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Overwatch marks a new low in Unlocking and Microtransaction systems that I'm aware of
- Thread starter Saty
- Start date
Why not a subscription service?
Is THIS really your argument? God. Next you'll tell me i can pull up yotube and listen there. I care about using speech in the middle of the game. Not to freaking preview them in menus.
So, people, do you have any arguments to raise that aren't:
1. I shouldn't care about Speech more than i do about cosmetics or does that it doesn't hold greater value.
2. If the unlockables don't affect gameplay then having them locked can't negatively impact the game or my experience with it.
3. Game having up front speech justifies having others locked.
4. You can hear the locked speech in the menu screen.
Because all of these are non-starters.
What a relief we have you to stand above us and tell us that we are wrong.
Are you still going with this? It's kinda pathetic crying about stuff in a game you don't even own.
Good job all future heroes will be free, and you can unlock it all through just playing the game then right?
Glass Shark
Banned
I don't think anyone is desperate for more microtransactions. Would it be better if all the skins and other stuff in the game were free and unlocked from the beginning? Sure. But it's not realistic, and Overwatch is certainly not "a new low" in microtransactions. In fact, it's one of the best implementations I've seen in a modern game.
super-famicom
Member
He probably hasn't unlocked the other quotes.
Why wouldn't it be?
Not every game is going to be a 10 million seller, and not every game can be made on a shoestring budget.
When you reach that intersect between the two, you get this weird situation where game prices have not kept up with inflation and the rising development costs of AAA gaming.
$60 today was only ~$40 in 2000. And now we're expecting developers with growing staff and wages to still survive off the same amount of sales but at a lower inflation adjusted price?
Either
A. Every game needs to outsell the last. Every single time
B. Game prices need to go up
C. Alternate means of income need to be established.
I'd heard that the drop rates were higher in the beta?
Nice!!!! Didn't know this!
It doesn't bug me. Do I want cool stuff? Sure. But I'm having fun playing the game right now and I haven't hit a wall. If they didn't have these unlocks there would be nothing to work towards. The prices do seem ridiculous though seeing as I have 150 gold total after maybe 5-6 hours of play.
this is actually what they do, albeit in not as straight forward of a way.
in hearthstone they reward you with currency which you can then decide when/how to spend.
in overwatch they reward you with currency (XP) that is then spent for you upon leveling.
the problem is people equate the credits in overwatch to the gold in HS, which is not correct. the credits in overwatch are like dust in HS. the "oops you have doubles" currency that you can then turn in for other items. the problem being (if they change anything it should be this) that you don't have the option of manually dusting anything in overwatch. It only auto-dusts for you when it duplicates.
edit - though in thinking about it, HS has to let you manually dust. Because if you get a legendary... it may completely suck and be of no value to you.. or other cards... where you may not then have other cards to make value of the ones you get.. whereas in Overwatch... everything by default has the same inherent value (i.e. you can use everything just the same). So it would be nice if I could dust a legendary for a character I don't really jive with to have money toward one I love.. but at the same time getting that leg I don't really care about doesn't actually harm my playing the game like it does in HS.
KillerDark
Member
Nice job dodging the actual point. They are one liners, they add practically nothing to characterization. Banter between characters (which is not locked and happens naturally) is what actually adds to the characterization. Please tell me how hearing 1 liners in spawn adds to your enjoyment (you will almost never hear them outside of spawn because no one is bothering to, why would they?), I would love to see your argument for this.
Lets take a look at one of Reapers locked lines:"Lets just get the job done". How does that being locked impact your enjoyment of the game that you admit you don't even own? What characterization does that add for Reaper that you didn't know before?
tldr: They are 1 liners, they add very little to no characterization.
MrRudiMentary
Member
If you're worried about missing out on story, you can listen to all the voice lines including the ones you haven't unlocked. You just can't use them in the match.
doctorblurg
Banned
Its a shame cause I can't truly understand what his character is about without them
nkarafo
Member
Why it's not realistic? Unlocking skins and other stuff used to be a bonus in fully priced games. I can see how this would be a thing for a free to play game only.
