Plasma, LCD, OLED, LED, best tv for next gen

Not trying to tilt you either way mind you, but there really is no TV in the market like this, the best thing you buy won't even come close.

And yet, that's exactly what it feels to me. :P To be perfectly honest it has really come down to the VT(W)60 being 1600€ vs. the W828 being 1120€ (plus the chance to win a PS4 if I buy it sometime next week). I could live with higher power consumption, heat and even some IR (unless my panel were to have a severe case of it, which I've seen reported quite often). I'd be watching the 55" from about 2 meters away, so dithering shouldn't be a problem (?). The buzzing ... yeah, that could drive me insane, if it was really bad. Especially at night, when I'd have to keep the volume at reasonable levels. I absolutey love the design of the VT60, but if I add up all the small things I might get annoyed with, LCD just seems to be the right-er choice for me.

Still ... it's all so frustrating.
 
After looking up what pentile displays were (thanks for pointing it out) I will definitely be avoiding the Samsung. I was wondering why certain 1080p TVs looked so grainy/pixelated when I was wandering around Best Buy and that apparently is the exact reason.

Is there any image retentation with your LG? I've heard that LG is fairly notorious for it and that was one of the most annoying things with the Samsung I've been using.
The 51" version of that set doesn't use Pentile.
 
And yet, that's exactly what it feels to me. :P To be perfectly honest it has really come down to the VT(W)60 being 1600€ vs. the W828 being 1120€ (plus the chance to win a PS4 if I buy it in sometime next week). I could live with higher power consumption, heat and even some IR (unless my panel were to have a severe case of it, which I've seen reported quite often). I'd be watching the 55" from about 2 meters away, so dithering shouldn't be a problem (?). The buzzing ... yeah, that could drive me insane, if it was really bad. Especially at night, when I'd have to keep the volume at reasonable levels. I absolute love the design of VT60, but if I add everything up ... yeah.

So frustrating.
Yeah, I know the feeling, and it's always hard earned money.

My VT60 was the most expensive thing I ever purchased and anything that expensive can go wrong, I mean, imagine it's dead on arrival, hell, I wanted the thing, badly, but after purchasing, and we're talking 2800 euros (65 inch model), of course it kinda hurt seeing them going off my account even if I though and think it was worth every penny. Fact is I'm not rich and I'm actually unemployed, but I really thought the living room needed something more, hence I bought a living room TV and not a new TV for my gaming room, no, it's not just for me.

And I think no one here could go back, I'm very happy. But I didn't need it, no one needs a huge ass top range TV, one can make do with something smaller and worse. Effectively you pay to be picky (shortly afterwards I went to the cinema... And hated it, that's right the TV I have at home surpasses cinema experience and blacks.

It never bothered me before, fact is I didn't need this. But I wanted it.

The W828B is not a bad TV, but don't look at either W900A or plasmas then, it's as simple as that. One can be happy just knowing you paid less, which is actually the case, so it's a decision like any other.

This said, I love it to bits :) Dithering is not really visible up close and IR problems are usually the fault of users, you have a phenomena around here which is, you bought a class leading TV, it's an informed purchase, but you don't know the tech at all. Plasmas have a very obvious break in period, plasma is just too new and doesn't respond like it will later on, hence you have to be careful specially in the first 300 hours with what you feed it. Some people get some and pull a calibration off the internet just to see it in all it's glory, they also disable Pixel Orbiter before they even know what it is and bump brightness up till they're satisfied.

That's a recipe for disaster in a way it isn't for my panel that, at this point can withstand a lot. A new panel really can't or shouldn't. I really believe most issues are steaming from that, because I've seen plasmas at people's homes that didn't know they had plasmas (hence they didn't mess with settings at all, it was just there) and they were fine. All of them.

Of course you can be unlucky, but I think most are trying to make the panel showcase what it's got before it's ready.
 
Hi guys can anybody tell me which of these two tv's is better for gaming?

http://www.very.co.uk/sony-w8-50-inch-smart-passive-3d-full-hd-led-tv-with-soundbar-offer-black/1395979129.prd?
_requestid=519273


http://www.very.co.uk/sony-kdl50w656asu-50-inch-full-hd-freeview-hd-led-smart-tv/1268338533.prd

I heard the 50W656 have very low input lag but I can't find anything on the other one, and as you can see that one currently comes with a soundbar which is nice. I've been looking for a few weeks mainly at the w656 but this other one has just caught my eye. My main concern is the input lag for the second one but so far can't find any numbers.

