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Next Super Smash Bros. discussion thread, Community Edition

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People keep championing that game, and I keep wondering "why?"

People just want another free-roaming 3D adventure game, with Zelda arriving once every five years and Metroid Prime on hiatus. Rather than asking for a brand new IP, a retro revival seems more realistic. That's my take on it, anyway - I can't speak for everyone.
 

WhyMe6

Member
Regarding Kid Icarus, I'd be content with this:

Playable Characters
Pit
Palutena

Boss
Medusa

Assist Trophy
Eggplant Wizard - turned into a walking eggplant for 5-10 seconds, unable to attack

Trophies
Dark Pit (also an alternate color for Pit)
Magnus
Hades

Considering the volume of which Sakurai pulls content from his company's own series, such as Kirby, I wouldn't be surprised if Kid Icarus had even more than you've suggested.

For example, Magnus (as mentioned before) and Eggplant Wizard could be Assist Trophies, but then Tempura Bomb (+ other things, such as Angel Rocket) could be an item.

I sure hope they throw in the claws as an item >_>
 
Considering the volume of which Sakurai pulls content from his company's own series, such as Kirby, I wouldn't be surprised if Kid Icarus had even more than you've suggested.

You mean the series that was represented with only one character prior to Brawl and only managed to get one new stage in Brawl?
 
Brawl had started development the October before it was announced, and they still didn't have very much to show. Smash 4 only started development around February of this year, has a simultaneous Wii U and 3DS version being made and for the Wii U version is being made on vastly more hardware than the previous game (as opposed to the slight jump between Melee and Brawl, where it likely didn't take long to start making assets they could show in Brawl's announcement trailer).

Even just a smaller CG teaser trailer with a new addition and a new 3rd party character and the official logo would be pushing it; it'd be best to keep expectations low and not expect anything beyond another mention in passing like it had at least year's E3.
 

Snakey

Member
I am strongly expecting Palutena to be among the first newcomers unveiled for Smash 4. However, despite an early Palutena unveil, I don't think there will be any other Kid Icarus newcomers added.

Mega Man is another character that I am expecting to see whenever Smash 4 is unveiled.
 
So ... with Kid Icarus released .... any chance of we start to hear some news in the next months ?

I expect atleast a Brawl level trailer.

With what lil I have heard about KI development (AFAIK it was supposed to come out last year but they needed more time. Seems likely to me that he would have at least had a small team of people working on Smash before KI came out) and how fast Nintendo seems to be able to crank out trailers (lets not forget that the first TP trailer was made 2-4 months before it's e3 reveal) I don't think it's wishful thinking at all.


And on top of that a full CGI trailer outsourced to an animation studio isn't out of the question either.
 

ffdgh

Member
I am strongly expecting Palutena to be among the first newcomers unveiled for Smash 4. However, despite an early Palutena unveil, I don't think there will be any other Kid Icarus newcomers added.

Mega Man is another character that I am expecting to see whenever Smash 4 is unveiled.

classic megaman or CvT megaman :p

sakurai....bring back melee's metal battle theme.
 

KevinCow

Banned
Keep your expectations low, people.

Fuck that.

I'm expecting them to announce that they invented time travel just so Sakurai and his team could complete Smash for Wii U launch.

Also it will have all the characters. Not a lot of characters. Not all the characters you want, or all the characters people were asking for. All the characters. Period. All of them.
 

Emitan

Member
Fuck that.

I'm expecting them to announce that they invented time travel just so Sakurai and his team could complete Smash for Wii U launch.

Also it will have all the characters. Not a lot of characters. Not all the characters you want, or all the characters people were asking for. All the characters. Period. All of them.

But they ran out of space on the disk so they cut Ridley. He's too big!
 

cednym

Banned
I don't think we're going to see a trailer or anything of substance until the fall. You can bet on an official announcement and logo at E3, though.
 
Keep your expectations low, people.
Fuck that noise.

