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Next Super Smash Bros. discussion thread, Community Edition
- Thread starter Snakeyes
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ScraftyDevil
Banned
You wound me, good Professor.
NeoGAF in general is pretty good about tolerance for all gens, but it's frigging awful elsewhere on the internet. I vent here because it's the only place I can Mewtwo "stupid" without being eaten alive by a wave of hate.
Seriously, go check any given Pokémon article/thread on a non-Pokémon fansite and marvel at the sheer number of people who put down all of the post-GB gens without acknowledging the flaws of those games.
Or maybe I'm just phenominaly whiny. *shrugs*
NeoGAF in general is pretty good about tolerance for all gens, but it's frigging awful elsewhere on the internet. I vent here because it's the only place I can Mewtwo "stupid" without being eaten alive by a wave of hate.
Seriously, go check any given Pokémon article/thread on a non-Pokémon fansite and marvel at the sheer number of people who put down all of the post-GB gens without acknowledging the flaws of those games.
Or maybe I'm just phenominaly whiny. *shrugs*
I get that there are people who say that Gen 1 is best and new Pokemon look dumb and blahdeblah, but it is kind of annoying the constant mention of Genwunners and how the Pokemon they like aren't cool and people ranting and raving about fetuses and blobs and blah blah blah.
Frankly, as Prof. Beef said, the people decrying the "genwunners" are as awful as the genwunners themselves.
astarisborn94
Member
New prediction roster... likely final before E3 2013:
Come pre-Smash 4 era and competition is less intense. No doubt Isaac still has to worry about competition, but I think he has enough for Sakurai to finally give him serious consideration for playable status.
I feel as our misc. series newcomers will be Little Mac, Isaac and Shulk. Saki also has a 50/50 shot, though he pales in comparison to the other three due to lack of importance and popularity (but has Sakurai's bias as an asset).
That said, most Assist Trophies looks like they won't be getting in Smash 4. The only realistic choices for Smash 4 are Little Mac, Isaac, Saki and Samurai Goroh. I'd say Ray as well due to Noise wanting to make a Custom Robo game (February, 2012, blog in 日本語 (Japanese), but that won't come out in time to affect Smash 4's roster (Smash 5 seems like Ray's shot to get in IMO).
We'll only find out for sure once Smash 4 is out, but I think this is a good stopping point for adding characters (barring third-party/last-minute clone addition).
Isaac didn't get into Brawl due to very strong competition. There was no way Isaac was going to get in over the likes of Wario in Smash 4. There was also Pikmin, which was a Miyamoto franchise, so it is likely that Olimar got priority because of it. Then you have to take into account other characters like Diddy Kong, Lucario, Meta Knight and Dedede, which makes me feel as Isaac didn't get into Brawl due to Sakurai prioritizing other characters.Mr. Fix said:
Come pre-Smash 4 era and competition is less intense. No doubt Isaac still has to worry about competition, but I think he has enough for Sakurai to finally give him serious consideration for playable status.
I feel as our misc. series newcomers will be Little Mac, Isaac and Shulk. Saki also has a 50/50 shot, though he pales in comparison to the other three due to lack of importance and popularity (but has Sakurai's bias as an asset).
I think it would refer to all Assist Trophies that didn't make it at the time. Like you said, I doubt this means anything for Smash 4 as I would imagine Sakurai only referred to these characters that way just for Brawl.GamerSoul said:
That said, most Assist Trophies looks like they won't be getting in Smash 4. The only realistic choices for Smash 4 are Little Mac, Isaac, Saki and Samurai Goroh. I'd say Ray as well due to Noise wanting to make a Custom Robo game (February, 2012, blog in 日本語 (Japanese), but that won't come out in time to affect Smash 4's roster (Smash 5 seems like Ray's shot to get in IMO).