Thanks.
 
Yeah, I know the feeling, and it's always hard earned money.

[... making sense ...]

The W828B is not a bad TV, but don't look at either W900A or plasmas then, it's as simple as that. One can be happy just knowing you paid less, which is actually the case, so it's a decision like any other.

You know, thinking about it, at the bottom line it's not even about the added cost for me. I keep thinking "eh, whatever, I'll likely be making the switch to OLED in a few years anyways, so why spend that much on a see-me-through TV right now" to justify going for the cheaper, but still pretty good W828. Whatever set I end up with will be a substantial upgrade over my 6 years old 720p Bravia, I'm sure. At the same time though ... I'm in that weird spot where I feel like I'm enough of a videophile that I definitely should be steering towards a clearly better TV ... but am I really that much of a videophile? I honestly don't know. At this point, I think the one thing that may sway me towards the VT60 is a demonstration. Seeing it in a properly set up environment, possibly next to a good LED. 'Cause, yeah, I've actually never seen one in person. Well, I've seen it briefly in stores, when it were still widely available, but I haven't experienced it. Unfortunately, none of my friends has one.

Having a VT60 is literally like having an orgasm every time you turn it on. Literally.

S...stop.
 
Having a VT60 is literally like having an orgasm every time you turn it on. Literally.

Heh, so jealous. I wish I could have held off and saved up for one, but I spent 11 months saving up for my 60" ST60 (and ended up paying only $1392 for it) and waiting any longer than that probably would have driven me insane. It's a fantastic TV too though.
 
I'm looking for a new 40 to 50" plasma/led and every model that has been suggested to me is out of production and hard to find ugh. Don't care if it has 3d or not. $1,500 or less would be a good price range. You guys have any suggestions!?
 
Hi guys can anybody tell me which of these two tv's is better for gaming?

http://www.very.co.uk/sony-w8-50-inch-smart-passive-3d-full-hd-led-tv-with-soundbar-offer-black/1395979129.prd?
_requestid=519273


http://www.very.co.uk/sony-kdl50w656asu-50-inch-full-hd-freeview-hd-led-smart-tv/1268338533.prd

I heard the 50W656 have very low input lag but I can't find anything on the other one, and as you can see that one currently comes with a soundbar which is nice. I've been looking for a few weeks mainly at the w656 but this other one has just caught my eye. My main concern is the input lag for the second one but so far can't find any numbers.

Thanks.

here is review of W829:
http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/kdl50w829b-201403023650.htm
 
Hi guys can anybody tell me which of these two tv's is better for gaming?

http://www.very.co.uk/sony-w8-50-inch-smart-passive-3d-full-hd-led-tv-with-soundbar-offer-black/1395979129.prd?
_requestid=519273


http://www.very.co.uk/sony-kdl50w656asu-50-inch-full-hd-freeview-hd-led-smart-tv/1268338533.prd

I heard the 50W656 have very low input lag but I can't find anything on the other one, and as you can see that one currently comes with a soundbar which is nice. I've been looking for a few weeks mainly at the w656 but this other one has just caught my eye. My main concern is the input lag for the second one but so far can't find any numbers.

Thanks.

That 656 is very expensive. My 50w685 cost me way less than that. It's also a 2013 set while that 829 is a 2014 set (doesn't mean it is better, just that there is a big price disparity and a 2013 6 series shouldn't be as expensive as a 2014 8 series)


Edit: also, if you buy that 50w829 from a Sony centre, it's the same price, still comes with a free soundbar, but you also get a 1-in-5 chance to win a PS4..

Edit 2: crampton and Moore have the 50w656 for £729 with a 5 year guarantee, and the w829 for £899 with 5 year guarantee, sound bar and the same PS4 lottery
 
Instead, on your remote press the big HOME button .. then at the top right of your screen go to :
SETTINGS>PREFERENCES>ECO>LIGHT SENSOR: OFF

Success!!! The TV now looks exceptional! Thank you so much for the heads up! Sony's multi-menu system is pretty obnoxious... It's pretty bad that you have to go through two different settings menus to get everything set properly.

I'm also amazed at how well this TV handles simulated 3D. I had no interest in the 3D feature when I purchased it but now that I've tested it with Star Trek Into Darkness and MGS Ground Zeros I've been completely won over. MGSGZ it's definitely a stand out in 3D.

