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Next Super Smash Bros. discussion thread, Community Edition
- Thread starter Snakeyes
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Black-Wind
Member
Every fan fav that's not from an iconic series shifts and changes over time as people think they're understanding of Sakurai's decisions becomes clearer.
Earlier in this thread people were more conservative with the number of new-comers it seems and the tone was way different. Smash threads are like a living things, they change very fast.
Eh Tingle's flamboyant-ness is alright with me and Smash could use that. I'm just not a fan of the dude. If he gets in, he gets in but I don't think his chances are any better than let's say Ghirahim at this point. The 3 main characters of the Zelda series are already in so it's anybody's guess who else will be included. He will make an appearance at least as an AT.
True, but I don't think we fully get Sakurai's way of thinking just yet. Other than the fact newer characters from an established series will be a more likely choice to rep the series in the next Smash. For example, Krom replacing Ike or what not. At this point, there is still a lot that is in the realm of possibility so it's interesting how even with little to no information there's this change, albeit cyclic lol, of what people think about those "wishful thinking" characters like Lip, Lyn, Ray MK II, Krystal, etc. I think having those random choices a part of the fun and balance out the logic that we think we really have in terms of roster choices. Who knows, hopefully by the end of e3 we'll get some more info to keep us guessing lol.
True, but I don't think we fully get Sakurai's way of thinking just yet. Other than the fact newer characters from an established series will be a more likely choice to rep the series in the next Smash. For example, Krom replacing Ike or what not. At this point, there is still a lot that is in the realm of possibility so it's interesting how even with little to no information there's this change, albeit cyclic lol, of what people think about those "wishful thinking" characters like Lip, Lyn, Ray MK II, Krystal, etc. I think having those random choices a part of the fun and balance out the logic that we think we really have in terms of roster choices. Who knows, hopefully by the end of e3 we'll get some more info to keep us guessing lol.
:l
I don't think Sakurai has been secretly and slowly integrating Tingle....or has he? lol
I wonder if they will go through the trouble of changing the ATs that won't be upgraded as playable characters this time around. I honestly think AT are really going to piss people off this time around because there's a chance that our fan favorites will fall to the horrible fate of just being an AT. I remember the whole Lyn "surprise, she's an AT! Bitch!" dojo reveal, twas not a good feeling :/
Red Arremer
Member
I was like "Oh hey, cool, Lyn... wait... she's an item? FFFFFUUUUUUU-"
I want Tingle to become a playable character more than anyone, but I don't see it happening. They don't even put him in Zelda games any more (besides miniscule references). Nintendo is still afraid of offending American customers and they think that Tingle is too camp for the hordes of insecure manchildren who buy videogames. It's all IGN's fault.
Tingle could work with balloons, I always thought that was a good idea if he was added to the roster. He better be 85% comedic relief though.
That is definitely the top pro of having Assist Trophies, I will not argue against that. It was a nice surprise. It's for those characters that deserve a little more than a trophy but I'm sure if we see characters this time around that most felt deserved a roster spot it's going to be another story. Plus I don't usually play with items all on so I don't really see ATs all that much and when I do I don't really notice them.
heh. I had the same response. I also noticed her model was not as clean and sharp as the models for the playable characters so I knew something wasn't right lol.
That is definitely the top pro of having Assist Trophies, I will not argue against that. It was a nice surprise. It's for those characters that deserve a little more than a trophy but I'm sure if we see characters this time around that most felt deserved a roster spot it's going to be another story. Plus I don't usually play with items all on so I don't really see ATs all that much and when I do I don't really notice them.
heh. I had the same response. I also noticed her model was not as clean and sharp as the models for the playable characters so I knew something wasn't right lol.
I hate to admit this but I can see that happening some how with Tingle of all people. Now I want a trailer this E3 lol. :/ Brawl's was just epic in every way possible and I know we'll get another sooner or later but not at this point in time. I'm going into e3 week with that mindset. Time to go iron some clothes before the game comes on....>_>
Red Arremer
Member
You mean kinda like Wario in Brawl's?
