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Overwatch |OT10| That'll do pig, that'll do

Fugu

Member
I don't see how that's a reach. If you aren't running a perfect team comp to counter the enemy then you are making the game harder for no reason and should be called out.
If I apply the same criteria to hero selection as I do to voice chat, then you should be called out when:

- You select a hero that actively makes the game worse for your other five teammates and
- You select a hero that has no reasonable chance of improving your odds of winning.

I would say that in such a case you absolutely should be called out.


People saying nothing on comms is the reason assholes exist in Overwatch.

That's what we'd call a reach.
Well, I didn't say any of that. I said that if he has nothing but bad experiences in voice then his status as the lone common factor makes him the obvious first answer to the question "why are all of his experiences in OW voice so bad?".
 
* let's see who got my PP reference *

...

Zki6LEk.gif
 
Maybe people who take the GAME so seriously that they would be mad at someone for doing something that make it more enjoyable to for that person to play, because it makes the super serious GAME a little bit harder for them, are the exact people that someone might have no wish to communicate with.
 

Fugu

Member
Maybe people who take the GAME so seriously that they would be mad at someone for doing something that make it more enjoyable to for them play, because it makes the super serious GAME a little bit harder for them, are the exact people that someone might have no wish to communicate with.
Okay now see this is some problematic logic. How do you feel about literal throwers?
 

Fugu

Member
You really want to compare the two?
No, but you put them in the same category: They make the game more difficult for me, someone who takes the game seriously, by doing something that fosters their own enjoyment.

i dont play that much, but i rather have someone who knows what to do than someone who is communicative,
These two things aren't mutually exclusive. In fact, they're complementary: a player who is communicative is far more likely to know what to do because they have more information with which to make decisions.
 
No, but you put them in the same category: They make the game more difficult for me, someone who takes the game seriously, by doing something that fosters their own enjoyment.
I think that's a stretch but okay.

I don't even know why I'm getting worked up. I talk more than anyone else i play with, more than someone should (too much? See, that can become detrimental and then we have a whole new problem) I've also been the guy where if some randoms wanted nothing to do with my constant yapping then I can't blame them.

For me it just boils down too: I know who I am, a solid diamond player. Talking or no talking, I don't see a correlation in ranking up or down. I'm going to consistently provide diamond level play to a team. I know the game mechanics very well. And I will attempt to win. So don't try to make me feel guilty if I'm too lazy to plug in my mic.
 

LiK

Member
I think that's a stretch but okay.

I don't even know why I'm getting worked up. I talk more than anyone else i play with, more than someone should (too much? See, that can become detrimental and then we have a whole new problem) I've also been the guy where if some randoms wanted nothing to do with my constant yapping then I can't blame them.

For me it just boils down too: I know who I am, a solid diamond player. Talking or no talking, I don't see a correlation in ranking up or down. I'm going to consistently provide diamond level play to a team. I know the game mechanics very well. And I will attempt to win. So don't try to make me feel guilty if I'm too lazy to plug in my mic.

We easily climbed as a duo totally micless in S2. I remember when we even carried a 4-stack cuz they kept dying. That was one of our greatest nights of Comp.
 
Mic/team-chat would always be better if used properly.

That's not what happens for the most part though, especially on EU with all the different languages. Open mic on console is also a problem (there should be an option of pressing a button to talk).

I know it's not the right thing to do in a team-based game but I'd rather play with no mic if I'm soloing (and a lot of times even team-chat off), only joining chat if I'm in a group to be able to give Owzers shit.
 

Fugu

Member
I think that's a stretch but okay.

I don't even know why I'm getting worked up. I talk more than anyone else i play with, more than someone should (too much? See, that can become detrimental and then we have a whole new problem) I've also been the guy where if some randoms wanted nothing to do with my constant yapping then I can't blame them.

For me it just boils down too: I know who I am, a solid diamond player. Talking or no talking, I don't see a correlation in ranking up or down. I'm going to consistently provide diamond level play to a team. I know the game mechanics very well. And I will attempt to win. So don't try to make me feel guilty if I'm too lazy to plug in my mic.
I care a lot less about people who don't talk than I do about people who don't join voice. Not everyone needs to be a shot caller; although it is clearly suboptimal not to have the option available to you, it is far more meaningful and detrimental to cut off almost all communication entirely by leaving voice.

There is a correlation between success in team activities and communication. This is well-trodden territory.
 

LiK

Member
Mic/team-chat would always be better if used properly.

That's not what happens for the most part though, especially on EU with all the different languages. Open mic on console is also a problem (there should be an option of pressing a button to talk).

I know it's not the right thing to do in a team-based game but I'd rather play with no mic if I'm soloing (and a lot of times even team-chat off), only joining chat if I'm in a group to be able to give Owzers shit.

I feel bad for EU players in general. The language barrier can be a problem.
 
Whenever I'm not on mic it's usually because I'm either eating or playing solo and don't want to yell at fandoms. I make liberal use of the command wheel though - it usually goes something like:

Group up!
Group up!
Group up!
Group up!
Too many messages...
Group up!
Group up!
Group up!
Group up!
 