This is Sakurai and Nintendo. And if there's one thing I think Nintendo will want it's to get an actual trailer out at a big event for a game they've been teasing/ using to promote a new console.

IMO it's either this E3 or E3 2013 seeing as I don't see them releasing something like a SSB trailer at some smaller event. Plus, it's Smash Brothers ... unless he decides to forgo 2D and make it some kinda Power Stone 3D 4 player brawler I don't see them not being able to "cheat" gameplay footage by just using w/e engine they used in Brawl with some updated vets and short CGI cutscenes to reveal new characters.


I'd be really hesitant to call anything with only two data points a "pattern."
I remember saying this in the Brawl times when people would try to make patterns as a way to support w/e.

Now that we have 3 games worth of stuff to look at the only patterns I'm willing to bet on is ...

Pokemon getting at least 2 new characters plus the likelihood of Lucario not coming back in favor of a 6th gen mon.
SF gets a 4th character? There seems to be a character from SF in added into every smash and so I wouldn't be shocked ...
And that's about as far as that goes for me :p
 

IntelliHeath

As in "Heathcliff"
I don't think we're going to see a trailer or anything of substance until the fall. You can bet on an official announcement and logo at E3, though.

I can see logo but that's it for my exception. I wouldn't be surprised if there is nothing to shown.
 
So Blackwind, do I get to make fun of you if Nintendo only shows a logo and no trailer at E3 this year? If they even mention the game at all?

Sure (I can't even remember the last time Nintendo did a trailer that was actually just a logo and title and NOTHING more).

Not sure what I should get if they DO show something (will likely be too hyped to care). How about I pick your ava for a month?

If we get neither then that should be a draw.
 

BGBW

Maturity, bitches.
Sure (I can't even remember the last time Nintendo did a trailer that was actually just a logo and title and NOTHING more).

Not sure what I should get if they DO show something (will likely be too hyped to care). How about I pick your ava for a month?

If we get neither then that should be a draw.

Well there was that Namco x Capcom x Sega teaser during the Nintendo Direct stream. Not quite Nintendo doing a logo only trailer, but it was their show.
 
Just do it since you are already famed villain on this forum.
I actually went back to Gamefaqs to see if I was mentioned again, but no dice. I guess that guy who wanted to punch me was all talk.
Sure (I can't even remember the last time Nintendo did a trailer that was actually just a logo and title and NOTHING more).

Not sure what I should get if they DO show something (will likely be too hyped to care). How about I pick your ava for a month?

If we get neither then that should be a draw.

Sorry, I don't do avatar bets.
Anymore.
 

IntelliHeath

As in "Heathcliff"
We might not even get a logo. We didn't for Brawl.

Hmm really? I thought we got first trailer a year after announced Melee remake for wii with online.


Also I am thinking about making a new thread for SSB4 roster prediction in 3 weeks for reward.
 

KevinCow

Banned
Hmm really? I thought we got first trailer a year after announced Melee remake for wii with online.

You're remembering right. Though they never actually announced a Melee remake, that was just what they intended to do if they couldn't get Sakurai on board. Because they only asked Sakurai to do it after they announced the game. Yeah.

E3 2005, they said, "Yo, we're gonna have a Smash Bros. game for this new console we're working on."

E3 2006, we got the Brawl trailer. Except it wasn't at the conference, it was at some post-conference thing that wasn't streamed to the internet.

Which, in retrospect, really annoys me. It would've been awesome to see that trailer live at the conference. I can only imagine the live reactions in the chat room, especially at the Snake part. Instead, the first time I saw it was when I logged onto IGN in the morning and was met with something along the lines of "SMASH BROS BRAWL REVEALED AND SOLID SNAKE AND PIT AND WARIO AND METAKNIGHT AND ZERO SUIT SAMUS ARE IN IT!" Gee, IGN, thanks for ruining all those surprises.