But what would I do if I don't have this one specific character line from when I start playing the game?! It's day light robbery making me play the game to unlock them!!
Man I remember how much time I put into Halo Reach to unlock and buy the robot arm, where were the freak out threads about that?
It's pathetic to suggest i can't protest design decisions without buying a game. I watched an Overwatch stream. This issue stuck out to me.
-tetsuo-
Unlimited Capacity
It is free.
Acceptance is fine; the dog piling on anyone who complains and enforced groupthink via shaming, not so much.
Sure , but we could just go to a system where there is no opt in and everyone gets charged 80 dollars to buy because it includes all of the content. Game development is more complex than it has ever been, those costs don't just get absorbed. Personally, I would rather have it this way, because I can choose which games/content I want to spend extra money on. Even with Overwatch, it's not like there isn't a complete game here. There are unlocks, but they don't significantly impact the game.
I get what you are saying, and to an extent, I agree. But realistically, something has to give. Either the cost of development has to go down(meaning less features), the price of the game has to go up, or the dev/publisher has to have the opportunity to make money off the back end. I know which one I prefer.
Glass Shark
Banned
Games cost exponentially more to make now, this has been covered to death in this thread.
nkarafo
Member
Is it? My bad then.
Glass Shark
Banned
Protest it all you want, but don't misrepresent the game and call it "a new low" when it's far from the worst business model in games.
It's pathetic that you'd make this thread really. Just another OW shitting thread, people can't deal with it being popular and others enjoying it.
What streamer were you watching that it made you go "god damn these one liners that no one ever uses are locked behind playing the game for a bit, Blizzard single handedly destroying the gaming industry confirmed !!!"
Of all the crappy things that actually do exist with the unlock system (and there is a lot), getting hung up on the speech options is a very shallow, very inconsequential hill to die on.
The shockingly poor amount of gold you get for dupes is a MUCH MUCH MUCH larger problem, especially when it can be days in between unlocks and you're still getting trash unlocks.
MMaRsu
Member
I think the OP's argument is silly but so is the idea that you need to own a game, or anything, in order to critique it. You simply need to be familiar with the relevant content (which the OP doesnt appear to be).
What's the problem with making a thread to complain about it? If someone has a complaint about a game where should they voice it? If you complain about a popular game in its OT people tend to shout you down for "shitting up" the OT, so surely making a separate thread which people can engage in or not (just like OW's loot system
) is preferable?Confused Cheeseburger
Member
Ok. Take you most basic character in Overwatch. Idk, Solider 76. Right. So 76 has an assualt rifle as his main damage dealer. 76 is good at medium to short range with this weapon. 76 also has helix rockets which do a good amount of damage as well, espcially good for crowd management. 76 is also one of the only characters that can sprint. Lastly 76 has a short, static heal than can heal multiple people. Given that 76 is designed to be an entry character for many, he actually has a lot of versatile utility in a given situation.
On defence, 76 can provide good damage out and mobility when a team has a lot of control minded heores. Example, Bastion does a lot of damage but can be easily flanked by many heroes that are for quicker and more mobile. 76's heavy pulse rifle has the range to turn on a dime and cover a bastion's flank. To add another fold, map specific vantage points and layout could also enhance this example. A match on defence in Watchpoint: Gibraltar gives Bastion pretty wide field of view in the first phase of the map, but a backdoor at attacker spawn makes him vulnerable. 76 has multiple ways to close down a slashing hero trying to flank such as Reaper or Tracer. 76 can run and catch up to them to take them out, he can send some helix rockets to cause damage and impede flanking, or given the size of the opening area, his rifle can do good damage without too much accuracy penalty. He also makes a good guardian of weaker support characters in more open maps like Numbani, because he can tap the first shot of his rifle and send out a 100 percent accurate shot. Widomakers and Hanzos with Defensive vantage point with height vantage in a map like Numbani, Solider 76 can do decent damage per shot and cause problem for the snipers because they have so little health, that even with the reduced damage of 76's single round he can cause a problem for them. In addition, 76 can almost always provide followup damage to close out an enemy started on by a teammate that couldn't finish them on for a number of reasons.
