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[Mobius and pet octopus]

Completely optional microtransactions in a paid game is very good. It allows the developers to earn additional revenue which can then be spent on future content. It gives incentive to keep creating new maps, heroes, and cosmetics which in turn keeps the game feeling fresh. That translates to the game having a larger active community for a longer period of time, as new content keeps giving people reasons to come back.

Some people hate microtransactions no matter what. It's the degree of hate that changes. And I personally think some people who act like they hate microtransactions, deep down don't really care that much. It's 2016 now and people still angry over microtransactions when they really don't impact game balance seems so archaic. Add in the fact that you unlock all the same content just playing the game and it adds up to a really silly joke.

If this were COD, they'd be both selling the cosmetics and selling maps and probably even heroes too. OW is giving you new heroes and maps for free. Yet lets focus on the completely optional cosmetic only microtransactions.

 

[JStein0222]

I'm less offended at their being microtransactions, more offended at how booorrriing 95% of the stuff is

 

[Dylan Sexbang]

This thread is weird, and it's weird that's it's gone on for so long and everyday it seems to grow. Purchasable cosmetics and optional voice lines that, since I've played, people only really utilize in the pre game? That's the new low? Especially when future maps and heroes will be made free?

Not like Black Ops 3 which I'm pretty sure the price is worse for random packs that actually have weapons, that takes even longer to earn crypto keys than it has been to earn any level up in Overwatch, while never adding new specialists on top of having to pay $15 for each map pack.

 

[Radnom]

Fine, fine, fine.

I'm not here for the cosmetics.

Sure, neither am I. I haven't even opened any of my loot crates. It's not a deal breaker. Knowing there's stuff in the game I'm never going to obtain unless I pay more money on top of what I already paid isn't a great feeling though. It's like seeing ads in a premium game, they're asking for more money as I play. Like "wouldn't you enjoy this even more if you paid us more money?". Probably not, but I'd like them to stop asking anyway!

 

[B.O.O.M]

No, no it doesn't. I've been in CB, I've been WIPEd in CB, and I've been in the OB and launch. It is very easy to get enough coins to get what you want unless what you 'want' is every fucking thing in the game.

I've got about 100 hours worth of boxes and I've got like 3500 gold left and 9 legendary skins, plus a ton of purple skins and emotes and intros and stuff.

I have only been playing OW since the the beta. I'm not sure what you mean by that second part of yours. You played 100 hours to get that is that it? lmfao if so. How many hours to get 1000 gold you reckon? It's not a small amount. It's fucking embarrassing compared to unlocks in games like UC4. Have you played the UC4 MP? I was able to unlock all characters via random unlocks in a few days. And if you spend actual money? you can choose and not pray your luck is good..this is some gambling mentality shit that's used in F2P games.

And also glad your luck was good with 9 legendaries. Because in the OT we had one guy who had one purple after 25 levels. This system is a bloody joke. I understand you love the game but let's not lose sight of BS practices when we see it. Not sure how many hours I have put into the game so far since launch. I'm around level 25. Have about 500 gold. So I can expect maybe after I put in as many hours again I will have enough to buy one single fucking legendary. So stop being disingenuous to other people when you reply to them. Collecting money to get the stuff that's really important like skins is not cheap in this game and is sure as hell ain't easy/quick either. This is like some browser F2P game tier stuff right here

 

[Warnen]

This thread is weird, and it's weird that's it's gone on for so long and everyday it seems to grow. Purchasable cosmetics and optional voice lines that, since I've played, people only really utilize in the pre game? That's the new low? Especially when future maps and heroes will be made free?

Not like Black Ops 3 which I'm pretty sure the price is worse for random packs that actually have weapons, that takes even longer to earn crypto keys than it has been to earn any level up in Overwatch, while never adding new specialists on top of having to pay $15 for each map pack.

I guess you never taunt someone after you push them off the map...

 

[TheYanger]

Microtransactions in a paid title is really crappy. Overwatch is definitely not the worst implementation at all, but it's still not ideal.

At least they didn't do what Team Fortress 2 did, which is sell me a game, then change it to a F2P model, adding new gameplay-changing weapons and then charging me just to have a random chance of getting them so that I can play on equal footing with other players - that's just ridiculous. I see Overwatch's implementation as similar to Counter Strike GO's weapon skins which is less of a problem, but still not ideal.

Just because it's possible to get everything through 'regular play' doesn't mean it's reasonable or a good implementation of this. To people defending microtransactions simply because it's possible to obtain things through regular gameplay, what if it took twice as long between drops? 10x as long? What if there were no microtransactions, would people still be happy with the progression rate?

When a game has microtransactions implemented, the balance of progress is changed to support them, generally at the expense of non-paying players so that paying is more ideal. If I've already dropped a bunch of money on the game, though, it's pretty crap to charge me more on top of that. Still, I saw from the beta that in this case the game is still a good and fun game without the cosmetic changes, and I bought it. In the end though, of course I'd prefer it to simply not have microtransactions.

None of these arguments apply to THIS game and how it does microtransactions. What if it took 10 years to get a box? Yes that would be shitty. It doesn't. it takes like an hour.