Yes.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
They could always try to pass him off as a rep for his own franchise, like Yoshi and give Zelda someone else. Never got why people didn't seem to get the joke behind him and think he'd be hilarious to play as in Smash.
Red Arremer
Member
It would be amazing. And he probably would be the one of the few newcomers fit for it. There's other characters that could work with it (e.g. many F-Zero characters), but they're nowhere near as important or likely as Tingle.
When they do a reveal trailer, whether it's this year or next, I hope they show it at the live E3 conference.
That Brawl trailer would've been so damn amazing to see live.
OH SHIT SUPER ATTACKS!
OH SHIT METAKNIGHT!
OH SHIT PIT!
OH SHIT ZSS!
OH SHIT WARIO!
Man, what a great trailer, I can't wait-- WHAT THERE'S MORE??
And then the internet would've exploded at the Snake reveal.
It was clearly created to be shown at the conference. I don't understand why they chose not to. Because instead, I just woke up the next morning and saw "SMASH BROS BRAWL ANNOUNCED!" next to a big picture of all the revealed characters.
That Brawl trailer would've been so damn amazing to see live.
OH SHIT SUPER ATTACKS!
OH SHIT METAKNIGHT!
OH SHIT PIT!
OH SHIT ZSS!
OH SHIT WARIO!
Man, what a great trailer, I can't wait-- WHAT THERE'S MORE??
And then the internet would've exploded at the Snake reveal.
It was clearly created to be shown at the conference. I don't understand why they chose not to. Because instead, I just woke up the next morning and saw "SMASH BROS BRAWL ANNOUNCED!" next to a big picture of all the revealed characters.
DICKS AHOY
Banned
If there's a similar reveal trailer (there won't be), it'd be interesting if the new characters have similar tropes.
Long requested nemesis/rival to a series with one rep perviously: Metaknight/Ridley
Classic character who's been long requested: Pit/Little Mac
Unexpected sexual appeal character: Zero Suit Samus/K. Rool
Long requested wacky spin-off character to a major series to seemingly cap things off: Wario/Tingle
Unexpected 3rd party character: Snake/Master Chief Mega Man
Long requested nemesis/rival to a series with one rep perviously: Metaknight/Ridley
Classic character who's been long requested: Pit/Little Mac
Unexpected sexual appeal character: Zero Suit Samus/K. Rool
Long requested wacky spin-off character to a major series to seemingly cap things off: Wario/Tingle
Unexpected 3rd party character: Snake/
Red Arremer
Member
Mmm, those hot crocodile manboobs.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
Bad news, guys.
In the newest issue of Nintendo Power, Masahiro Sakurai gave an interview on the topic of Kid Icarus: Uprising and the Super Smash Bros. series. The final question of the interview was as follows:
Nintendo Power: With so much content packed into the previous Smash Bros. games, what difficulties do you encounter when creating a new one?
Sakurai: It isn't a matter of "if the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough." There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance, and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and make them feel distinctive... In terms of quantity, we've probably already reached the limit of what's feasible. I think a change of direction might be what's needed.
So, is it cuttin' time?
In the newest issue of Nintendo Power, Masahiro Sakurai gave an interview on the topic of Kid Icarus: Uprising and the Super Smash Bros. series. The final question of the interview was as follows:
Nintendo Power: With so much content packed into the previous Smash Bros. games, what difficulties do you encounter when creating a new one?
Sakurai: It isn't a matter of "if the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough." There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance, and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and make them feel distinctive... In terms of quantity, we've probably already reached the limit of what's feasible. I think a change of direction might be what's needed.
So, is it cuttin' time?
He didn't care about balance in Brawl (Samus!!!!), I hope it doesn't compromise the number of characters this time now that it seems that other people will help with the balance.
So, is it cuttin' time?
Damn. Hopefully it's still at around 40.
Bad news, guys.
In the newest issue of Nintendo Power, Masahiro Sakurai gave an interview on the topic of Kid Icarus: Uprising and the Super Smash Bros. series. The final question of the interview was as follows:
Nintendo Power: With so much content packed into the previous Smash Bros. games, what difficulties do you encounter when creating a new one?
