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NFL Offseason Thread |OT2| Brought To You By Buckethead™

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D

Dysun

Member
Sanjuro said:
Sarcasm? There are a plethora of quarterbacks available in the draft. There is no reason why the Jets shouldn't bite. They have the worst quarterbacks in the league...both of them. No Jets fan can seriously tell me, no, we're good!
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Not what I implied, the Jets QBs are obviously awful and FUBAR. Geno/Nassib are mediocre prospects and would rather they dont waste their time on a project
No matter what we're tied with Butt Fumble for another season, so tank and lets see what's up next year.
 
L

Lonestar

I joined for Erin Brockovich discussion
MechDX said:
tryann-mathieu-girlfriend-sydni-paige-russell.jpg


Meh..
Click to expand...

Maybe she's wearing some giant heels, or is an Amazon, but she appears taller.
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
Dysun said:
Not what I implied, the Jets QBs are obviously awful and FUBAR. Geno/Nassib are mediocre prospects and would rather they dont waste their time on a project
No matter what we're tied with Butt Fumble for another year, so tank and lets see what's up next year.
Click to expand...

It's not a project when everything you have is worse. It's a need. Not a Jets fan, so don't care either way. I'm just shocked they still have the same two quarterbacks going into this season and that Rex still has a job, especially in that New York environment.
 
T

The_Darkest_Red

Member
Dysun said:
Not what I implied, the Jets QBs are obviously awful and FUBAR. Geno/Nassib are mediocre prospects and would rather they dont waste their time on a project
No matter what we're tied with Butt Fumble for another year, so tank and lets see what's up next year.
Click to expand...
I actually agree with this. No use wasting a pick on a guy you don't have faith in when you're basically stuck with Sanchez anyway and you can probably get someone much better in the next draft. It's similar to the Dolphins passing on some QB's in the 2011 draft (like Ryan Mallett) even when they knew Chad Henne wasn't the answer. They stuck it out one more year and ended up with Tannehill.
 
S

Sanjuro

Member
The_Darkest_Red said:
I actually agree with this. No use wasting a pick on a guy you don't have faith in when you're basically stuck with Sanchez anyway and you can probably get someone much better in the next draft. It's similar to the Dolphins passing on some QB's in the 2011 draft (like Ryan Mallett) even when they knew Chad Henne wasn't the answer. They stuck it out one more year and ended up with Tannehill.
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Eh, Jets aren't sticking it out. They are just trying to embarrass Rex for 2013.
 
J

jergrah

Member
The_Darkest_Red said:
I agree with you on the trade value, but what I'm really worried about is paying Albert. I just hope the Phins can get him to sign for a reasonable price.

An upgrade there would be great, and Cyprien/Rashad Jones would make for a nice combo.

So, fellow brother, what do you think of the new logo/uniforms?

Looks great.

Do you ever offer any meaningful insight about the team or do you just stop by to say how much they suck on occasion?
Click to expand...

I rarely say they suck :) Im critical of certain moves, sure, but I love my team.

I'd like to provide more input here, just based on time and not wasting my day away.

I don't much care about uniforms -- but I like the new look.

In regards to Albert, I'm cool with 6-7/year
 
E

effzee

Member
squicken said:
I'd be shocked if Tyrann got drafted. So many character red flags for a guy who is pretty limited in his roles
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People with far more character issues have gone in years past. I'd be shocked if he isn't drafted.

Hell if it gets to that extreme and he is there in the 7th, with 4 picks in that round the Eagles better pick him up.
 
T

The_Darkest_Red

Member
jergrah said:
I rarely say they suck :) Im critical of certain moves, sure, but I love my team.

I'd like to provide more input here, just based on time and not wasting my day away.

I don't much care about uniforms -- but I like the new look.

In regards to Albert, I'm cool with 6-7/year
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The last part of that comment wasn't directed at you, man! You're a quality poster, in my opinion.
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
D

Dysun

Member
The_Darkest_Red said:
I actually agree with this. No use wasting a pick on a guy you don't have faith in when you're basically stuck with Sanchez anyway and you can probably get someone much better in the next draft. It's similar to the Dolphins passing on some QB's in the 2011 draft (like Ryan Mallett) even when they knew Chad Henne wasn't the answer. They stuck it out one more year and ended up with Tannehill.
Click to expand...