And since there were no microtransactions for all of closed beta and open beta, yes we knew they were coming but they weren't there, I can safely say that yes I would still be happy wtih the rate of acquisition. This is a game you're going to be playing for a long time, with no 'progression' so having a minor form of carrot on the stick for a long time is preferable to be quite honest. I would have no problem with the current rate of unlocks were microtransactions not to exist, because I've already sunk hundreds of hours into that exact game with that scenario.

You're not wrong that the time and severity of unlocks and how much it pushes you to spending money is totally relevant, but you're wrong to say "WHAT IF" in regards to this game, because there is no what if, there is only what is. And what is is fair as fuck. You say you'd rather it not be there. why? The rate is fine, if they simply took them out and changed nothing else, the game wouldn't improve, and now suddenly you'd be having to fund new heroes and maps some other way, because that 60 dollar box isn't going to do it for 2-3 years or more. If Joe CEO wants to drop 1000 bucks to get some crates, fuck it so be it, it means you get everything for free.

I have only been playing OW since the the beta. I'm not sure what you mean by that second part of yours. You played 100 hours to get that is that it? lmfao if so. How many hours to get 1000 gold you reckon? It's not a small amount. It's fucking embarrassing compared to unlocks in games like UC4. Have you played the UC4 MP? I was able to unlock all characters via random unlocks in a few days. And if you spend actual money? you can choose and not pray your luck is good..this is some gambling mentality shit that's used in F2P games.

And also glad your luck was good with 9 legendaries. Because in the OT we had one guy who had one purple after 25 levels. This system is a bloody joke. I understand you love the game but let's not lose sight of BS practices when we see it. Not sure how many hours I have put into the game so far since launch. I'm around level 25. Have about 500 gold. So I can expect maybe after I put in as many hours again I will have enough to buy one single fucking legendary. So stop being disingenuous to other people when you reply to them. Collecting money to get the stuff that's really important like skins is not cheap in this game and is sure as hell ain't easy/quick either. This is like some browser F2P game tier stuff right here

1000 gold? You can get that in like 2 days depending on your luck with boxes. If you're not getting good drops it means you're accruing more dupes which are going to get you more gold too. If you think this is REMOTELY like an F2P game, you've never looked at an F2P game, and if you think uncharted is 'fair' and this isn't, you're literally fucking high. It's the exact same thing!

 

[Warnen]

Me thinks some people in this thread would defend Overwatch if it require live babies for the Microtransactions fee...

 

[borghe]

no way, Hearthstone released paid expansions with a bunch of "must own" cards regularly

none of hearthstone's expansions are paid. everything in the game is f2p. you can buy all expansions with in-game currency. and the expansions they retired you can craft cards for.

Me thinks some people in this thread would defend Overwatch if it require live babies for the Microtransactions fee...

so this is what happens when you run out of invented crisis?

I guess you never taunt someone after you push them off the map...

voice line? don't really care. Emote? Fuck no. Emote stuns you for the length of the emote.

 

[gatti-man]

the people who are going to play this regularly would put in 400 hours even if the unlocks did not exist at all. the game itself is the point, not skins and sprays.

So that excuses an obvious gambling mechanic that holds back content in an attempt to fleece gamers who can't or won't spend a ridiculous amount of time playing the game. That's no ok by me.

None of these arguments apply to THIS game and how it does microtransactions. What if it took 10 years to get a box? Yes that would be shitty. It doesn't. it takes like an hour.

And since there were no microtransactions for all of closed beta and open beta, yes we knew they were coming but they weren't there, I can safely say that yes I would still be happy wtih the rate of acquisition. This is a game you're going to be playing for a long time, with no 'progression' so having a minor form of carrot on the stick for a long time is preferable to be quite honest. I would have no problem with the current rate of unlocks were microtransactions not to exist, because I've already sunk hundreds of hours into that exact game with that scenario.

You're not wrong that the time and severity of unlocks and how much it pushes you to spending money is totally relevant, but you're wrong to say "WHAT IF" in regards to this game, because there is no what if, there is only what is. And what is is fair as fuck. You say you'd rather it not be there. why? The rate is fine, if they simply took them out and changed nothing else, the game wouldn't improve, and now suddenly you'd be having to fund new heroes and maps some other way, because that 60 dollar box isn't going to do it for 2-3 years or more. If Joe CEO wants to drop 1000 bucks to get some crates, fuck it so be it, it means you get everything for free.

Saying "it just takes an hour per box" is so misleading it stinks. Let's be real. I'm level 20 and most of my characters have 2-3 items unlocked most of which are bs tags or lines of dialogue out of 54. I've played the game easily for 15 hours now. The average player will have to pay to get the skins they want and the worst thing is they don't even have a guarantee because the boxes themselves are RNG for items that frankly should have just been included with such a small amount of content at launch.

This criticism is only going to get worse as more and more people hit level 20 and see the grind get longer and longer and the rewards stay crappy.