One more question to throw by you guys... What's a good, low cost audio option for TVs these days? Ideally I'd like to stay around $100.00 but it seems like the sound bars are all starting around double that. My parents actually bought a cheap Logitech 2.1 PC system that they've hooked up to their 42" in their home. It sounds pretty awesome and I think that was only around $100.00. Anyone else do something like this?
 
Success!!! The TV now looks exceptional! Thank you so much for the heads up! Sony's multi-menu system is pretty obnoxious... It's pretty bad that you have to go through two different settings menus to get everything set properly.

Awesome! Glad that worked out for you.
It does make a pretty dramatic difference and would be something that I think pretty much every user would want to toggle off immediately right out of the box.
 
Playing Trine 2 in 3D on my 60 inch Phillips LED right now, looks amazing. That said I keep hearing OLED is supposed to be the future, though they've been saying that for 6 years now and I've yet to see affordable big screen models.
 
And I'm just sitting here with a 320 euro LG HDTV. the LG 32LS570S to be precise.

I used to love this screen to death, but recently I bought a macbook, iPad and Wii U. And ALL of those screens look different to the TV, but SIMILAR to each other. Seems as if stuff that is clearly red on the apple displays is orangy on the TV. It's really quite annoying, because colour seems washed out when comparing :(

Also: I hate my living room, I have to adjust brightness troughout the day to not get black crush or gray blacks.


It's 32 inches though, because europe I guess.
 
4K TVs vs OLED TV vs Plasma Shootout

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/result-201406013793.htm

(load the commets below the article for further interesting info)


"Out of more than 30 attendees, only 17 stayed until the end to participate in the voting (the organisers and ourselves were excluded from the process). In the “Best 4K Ultra HD TV” category, it was a landslide win for the Panasonic TX-65AX802B which secured a whooping 65% of the votes (11 out of 17) despite not supporting Netflix 4K. The “Best TV” category was much closer, but it’s the other Panasonic, the Viera ZT plasma, which took the prize home, edging out the LG curved OLED by 10 votes to 7.

None of the 4K LED LCDs received any vote for “Best TV”, suggesting that they still have some way to go before approaching the picture quality of the as-good-as-dead plasma and the not-yet-fully-fledged OLED TVs. That the Viera AX802/ AX800 managed to score a comfortable win over Samsung’s and Sony’s offerings just goes to demonstrate how good Panasonic is at making top-notch TVs: you can take TV (plasma) out of a company, but you can’t take the company out of TV."



So....

- Best tv was/is STILL Panasonic ZT60
- NOONE voted on a 4K TV:s as "best tv"



Attendant impressions below:

"1) 4K vs 1080p

We started with comparing Netflix 4K (House of cards) on the Samsungs and the Sony. Panasonic did not support Netflix 4K.

Pictures were quite sharp, but not eye popping as you would expect with 4K. On comparison with House of cards season 1 on blu-ray (the opening credits are the same in season 1 & 2) on the LG and Panasonic ZT, the pictures were very similar. I couldn’t appreciate the difference 4K brings. According to Vincent, this was mainly due to 4K compression that Netflix employs. We also compared a less compressed 4K clip on 4K TVs with the same clip in 1080p on 1080p TVs. 4K was a bit sharper, more noticeable when you walk closer. Where 4K really shone was with a demo clip of food. Absolutely stunning!! The images just popped out.

All 4K TVs upscaled 1080p content and SD content quite brilliantly, and the pictures were compared to those on 1080p TVs.

Overall, I do not think there’s much to differentiate between 4K and 1080p TVs. Lack of 4K content make 1080p TVs an attractive bargain at the moment. The advantages of 4K are definitely there, when there’s enough content and provided it’s not compressed too much.

2) Blacks

Plasma and OLED had a clear advantage over LED. All 4K TVs struggled with displaying true blacks. The black bars on top and bottom looked dark grey on LED. OLED was the best, with proper black. It made even the plasma look average! Amongst the LED TVs, Panasonic displayed the deepest black, followed by Samsungs. Sony disappointed the most. What Sony does though, is when there’s a pure black screen, it switches the LED off. So pitch black looks blacker on the Sony compared to others, as long as there’s no other picture to display.

They played a clip from TDKR, where Bane breaks Batman’s back. LG was the best, followed by Panasonic ZT, Panasonic 4K, Samsungs and Sony in that order. The Panasonic ZT, curiously, showed up dithering when looked closely. This wasn’t consistent.