Sakurai: It isn't a matter of "if the next game has 50 characters, that'll be enough." There is a certain charm to games that have huge casts of characters, but they tend to have issues with game balance, and it becomes very difficult to fine-tune each character and make them feel distinctive... In terms of quantity, we've probably already reached the limit of what's feasible. I think a change of direction might be what's needed.
So, is it cuttin' time?
I'll murder if they remove Wolf. Though, I understand where Sakurai is coming from, having a huge roster is very difficult. But hey, you know what they should just do instead? Don't add the fluff such as SSE this time. Honestly I did enjoyed SSE but it felt like an unnecessary mode.
Put as many characters in as you can. Balance as best as you can. Provide balance updates throughout the game's life as certain characters wind up too good or too bad.
Bam, fixed your stupid balance problem, Sakurai.
Really? Samus is the first character to mind? Not Metaknight or Ganondorf?
Bam, fixed your stupid balance problem, Sakurai.
Really? Samus is the first character to mind? Not Metaknight or Ganondorf?
Diddy Kong
Banned
That news doesn't sound good to me
I know about those two, but this reminded me of my time playing with her the other day and having difficulties to KO other characters. It's so frustrating when the supposedly fast and frail characters can do it better. For me, as a casual player, Ganondorf at least can KO people.
That news doesn't sound good to me
Diddy Kong replaced by Tingle
Honestly, considering they have to probably update a lot of models and animations of previous characters, and maybe give them new attacks, I didn't expect many new additions. It would be interesting if they looked at it like a new game with 40 slots, which could lead to a lot of cuts and new picks.
But seriously, balance patches are your friend, Sakurai.
But seriously, balance patches are your friend, Sakurai.
Professor Beef
Banned
Large HDDs are a better friend.
friskykillface
Banned
This, really boggles my mind too man. How the hell wasn't it shown live, what year was that again? 2006,2007.
I want to see what was shown that conference to make them not show smash.
That trailer still makes me
Black-Wind
Member
Sakurai, you clearly didn't give 2 boobs about balancing Brawl ... just get something out with as much as you can and let the fans make another Project M.
There seems to already be people that think that this might mean that SmashU will simply have a large portion of the roster replaced and the vets completely revised.
If what you post is to be trusted I would say so.So, is it cuttin' time?
There seems to already be people that think that this might mean that SmashU will simply have a large portion of the roster replaced and the vets completely revised.
Starphoenix
Member
I'm just going to copy my posts from elsewhere.
Right now Sakurai is just realizing he has hit a point where there just is not that many characters left that people are going to be screaming an wailing to be included. Yeah, you have Ridley, King K. Rool and Mewtwo (even Megaman though he is third party) that are pretty much the unanimous choices, but beyond that? Nothing. You start wade into murky territory where characters are just not as widely supported or are only supported by certain regions.
He is not saying he cannot or will not put in fifty characters (though I would not go around expecting more than that), all he is to get across is it is simply not enough to buff the roster and call it a day. He has said this countless times before, it is not some new idea that magically came from somewhere changing anything we have already concluded. Unless you were expecting a fifty-eight character roster, than yes this may come as a surprise to you, but outside of that there is nothing that is different than what Sakurai has already said in the past. Previously he has stated he could just add fifty characters and double the stages, but he does not want to. Nothing in this statement is saying he cannot do it, I mean after all he has more power to work with now; his intention, however, is to not simply add increase without differentiating the title from its predecessors. Read in the context of everything else he has said recently.
Right now Sakurai is just realizing he has hit a point where there just is not that many characters left that people are going to be screaming an wailing to be included. Yeah, you have Ridley, King K. Rool and Mewtwo (even Megaman though he is third party) that are pretty much the unanimous choices, but beyond that? Nothing. You start wade into murky territory where characters are just not as widely supported or are only supported by certain regions.
He is not saying he cannot or will not put in fifty characters (though I would not go around expecting more than that), all he is to get across is it is simply not enough to buff the roster and call it a day. He has said this countless times before, it is not some new idea that magically came from somewhere changing anything we have already concluded. Unless you were expecting a fifty-eight character roster, than yes this may come as a surprise to you, but outside of that there is nothing that is different than what Sakurai has already said in the past. Previously he has stated he could just add fifty characters and double the stages, but he does not want to. Nothing in this statement is saying he cannot do it, I mean after all he has more power to work with now; his intention, however, is to not simply add increase without differentiating the title from its predecessors. Read in the context of everything else he has said recently.