Drafting a QB because your QB sucks is how teams end up with Weeden, Gabbert, etc. If you dont love a QB, don't take him
I see wildy inaccurate Geno and I want no part of that. It's the same boat we already have
 
C

Crisco

Banned
Lonestar said:
Matheiu could be, at best, an average DB in the NFL. Too small. His whole reputation was built off of forced fumbles (he had an incredible streak of causing them his last year at LSU). But Forced Fumbles are one of the flukiest "stats" out there, more luck than planning.

Great returner, can tackle for a small DB, but will get abused by taller WR's and jump balls.

That, plus being all kinds of a mentally screwed up young man (not even counting the drug problem, he has problems recognizing reality)
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I dunno, there are definitely guys in the league who consistently force fumbles by design. Tillman and Woodson come to mind. It's not all luck.
 
K

Kave_Man

come in my shame circle
Crisco said:
I dunno, there are definitely guys in the league who consistently force fumbles by design. Tillman and Woodson come to mind. It's not all luck.
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I was about to say. I distinctly remember a feature on MNF or Countdown where they featured him and he explained what he tries to do to force the fumbles.
 
E

eznark

Banned
cajunator said:
Wow.
I feel bad for Shango.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UVGmH0HisuM
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I don't. If you know you team is desperate for a center (everyone knew it) and you don't care enough to do research on any of the centers in the draft, then you clearly give way fewer fucks than the character you portray.

Frederick is a way, way, way better football player than Long. That isn't saying a lot, but way too many people are buying into the "he's a third round grade" storyline. Based on his football career he was a first rounder. After the combine he dropped. Unless you are doing interesting things with your center like the Niners (and probably Philly) who gives a shit if your center is a workout warrior?

I don't think I saw anyone ever have another center ranked higher than him. Trading up was weird but with the new slotting rules it's not a huge deal.
 
C

chuckddd

Fear of a GAF Planet
eznark said:
I don't. If you know you team is desperate for a center (everyone knew it) and you don't care enough to do research on any of the centers in the draft, then you clearly give way fewer fucks than the character you portray.

Frederick is a way, way, way better football player than Long. That isn't saying a lot, but way too many people are buying into the "he's a third round grade" storyline. Based on his football career he was a first rounder. After the combine he dropped. Unless you are doing interesting things with your center like the Niners (and probably Philly) who gives a shit if your center is a workout warrior?

I don't think I saw anyone ever have another center ranked higher than him. Trading up was weird but with the new slotting rules it's not a huge deal.
Click to expand...

The guy is an internet message board with a tv show.
 
E

eznark

Banned
chuckddd said:
The guy is an internet message board with a tv show.
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I guess I am using him a "generic football fan x." Mike Mayock says the guy is a "third round grade" so all the troglodytes who can't think for themselves parrot it and chuckle at how terrible a pick it was, most of whom (as ChanHuk said) couldn't even tell you what team he played for much less ever watched him play or really have any idea what type of skill set is important for the position.

I love Mayock, truly I do, but the guy isn't the be all end all. He puts too much importance on workouts over performance, thinks every team needs to be built the exact same way and doesn't seem to have a strong grasp of what guys fit in particular defenses. He also has seemingly no concept of the cap side of the game. That said he is generally fantastic but I strongly disagree with how badly he killed a center after a bad 40 time.
 
D

Draxal

Member
eznark said:
I don't. If you know you team is desperate for a center (everyone knew it) and you don't care enough to do research on any of the centers in the draft, then you clearly give way fewer fucks than the character you portray.

Frederick is a way, way, way better football player than Long. That isn't saying a lot, but way too many people are buying into the "he's a third round grade" storyline. Based on his football career he was a first rounder. After the combine he dropped. Unless you are doing interesting things with your center like the Niners (and probably Philly) who gives a shit if your center is a workout warrior?