They then played a clip from Kill Bill vol. 2 where Uma Thurman is buried. There were occasional flickers of light when she used to switch the torch on. LG was proper black, and it managed to show the detail when the light was switched on, but I thought it was too dark. Panasonic ZT displayed detail the best, followed by Panasonic 4K and Sony. Samsung’s algorithm got confused and was simply flicking the screen between black and grey, and was unable to show any picture at all. Vincent said this was amongst the most difficult pictures to show on TV in general and is quite rare.

Vincent did mention that Panasonic has always brightened the shadow detail by gamma tracking and deviated from reference compared to Kuro.

According to him, the Panasonics have not reached the black levels of the Kuro. In fact, the last batch of Pioneer KRP plasmas had a 10th generation Kuro panel which was blacker than even the 9th generation Kuro! My Kuro probably has the 10th generation panel, as I ordered the very last batch.

One thing to add: the differences between the TVs in blacks were very apparent in perfectly dark environment. When they switched the lights on (even when dim), the differences rapidly diminished and in bright light, it was very difficult to spot (except on OLED). Also, in presence of more colours on the screen (including black and white chequered pattern), the difference between blacks gets significantly smaller.

3) Whites

This is where LEDs had a clear advantage over plasma as well as OLED. Samsung flat was the whitest, followed by Samsung curved, Panasonic 4K, Sony, Panasonic plasma and LG in that order. Plasmas made after 2009 energy regulations had Automatic Brightness Limiter (ABL) built in, which cannot be switched off. That’s why Panasonic ZT suffered. LG was quite interesting. Theoretically, it should be able to display perfect whites as it’s the most energy efficient, but Vincent thinks LG has employed ABL to prevent the OLED from burning in.

They then played a clip showing snow. The results were similar to the white test pattern. LG showed a reddish tinge to snow, especially on bottom right. It was quite distracting.

If you view the TVs on their own without comparing, you won’t mind the whites of plasma. Also, in presence of more colours on the screen (including black and white chequered pattern), the difference between whites gets significantly smaller.

4) Colour

As a rule, if you have a perfectly black canvas, colours will show better. LG was the best here, but it struggled a bit with blues, with a purplish tinge. This is because LG employs a WRGB panel as opposed to true RGB panel of Samsung. Panasonic ZT was glorious in displaying colour, followed by the Samsungs, the Panasonic and the Sony in that order.

They played a clip from Life of Pi. Overall, the OLED and plasma was better than LED, but the difference wasn’t much. All the TVs were beautiful to look at.

5) Motion

They played a test pattern from AVS HD which was scrolling from right to left of the screen.

The 4 vertical lines in each group get closer as they go down. The longer they remain distinctly separate, better is the motion. Initially, all motion processing in the LED and OLED was switched off. Plasma did not need any motion processing.

Panasonic ZT showed all the 4 distinct lines all the way down to 1080. This was followed by the Samsungs, which went down till 600, then the Panasonic 4K at 500, the Sony at 350 and LG at 300. I was quite shocked with how poorly the LG performed.

With motion processing switched on to standard, the Samsungs went down all the way to 1080, Panasonic 4K to 1000, Sony to 900 and LG to around 700.

In motion interpolation detection pattern (where a black and white chequered box was moving around the screen on a blue and white (smaller) chequered background), the Samsung was the best, even better than the Panasonic ZT.

4K LED and OLED employ sample and hold motion processing, which the Panasonic employs impulse. Sample and hold is prone to flicker.

To compensate for this, Sony and Samsung employ black frame insertion. When activated, Samsung was better. Sony is meant to be superior here, but it dims the image which cannot be compensated enough. Black frame insertion introduces flicker which apparently has got better since last year.

They played a football clip. Panasonic was clearly the best with motion and panning shots. LG looked very attractive with beautiful images, which made motion problems more difficult to spot. LEDs suffered from some judder, but I thought they were eminently watchable.

6) Screen uniformity

They showed a grey screen. Panasonic ZT was perfectly uniform. Samsung flat was amazingly uniform too, followed by curved. Vincent says Samsung moved the power from the back of the panel away about 2 years ago, which has paid rich dividends. Samsung TVs from series 7 upwards have the most uniform panels amongst all LED TVs. Due to the curve, the corners did not look uniform in the Samsung 4K curved. Panasonic and Sony displayed quite significant clouding, with Sony being worse. LG was actually the worst, with bad DSE.