...But yeah, by that pattern, there would be a trailer this year. Which I'd say is more likely than a lot of people seem to think. I don't expect the game itself is far along in development since Kid Icarus only just came out, but I could see an outsourced CG trailer with a handful of character reveals being shown at E3.
 

cednym

Banned
I was going through some of my old discs and hard drives and I came across something that I've been trying to find for years: beta Smash Bros. roster information that I typed up waaaay back in 2002.

These notes come from the official Japanese N64 Smash Bros. site and a bunch of old Famitsu magazines from early 2002 (I want to say somewhere between January and April). I'd greatly appreciate any help in relocating some of these articles, because it appears that they've been lost in time. I'm hopeful that there's additional information out there in issues that I haven't had the chance to read.

In the original Super Smash Bros., Sakurai wanted to include some hidden villains: Bowser, Dedede, Wolf (Star Fox 64 was brand new during the planning period), and Mewtwo. However, time and budget constraints meant that Sakurai had to ditch these characters.

Fast forward to Melee: Bowser, Dedede, and Mewtwo were planned for inclusion, but later on Sakurai decided to cut Dedede in favor of adding six clones in his place. (Fans were asking for more characters, so Sakurai figured it would be better to add six clones than to add one original character.) Wolf was going to be one of these clones, but ultimately Falco made the cut because he received more fan requests and because he stood out more from Fox visually. So… Dedede and Wolf were both planned for the first Smash Bros. AND Melee, but they made the final cut for neither. You could say that Dedede and Wolf were eight years in the making.

Just for fun, here's a quick mock-up of what the N64 Smash Bros. select screen probably looked like in terms of placement:

3jWQF.png


I'm amazed at how conveniently the villains line up below their respective universes. I didn't even have to change the order of any of the default characters!

What does this mean for SSB4? Some of the "Forbidden Seven" might be more likely than we think, given Sakurai's evident propensity for carrying over planned characters into future games.
 

IntelliHeath

As in "Heathcliff"
3jWQF.png



What does this mean for SSB4? Some of the "Forbidden Seven" might be more likely than we think, given Sakurai's evident propensity for carrying over planned characters into future games.

Good Read,. Apparently, I remembered the information. Oh boy, what a nostalgia trip that I just took. However, who are 7 forbidden characters? Plus I remember there are few more characters that didn't able to make into early two games. I had the list somewhere on internet.

Edited: I am tempted to going ahead and make thread for prediction for rosters. Contest for prize.
 

IntelliHeath

As in "Heathcliff"
Brawl's Forbidden Seven:

Roy
Mewtwo
Dr. Mario
Dixie Kong
Toon Zelda
Toon Sheik
Plusle and Minum

I know they already disproved Plusle and Minum, right?

I am fine with Dr. Mario being alt costume, but I want Dixie to be separate character, rather than being Diddy's partner. Also I want them to save Toon Zelda/Tetra/Sheik as last minute character because I would like to see newcomers.

Mewtwo and Roy, you are welcome to come back on my book.


none of those characters should be in smash 4 except possibly toon zelda/sheik.

Apologies, but I strongly disagreed with you.
 

SmithnCo

Member
Some of the forbidden seven getting in would be pretty cool, a lot of them have potential. They all seem kinda clone-y (besides Mewtwo and Dixie) but even as clones I think Plusle/Minun would be fun. I think it could be time for another Ice-Climbers-esque character. I would like Toon Zelda too mostly because Tetra is awesome.

If Mewtwo returns hopefully it is more powerful and has an awesome Final Smash. The Melee version being super low tier sucked because I got my ass kicked whenever I played it, lol.
 

JazzmanZ

Member
As far as I'm aware there were a number of beta characters for all the games.

SSB originally would of had

-Bowser
-Peach
-Dedede
-Wolf
-Mewtwo
-Meowth
-Siguerd (Fire Emblem fame)
-Lucas

SSBM would of had

-Dedede
-Banjo-Kazooie
-Snake
-Wolf
-Diddy kong?