Professor Beef
Banned
What he SHOULD do is
- Add in all previous versions of characters from 64 and Melee, including models, damage/hitstun and dodge mechanics
- Rebalance the Brawl cast
- Add in a few more select characters
- Netcode
- Add a toggle switch for stage hazards
- Netcode
- Netcode
There. Send me a check, Sakurai.
- Add in all previous versions of characters from 64 and Melee, including models, damage/hitstun and dodge mechanics
- Rebalance the Brawl cast
- Add in a few more select characters
- Netcode
- Add a toggle switch for stage hazards
- Netcode
- Netcode
There. Send me a check, Sakurai.
That is actually the worst suggestion I have read in this thread. Congratulations.
Wait, what?
So vanilla SSB4 should get away with being broken just because people can easily do mods to fix it? Or am I reading you wrong?
Professor Beef
Banned
I've surpassed the Geno begging? I'm honored.
You missed the guy who wanted Mickey Mouse and Goku
Might as well just play Brawl for those who aren't into competitive Smash like me.Anth0ny said:
New fighters or bust
I think SSB4 will get away with almost anything no matter what. Which isn't a good thing.
You missed the guy who wanted Mickey Mouse and Goku
I would rather have Mickey Mouse and Goku than another 5+ years of Melee Fox and Falco and Marth.
Black-Wind
Member
IDK where you're getting that from.
Going by that quote, and assuming it's not only legit but properly quoted, it simply appears that he thinks the number of characters that he can handle while making it balanced has reached it's max and that it's just not "feasible" to keep adding more.
And he is right ... at some point the amount of character would just be too much. But I'm greatly disappointed that he feels that this number is the cutoff point.
Starphoenix
Member
I'm getting that from other quotes he has been cited in the past as saying.
Pretty much this.
EDIT: What were the other quotes, Starphoenix? Please share since I forgot what he exactly said.
Starphoenix
Member
http://i1099.photobucket.com/albums/g388/birdyfan93/02-24-2012120656AM.jpg
Third paragraph under the second screenshot.
Black-Wind
Member
People are gonna make a Protect M regardless and if Brawl has shown us anything it's that he can go WILDLY wrong with balancing.
Not saying it SHOULD just be a "I don't give-a-fuck, toss in w/e and have the fans fix it" thing like Skyrim or something, just that I don't see why he would make what I'm assuming to be Brawl's Amount of characters as the cut-off number of things he can handle balancing when he does have other options, like patches based on data from online play or his team (as he has pointed out before). But personally I'm sure I would enjoy the fan version even more than the end result.
I'm a firm believer in the thought that "the only relevant info is the latest info" seeing as people can and will change their minds over the course of developing something.
And on top of that I don't remember him ever saying to expect any number of new-comers...
Chet Rippo
Member
Do I have to bring up Exhibit A again?
Makes Captain Falcon look like a dweeb.
Maturity, bitches.
Freezie KO
Banned
It'd be cool if Nintendo plays the trailer right at the end of their conference. The huge reveal is Smash Bros. They show some new gameplay, but one of the newly introduced characters is unrecognizable. All E3 and the internets are like, "Who is that?"
Then after the trailer, when the conference is supposed to be over, Miyamoto comes out and introduces his new character IP game starring that new introduction.
Then after the trailer, when the conference is supposed to be over, Miyamoto comes out and introduces his new character IP game starring that new introduction.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
This game needs more playable armadillos, dinosaurs, and whatnot.
Starphoenix
Member
The point is is that he has not changed his mind, what he has said is consistent with what he has always said from the time Brawl was completed. If you want relevant info than he also stated this recently:
There is nothing stopping him from doing that, but he has expressed since 2008 that he does not simply want to increase the roster without bringing something different to separate the new game from its predecessors.
It does not have to be either/or, but simply a matter of perspective.
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