This also isn't carrot on a stick. I'd be fine with carrot on a stick. This is crap on a stick. After 20 packages you know many times I have received a skin I wanted? Or even a pallet swap of a character I regularly play? Zero times. ZERO. It's so in your face that blizzard expects you to fork out even more than $60 for the game it's insulting. The maps are already getting repetitive as well because there are so few. It's just a sucky thing to do with so little variety to begin with.

Completely optional microtransactions in a paid game is very good. It allows the developers to earn additional revenue which can then be spent on future content. It gives incentive to keep creating new maps, heroes, and cosmetics which in turn keeps the game feeling fresh. That translates to the game having a larger active community for a longer period of time, as new content keeps giving people reasons to come back.

Some people hate microtransactions no matter what. It's the degree of hate that changes. And I personally think some people who act like they hate microtransactions, deep down don't really care that much. It's 2016 now and people still angry over microtransactions when they really don't impact game balance seems so archaic. Add in the fact that you unlock all the same content just playing the game and it adds up to a really silly joke.

If this were COD, they'd be both selling the cosmetics and selling maps and probably even heroes too. OW is giving you new heroes and maps for free. Yet lets focus on the completely optional cosmetic only microtransactions.

If this were COD we would have about 10 times more content, packs would drop 3x faster, and I would actually feel like I'm progressing while I play versus just feeling like to get what I want I need to bust out my wallet. And CODs reward system is bad but this is worse for a launch game which is what we are talking about. I'm not going to theorize about what blizzard may or may not do in the future with content for this game. Let's stick to the here and now. What people are paying for now.

 

[Cleve]

I don't see how you could consider this model the most offensive when there's nothing but cosmetics, and it isn't even a paywall. Does it suck? Sure. Is it a new low? Fuck no.

 

[B.O.O.M]

Me thinks some people in this thread would defend Overwatch if it require live babies for the Microtransactions fee...

Sadly yes.

So that excuses an obvious gambling mechanic that holds back content in an attempt to fleece gamers who can't or won't spend a ridiculous amount of time playing the game. That's no ok by me.

Bingo! That's exactly what I was trying to say. It's an obvious gambling mentality mechanic used in F2P games.

1000 gold? You can get that in like 2 days depending on your luck with boxes. If you're not getting good drops it means you're accruing more dupes which are going to get you more gold too. If you think this is REMOTELY like an F2P game, you've never looked at an F2P game, and if you think uncharted is 'fair' and this isn't, you're literally fucking high. It's the exact same thing!

See again you're so damn blind by your love for this game you don't realize you are repeatedly being disingenuous as fuck. If my luck is good? Yea I mean depending on your luck you might end with 20 Legendary skins too in half a day! If I'm not getting good drops it could also means I could be only getting useless sprays and player icons, not duplicates. And how much does a spray duplicate going to net a player? 5 gold that's how much. This is MOST definitely using the gambling mechanic of a F2P play. You can pay money for extra loot and you STILL can't be sure what drop you get. Hell that is actually worse than many F2P games so maybe you're right that i'm wrong in comparing this to F2P games in general.

and Again tell me have you even played UC4 MP? That unlock system is supppppppppper user friendly. One main reason is among the cosmetic goods they don't have a million sprays and user icons etc. Taunts, clothes, characters etc are all easily unlockable thanks to that. It's a simple matter of understanding that the Dev can use simple probability calculations to either make these optional material fairly accessible or abuse the system to entice players to spend more and more money in the hopes their 'luck' is good enough to get something they like. This also tells me you have no fking clue about UC4 MP too. If you pay money and get in-game currency in that game, unlike this stupid system you can actually choose what you want directly. Simple and to the point. So no, they are not even remotely the same. Stop with the mental gymnastics. I love this game a lot but this unlocking system is pure shit move by the dev/pub

 

[borghe]

So that excuses an obvious gambling mechanic that holds back content in an attempt to fleece gamers who can't or won't spend a ridiculous amount of time playing the game. That's no ok by me.

you and the rest of this thread seem to have a serious separation of concern as to what "content" is.

invented crisis indeed. just goes to show. a company puts in the absolute smallest most minimal post-launch optional payment and people are still up in arms. when they clearly know that the only alternative is paid DLC (or running your own ubiquitous PC gaming store with control/share of like 99% of all PC game purchases)

Bingo! That's exactly what I was trying to say. It's an obvious gambling mentality mechanic used in F2P games.

the thing about gambling (and whales). The concern for them from others is in fact usually jealousy, not concern. I am fine having spent $80 on loot boxes so far. You are "concerned" (aka jealous) that I am fine spending $80? Oooh, I'll spend another $40 right now. Concern away for me.

 

[aeolist]

So that excuses an obvious gambling mechanic that holds back content in an attempt to fleece gamers who can't or won't spend a ridiculous amount of time playing the game. That's no ok by me.

if you're not going to spend a lot of time playing the game for fun then why do you want skins in the first place? i honestly think that if you don't enjoy the game for what it is but keep playing to get unlocks there is something wrong with you.

 

[Grisby]

I'm of two minds. It sucks that you see all these costumes and you probably won't unlock the ones you want in a normal amount of playtime.

However, the free content, and it being applied to everyone mind you (that's the most important bit) is nice. It sucks, because I won't get the Halo 5 armor that I want, nor will I probably ever unlock all of the new operators in Rainbow Six Siege, but at least it doesn't kill off or split the community.

