously.
It's great that regular Joe just can't get up and buy a weapon. We wouldn't want to turn into the US.
Haint
Member
Quoting myself from pages ago, Yes, lets tell 10,000's of thousands of politicians, aids, and military personnel in a dozens countries about our surprise attack that's actually real and not the Trump bluff negotiation tactic everyone thinks it is. The oil calls and equity put volumes alone would signal the exact day. Trump might as well have texted the ayatolla the date and locations himself so they'd have plenty of time to bring in additional defensive equipment from Russia and China. You can't hold months long dozen country tribunals on a surprise attack everyone thinks is a fake out with bureaucrat allies who will cut off their nose to spite their face.
As I said above, I don't think NATO was ever expected to be materially involved, only offer an illusion of a threat to encourage concessions and negotiation.
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Hypereides
Member
That you state something like this without seemingly a slightest undertone of remorse... I have no words.
Is this where we're at? We're going back to the primitive thought of entertaining imperialism being somehow remotely rational in 2026?
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Zathalus
Member
Don't be silly. You don't need to inform your allies of the exact details of what you are planning to do. Just that you are going to take military action and what support they can provide in future, or at least a heads-up about presenting a united front. And US allies like Germany, Poland, or the UK are fully capable of operational security, and have done many times in the past.
Regardless of that, my point still stands, NATO as a whole has done nothing, because article 5 hasn't been invoked. NATO is a defensive alliance as some here seem to have forgotten. Meant as a tool of defense and detterance. It can also be used as leverage, but only if member states are actually involved. Individual countries within NATO have offered various levels of support for this attack against Iran, up to being willing to assist the US Navy with clearing the Strait. As for airspace, most have allowed full access as usual, others have restricted their airspace, something they are allowed to do.
Calling this as being betrayed by NATO is nonsense, at most you can claim Spain has betrayed the USA but even then that is rather spurious.
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IlGialloMondadori
Member
One of the strangest, dumbest people to ever exist, and he managed to rise to the heights of power.
Truly remarkable.
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Haint
Member
Ah yes, "Defense Only", just like Ukraine huh? How many self quotes are you going to make me pull: Ukraine is not in NATO, so who are we defending exactly in this supposed defensive only alliance as you call it? How is the US is expected to send mountains of weapons, money, and intelligence to defend a maybe precursor of a precursor Russian invasion when NATO can't even pretend to act tough when we need it? And not only can't meet that bare minimum, but take obstinate positions AGAINST us.
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Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The exact opposite actually.
Opinions of the EU remain mostly favorable across 25 countries
A median of 62% of adults across 25 surveyed countries say they have a favorable opinion of the EU. Another 32% have an unfavorable view of the organization.
European Parliament Autumn 2025 Eurobarometer
Discover how SCOs and FNLC are reducing administrative burdens and enhancing 2021-2027 fund management.
EU Earns Steady, High Approval Across the Bloc
Approval of the EU's leadership among its member states remained high at 60% in 2025.
Turns out being threatened by both the USA and Russia makes people nervous. Even some of the right-wing populist groups are becoming more pro-EU and they have slowly come to realize that they can actually influence EU policy if they gain power. Euroscepticism has changed from let's leave the EU (which will just weaken Europe as a whole) to let's change the EU from within.
It was something to rally against while they were fringe and slowly gaining power, but now that some of this parties have a shot of gaining actual power they realize the EU is a powerful tool they can leverage. And the geopolitical reality makes it pretty clear as well.
Those poll numbers are not reflective of the actuality! The National Rally has been kept out of power in France via cordon sanitaire and dubious legal proceedings, meanwhile the Mercosur agreement has French farmers near riot. Germany is deep along the same path with AFD continuing to gain support but being blocked by unnatural political alliances that seek to hold onto power even at a cost of effectively stale-mating policy.
The two biggest economies and the lynch-pin of the EU alliance stuck with failing, ineffective governments. Meanwhile across the rest of Europe public sentiment continues to grow increasingly concerned and angry over uncontrolled mass migration that is basically uncheckable under the aegis of ECHR. The few countries that attempt to take a harder line e.g Poland and Italy being forced into ongoing legal conflict versus the EU court.
Sorry, but the harsh truth is most of Southern Europe is too poor to have much of a say in anything (even within the EU), while the Nordics are looking increasingly nervous and preoccupied by potential Russian expansionism to do more than think of their own borders.
And then, of course, we have the UK, led by the least popular PM since records began and a ruling party on the verge of electoral annihilation.
In a few years the political landscape could be entirely different. In fact I'd suspect its an inevitability given the direction of political travel across the continent.
Angry_Megalodon
Member
Things are a bit more complex (and crazier) than this.
The only reliable partners for USA nowadays are in eastern Europe and, maybe, Italy. Every other country from the UE is NOT any guarantee and I would not count on them, not even on the UK.
The problem is that much of the present situation is USA's fault and that's a hard pill to swallow. The west has been infected by movements, fake NGOs and politicians who are actively working against the West. The European Union doesn't work for the benefit of European countries but for elites, many of them being globalist Northamericans. In a way, it was the USA that infected us with this virus and now is paying the consequences of their abuse of soft power exercised in the last twenty five years. Just repeating the same mistakes they did to Latin America in the late 20th century.
The average European citizen is mostly fed up with the European establishment, many people have realized that the UE was always a scam and nowadays are advocating for a breakup. That's why the nationalistic right is on the rise in Europe. My prediction is that when the real breakup happens, NATO will be disbanded and international relations will consist of bilateral alliances.
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RoadHazard
Gold Member
It seems that you, like Trump, don't understand that NATO is a defensive alliance. It's not an organisation you call upon to help with your invasions.
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