7) 3D

The manufacturers aren’t interested in 3D much. In fact, on 2014 models, there’s no dedicated 3D button on the remotes of Samsung, Sony and LG. We did not use 3D glasses, but saw some patterns (vertical and horizontal scanning). Samsung and Sony showed the pattern perfectly well, followed by Panasonic 4K. Interestingly, Panasonic ZT cannot do full HD 3D which was very apparent on the patterns. This is because they preferred gradation to resolution for better picture quality at the expense of resolution. Samsung plasma (F8500) preferred resolution to gradation.

They then showed a clip from Wall-E. Sony and Panasonic 4K displayed it the best. Samsungs showed judder playing 24p 3D clip, because they do it at 60p (which is what they use in South Korea). They aren’t interested in correcting this for other countries. You can eliminate judder by motion interpolation. This gives the picture a “soap opera” effect. The pictures looked very real with no judder. I actually preferred it, but I was in the minority in the group today. Vincent prefers judder to soap opera effect.

8 ) Gaming

Vincent measured input lags on some TVs in front of us. Sony has the best input lag amongst LEDs (around 30-35ms in game mode), followed by the Panasonic 4K and then the Samsung. LG was average. Panasonic plasma, on paper showed an input lag of 44.5ms but that was because of impulse processing, and the device is designed to read from sample and hold processing. Vincent thinks the real input lag is likely to be closer to 20-24ms. Also, there’s no dedicated game mode on Panasonic, so you can fiddle with other processing to get far better pictures than the LEDs.

9) Viewing angles

All LEDs suffered from drop in picture quality when you beyond 60-70 degrees on either side, while plasma and OLED were perfect even in extreme angles.

So, in conclusion (my opinion):

1) Panasonic ZT plasma is the best buy overall.

2) LG OLED showed the best pictures by a significant margin, but the technology isn’t mature yet.

3) Amongst 4K TVs, I thought Samsung flat was the best, due to screen uniformity, accurate rendition of whites and better motion control. It was better than the curved due to screen uniformity. Also, the reflection on the curved Samsung is far more distracting that the flat TVs.

4) Panasonic 4K had the deepest blacks amongst the 4K TVs, but I didn’t like the clouding. However, Panasonic 4K won when we voted our choices.

5) Sony was surprisingly poor overall. It had the best sounding speakers though.

6) No TV is perfect. Choose according to which features are important to you."
 
KDL65W950B
vs
KDL60W850B

Both have very low input lag.
I assume both are good for gaming.
Does the 950b have better picture quality also?
 
Guys, I am looking for a 32" tv for my bedroom. I have a Samsung at the moment but it suffers from terrible motion blur! And sets out there that have zero to minimal motion blur?

Thanks

P.s my budget is £350 !
 
So trying to decide between 4k and non for my next tv. my current choices are either last years:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-65-class-64-1-2-diag--led-4k-ultra-hd-tv-2160p-120hz-smart-3d-hdtv/1912267.p?id=1219066831831&skuId=1912267

or this years:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-65-class-64-1-2-diag--led-1080p-120hz-smart-3d-hdtv/5009363.p?id=1219106280447&skuId=5009363&st=sony%2065w950b&cp=1&lp=1

the obvious reasoning of "4k is higher so should be better" rings true, but I'm wondering if it would make a huge difference given like 90% of the things I would be able to watch isn't 4k but would be up scaled. then you also have a "last years tech vs this years tech" question like the difference in panels.

any opinions would be welcomed! I game 40% of the time and watch blurays / netflix 60% of the time.
 
So trying to decide between 4k and non for my next tv. my current choices are either last years:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-65-class-64-1-2-diag--led-4k-ultra-hd-tv-2160p-120hz-smart-3d-hdtv/1912267.p?id=1219066831831&skuId=1912267

or this years:

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/sony-65-class-64-1-2-diag--led-1080p-120hz-smart-3d-hdtv/5009363.p?id=1219106280447&skuId=5009363&st=sony%2065w950b&cp=1&lp=1

the obvious reasoning of "4k is higher so should be better" rings true, but I'm wondering if it would make a huge difference given like 90% of the things I would be able to watch isn't 4k but would be up scaled. then you also have a "last years tech vs this years tech" question like the difference in panels.

any opinions would be welcomed! I game 40% of the time and watch blurays / netflix 60% of the time.