None of these arguments apply to THIS game and how it does microtransactions. What if it took 10 years to get a box? Yes that would be shitty. It doesn't. it takes like an hour.

Takes a lot more than an hour at lvl25. For playing by yourself anyways.

 

[Warnen]

so this is what happens when you run out of invented crisis?

??


I've embraced craziness of this game, bought boxes and all. No question it's a fun well made game but doesn't change the fact the mt set up is poorly done. You can like something and admit it has flaws.

voice line? don't really care. Emote? Fuck no. Emote stuns you for the length of the emote.

Then sir you haven't lived.

 

[borghe]

??


I've embraced craziness of this game, bought boxes and all. No question it's a fun well made game but doesn't change the fact the mt set up is poorly done. You can like something and admit it has flaws.

I stand by what I said.. MT's are AS FAIRLY done as you are going to see.. and it beats the ever living hell out of paid DLC or annual releases/passes. Those are your ONLY two options (or owning a store that has 99% PC game sales market share).

People seem to be ignoring that entirely.

People point out the supposed shittiness, yet there is no alternative they offer for supporting a game that runs, say... 10M players for the foreseeable future with developing and releasing new content.

Then sir you haven't lived.

Not buying it in this game. YouTube or it didn't happen (unless you just don't care about getting killed during)

 

[B.O.O.M]

the thing about gambling (and whales). The concern for them from others is in fact usually jealousy, not concern. I am fine having spent $80 on loot boxes so far. You are "concerned" (aka jealous) that I am fine spending $80? Oooh, I'll spend another $40 right now. Concern away for me.

I'm honestly not sure if this is sarcasm or not. Is it? Cz I have no idea why you think I would be 'jealous' of others spending their money as they fit?

And did you just seriously say people concerned about gamblers are concerned usually because of jealousy? I refuse to believe this is a non-sarcastic comment.

 

[Gator86]

Fine, fine, fine.

I'm not here for the cosmetics.

It's always amazing to me how so many people rapidly devour gross business practices. I can't wait for Madden 18 where you have to pay extra to unlock away jerseys included in the full price game.

 

[Warnen]

I stand by what I said.. MT's are AS FAIRLY done as you are going to see.. and it beats the ever living hell out of paid DLC or annual releases/passes. Those are your ONLY two options (or owning a store that has 99% PC game sales market share).

People seem to be ignoring that entirely.

At this point I'd say they were fair if the dupe rate wasn't so high, I'm not kidding when I says 10+ boxes of of 50 had all dupes. Not to even count the ones that had 2-3 in each.

Plantz vs zombie 1/2 did it better. Free content updates, all cosmetics / characters (baslicly skins). Nothing repeated.

 

[borghe]

It's always amazing to me how so many people rapidly devour gross business practices. I can't wait for Madden 18 where you have to pay extra to unlock away jerseys included in the full price game.

or get them for free. sorry it's not as quickly as you'd like.

At this point I'd say they were fair if the dupe rate wasn't so high, I'm not kidding when I says 10+ boxes of of 50 had all dupes. Not to even count the ones that had 2-3 in each.

Plantz vs zombie 1/2 did it better. Free content updates, all cosmetics / characters (baslicly skins). Nothing repeated.

dupe coins "seem" to be 20-25% I believe. I think I get 15$ for a 75$ voice line.. and 5$ for a 25$ icon or something. It's not that bad.. basically 5 dupes of an item and you can buy one you want. obviously getting 20% value sucks.. but at the same time it was also luck.. you could have just as well gotten a 150$ or 500$ chest.

 

[gatti-man]

if you're not going to spend a lot of time playing the game for fun then why do you want skins in the first place? i honestly think that if you don't enjoy the game for what it is but keep playing to get unlocks there is something wrong with you.

To me 10 hours is a lot of time. So let's say I spend 10 hours a week playing a game. So if I consistently, only play overwatch for almost an entire year I might unlock everything in the game. Try to have perspective on people who can't game insane amounts of hours especially on an mp only team shooter with a tiny variety of maps. I mean come on I like playing other games too.

you and the rest of this thread seem to have a serious separation of concern as to what "content" is.

invented crisis indeed. just goes to show. a company puts in the absolute smallest most minimal post-launch optional payment and people are still up in arms. when they clearly know that the only alternative is paid DLC (or running your own ubiquitous PC gaming store with control/share of like 99% of all PC game purchases)

the thing about gambling (and whales). The concern for them from others is in fact usually jealousy, not concern. I am fine having spent $80 on loot boxes so far. You are "concerned" (aka jealous) that I am fine spending $80? Oooh, I'll spend another $40 right now. Concern away for me.

I know what content is. This game has amazing character content but besides the gameplay it's all held behind a pay wall or a time wall which for an adult is essentially the same thing. And minimal? To get what I want at this pace I would have to buy at minimum another 20 loot crates for 1 legendary skin. $20 per skin is not minimal and that's not even the point. The point is blizzard designed the entire reward mechanic to push gamers to pay extra. It's not one of a few choices. It's obviously been done that way. The whole mechanic is skewed towards it.

