They did the smart thing and hired dudes that would establish good core mechanics. They should have tried a bit harder at the presentation though. They have no excuse if a sequel is ever made.
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PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale |OT| Use Supers to Smash your Bros!
- Thread starter TheMink
- Start date
They did the smart thing and hired dudes that would establish good core mechanics. They should have tried a bit harder at the presentation though. They have no excuse if a sequel is ever made.
LightofRohan
Member
This game is in a perfect position for an awesome sequel. Hopefully they can justify making one...
They got the core mechanics/fighting down (w/ some tweaks). They just need to go balls out w/ modes, extras, presentation, stories ect.
But it's also much harder for them then say Nintendo. Because they have a LOT of dialogue in these games and every character has some type of speech, it'll probably be really expensive to get all that voice work together and writing all that shit. Plus I don't think they'll ever be able to do fully animated stories, that'd just be way too much work.
The art style is uniform. The characters are all done in the same style, while staying true to their source material. The thing is, we have a very, very diverse set of body types that give the impression that it's not a cohesive look, but it really is.
For example, when you load up any character on, Paris, San Francisco, Time Station, Columbia, and Invasion, they mesh really well together. The lighting, the slight stylized look to all of the characters (especially the ones that come from realistic looking games like Uncharted, MGS, and Killzone).
I also think people forget that games like God of War started off with a very stylized look, with Kratos really not going overly realistic until God of War 3. GoW1 and 2 had a very stylized look:
God of War 1:
God of War 2:
Then, God of War 3 amped up the style to more realistic:
This is the Kratos in PlayStation All Stars (screen captured from my Vita)
He's somewhere in between the GoW2 and GoW3 Kratos. The other realistic characters have undergone a similar bit of stylization. Nathan Drake is significantly stylized compared to his UC incarnations.
I think the characters work well, and part of the fun is the absurdness of having Drake next to Sly Cooper. I love Smash, but Nintendo characters, visually, are almost interchangable when it comes to their games. Mario wouldn't look out of place in Donkey Kong or Kirby. Zelda and Link wouldn't look out of place in the Mushroom Kingdom. Kirby fits right in with the Earthbound crowd. I love the characters, but I'm not going to pretend that Nintendo isn't dipping into a very similar well with their franchises visually. It makes a game like Smash look more cohesive, which is a plus. It's also not a criticism.
I think you could do the same with, say, all the various characters in Pixar's movies. You could probably mix and match them with no problems if there was a Smash style game with Pixar characters. (I'd totally be down for that, actually...)
For example, when you load up any character on, Paris, San Francisco, Time Station, Columbia, and Invasion, they mesh really well together. The lighting, the slight stylized look to all of the characters (especially the ones that come from realistic looking games like Uncharted, MGS, and Killzone).
I also think people forget that games like God of War started off with a very stylized look, with Kratos really not going overly realistic until God of War 3. GoW1 and 2 had a very stylized look:
God of War 1:
God of War 2:
Then, God of War 3 amped up the style to more realistic:
This is the Kratos in PlayStation All Stars (screen captured from my Vita)
He's somewhere in between the GoW2 and GoW3 Kratos. The other realistic characters have undergone a similar bit of stylization. Nathan Drake is significantly stylized compared to his UC incarnations.
I think the characters work well, and part of the fun is the absurdness of having Drake next to Sly Cooper. I love Smash, but Nintendo characters, visually, are almost interchangable when it comes to their games. Mario wouldn't look out of place in Donkey Kong or Kirby. Zelda and Link wouldn't look out of place in the Mushroom Kingdom. Kirby fits right in with the Earthbound crowd. I love the characters, but I'm not going to pretend that Nintendo isn't dipping into a very similar well with their franchises visually. It makes a game like Smash look more cohesive, which is a plus. It's also not a criticism.
I think you could do the same with, say, all the various characters in Pixar's movies. You could probably mix and match them with no problems if there was a Smash style game with Pixar characters. (I'd totally be down for that, actually...)
LightofRohan
Member
Goddam, I always forget how amazing Kratos looks in GoW3.
I know some SSM artists and they are the most talented mofo's I've met (that and Naughty Dog).
Also, I don't understand the complaint that the characters aren't unified and stylized to match each other. It's a goddam clash of all these different worlds coming together to fight, of course it's suppose to look like a mess... isn't that the point? But as Figboy stated, they did a great job of slightly stylizing each character to mesh a little better w/out losing their charm. It helps that all the characters use a similar shader setup, which makes them react to lighting similarly.
Eh, it's not that big of a deal. I got used to it in Smash Bro's; Toon Link, Young Link, Old Link. Dr Mario, Mario, Luigi. Falco, Fox. ect. ect. What they should have done is just make Good Cole default as Kessler.