I don't see why wanting them to return over newcomers from the franchise would be crazy. Its like saying I'm crazy for preferring Isaac over Shulk..ScraftyDevil said:
Honestly, Bayonetta fits this better than Roy and especially Mewtwo. At least Roy and Mewtwo have merits for coming back. Bayonetta is essentially a female bandwagon hidden under the "Bayonetta 2 Wii-U exclusive" banner.Boss Doggie said:
Green Mamba
Member
TyeForce, Mach Rider really aught to be listed in the retro poll.
And count me among those who thinks the "Genwunner" rallying cries to drown out dissenting modern opinions is incredibly obnoxious. Yes, there are real people out there that have that awful "Genwunner" viewpoint, but being just as obnoxious in the counter hate is not the solution.
Personally, I like and dislike Pokemon from all of the generations. That said, Mewtwo is still one of my favorite Pokemon, and I think the potential new form's design is terrible. This is an acceptable opinion to have. Attempting to nullify my opinion by basically saying "lol genwunner" is very annoying.
And count me among those who thinks the "Genwunner" rallying cries to drown out dissenting modern opinions is incredibly obnoxious. Yes, there are real people out there that have that awful "Genwunner" viewpoint, but being just as obnoxious in the counter hate is not the solution.
Personally, I like and dislike Pokemon from all of the generations. That said, Mewtwo is still one of my favorite Pokemon, and I think the potential new form's design is terrible. This is an acceptable opinion to have. Attempting to nullify my opinion by basically saying "lol genwunner" is very annoying.
Professor Beef
Banned
Well your first problem is going to fansites in the first place.
New prediction roster... likely final before E3 2013:
This seems like a realistic roster imo. I think we'll see a Gen 6 Pokemon in there, though.
I would say Chrom should be there, too, but 4 swordsman FE characters seems like too much.
As long as Palutena is in, I'm happy.
I wanted to put a Final Fantasy rep on there, but there doesn't seem to be a clear consensus on who the Final Fantasy rep should be. Personally, I was torn between Black Mage, Moogle, and Chocobo. And from searching online, it looks like Sora has been more requested, anyway. That said, I don't think Sora should or will ever be in Smash Bros., lol. But hey, he shares a name with Sakurai's studio! Maybe that counts for something? =P
I considered Mach Rider, but I didn't think his franchise had as much weight as any of the others. That doesn't mean he couldn't be included, of course. And that's what the "Other" option is for.
astarisborn94
Member
If there's going to be a Square Enix character, Slime is the best choice SE could make. Its too bad that Sakurai won't include him due to having "no arms or legs".
Four Fire Emblem characters could happen. I think if we get DLC (big if), Chrom will be in as I do think Sakurai will plan him to be in the game. There's also the possibility that Sakurai adds all four FE characters (Marth, Ike, Roy and Chrom) form the start or that Chrom gets in over Roy. If I had to rate Chrom's chances, I'd put him at a 50/50.
I'd rather wait and see what Gen 6 Pokémon we do get before we add a Gen 6, but I will admit that it is a possibility.This seems like a realistic roster imo. I think we'll see a Gen 6 Pokemon in there, though.
I would say Chrom should be there, too, but 4 swordsman FE characters seems like too much.
As long as Palutena is in, I'm happy.
Four Fire Emblem characters could happen. I think if we get DLC (big if), Chrom will be in as I do think Sakurai will plan him to be in the game. There's also the possibility that Sakurai adds all four FE characters (Marth, Ike, Roy and Chrom) form the start or that Chrom gets in over Roy. If I had to rate Chrom's chances, I'd put him at a 50/50.
I think this would be better:
Have Grima as a stage. It would be intense as hell.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
That would be good guess with the time. Your prediction roster is very safe but It's good enough for me.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
I just mean any site that isn't a Pokémon fansite (GameFAQs, IGN, etc.). My bad for wording it strangely.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
That's why I'm retired with most of those forums.
I would definitely go for an FF1 character or mascot. BM, WM, and Ninja were all in a game WITH Mario and company, so they could work, likewise Mog and Cactuar. If they had to have a pretty boy with a sword, though, the Warrior of Light in his NES alternate costume works just fine, even if the inevitable horde of silly people asking why Roy suddenly doesn't have a cape pop up.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I wish that Square-Enix would go with Crono but no, they wouldn't.