Having a distasteful gambling mechanic has zero to do with jealousy. I mean really? I bought emotes in destiny and would buy skins in this game if I could ACTUALLY YOU KNOW buy them. But I can't because that's not the design. Blizzard decided they can maximize the fleecing by making it random. That's dirty and I won't give them a dime because of it.

 

[Warnen]

Not buying it in this game. YouTube or it didn't happen (unless you just don't care about getting killed during)

You don't do it all the time just try it when no one around. Defending the starting point with Lucio Watchpoint Gibraltar. Some times a sneak will get behind past the escort truck and you can just bump him off and taunt.

 

[borghe]

To me 10 hours is a lot of time. So let's say I spend 10 hours a week playing a game. So if I consistently, only play overwatch for almost an entire year I might unlock everything in the game. Try to have perspective on people who can't game insane amounts of hours especially on an mp only team shooter with a tiny variety of maps. I mean come on I like playing other games too.

but they're cosmetics.. that don't affect your game. I mean you can't even see them unless you make the highlight and even then it's just the intro.

I get you guys dance around this making it sound more serious "content" "content".. just say it.. paper doll dresses.

You don't do it all the time just try it when no one around. Defending the starting point with Lucio Watchpoint Gibraltar. Some times a sneak will get behind past the escort truck and you can just bump him off and taunt.

TBH I would taunt.. but yeah, this game is pretty brutal about it. Very few instances where I could do it without hurting my team. Something like you're saying though.. a lone wolf and no one is around.. sure. interestingly, this is arguably the most important cosmetic because you can actually see it.. even still, there are only 3 taunts per character.. and you can only equip one. and they're cheap(75?)

The point is blizzard designed the entire reward mechanic to push gamers to pay extra.

ok... and whyyyyyyyyy is blizzard pushing gamers to pay extra? c'mon.. you're almost there.. no season pass. no paid dlc.. yet we get new content.. so where do you think that money is coming from?

 

[Kuro]

Was there this much backlash from hats in tf2?

 

[Speely]

I have no problem with Blizzard making some sustained revenue with which to continue developing maps, modes, and heroes. Who knows how much content might be added, and what kind of content? It's just fluff stuff. Cosmetics are what all microtransactions should be imo.

 

[gatti-man]

but they're cosmetics.. that don't affect your game. I mean you can't even see them unless you make the highlight and even then it's just the intro.

I get you guys dance around this making it sound more serious "content" "content".. just say it.. paper doll dresses.


TBH I would taunt.. but yeah, this game is pretty brutal about it. Very few instances where I could do it without hurting my team. Something like you're saying though.. a lone wolf and no one is around.. sure. interestingly, this is arguably the most important cosmetic because you can actually see it.. even still, there are only 3 taunts per character.. and you can only equip one. and they're cheap(75?)

Cosmetics do affect this game. Emotes, dialogue, skins, tags, and entry moves are all content that should be included and normally is. If you don't unlock extras the game gets awe fully samey really fast.

I play games with my eyes. Skins and emotes and dialogues and entry moves all effect my enjoyment of the product especially when the variety without them is non existent. It's content and it does affect my enjoyment of the game. If it didn't why would people say "oh check out my new skin!" Why do people grind for that cosmos armor in COD. Variety makes games more fun (obviously).


-replying to your edit-

Blizzard is charging for content they obviously cut from the base game because they can. Its not to fund further development. It honestly has zero to do with that. They haven't released a time schedule for expanding the tiny amount of maps at launch or modes. Until they do I'm not excusing ridiculous pricing and design for some funding further development. The game feels incomplete for a $60 as is. People are just giving it a pass for the promise of future content which to me is hilarious since when is this wonderous content coming out? Do we know? Nope. Do we know the quantity? No. Date? No. Style? No. It's just hand waving and excuse making in this thread.

Was there this much backlash from hats in tf2?

Rewards in TF2 drop far far more than what you get in overwatch. Not even comparable to me.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

If this were COD we would have about 10 times more content, packs would drop 3x faster, and I would actually feel like I'm progressing while I play versus just feeling like to get what I want I need to bust out my wallet. And CODs reward system is bad but this is worse for a launch game which is what we are talking about. I'm not going to theorize about what blizzard may or may not do in the future with content for this game. Let's stick to the here and now. What people are paying for now.

10 times more content? lol... what cod game had content drops a week after launch? If you're referring to non post launch content, that is not relevant to this discussion. And to the point, the comparison was made only to point out that COD sells maps as DLC and this game doesn't. Selling maps as DLC is one of the worst things to happen to COD. Originally COD DLC maps were free at one point btw.

COD's progression system is a completely different philosophy than OW's. OW is not about vertical progression, COD's has a lot of vertical progression. OW's progression is better for the game by a mile.

Also, it's cute that you want to dismiss future content additions from the discussion where my entire point was that these micro-transactions support them and the game in the long run. That is a creative way to dismiss an argument without having to accept or refute it.