I don't think I saw anyone ever have another center ranked higher than him. Trading up was weird but with the new slotting rules it's not a huge deal.
Click to expand...

I think Schwenke was the consensus number one. But all the top centers were pretty much interchangeable.
 
C

ChanHuk

Banned
eznark said:
I don't. If you know you team is desperate for a center (everyone knew it) and you don't care enough to do research on any of the centers in the draft, then you clearly give way fewer fucks than the character you portray.

Frederick is a way, way, way better football player than Long. That isn't saying a lot, but way too many people are buying into the "he's a third round grade" storyline. Based on his football career he was a first rounder. After the combine he dropped. Unless you are doing interesting things with your center like the Niners (and probably Philly) who gives a shit if your center is a workout warrior?

I don't think I saw anyone ever have another center ranked higher than him. Trading up was weird but with the new slotting rules it's not a huge deal.
Click to expand...

Frederick would've been there in the middle of the second round probably. But the biggest head scratcher was that they only got a 3rd round pick for moving from the middle of the 1st to the end. The Cowboys could've added youth to their d-line or picked up a needed FS.

Patriots keep coming up on trades, how did they swindle the Vikings?
 
C

cashman

Banned
Gilbert Brandt had him at 26 to the Packers in his first mock draft. Still they could have gotten him in the second if they really wanted.
 
E

effzee

Member
yankeehater said:
So Ruben Frank and Ray Diddinger were both saying they didnt like the pick the Eagles made. Ruben said he isnt NFL ready and there is no way to know when he will be NFL ready since he is such a project.

Ray said he had really poor technique, he cant anchor and will need to put on a lot of weight, he said he is incredibly raw and that his tape was no where near the level of guys like Luke or Fischer. He also said that if he was making that pick he wouldnt have taken Lane.

This really feels like Howie was just determined to show people how smart he was and he took a huge reach based on upside. I just cant believe the 4th best player was an undersized OT that 2 years ago was playing QB. Hopefully they can still salvage the draft in the later rounds. At least the Cowboys and Redskins didnt do anything to improve their teams last night.
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Dude I can also find two guys who would rave about Lane Johnson so bringing up two guys who disagree is not all that shocking. Not everyone is going to like every pick. And for sure he was the #3 ranked OT in the tackle but by no one's account did that #3 mean "distant 3rd to be picked in rounds 2 or later". A lot of draft analysts had him either right up there or right behind Fisher and Joekel. A reach would have been like what the Cowboys did at Center.

One thing I heard over and over about Lane Johnson was that he is not the most ready out of the top 3 tackles, when they studied week after week he improved. So he is already super athletic, talented, and still learning the position. You could probably plug in Jocker and or Fisher at LT right away and this guy might need more coaching but he has the highest upside. And then think about the offense Chip wants to run. Forget who the QB is, we want an OLINE that can both pass and run block and run a very fast tempo hurry up offense. This guy fits that style completely.

Also have to keep in mind it takes two to tango for trades. Raiders didn't get much in return from Miami. They still got their guy (though I thought should have been Floyd), but they only gained a 3rd. It's obvious that Miami couldn't trade up with the Eagles because I don't think that offer would be enough to entice them to fall back to 12 where they couldn't be sure they could get their next tier of "gotta have guys".

If Miami was offering their 2nd round pick and the #12 spot and the Eagles still turned it down then I would be pissed. But as it went down the Raiders got a third and the Eagles still get to keep their 2nd, get their guy (1 out of the 4). Eagles couldn't have willed themselves to move down, there had to be a credible trading partner. So if you are left with no trading partner, 3 out of the 4 top guys on your board gone, who can you logically pick that would make more sense than Lane Johnson.

Then as I mentioned its his upside, he is a freak athlete who immediately starts at RT and will only improve, he can replace Peters in 2015 if he leaves via FA, and he improves the Guard position because we no longer have to rely on Watkins.
 
S

squicken

Member
effzee said:
People with far more character issues have gone in years past. I'd be shocked if he isn't drafted.