I'm debating between those 2 sets as well. Actually I have the KDL-W850B in there also, but I have a question. The W950B has better Picture Quality over the W850b right?
Also input lag just released saying the W950B also has better input lag. At 17ms.
http://www.displaylag.com/oled-4k-2014-input-lag-results/
 
I'm debating between those 2 sets as well. Actually I have the KDL-W850B in there also, but I have a question. The W950B has better Picture Quality over the W850b right?
Also input lag just released saying the W950B also has better input lag. At 17ms.
http://www.displaylag.com/oled-4k-2014-input-lag-results/

from what I've read around sony only put the truliminous (sp?) in the 950b for their 2014 models. so in terms of PQ it's the better or the two.
 
I'm in the same boat as DJ SLEV3N in terms of motion blur.

I am buying a set for my room and only can get a 32" don't want to go any lower. This Sony I've kinda narrowed it down to by researching on avforums and overlockers forum (lol) just need the GAF opinion on it!
 
Just placed an order for a Sony KDL50W800B. I am very picky about dirty screen effect and banding. I tried several Sony 805 models last year and each was a disaster. I've noticed a couple reviews that mention this years models are much better in this regard, so I decided to give it a shot.

Really hope this one works out because I'm tired of gaming my small 42 inch set.
 
Yes, BB has the H6350 for 799$ and the W600 for 650$.

The main thing right now is motion blur, I heard the H6350 based on the RTINGS review has less motion blur.

I'm actually in the midst of researching the W600B myself. I'm looking at the 47.6" version in particular. I have heard that the input lag is minimal but not much about motion blur. I usually like to strip my picture of any post processing when I can.

I'm wondering if anyone knows the lowest price they've seen the W600B go for? $650 seems to be the base price, has the set ever been on sale? I'm in the favorable position of being able to wait before jumping and was wondering if I might be able to save $50, even $100, on this.
 
I'm debating between those 2 sets as well. Actually I have the KDL-W850B in there also, but I have a question. The W950B has better Picture Quality over the W850b right?
Also input lag just released saying the W950B also has better input lag. At 17ms.
http://www.displaylag.com/oled-4k-2014-input-lag-results/

from what I've read around sony only put the truliminous (sp?) in the 950b for their 2014 models. so in terms of PQ it's the better or the two.

While it's true that the flagship W950 has a Triluminos display and might have slightly better color reproduction because of it, it's actually this year's Sony's W8 series (which the W850 model is a part of) that has an overall better panel / PQ. W8's black levels are much better, for example. For some reason Sony went with an IPS panel for the W9 series and it didn't pay of. Pretty much every review I've read confirms it.
 
While it's true that the flagship W950 has a Triluminos display and might have slightly better color reproduction because of it, it's actually this year's Sony's W8 series (which the W850 model is a part of) that has an overall better panel / PQ. W8's black levels are much better, for example. For some reason Sony went with an IPS panel for the W9 series and it didn't pay of. Pretty much every review I've read confirms it.

oh that's too bad and a bad decision by sony. would you happen to have any insight on the 2013 sony 4k's? (specifically the 65x850a) .. I assume that has the better panels and besides it being 4k has the better power behind it? (I.E. motion flow 960 vs 480)
 
While it's true that the flagship W950 has a Triluminos display and might have slightly better color reproduction because of it, it's actually this year's Sony's W8 series (which the W850 model is a part of) that has an overall better panel / PQ. W8's black levels are much better, for example. For some reason Sony went with an IPS panel for the W9 series and it didn't pay of. Pretty much every review I've read confirms it.

So are you saying its better off getting the W850b and not the W950b.
The W850b does come in a 70 inch. That would be great for me. Since the 950b only comes up to 65.
 
There are decent 1080p TVs for 300 bucks. You just have to do a bit of hunting.

Funny you say that, because as I was about to buy the previous TV at Best Buy, I noticed they had an 'open-box' 1080p Sony TV for $330. I ended up buying that one of course, and later realized it normally goes for $700.
 
Anyone have any experience in how the upconvert looks on a 4k playing console games? I keep on reading about how laggy it gets cause of the upconvert or it doesn't look any better and if anything worse. then I read user reviews that say gaming looks beautiful. I'm so torn. I understand 4k isn't worth it but it just seems spec-wise the 65x850a is just a plain better tv than the new 65w950b.
 