 

[Warnen]

dupe coins "seem" to be 20-25% I believe. I think I get 15$ for a 75$ voice line.. and 5$ for a 25$ icon or something. It's not that bad.. basically 5 dupes of an item and you can buy one you want. obviously getting 20% value sucks.. but at the same time it was also luck.. you could have just as well gotten a 150$ or 500$ chest.

That's why I say PvZ did it better no 20-25% return, you just don't get dupes.

Only up side to this game systems is

1) bank points for new stuff
2) reason for boxes after you unlock everything



I'd buy another $40 worth of boxes right now but the idea of so many dupes is putting me off.

 

[Fixed2BeBroken]

That's why I say PvZ did it better no 20-25% return, you just don't get dupes.

Only up side to this game systems is

1) bank points for new stuff
2) reason for boxes after you unlock everything



I'd buy another $40 worth of boxes right now but the idea of so many dupes is putting me off.

yea but in PVZ you unlocked stuff that wasn't purely cosmetic. You unlocked game affecting items.

in this, all of that is already unlocked.

seriously, this dude is at the level of trolling at this point.

 

[Owzers]

I somewhat like everyone not having every skin all the time, which is what would happen if they were just easy unlocks. On the other hand, i want those skins.

 

[borghe]

Cosmetics do affect this game. Emotes, dialogue, skins, tags, and entry moves are all content that should be included and normally is. If you don't unlock extras the game gets awe fully samey really fast.

and we're done here. without cosmetics the game gets stale folks.

I get it man.. you are going to go down with this cosmetics ship. Good luck.

In the meantime I got a legendary skin in my level 10 crate and did in fact buy another 40 a few minutes ago. 3 legs and ~1700 credits.

I guess I don't know what to say except "you're very welcome that my $250 paid into the game so far ensure that all content is released to everyone for no additional charge."

That's why I say PvZ did it better no 20-25% return, you just don't get dupes.

Only up side to this game systems is

1) bank points for new stuff
2) reason for boxes after you unlock everything



I'd buy another $40 worth of boxes right now but the idea of so many dupes is putting me off.

number 2 is why it is the way it is.. also as new skins are released.. and as people invest heavy amounts of time in this, it'sll be just like hearthstone where people will have like 10,000 credits when a new wave of skins is released. PvZ2 could do 1:1 because they were just traditional unlocks, not actual post-launch support going toward major new development.

 

[gatti-man]

and we're done here. without cosmetics the game gets stale folks.

I get it man.. you are going to go down with this cosmetics ship. Good luck.

In the meantime I got a legendary skin in my level 10 crate and did in fact buy another 40 a few minutes ago. 3 legs and ~1700 credits.

I guess I don't know what to say except "you're very welcome that my $250 paid into the game so far ensure that all content is released to everyone for no additional charge."



number 2 is why it is the way it is.. also as new skins are released.. and as people invest heavy amounts of time in this, it'sll be just like hearthstone where people will have like 10,000 credits when a new wave of skins is released. PvZ2 could do 1:1 because they were just traditional unlocks, not actual post-launch support.

So I dismantle your argument and you put words in my mouth to hand wave it away. I didn't say the gameplay i.e. Game gets stale. I Said it gets samey and it does. The characters always look the same, say the same things, have the same win poses, have the same entries etc. it's samey when there could be far more visual variety.

I honestly don't care what you do with your money that's your business. I'm here to talk about a shitty mechanic blizzard is putting in overwatch that's it.

10 times more content? lol... what cod game had content drops a week after launch? If you're referring to non post launch content, that is not relevant to this discussion. And to the point, the comparison was made only to point out that COD sells maps as DLC and this game doesn't. Selling maps as DLC is one of the worst things to happen to COD. Originally COD DLC maps were free at one point btw.

COD's progression system is a completely different philosophy than OW's. OW is not about vertical progression, COD's has a lot of vertical progression. OW's progression is better for the game by a mile.

Also, it's cute that you want to dismiss future content additions from the discussion where my entire point was that these micro-transactions support them and the game in the long run. That is a creative way to dismiss an argument without having to accept or refute it.

Launch for launch a COD game crushes Overwatch in content. That's not even debatable. Overwatch probably won't have comparable content in 6 months time. I'd be surprised if in a year we could compare the two and have them line up in content.

I'm dismissing future content because you have no idea when or what that will be. You're just grabbing wishes and dreams out of the sky about future content. Blizzard hasn't said one concrete thing about future content or what it will be so why even talk about it. If blizzard releases two maps a year and one mode a year that's free future support and in 3 years would still be less overall content than a COD releases with at launch.

 

[Finalow]

And before you say that it doesn't affect gameplay so it's good - it does effect the writing, the characterization and basically the heart of the game. In Multiplayer games, any piece of writing is crucial to set-up the characters, to give them personality and to give them voice, figuratively and literally.
.

some speech lines are the heart of the game? Lol, what.

microtransactions are one of the (many) awful things about gaming nowadays, especially in full-priced games, but in this game they hardly make any difference and at least they (Blizzard*) had the decency to give players the option to unlock everything by playing.

 

[Warnen]

yea but in PVZ you unlocked stuff that wasn't purely cosmetic. You unlocked game affecting items.

in this, all of that is already unlocked.

seriously, this dude is at the level of trolling at this point.