SenorArdilla
Member
Would Square-Enix even want a character in the next SSB?
This is the company that made ATB. They're not above doing anything anymore.
SenorArdilla
Member
Right then. Any particular FF characters from Theatrhythm that seem more likely than the others?
Nah it's most definitely the former. Pokemon talk on the internet from non-fans is almost always going to be terrible :|
I'm not a scholar of these things. I just think an FF1 rep makes the most sense, since they're all archetypal representatives of the entire series.
IntelliHeath
As in "Heathcliff"
I don't think Square-Enix would look at that same way as you did.
peaceiscloser
Member
I don't know about Mach Rider. I mean, I've played the game and I know it's really unique gameplay-wise, but didn't Miyamoto consider F-Zero to be pretty much a replacement for the series, at least thematically?
astarisborn94
Member
I added Mach Rider due to being the spirtual predecessor of F-zero, which I feel gives the series some importance. Not to mention that Sakurai likes him based off Mach Rider being his "favorite character" for Smash 2 and Sakurai planning on bringing back old characters. I know most people expect it to be Takamaru (and I do think he will get in), but I'm leaning towards Mach Rider.
Before Wada left I'd say "It's Lightning" but now, I dunno. I mean, they did have a bunch of FF1 characters in the Mario Sports series, so there's at least precedent.
Green Mamba
Member
In Melee Mach Rider also got a full blown redesign for his trophy unlike the other retro character trophies (okay, admittedly there's not much you can do with Bubbles). I think most people underestimate him greatly. At the very least I'd say he's number two after Takamaru when it comes to retro characters and even then I'm not entirely sure if I think Takamaru is actually that likely or if I've just bought into the potential groupthink.
EDIT: Did you know that Bubbles appeared in Donkey Kong: King of Swing? Random factoid that I remembered just now. Has no bearing on anything but I thought that was interesting.
EDIT: Did you know that Bubbles appeared in Donkey Kong: King of Swing? Random factoid that I remembered just now. Has no bearing on anything but I thought that was interesting.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I love how hating on modern gens is acceptable but saying genwunners is "OMG you're just as bad!"
HERE COMES THE ROOOOOCKS!
You should check out transformers fandom more and you'll get the origin name
HERE COMES THE ROOOOOCKS!
You should check out transformers fandom more and you'll get the origin name
Blood Diamonds
Banned
Okay, so here's my list of characters that
should be in the next Smash:
-Saki
-Takamaru
-Chrom
-Louie/New Pikmin rep with Pikmin from Pikmin 3 (AKA NOT A FUCKING CLONE)
-Dixie Kong (DK is a pretty important Franchise to Nintendo, I think it deserves more than 2 reps.)
-K. Rool
-Little Mac (He made a comeback with Super Punch Out!! He deserves to be in)
-Toon Zelda (Come on Sakurai make the dream come true)
need
-Saki
-Takamaru
-Chrom
-Louie/New Pikmin rep with Pikmin from Pikmin 3 (AKA NOT A FUCKING CLONE)
-Dixie Kong (DK is a pretty important Franchise to Nintendo, I think it deserves more than 2 reps.)
-K. Rool
-Little Mac (He made a comeback with Super Punch Out!! He deserves to be in)
-Toon Zelda (Come on Sakurai make the dream come true)
Green Mamba
Member
Who said that being what you would call a genwunner is okay? I certainly didn't. I just despise the aggressive use of the term to attack those who may actually have a genuine, thought out opinion.
Rather specifically lately that the idea that someone could like the original Mewtwo but dislike the potential new design makes them a "genwunner" worthy of ridicule and sarcastic spite. That's what bothers me about it. It's a term made in response to an actual annoying phenomenon that is more and more commonly used as an aggressive blanket term to shield yourselves from any dissenting opinion you might disagree with. It's annoying, disrespectful, and does not invite actual discussion, instead trying to stamp it out.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
But see, genwunner is not a term simply used on "hey I like generation I". It's mostly used on "151 only, bitches!" though I believe it should be extended on "I think generation 1 has the best design". I actually see it more used on that than simply a broad generalization on a certain generation fan. I mean, judging by this thread, no one even used it at all, except for (rightfully) using them as an argument against another has no basis on. This is noticeable on Smash where Pokemon trends tend to come late to its fans who aren't aware on Pokemon stuff.