I know some SSM artists and they are the most talented mofo's I've met (that and Naughty Dog).
Also, I don't understand the complaint that the characters aren't unified and stylized to match each other. It's a goddam clash of all these different worlds coming together to fight, of course it's suppose to look like a mess... isn't that the point? But as Figboy stated, they did a great job of slightly stylizing each character to mesh a little better w/out losing their charm. It helps that all the characters use a similar shader setup, which makes them react to lighting similarly.
Eh, it's not that big of a deal. I got used to it in Smash Bro's; Toon Link, Young Link, Old Link. Dr Mario, Mario, Luigi. Falco, Fox. ect. ect. What they should have done is just make Good Cole default as Kessler.
Byakuya769
Member
Every time I boot this game up for a go, I see not one, but two Coles and get pissed. Why couldn't they have just done a Zelda/Sheik transformation, fuck.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Kratos wasn't stylized, PS2 just couldn't render him any more realistically than that. Look at the CGI in God of War 1 and 2 if you want to see how the developers up envisioned him then. It was realistic.
Anyway, they need to go unified art style. It would give the game much more identity
Just got in a 1v1... call me salty, but the super system does frustrate me. Got a kid who glitched in a 2v2 the other night to rematch, had to wait for partners so did a 1v1. I was handling the guy as parappa, but as evil cole he ultimately won because of hit confirming his level 1 super. I know you can confirm parappas, but it is significantly harder for it to land, and on some maps cannot be done. Ultimately in the 2v2 we absolutely destroyed these guys, given the fact that I didn't have to rely on a crappy level 1 super. I understand some characters are better for certain situations... it's just dissapointing that my main character, parappa, is definitely not a great choice for 1v1, at least IMO.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Hardcore fighting game
Refocus efforts towards 1v1 and 2v2 and flesh out the mechanics. Shrink the level size and bring the action a bit closer Dojo is about the right size for a stage
And reconsider supers. Have them take off health rather than insta killing
TimeEffect
Member
Well, I saw it today too, on the Score here in Canada
Wish they'd get the Robot Chicken bit on TV though. What use is that on Youtube, where most probably own the game, or know about it, anyway?
Chuck Norris
Banned
Do you use neural O to set up Parappas super? His is pretty much the strongest in the game for guaranteing a hit IMO
That's like trying to argue that Mario wasn't stylized because the NES couldn't render him more.
Technology informs character design in video games. Lara Croft got the iconic belt and gun holsters not because they thought they looked cool, but because they covered up some graphical corruption on her hip joints.
The PS2 couldn't render something like GoW3, that's true. That doesn't change that everything from the environments to the character models in God of War were very, very stylized. Especially when you take into account that there were more realistic games, with more realistic art styles on the PS2, Xbox, and PC.
The tech certainly played a roll in the level of detail on the screen, but Kratos was stylized. Yes, Kratos was more detailed in the cutscenes, but he was still fairly stylized even in the CG cutscenes. They were detailed cutscenes, but everything about the GoW world had a slightly "animated" look to it. I thought it looked great, and as amazing as GoW3 looked, I really would have liked it to have that more sleek, colorful look of GoW1 and 2.
PBR has a visual identity in my opinion.
Here's 4 of our more realistic characters:
I feel the art style is very uniform, despite how visually distinct the characters are. This particular stage, and the lighting really highlights that uniformity in my opinion.
Thats not technically a hit confirm, but for some reason people dont roll out of it
IHaveCandy
Banned
Heihachi's down O, forward square is a very easy guarantee for his level 1.
LightofRohan
Member
I believe they kept GoW1/2 stylized in order to reach a higher framerate to match up w/ the fluidity of Kratos' animation sets. They kept the prerendered elements somewhat stylized to match the rest of the game, but ultimately preferred the realistic style in GoW3 to enhance the gritty violence.
Well, yeah, obviously the tech of the PS2 informed the visual look of the PS2 titles. That doesn't change the fact that that look became the God of War look, which was drastically changed in the third, to make the game look more like the CGI of the first 2. Personally, I preferred the stylized look of GoW1 and 2, and it's really jarring to me to go from playing the GoW HD Collections (both collections), then popping in GoW3, and playing a game that is very stylistically different.
I love GoW3, but the uber-realism isn't one of the reasons why (although Poseidon's intro is still one of my favorite intros of a boss in gaming).
narcosis219
Member
I don't think this is a hit confirm. You can roll out before the super hits
That sounds good. The core mechanics are there and are solid they just need to flesh everything out and improve the presentation and fanservice.
Not even close... this isn't a hit confirm at all. Only way to hit confirm his level 1 is throwing the enemy off a wall and getting them on the bounce back. Sucks because it's hard to know the distance for sure, and a lot of maps it's not possible. not only that, but to get them into position for it is impossible.
edit- for the record there a ton of better hit confirms for level 1... evil cole who I was versing has a great hit confirm for his level 1.