How is it trolling? I bought boxes in Overwatch, they got my money. I'm pointing out what I believe is a better system.

Also in PvZ cosmetic stuff are in different packs then the characters. So yes there are other things to only but if you just want cosmetics (like in Overwatch) there is an option for that.

Again not saying PvZ is a better game or anything, just has a similar system for micro transactions.

 

[gatti-man]

some speech lines are the heart of the game? Lol, what.

microtransactions are one of the (many) awful things about gaming nowadays, especially in full-priced games, but in this game they hardly make any difference and at least they had the decency to give players the option to unlock everything by playing.

10 speech lines and 3 emotes per character. Not to mention win poses, tags, and skin variety.

Saying you can unlock it by playing isn't really true. Saying you can unlock content by playing a ton of hours is more accurate. Or one box on average per hour containing usually 1 tag 1 voice line and 1 emblem then maybe a pallet swap or 50-100 gold coins or just another tag. When you spell it out it's really underwhelming.

 

[Hasney]

10 speech lines and 3 emotes per character. Not to mention win poses, tags, and skin variety.

Saying you can unlock it by playing isn't really true. Saying you can unlock content by playing a ton of hours is more accurate. Or one box on average per hour containing usually 1 tag 1 voice line and 1 emblem then maybe a pallet swap or 50-100 gold coins or just another tag. When you spell it out it's really underwhelming.

It's awesome, right? Still be unlocking things by the 1,000th hour that I will be playing anyway due to the gameplay being so good. You won't run out by that point, so something new every hour like you said!

 

[homeworkfilms]

I love Overwatch but the loot system is clearly on the stingy side. I am at level 23 and have 450g so I am not even half way to 1 top skin for my favorite character. That is far too low and encourages loot box purchases. Double the drop rate and I think the system would be fairer.

 

[borghe]

So I dismantle your argument and you put words in my mouth to hand wave it away. I didn't say the gameplay i.e. Game gets stale. I Said it gets samey and it does. The characters always look the same, say the same things, have the same win poses, have the same entries etc. it's samey when there could be far more visual variety.

I honestly don't care what you do with your money that's your business. I'm here to talk about a shitty mechanic blizzard is putting in overwatch that's it.

you didn't dismantle my argument, unless I missed it and you actually touched on the topic of "how does blizz give us new gameplay content and continued online support without microtransactions?"

I love Overwatch but the loot system is clearly on the stingy side. I am at level 23 and have 450g so I am not even half way to 1 top skin for my favorite character. That is far too low and encourages loot box purchases. Double the drop rate and I think the system would be fairer.

and potentially halves (or whatever) the money coming in from loot boxes.. putting a dent on the incoming revenue supporting post-launch development. this is ultimately the dilemma. what's fair.. and what keeps all future content free from additional charge? The one thing gatti-man and similar ignore.

 

[katsubento]

I'm going to buy some loot crates just because of this thread.

 

[Odrion]

Hey wait didn't Naughty Dog put a paywall behind overpowered weapons in The Last of Us months after the release?

 

[borghe]

Hey wait didn't Naughty Dog put a paywall behind overpowered weapons in The Last of Us months after the release?

and paid map packs coming in UC4. Yes, the big thing the major crusaders here keep ignoring. they seem to not understand online games need continued income to survive.

 

[Warnen]

I'm going to buy some loot crates just because of this thread.

I recommend the 50 pack

 

[Ricerocket]

Cosmetics do affect this game. Emotes, dialogue, skins, tags, and entry moves are all content that should be included and normally is. If you don't unlock extras the game gets awe fully samey really fast.

I play games with my eyes. Skins and emotes and dialogues and entry moves all effect my enjoyment of the product especially when the variety without them is non existent. It's content and it does affect my enjoyment of the game. If it didn't why would people say "oh check out my new skin!" Why do people grind for that cosmos armor in COD. Variety makes games more fun (obviously).


-replying to your edit-

Blizzard is charging for content they obviously cut from the base game because they can. Its not to fund further development. It honestly has zero to do with that. They haven't released a time schedule for expanding the tiny amount of maps at launch or modes. Until they do I'm not excusing ridiculous pricing and design for some funding further development. The game feels incomplete for a $60 as is. People are just giving it a pass for the promise of future content which to me is hilarious since when is this wonderous content coming out? Do we know? Nope. Do we know the quantity? No. Date? No. Style? No. It's just hand waving and excuse making in this thread.



Rewards in TF2 drop far far more than what you get in overwatch. Not even comparable to me.

They really don't affect me at all. I don't care that I killed someone with a voice line I don't have because you don't even hear it. Am I making an excuse for the game because I don't care?

 

[TheYanger]

Cosmetics do affect this game. Emotes, dialogue, skins, tags, and entry moves are all content that should be included and normally is. If you don't unlock extras the game gets awe fully samey really fast.

I play games with my eyes. Skins and emotes and dialogues and entry moves all effect my enjoyment of the product especially when the variety without them is non existent. It's content and it does affect my enjoyment of the game. If it didn't why would people say "oh check out my new skin!" Why do people grind for that cosmos armor in COD. Variety makes games more fun (obviously).