In any case this is Smash, so yeah, let's just skip it.
I don't see Mach Rider happening. They'd basically have to completely reinvent him since he doesn't have anything particularly interesting about his character and he doesn't do anything off his bike. I imagine he'd pretty much be a fast guy who punches and kicks, which... is basically Captain Falcon. He doesn't have a neat gimmick like Ice Climbers, Game & Watch, or Pit.
As far as popularity goes, I imagine most of us would barely have heard of him if it wasn't for his cool trophy in Melee.
Unless he's on his bike all the time, in which case forget everything I've said, because that would be awesome. He could do MX tricks for his aerials!
As far as popularity goes, I imagine most of us would barely have heard of him if it wasn't for his cool trophy in Melee.
Unless he's on his bike all the time, in which case forget everything I've said, because that would be awesome. He could do MX tricks for his aerials!
I don't think he has a chance of making it in either tbh
The roster is entirely based on Sakurai's discretion. I don't think he cares about decisions that make "sense" or characters that "deserve to be in." He clearly chooses his favorites, with some light input from fans.
This is why I don't think Little Mac has a chance of being playable, despite there being a huge fan following for him. Sakurai doesn't strike me as the type to like him (in fact his trophy description and appearance in brawl is somewhat condescending)
The roster is entirely based on Sakurai's discretion. I don't think he cares about decisions that make "sense" or characters that "deserve to be in." He clearly chooses his favorites, with some light input from fans.
This is why I don't think Little Mac has a chance of being playable, despite there being a huge fan following for him. Sakurai doesn't strike me as the type to like him (in fact his trophy description and appearance in brawl is somewhat condescending)
Blood Diamonds
Banned
Well they could turn the Machine guns he has in his Bike into a two handed weapon Mach Rider could use and can shoot but can also be used for his Smash attack (As in swinging the weapon around)
But that's just me, I mean, they turned Pit's bow into Two blades, so why not a machine gun?
But that's just me, I mean, they turned Pit's bow into Two blades, so why not a machine gun?
DICKS AHOY
Banned
persecution complexes are a hellova drug
Also mach rider could be a cool retro rep. Honestly surprised Nintendo never tried doing a Wii Ware or eShop revival for the game (or Ice Climbers for that matter). They'd both make pretty fun modern-day arcade titles if remixed and jazzed up a little.
astarisborn94
Member
Considering that we got Ice Climbers and Captain Falcon, reinventing characters is not a new thing. Most any characters can be made into interesting choices.
I'd imagine that with a Down B or a Final Smash, Mach Rider could use his bike for all sorts of tricks. Would keep the nature of the game while still working out fine.
Pit got in due to demand from America and Japan.PK Gaming said:
There's also this. He mentions this:
So yes, he does take popularity seriously.
This is literally the worst reason to hate Charizard ever.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Nah it's irrelevant, I just like to do nasty things to the Zard much like how people do nasty things to ROB and such.
If that was the case Excite Biker is more likely.
- They've brought him back a bunch i.e. visualizer in the music app on both DSi and 3DS and the first 3D Classic title.
- He would have a gimmick based around knocking him off his bike and having his run to it.
- He's far more recognisable.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
Is Sakurai still convinced AC cast aren't violent?
Professor Beef
Banned
needs to be the next newcomer.
Why do people want Capcom characters in the game?
...That's Ray 01 from Custom Robo. He's not a Capcom character, he's first party.
Boss Doggie
all my loli wolf companions are so moe
I'm more surprised he said Capcom rather than Bamco
I thought the custom robo series was done by one of Nintendo's second party devs.
Professor Beef
Banned
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