Hell if it gets to that extreme and he is there in the 7th, with 4 picks in that round the Eagles better pick him up.
Click to expand...

There's different kinds of character issues, though. Some guys make awful decisions off the field, but love football. Work hard, play hard. Those are the guys you take chances on. Matthieu seems to love the life more than he loves football. I think teams will steer well clear. Maybe someone takes a flier in round 7, but I doubt it
 
E

eznark

Banned
Draxal said:
I think Schwenke was the consensus number one. But all the top centers were pretty much interchangeable.
Click to expand...

I saw Schwenke behind Barrett Jones and the San Jose St. kid on a couple of boards. I saw Frederick and Jones flip flopped a few times but I don't think I saw Schwenke at the top ever. Maybe.

I guess one big point that someone made last night is that in a draft that is fantastically mediocre at best, it probably makes sense to go hard after the guy you love, damn the value.

Gilbert Brandt had him at 26 to the Packers in his first mock draft. Still they could have gotten him in the second if they really wanted.
Click to expand...
No disagreement, I think they just figured why risk the Packers taking him? Not sure why they took him then but it's not like there were sure fire amazing players available there.

I generally hate drafting for need but in a weak class it probably makes sense.
 
D

DeaconKnowledge

Member
squicken said:
There's different kinds of character issues, though. Some guys make awful decisions off the field, but love football. Work hard, play hard. Those are the guys you take chances on. Matthieu seems to love the life more than he loves football. I think teams will steer well clear. Maybe someone takes a flier in round 7, but I doubt it
Click to expand...

He's criminally short. Personally I think that's going to kill him more than his demons.
 
T

The_Darkest_Red

Member
effzee said:
Dude I can also find two guys who would rave about Lane Johnson so bringing up two guys who disagree is not all that shocking. Not everyone is going to like every pick. And for sure he was the #3 ranked OT in the tackle but by no one's account did that #3 mean "distant 3rd to be picked in rounds 2 or later". A lot of draft analysts had him either right up there or right behind Fisher and Joekel. A reach would have been like what the Cowboys did at Center.

One thing I heard over and over about Lane Johnson was that he is not the most ready out of the top 3 tackles, when they studied week after week he improved. So he is already super athletic, talented, and still learning the position. You could probably plug in Jocker and or Fisher at LT right away and this guy might need more coaching but he has the highest upside. And then think about the offense Chip wants to run. Forget who the QB is, we want an OLINE that can both pass and run block and run a very fast tempo hurry up offense. This guy fits that style completely.

Also have to keep in mind it takes two to tango for trades. Raiders didn't get much in return from Miami. They still got their guy (though I thought should have been Floyd), but they only gained a 3rd. It's obvious that Miami couldn't trade up with the Eagles because I don't think that offer would be enough to entice them to fall back to 12 where they couldn't be sure they could get their next tier of "gotta have guys".

If Miami was offering their 2nd round pick and the #12 spot and the Eagles still turned it down then I would be pissed. But as it went down the Raiders got a third and the Eagles still get to keep their 2nd, get their guy (1 out of the 4). Eagles couldn't have willed themselves to move down, there had to be a credible trading partner. So if you are left with no trading partner, 3 out of the 4 top guys on your board gone, who can you logically pick that would make more sense than Lane Johnson.

Then as I mentioned its his upside, he is a freak athlete who immediately starts at RT and will only improve, he can replace Peters in 2015 if he leaves via FA, and he improves the Guard position because we no longer have to rely on Watkins.
Click to expand...
The Dolphins gave up their first of two second round picks in the Raiders trade.
 
D

Draxal

Member
eznark said:
I saw Schwenke behind Barrett Jones and the San Jose St. kid on a couple of boards. I saw Frederick and Jones flip flopped a few times but I don't think I saw Schwenke at the top ever. Maybe.

I guess one big point that someone made last night is that in a draft that is fantastically mediocre at best, it probably makes sense to go hard after the guy you love, damn the value.