4K TVs vs OLED TV vs Plasma Shootout

http://www.hdtvtest.co.uk/news/result-201406013793.htm

(
8 ) Gaming

Vincent measured input lags on some TVs in front of us. Sony has the best input lag amongst LEDs (around 30-35ms in game mode), followed by the Panasonic 4K and then the Samsung. LG was average. Panasonic plasma, on paper showed an input lag of 44.5ms but that was because of impulse processing, and the device is designed to read from sample and hold processing. Vincent thinks the real input lag is likely to be closer to 20-24ms. Also, there’s no dedicated game mode on Panasonic, so you can fiddle with other processing to get far better pictures than the LEDs.

."[/I]

None of those sets is great for gaming, Input lag is important for all fast paced games - COD / fighting games / Ninja Gaiden etc etc

The Panasonic is good, and probably best set for TV, but for gaming its just average to good.

Input lag (high-speed camera) 23ms compared to lag-free CRT
Leo Bodnar lag tester 41.5 ms

Good sony sets have 6-8 ms lag to CRT, gaming monitors 2 ms

Film buff = get a plasma, gaming TV = sony..
 
So are you saying its better off getting the W850b and not the W950b.
The W850b does come in a 70 inch. That would be great for me. Since the 950b only comes up to 65.

oh that's too bad and a bad decision by sony. would you happen to have any insight on the 2013 sony 4k's? (specifically the 65x850a) .. I assume that has the better panels and besides it being 4k has the better power behind it? (I.E. motion flow 960 vs 480)

Hm, I thought you guys were talking about the W855 model, which is a full HD TV, not 4K. I don't know if the same logic (W8 > W9) applies here and what panels are used in Sony's 4K sets. You best check / ask the folks over at AVForum.
 
Hm, I thought you guys were talking about the W855 model, which is a full HD TV, not 4K. I don't know if the same logic (W8 > W9) applies here and what panels are used in Sony's 4K sets. You best check / ask the folks over at AVForum.

ahhh. weird to say I'm not even thinking of the 4k as a 4k but simply a tv with better specs (i.e better panel, motion 960) then it simply having the capability to do 4k. I should also mention there's a local deal where the 4k would only really be $600ish more than the 65w950b. but I guess I'm still trying to figure out if, spec-wise, the x850a is better than the newer w950b.
 
None of those sets is great for gaming, Input lag is important for all fast paced games - COD / fighting games / Ninja Gaiden etc etc

The Panasonic is good, and probably best set for TV, but for gaming its just average to good.

Input lag (high-speed camera) 23ms compared to lag-free CRT
Leo Bodnar lag tester 41.5 ms

Good sony sets have 6-8 ms lag to CRT, gaming monitors 2 ms

Film buff = get a plasma, gaming TV = sony..

Personally I think the importance of input lag is grossly overvalued here. I have a 60" Panasonic ST60, which is rated at like 75 ms on the bodnar test and 45 camera. There's also reason to believe that the bodnar test isn't accurate on it (and hdtv.uk believes that it doesn't work right on Panasonic Plasmas) and the camera rating is probably closer.

Either way I personally cannot tell that there's any at all no matter what type of game I play. Killzone, Watch Dogs, Assassin's Creed, Transistor, Wolfenstein, Knack, Wind Waker, Mario Kart 8, Child of Light, Fez, Resogun, and everything else I own plays perfectly fine on it. None of my friends that I've had over to see the TV can tell the difference either.

I don't have any audio sync issues with it either and if it really was that high it'd be noticeable.

If you're crazy into fighting games and pro enough that frame counting matters, yeah, you want totally lag free stuff, but from Kart Racing to Action Games to Shooters I just haven't had a single problem or noticed any lag in doing anything at all.

I also have a relatively low input lag NEC 20WMGX2 and it doesn't feel any different from the ST60 at all. And if you're spending enough to get the VT, which is tested at much lower than the ST, then I bet you really won't ever notice anything on it.

So yeah, personal opinion and experience from owning a supposedly "bad for gaming" TV for 14 months with 7,879 hours on it and a crapload of gaming - input lag rating, grossly overvalued unless you're an actual pro tournament gamer type person.
 
Personally I think the importance of input lag is grossly overvalued here. I have a 60" Panasonic ST60, which is rated at like 75 ms on the bodnar test and 45 camera. There's also reason to believe that the bodnar test isn't accurate on it (and hdtv.uk believes that it doesn't work right on Panasonic Plasmas) and the camera rating is probably closer.