The reason I replied with this is to show that Overwatch's content comes from the variety of its sheer factors. It has so many variables and gameplay options at any time that understanding when to throw out the right options gives it depth that no multiplayer shooter has this generation. Titanfall is a fine game but it doesn't have the same amount of mechanical density, "content" or not. It's the same reason why Battlefront could have 30 maps and still be disappointing because it lacks depth. Depth is content. Why the hell else would people still be playing Dota 2, LoL or Street Fighter? Call of Duty can have all the modes it wants, but ultimately that game is that game. Given the Solider 76 rundown I just gave, there are 20 other characters with that depth. That's hand over fist content to me. That's content in the fundamental gameplay core which I've learned in Beta and final release. I know we are talking about MT, but the checkbox argument of content vs gameplay is obtuse.
for the simple reason that there are considerable ongoing costs in running this game, and they've vowed that gameplay updates will be free.
CoD maintains online servers by releasing a new game every year.
Valve maintains online by running steam.
companies need a way to pay those continued costs.. so without microtransctions, how else do you feel a company should be able to support those ongoing costs? paid gameplay expansions (thus splintering the player base?)
Not to mention, games in the past would be released and be done with. Blizzard is going to provide free content for Overwatch. Monetizing those loot crates helps accomplish this. People just don't get it.
Yeah it is pathetic argueing how something so rapidly impacts your enjoyment with zero own gameplay impressions to back it up with.
I mean this enjoyment of yours is a completely imaginary situation you specifically built up just for the sake of making a thread to complain about the game.
yes this is the only problem I have with the system.
IN Hearthstone you have way more freedom in how you want to unlock things for classes you want to play. granted having cards is way more important than cosmetic items obviously. But if there's a dumb voice line for a character I never play I should be able to "disenchant" it for like 5 credits or something to save up for something I want on one of my mains.
Currently it takes forever to save up for a specific skin on a specific charactrer because the only way to earn currency is getting lucky by opening a loot box which is only awarded through leveling up(w/o counting paying real money)
But like I said in Hearthstone they've added a bunch of ways to earn packs (spectator quest, extra arena pack, tavern brawl, giving away free packs at expansion ect..) and I think they'll eventually do that with Overwatch.
nkarafo
Member
So you think he criticizes it only because it's popular?
That's a bad excuse for defending something.
AnathemicOne
Banned
25 coins, 25 fucking coins people for "BEEP fucking BOOP", or to be more fair "winkyface ".
As for the arguments on being against the grind itself rather than the specific unlock/reward you get, please keep in mind that the "grind" is playing the actual fucking game. If you are playing Overwatch and feel that the gameplay/matches are the equivalent of say an MMO daily/mob grinding then the game isn't for you, simple as that.
".As for the arguments on being against the grind itself rather than the specific unlock/reward you get, please keep in mind that the "grind" is playing the actual fucking game. If you are playing Overwatch and feel that the gameplay/matches are the equivalent of say an MMO daily/mob grinding then the game isn't for you, simple as that.
I think the OP's argument is silly but so is the idea that you need to own a game, or anything, in order to critique it. You simply need to be familiar with the relevant content (which the OP doesnt appear to be).
What's the problem with making a thread to complain about it? If someone has a complaint about a game where should they voice it? If you complain about a popular game in its OT people tend to shout you down for "shitting up" the OT, so surely making a separate thread which people can engage in or not (just like OW's loot system
Are you seriously that blind? This is just one of many people making threads to shit on OW, have you not seen the front page this week?
And yeh, keep it to the OT. I don't feel the need to make a thread every time I have a thought.
I'm not defending it because it's popular though, I've outlined already why I don't agree with his complaints. I'm saying that he's leveling these complaints at OW when many other games have done worse with MT and season passes and OW is actually a really good implantation of DLC. I'll go any day for MT cosmetics over paying for maps and characters.