No disagreement, I think they just figured why risk the Packers taking him? Not sure why they took him then but it's not like there were sure fire amazing players available there.

I generally hate drafting for need but in a weak class it probably makes sense.
Click to expand...

Most boards I saw had Schwenke has the highest, but the others were right behind him.

And yeah, Cowboys are getting too much slack for their pick. Every pick from 16 on has been pretty much a pure need pick. And they needed a center badly.
 
M

mr2xxx

Banned
DeaconKnowledge said:
Guys, who are your top wants for the second round?
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Needs are FS, CB, RT, WR, SS, TE in that order. So I'd go for FS:D.J Swearinger, Cyprien, Rambo if we trade back a bit. This has been our biggest weakness and needs to be addressed in the 2nd or third. CB: Haven't watched any of them but there is plenty of talent of here. Hall and Biggers are on one year contracts so we will need someone.WR: Woods, Allen, Marcus Wheaton, Allen plenty of talented WRs left too; Moss will be gone next year, Hankerson hasn't developed , Morgan final year of contract and still has injury issues. TE: Ertz; Fred Davis coming of a ACL is on a 1 year contract. And finally two guys I don't love by any stretch but a possibility to replace Fletcher ILB:Kevin Minter, Teo.
 
C

ChanHuk

Banned
effzee said:
Also have to keep in mind it takes two to tango for trades. Raiders didn't get much in return from Miami. They still got their guy (though I thought should have been Floyd), but they only gained a 3rd. It's obvious that Miami couldn't trade up with the Eagles because I don't think that offer would be enough to entice them to fall back to 12 where they couldn't be sure they could get their next tier of "gotta have guys".

If Miami was offering their 2nd round pick and the #12 spot and the Eagles still turned it down then I would be pissed. But as it went down the Raiders got a third and the Eagles still get to keep their 2nd, get their guy (1 out of the 4). Eagles couldn't have willed themselves to move down, there had to be a credible trading partner. So if you are left with no trading partner, 3 out of the 4 top guys on your board gone, who can you logically pick that would make more sense than Lane Johnson.
Click to expand...

Uh Dolphins gave up the #12 and #42 pick for the #3. The trade is a wash really, nobody really fleeced one another as they each got who they targeted.
 
D

DeaconKnowledge

Member
mr2xxx said:
Needs are FS, CB, RT, WR, SS, TE in that order. So I'd go for FS:D.J Swearinger, Cyprien, Rambo if we trade back a bit. This has been our biggest weakness and needs to be addressed in the 2nd or third. CB: Haven't watched any of them but there is plenty of talent of here. Hall and Biggers are on one year contracts so we will need someone.WR: Woods, Allen, Marcus Wheaton, Allen plenty of talented WRs left too; Moss will be gone next year, Hankerson hasn't developed , Morgan final year of contract and still has injury issues. TE: Ertz; Fred Davis coming of a ACL is on a 1 year contract. And finally two guys I don't love by any stretch but a possibility to replace Fletcher ILB:Kevin Minter, Teo, .
Click to expand...


Stay the fuck away from Keenan Allen.

That goes for the rest of you too.
 
B

BlackGhost

Banned
ESPN's Bill Williamson is "hearing a lot of chatter" about the Raiders targeting USC QB Matt Barkley at No. 42.
That's the pick the Raiders got from the Dolphins for trading down from No. 3 to No. 12. Barkley hasn't been strongly connected to any team since the draft kicked off at 8ET Thursday evening, but there's buzz as many as three QBs could come off the board between picks 33-39. Rotoworld's second-round mock has Barkley tumbling to the Bears at No. 50.
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LA Raiders.
 
M

mastershake

Member
DeaconKnowledge said:
He's criminally short. Personally I think that's going to kill him more than his demons.
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I'm not that familiar with him but would he make a good nickel back? I agree with you that he's way to small to be on the outside with WR's that are much bigger and stronger than him

wienke said:
Hopefully a center and a safety.

Or linebacker and a safety.
Click to expand...

Time to pick up the fastest LB available. Let's go!
 
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