Mr Git

Member
Mmm well Morocco ain't that far from Portugal

They're Moroccans though :p

It's not often you'd ever get decent callouts from me playing qp or arcade - I'm usually half cut, stoned or tired so you'd get informative things like, "uhh watch it there's whosit on the jobby next to the whatsit".
Console needs some kinda push to talk and that would encourage people to use comms although sometimes I don't blame people for not hearing anything over what is often a massive din.
 

LiK

Member
They're Moroccans though :p

It's not often you'd ever get decent callouts from me playing qp or arcade - I'm usually half cut, stoned or tired so you'd get informative things like, "uhh watch it there's whosit on the jobby next to the whatsit".
Console needs some kinda push to talk and that would encourage people to use comms although sometimes I don't blame people for not hearing anything over what is often a massive din.

I'll play with you.
 
I care a lot less about people who don't talk than I do about people who don't join voice. Not everyone needs to be a shot caller; although it is clearly suboptimal not to have the option available to you, it is far more meaningful and detrimental to cut off almost all communication entirely by leaving voice.

There is a correlation between success in team activities and communication. This is well-trodden territory.


Leaving voice chat is often seen as throwing on PC (where the game is actually played properly).

There some uncommon instances of toxicity where the chats are clogged by someone turning the whole team against some suspect teammate. Going with a shitty off-meta pick in comp though. Why don't you play QP? Expect to get called out on comms.

It is ironic how off-meta mains complain about QP where people don't play the game properly, but somehow going with a shitty pick like Symm/Junkrat isn't the same case. Hypocrisy and selfishness at its best.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
I gave up my strategy of trying to learn something other than symmetra and skyrocketed back 500 SR in like 50 games to 2300, ignoring all the hate I get for playing her. I know it won't work forever, but if I just get to platinum I think I'll have reached my goal.

The symmetra flank playstyle is just basically how i've played fps games all my life, and I don't have the mechanics for someone like tracer. I also have 500 hours of practice in TF and TF2 placing turrets on maps that are hard to place turrets, which wasn't ranked so no harm done. It is simply where my skills are best, and even if it's impossible to go pro with those specific skills no matter how good those skills are, they're good enough to win games in Gold.

So yes, I am going to get mad at players that choose to hate on me for giving them the best chance to win, and the results to show for it. I'll just show it by simply leaving voice chat, and not adding to the toxicity. And I am doing what Comp is about by trying my best to win as a team to improve my rank, which isn't possible in QP.
 

Fugu

Member
Leaving voice chat is often seen as throwing on PC (where the game is actually played properly).

There some uncommon instances of toxicity where the chats are clogged by someone turning the whole team against some suspect teammate. Going with a shitty off-meta pick in comp though. Why don't you play QP? Expect to get called out on comms.

It is ironic how off-meta mains complain about QP where people don't play the game properly, but somehow going with a shitty pick like Symm/Junkrat isn't the same case. Hypocrisy and selfishness at its best.
I'm a PC player. I don't really know (or especially care to know) what happens in console comp, to be honest, although I would hope that the central common purpose of... trying to win would carry over.

I don't mind off-meta otps as long as they produce results. I, like I would imagine most people who have played at or above the 3500 line for any significant amount of time, have won dozens of games on the backs of a Sym otp and have long since stopped being surprised by their efficacy.

I do, however, treat leaving voice chat as low key throwing, as you mentioned.
 
Another to add to the list just like all those randoms.

How do you know who is going to ult first if you're playing Zen with a Lucio? Is there shorthand for it, and I just don't know it? I'm sure there's a way, but I can't figure it out, and Lucio and I always double up our ults if he's not on comms.

I don't have a "right" answer on this, but anecdotally I play way better with comms. I know that means I don't have great game-sense, and I'll cop to that, but I like to win too much to turn them off.
 

Cappa

Banned
I need overwatch in my life. :( by the time Ill get to play ive probably decayed all the way down to 3000 and Ill probably spiral down to gold lol
 
I'm a PC player. I don't really know (or especially care to know) what happens in console comp, to be honest, although I would hope that the central common purpose of... trying to win would carry over.

I don't mind off-meta otps as long as they produce results. I, like I would imagine most people who have played at or above the 3500 line for any significant amount of time, have won dozens of games on the backs of a Sym otp and have long since stopped being surprised by their efficacy.

I do, however, treat leaving voice chat as low key throwing, as you mentioned.

Yeah I was expanding on your post; I know you are a 3.9k SR PC player. It is a shame that there are people who actively say incorrect game advice and are flat out rude to correct advice from you and other GMs here. I remember a post about team comps and some advanced macro stuff that was met with defensive low elo arguments. People literally wait and pay for coaching and people here just actively refuse advice LOL. The PC community is just way more open-minded and much better overall; it is ironic that some people here shat on the PC community just because of a small argument.


I play on PC BTW, and I always join voice chat/ask my group to join if we are in a stack. Callouts are really important. I can't imagine a 3.5kSR+ game without a shot caller. How can you focus targets in dive comps, manage ult economy and read ults/coordinate support ults without comms? It is a different game with comms; there is no amount of game sense that will save you from certain situations. It is just another game with comms.
 