I imagine we'll have many more to come. Sad mods don't close blatant shitting threads like this.
KiefbladeMaster
Member
Kinda don't even know what to say to this? You can just play the game, level up, and unlock the skins/voices you want for free.
The whole reason these loot crates exist is so that we all get to play on free new maps and new heroes. That's a great trade, imo.
The whole reason these loot crates exist is so that we all get to play on free new maps and new heroes. That's a great trade, imo.
Steve Youngblood
Member
I don't really know what to tell you. I mean, I get arguments against microtransactions at all in non-F2P games. I get arguments that are fine with them as long as they don't affect gameplay balance (i.e. cosmetic-only). But the premise here is such an arbitrary line in the sand that I honestly don't know how to respond.
As consumers we are free to justify how we spend our money however we like. So I'm not really here to tell you that you're wrong if you think these lines shouldn't be locked. But from where I'm sitting, it's just really bizarre to single that out while being ok with other forms of cosmetic unlocks. You subjectively care more about one than the other, and that's fine. But it's hard to have a broader philosophical conversation about this since it's such a specific thing that most people aren't going to differentiate from the other unlockables.
Can we account for inflation, current team sizes, server upkeep, and time spent playing games now compared to then?
shiftplusone
Member
he doesn't own the game and his critique is that his enjoyment of said game is hindered by its design decisions.
It's asinine.
25 coins, 25 fucking coins people for "BEEP fucking BOOP", or to be more fair "winkyface
As for the arguments on being against the grind itself rather than the specific unlock/reward you get, please keep in mind that the "grind" is playing the actual fucking game. If you are playing Overwatch and feel that the gameplay/matches are the equivalent of say an MMO daily/mob grinding then the game isn't for you, simple as that.
also this. I am no designer but I would hazard a guess that they hope you enjoy the game. sometimes you unlock stuff when you play.
I don't think they hope that you unlock stuff, and theres a god damn game part you have to deal with in order to unlock stuff
Blind to what? Are you implying that there's come kind of concerted campaign to besmirch the game? Why do you care? Why is it a problem? If you find the threads objectionable then you're not compelled to engage with them.
I was objecting to the general stance, as I said in this case the OP clearly doesnt have familiarity with the content relevant to his argument.
Cloggerdude
Member
Tame by Gaf standards.
There ARE actual issues I would like to see addressed, but most of these threads are too busy bitching about relatively inconsequential things.
Which you can still do, i have lots of stuff and i haven't spent any money. Nothing to do with being an apologist, this is just a shitty complaint.
This makes no sense -- its still just a bonus, like any other game where you can unlock new skins / music / etc etc. They just let people who want to unlock them without any work do it with money. It's no different than shelling out for a gameshark back in the day, except the money is actually going to the developer who is going to provide more content free of charge.
Inspector Jones
Member
Yep; people need to start realizing that games, especially MP games, are more of a service now then ever before. You are free to think if this is good or not, but without these microtransactions, Overwatch would either not exist in its current form, have even worse ways of gaining additional funding, or we'd never see any future updates (Not free updates anyway).
Again; Blizzard's approach is very similar to Valve's (Which I've always liked) and right now I'd say Blizzard's monetization is better (No special keys needed to unlock loot boxes).
Blind to this and this and obviously this thread we're in now. People just can't deal with it not being a game for them or some other random thing, feel the need to make a thread to tell everyone some stupid opinion. I find it objectable that these shit threads are allowed to be made and continue for as long as they do, after reading a few pages you can see how it'll progress. The OP is flat out wrong, it's not even a matter of opinions. OP is acting like the one liners are more than they are for starters.
TDLink
Member
For the record the way the loot boxes work is that at least 1 of the 4 drops is always Rare (Blue) or better. If you go 10 boxes without getting a Legendary (Gold) the percent chance for a Legendary dropping doubles until you do.
It's a pretty good system that guarantees you always get at least something cool.
It's a pretty good system that guarantees you always get at least something cool.