Either way I personally cannot tell that there's any at all no matter what type of game I play. Killzone, Watch Dogs, Assassin's Creed, Transistor, Wolfenstein, Knack, Wind Waker, Mario Kart 8, Child of Light, Fez, Resogun, and everything else I own plays perfectly fine on it. None of my friends that I've had over to see the TV can tell the difference either.

I don't have any audio sync issues with it either and if it really was that high it'd be noticeable.

If you're crazy into fighting games and pro enough that frame counting matters, yeah, you want totally lag free stuff, but from Kart Racing to Action Games to Shooters I just haven't had a single problem or noticed any lag in doing anything at all.

I also have a relatively low input lag NEC 20WMGX2 and it doesn't feel any different from the ST60 at all. And if you're spending enough to get the VT, which is tested at much lower than the ST, then I bet you really won't ever notice anything on it.

So yeah, personal opinion and experience from owning a supposedly "bad for gaming" TV for 14 months with 7,879 hours on it and a crapload of gaming - input lag rating, grossly overvalued unless you're an actual pro tournament gamer type person.

You can definitely play any game on a TV with a 45-75ms input lag. The thing is you don't know exactly how that game is supposed to feel in your hands on a zero lag TV. We're talking about the link between you and the game. The importance of that cannot be understated. The responsiveness of any video game has a huge impact on how good the controls feel, and how well it plays.

So in other words, if your only experience with the game is on that 75ms tv, you're not gonna know how it's really supposed to feel. Unless the input lag is horrible, ie (100ms) or more, it's not gonna smack you over the head. But without you even knowing it, there are likely parts of certain games where you don't realize the TV is making it harder on you, and that part that was so hard to clear in that one game wouldn't have actually been as hard to complete on a TV with 20ms of input lag.

Also, it takes very serious input lag to noticeably throw off the audio sync. We're talking like 150ms or more.
 
You can definitely play any game on a TV with a 45-75ms input lag. The thing is you don't know exactly how that game is supposed to feel in your hands on a zero lag TV. We're talking about the link between you and the game. The importance of that cannot be understated. The responsiveness of any video game has a huge impact on how good the controls feel, and how well it plays.

So in other words, if your only experience with the game is on that 75ms tv, you're not gonna know how it's really supposed to feel. Unless the input lag is horrible, ie (100ms) or more, it's not gonna smack you over the head. But without you even knowing it, there are likely parts of certain games where you don't realize the TV is making it harder on you, and that part that was so hard to clear in that one game wouldn't have actually been as hard to complete on a TV with 20ms of input lag.

Also, it takes very serious input lag to noticeably throw off the audio sync. We're talking like 150ms or more.

Yeah, if you're used to it, you're used to it. But like I said, I compared it to my NEC 20WMGX2, which is much lower, and could not tell the difference. I have both of them plugged into the same PC 24/7. I've tested games back and forth on both when I first got the TV over a year ago and it didn't matter. Likewise, various friends with other monitors and TVs did not notice anything when playing on it either regardless of what they have, even with games they're really familiar with. Maybe they all had displays in the same range.

I think it's mostly a thing of how modern video games are built though. Sure, you could probably notice it easily on Quake or CS, but pick any random game of recent years and it probably won't matter. It's just very, very overvalued unless you're into a very small and specific subset of games, imo.

The quality of the Panasonic Plasma lines is crazy good and people shouldn't shy away from them just because of a little number that will probably not actually mean anything to them.
 
It's just very, very overvalued unless you're into a very small and specific subset of games, imo.
I think interactivity and responsiveness encompass the entire point of video games as a medium.

I have never and hopefully will never spend money on a display that lags by more than one frame.
 
took the leap and ordered the XBR65X850A. seems like an amazing tv and it's going for a good price since the 2014 models are out. it has the IPS panels instead of the changed new ones and just plains look sexier! the only issue now is the input lag. but I won't know how that feels until I can play games on it with my own two hands. I've read too many personal experiences going both ways: "gaming feels good!" "input lag is too bad!!" .. either way I'll have 45 days to try it out. and worse case scenario I'll exchange it and try out the 2014 Bravia 65W950A. that at least I know has amazing input lag (17ms if I remember right).

sooooo excited for next week!!! XD
 
Top Bottom