Chuck Norris
Banned
No it not like that at all really. As I said the CGI showed how Kratos was supposed to look, had the PS2 been able to render it that is how he would look. You can pick up the likes of MGS2 and 3 and find a Solid Snake who looks significantly less realistic than in MGS4, but that does not mean they weren't aiming for realism. The only example I can think of where truly realistically rendered characters were achieved on PS2 was Silent Hill 3 and we all know that was some voodoo magic shit there. Otherwise, they had to cut corners in polygon counts and especially texturing because of PS2s power.
Gunstarheroes
Member
Had an amazing tournament tonight at my college, 2v2, 5:00 time matches. 32 people. Nice variety out there (the winning team was Heaichi and Kratos, 2nd was Sackboy and Sly, 3rd was Spike and Sly, 4th was Raiden and Ratchet). Really good matches, 2 people actually went to wal-mart and bought a copy, and the winner took home a PS3 and a copy of a game from each franchise in the game.
Chuck Norris
Banned
I guess I jut haven't experienced anyone good enough to dodge it. You can also do neutral O - down square - up square (tap) then launch it while they are mid air. Leaves a very tiny window to dodge in
Nice. Wish I was that guy. This game is making me want to go out and buy stuff inFamous 2 and the Uncharted game right now. Hell, even Heavenly Sword (despite not caring much for the demo). Definitely reminds me of my experience with Melee. I bought Metroid Prime Day 1 just because Samus was my main.
Napalm_Frank
Member
Same with invasion.
Chuck Norris
Banned
Supers are definitely not balanced for 1v1 because as we know, not all level ones are created equal. So some players will have to work for a level two for only one guaranteed kill each time
I really hope they use a health bar next time. I respect them trying something new, but they were trying to fix something that wasn't broken. The great fighting mechanics are undermined by super only kills
I really hope they use a health bar next time. I respect them trying something new, but they were trying to fix something that wasn't broken. The great fighting mechanics are undermined by super only kills
If you're playing 1 v 1 in a serious match, everyone is going to know it's comming, all you have to do is mash dodgge, it's very easy to get around it. I'll try out the other one.
Haha I always call it a yo yo too, but it's a mic. I think it's the skateboard makes me think yo yo for some reason.
It really is an awful system, really dissapointing :-/. They should've just gone with ring outs similar to smash. The supers could work similar to final smash or w/e.
Napalm_Frank
Member
How would killsteals work or just make a 1v1 game?
Chuck Norris
Banned
I'm slowly coming to the opinion that these devs need to work to their strengths. They are legitimate fighting enthusiasts and should build a game that reflects that
To me it feels like they built a game with depth, but then tacked on an overly simple system of supers on top that undermined the rest.
I would not be disappointed if they basically started ground up for the sequel. Avoid the Smash Bros stereotyping and build a unique fighter.
AnkiRendan
Member
How in the world do you tech it? I feel so bad for not being able to do anything about it.
Gow games always went for realistic graphics only to be limited by the hardware,i know it and stig confirmed that too.
TimeEffect
Member
I dont see why they cant add a health mode, tbh. Cant they just use the AP values to equate to damage?
I can finally play again, woo
LightofRohan
Member
So would a health mode keep supers? Instead of killing they'd just do a set amount of damage? I feel like it'd become the same exact thing, rushing for a super to do the killing blow.
PartTimeWarrior
Banned
Today I learned Sackboy's neutral Triangle is called Jam Session and I can't stop laughing at it
Out_Of_Ammo
Member
The leaderboards just reset at the end of the month.
Oh. What is the point of that...
Just got in some crazy matches with a cocky fella named newvoodoo. Kept teabaggin despite us winning. He set us the invite and won 3 straight 2v2s, one using sackboy who got 6 kills on 1 special, but w/e. After that we won 4 in a row only one of them was close. Sweet redemption.
PowderedToast
Junior Member
i don't mind the super system, but when i play with some friends over the holidays i'm thinking of setting AP generation to high and having it timed, so there's no stalemates and people have no struggle getting decent supers
the one thing i'd like to see patched in is skippable level 3 cutscenes. heihachi's in particular is really annoying when used more than once in a match
the one thing i'd like to see patched in is skippable level 3 cutscenes. heihachi's in particular is really annoying when used more than once in a match
electroshockwave
Member
I think they would have to get rid of level 3s and increase the amount of AP you need to gain to get supers too but I suppose it could work.
EDIT Why do I have to accept the EULA everytime I play online? I also thought I was having the same problem I was during the beta (where I was stuck at the searching for opponents/connecting screen) but I have gotten into a few matches. Although it can still take longer than I'd like or kick me back to the character select screen with an error code.