-replying to your edit-

Blizzard is charging for content they obviously cut from the base game because they can. Its not to fund further development. It honestly has zero to do with that. They haven't released a time schedule for expanding the tiny amount of maps at launch or modes. Until they do I'm not excusing ridiculous pricing and design for some funding further development. The game feels incomplete for a $60 as is. People are just giving it a pass for the promise of future content which to me is hilarious since when is this wonderous content coming out? Do we know? Nope. Do we know the quantity? No. Date? No. Style? No. It's just hand waving and excuse making in this thread.



Rewards in TF2 drop far far more than what you get in overwatch. Not even comparable to me.

Rewards in TF2 drop ONE per 50 minutes with a cap per week. Are you fucking shitting me right now? And they're actual gameplay affecting shit, except for the hats, which drop FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR less.

I'm of two minds. It sucks that you see all these costumes and you probably won't unlock the ones you want in a normal amount of playtime.

However, the free content, and it being applied to everyone mind you (that's the most important bit) is nice. It sucks, because I won't get the Halo 5 armor that I want, nor will I probably ever unlock all of the new operators in Rainbow Six Siege, but at least it doesn't kill off or split the community.

Takes a lot more than an hour at lvl25. For playing by yourself anyways.

It took me 1.5 hours in beta before they added win of the day, consecutive match bonuses, and group bonuses. You're right, you get 20% less playing solo. That uscks, join a group. In a group it's absolutely an hour per level/box. It also resets every 100 levels and gets very fast again for a bit, basically giving you an extra like 10 boxes/levels per 100 just due to math.

People in here trying to act like this shit takes forever to get...the game has been out for a matter of DAYS. Are you fucking serious with this shit? I've got hundreds of hours invested in it over the past 6 months, By the end of closed beta, a 3 month period with cosmetic unlocks and levelling system, I had EVERY 'first choice' skin for every character in the game. There was nothing I wanted that badly that I didn't have. This isn't me guessing at this, this is anecdotal from actually having done this exact 'grind' already 4 months ago.

Edit: and we're not talking poopsock levels of hours here. I ended the closed beta at level 120 or so. There are people that are already in their 70s on live.

 

[borghe]

I recommend the 50 pack

I do want to commend you.. you seem to be focusing on "what distribution is fair".. which is entirely subjective. I can understand that. I'm fine with it because it apes HS which is more brutal because that actually affects the game.. but I can understand people wishing it were a little more generous. but at the very least you have a firm grasp that these MTA purchases are going somewhere that ultimately makes the game WAAAAYYYY better (free DLC for the life of the game)

this thought that blizz should just fund ongoing costs and new development out of the goodness of their hearts is bizarre.

 

[Finalow]

10 speech lines and 3 emotes per character. Not to mention win poses, tags, and skin variety.

what's your point here. that's supposed to be the heart of a game like this one? Same ''lol what'' reaction as before if your answer is yes.

Saying you can unlock it by playing isn't really true. Saying you can unlock content by playing a ton of hours is more accurate

it is true, read that again. can you unlock everything by playing? Yes. does it take 900 hours / a lot of time? It does, but you still can unlock everything.

I really don't understand how can people care so much about cosmetics, by the time you try all the characters and 'get bored' of their default skins/lines you probably have already unlocked plenty of new options.
it's definitely not the best unlock system out there but I don't really see any major issues.

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

Launch for launch a COD game crushes Overwatch in content. That's not even debatable. Overwatch probably won't have comparable content in 6 months time. I'd be surprised if in a year we could compare the two and have them line up in content.

I'm dismissing future content because you have no idea when or what that will be. You're just grabbing wishes and dreams out of the sky about future content. Blizzard hasn't said one concrete thing about future content or what it will be so why even talk about it. If blizzard releases two maps a year and one mode a year that's free future support and in 3 years would still be less overall content than a COD releases with at launch.

Like I said, launch content is not even relevant to the talking points I made. You keep bringing it up as if it's some kind of big deal though, because you cannot actually address what I've said. We're talking about future content here being supported and incentivized by microtransactions, but you want to dismiss it because we don't know exactly when those content drops will be?

We do have concrete information on future content. We do know what it will be. We know they intend to add maps and heroes. You acknowledged that yourself while simultaneously claiming that we know nothing. We don't need to know exactly what the maps and heroes are now. What is relevant is that microtransactions gives the developers reasons to keep the community going long. The more content they add, the more they keep people coming back and buying loot boxes. If they stop adding content, people have no reason to buy boxes.

We're talking about Blizzard here. They support their games forever. They're still patching diablo 2, a game that came out 16 years ago. Hearthstone is getting 3 content expansions per a year, all thanks to microtransactions.

 

[Alienous]

You can unlock the line "Hm.." for Hanzo in the loot crates.

L
O
L

 

[Frozenprince]

So you can unlock these just by playing the game (I unlock one or two with literally every loot box I get), and you're still bitching over... what exactly?

You get the full playable GAME, you know the thing that you spend the vast majority of your time playing and stuff, for the base price.

Bitching about skins has never made sense to me.