SSBB had the forbidden 7
-Toon Zelda
-Dixie kong
-Plusle and Minun
-Dr.Mario
-Mewtwo
-Roy
-I forget the last one
 

SmithnCo

Member
I see plusle/minun as Ice Climbers with basically Pikachu's moves. Maybe with some comical Pichu stuff thrown in. Like maybe they hurt each other with their attacks and end up using each other as weapons.
 
Did they ever confirm that Rare characters were planned for Smash at some point? The most I remember is Loveday in Scribes saying Sakurai/HAL asked them to make quite a lot of content for Melee for them (guessing the DK levels were partially made by them) but most of it wound up getting cut, but I just assumed he meant stuff like Diddy Kong Racing trophies or whatever. The cloaking device was also from Perfect Dark, wasn't it?
 
What does this mean for SSB4? Some of the "Forbidden Seven" might be more likely than we think, given Sakurai's evident propensity for carrying over planned characters into future games.

This is a really interesting post. I knew about Dedede, Mewtwo, and Bowser, but I didn't know about Wolf (except that he was going to be in Melee) or that those were all supposed to be secret characters. I didn't know that Sakurai actually said he considered and dropped the Animal Crossing guy, either.

As far as I'm aware there were a number of beta characters for all the games.

SSB originally would of had

-Bowser
-Peach
-Dedede
-Wolf
-Mewtwo
-Meowth
-Siguerd (Fire Emblem fame)
-Lucas

The ones that Cednym mentioned are the only ones that we know were going to get in. I don't think Sakurai or anyone from Nintendo said that Meowth, Sigurd, Peach, or Lucas were planned for the first Smash Bros., but Lucas was going to replace Ness in Melee early on.

SSBM would of had

-Dedede
-Banjo-Kazooie
-Snake
-Wolf
-Diddy kong?

Snake wasn't actually planned or considered by the developers; Kojima just wanted him in the game (and asked too late). Banjo-Kazooie were probably never considered, and no one's ever said anything about Diddy to my knowledge.

SSBB had the forbidden 7
-Toon Zelda
-Dixie kong
-Plusle and Minun
-Dr.Mario
-Mewtwo
-Roy
-I forget the last one

That's all of them. The last one was just Toon Sheik.
 

cednym

Banned
This is a really interesting post. I knew about Dedede, Mewtwo, and Bowser, but I didn't know about Wolf

I'm thinking Wolf's name is omitted from the poll results page because Sakurai says something along the lines of "characters from above like Bowser, Dedede, and Mewtwo were considered"; Wolf isn't mentioned on the page, so it wouldn't make sense to bring him up in that context.
 
Just give me Palutena, and I'll be happy.

I don't think the other KI characters would translate very well unless it were one of the semi-minor stage bosses.
 

SmithnCo

Member
Just give me Palutena, and I'll be happy.

I don't think the other KI characters would translate very well unless it were one of the semi-minor stage bosses.

I agree, and I'd be pretty surprised if Palutena isn't in actually. People want a magic user and more female characters is a plus. Hopefully if she is in they give her plenty of alt colors based on the other notable characters.

I could see an Uprising antagonist as a story mode boss as well.
 

cednym

Banned
I haven't played Uprising (no 3DS), so forgive me for asking such a stupid question, but does Palutena appear in the game during any of the combat sequences, or is she strictly a communications character? I definitely think she's going to be in the game, but it'd be nice if there's stuff in Uprising to pull from directly for her attacks.
 

SmithnCo

Member
I haven't played Uprising (no 3DS), so forgive me for asking such a stupid question, but does Palutena appear in the game during any of the combat sequences, or is she strictly a communications character? I definitely think she's going to be in the game, but it'd be nice if there's stuff in Uprising to pull from directly for her attacks.

I don't want to spoil much, but yes. She appears in a battle situation and has attacks to draw from. I'm thinking something along the lines of Zelda with beams, etc. Plus she can call in Centurion guards.

She also needs to be in because of the possible taunt/dialouge hijinks.
 
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