LiK

Member
How do you know who is going to ult first if you're playing Zen with a Lucio? Is there shorthand for it, and I just don't know it? I'm sure there's a way, but I can't figure it out, and Lucio and I always double up our ults if he's not on comms.

I don't have a "right" answer on this, but anecdotally I play way better with comms. I know that means I don't have great game-sense, and I'll cop to that, but I like to win too much to turn them off.

Just use the Ult command when it's full and when people are launching into a point, Lucio can use it if their health ain't bad. I tend to Ult as Zen if I see multiple people's health going down at once in a team fight to keep them alive. My most recent duo with Owzers was me playing as Zen without comms. I Ulted twice in there just to keep the team alive and we won the team fights both times. Here's the match:

https://youtu.be/TJa3URooedo

As I've said before, I'm simply pointing out that games aren't worth playing with comms if people are being jerks or talking way too much. It's distracting to me. If you guys enjoy comms, then that's perfectly fine.
 

finalflame

Member
Competitive Overwatch needs to be played with comms. QP can be played however you desire. Not participating in comms because you find it "distracting" is doing a disservice to your team (which isn't to say you'll never win, but it's less than ideal).

My $0.02.
 

Fugu

Member
Yeah I was expanding on your post; I know you are a 3.9k SR PC player. It is a shame that there are people who actively say incorrect game advice and are flat out rude to correct advice from you and other GMs here. I remember a post about team comps and some advanced macro stuff that was met with defensive low elo arguments. People literally wait and pay for coaching and people here just actively refuse advice LOL. The PC community is just way more open-minded and much better overall; it is ironic that some people here shat on the PC community just because of a small argument.


I play on PC BTW, and I always join voice chat/ask my group to join if we are in a stack. Callouts are really important. I can't imagine a 3.5kSR+ game without a shot caller. How can you focus targets in dive comps, manage ult economy and read ults/coordinate support ults without comms? It is a different game with comms; there is no amount of game sense that will save you from certain situations. It is just another game with comms.
The biggest irony in all of this is the recurring trend of lower SR players telling higher SR players that they (the lower SR players) have such good game sense that they don't need voice. No you don't! Nobody does! There are some very high ranked players that occupy a weird space whereby their gamesense is good enough to "communicate" implicitly at a level that is sufficient for ladder play (although not, notably, sufficient enough for pro or pseudopro play like scrims) but they are few and far between and one does not get to that level by chronically not communicating.

The game flows so much better with shot calling and ult co-ordination that it's insane. And even if you believe that you don't need shot calling, you should realize that unless you are in GM (...and even then to some extent) you are playing at a level where ult management is far from ideal and can readily be improved by declaring your intention to ult in the next fight instead of just "feeling it".

How do you know who is going to ult first if you're playing Zen with a Lucio? Is there shorthand for it, and I just don't know it? I'm sure there's a way, but I can't figure it out, and Lucio and I always double up our ults if he's not on comms.

I don't have a "right" answer on this, but anecdotally I play way better with comms. I know that means I don't have great game-sense, and I'll cop to that, but I like to win too much to turn them off.
There is no shorthand. There is, however, shorthand for two supports using their ults simultaneously: Bad ult economy.

Or, alternatively, OH LET'S BREAK IT DOWXPERIENCE TRANQUILITY

Still haven't played my placement matches this season after playing for a year straight.

What is this.

How is my boi Reaper after the patch?
PC? He's alright. He's terrifying up close but too many characters simply don't have to deal with him if they don't want to and/or can kill him at range.

His biggest problem is that a lot of meta heroes make his life a lot worse, like Lucio and D.Va.
 

MCD

Junior Member
48 eliminations and all gold as D.VA.

From Bastion and Tracer only to D.VA. I am enjoying her so much.

I do play Mercy sometimes but she can be stressful.
 

Fugu

Member
Competitive Overwatch needs to be played with comms. QP can be played however you desire. Not participating in comms because you find it "distracting" is doing a disservice to your team (which isn't to say you'll never win, but it's less than ideal).

My $0.02.
It actually blows my mind that this is a controversial statement.
 

QisTopTier

XisBannedTier
I gave up my strategy of trying to learn something other than symmetra and skyrocketed back 500 SR in like 50 games to 2300, ignoring all the hate I get for playing her. I know it won't work forever, but if I just get to platinum I think I'll have reached my goal.

The symmetra flank playstyle is just basically how i've played fps games all my life, and I don't have the mechanics for someone like tracer. I also have 500 hours of practice in TF and TF2 placing turrets on maps that are hard to place turrets, which wasn't ranked so no harm done. It is simply where my skills are best, and even if it's impossible to go pro with those specific skills no matter how good those skills are, they're good enough to win games in Gold.

So yes, I am going to get mad at players that choose to hate on me for giving them the best chance to win, and the results to show for it. I'll just show it by simply leaving voice chat, and not adding to the toxicity. And I am doing what Comp is about by trying my best to win as a team to improve my rank, which isn't possible in QP.

Reaper is a character in overwatch that flanks and doesnt killhimself in the process
 
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