Hah I've never seen kuma commit suicide before. Speaking of supers and pitfalls, doesnt it seem a little to punishing for some level 2s to be stuffed by falling into a pit/water. I think kuma, fat princess, ratchet should get the level 3 treatment and warp with their supers still active.
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
PlayStation All-Stars Battle Royale |OT| Use Supers to Smash your Bros!
- Thread starter TheMink
- Start date
Lol.
By that logic no game is unbalanced.
"All players have to do is play the low tier characters the way high level players play them".
Sometimes it's easier to admit some characters are far more better than others. I like the game. But really hope if they ever do a sequel they change up the mechanics.
By that logic no game is unbalanced.
"All players have to do is play the low tier characters the way high level players play them".
Sometimes it's easier to admit some characters are far more better than others. I like the game. But really hope if they ever do a sequel they change up the mechanics.
I think it's decently balanced considering how different each character is, but some definitely stand above the rest. Especially in FFA which heavily favors some characters. Which is why ranked 1v1 is needed.
But then there's the glitches which I hope they fix. The Heihachi one sounds infuriating.
But then there's the glitches which I hope they fix. The Heihachi one sounds infuriating.
The game is an incohesive mess.
It's like they didn't set a consistent boundary amongst their movesets. You can have diversity and a decent amount of parity.
You cannot sit here and tell me Drake isn't super for super worse than Nariko. With that he has a better moveset than most of the other characters.
He's just one example.
You think Drake has worse Supers than Nariko?
...Who here still actively plays the game I want to add you guys too my friends list.
I think Drake's 1 has more setups than Nariko's awful 1 right? And his 2 at least comes out fast. I like Nariko but her level 1 and 2 are pretty abysmal.
But a lot of the supers are borderline useless, like FP's 3 and the insta-kill 3s on anything but FFA.
In that case I agree. Some characters got the short end of the stick with supers, like Spike. Meanwhile Kratos and Raiden murder everyone with theirs.
I play, but a lot on vita
#1 defender
Member
I've been busy with Okami HD recently and i'm getting Ni No Kuni soon, but i still play PSASBR regularly and could need a 2v2 partner from time to time.
My PSN: everlong416
ScraftyDevil
Banned
I'll he playing more regularly after Kat and Emmet hit next week. My PSN ID is in my profile (warning: it's lame).
Also, since KevinCow unfortunately got banned, do you need a partner for the next tourney, SmithnCo?
Also, since KevinCow unfortunately got banned, do you need a partner for the next tourney, SmithnCo?
Probably, I can't really set it up without the forum and I don't know if he plays any more.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
I can fill that void if you wish to compete.
This. If I didn't think the combat in this game was so fun I would have dropped it by now due to the awful balancing.
Also I would play with gaffers more, but for some reason the netcode has been really bad on my end recently and I get dropped from a lot of matches. I've stopped playing for a while in hopes that there will be some sort of patch along with the Kat/Emmett DLC.
So say a hypothetical sequel gets made down the road what do you guys think they should do.
I'm not going to lie I like the metagame that evolved from the "Super System" but I'm not gonna act like this system isn't the main source of this games problems.
Should they work on the system they have with multiple supers for each character, an improved dodging system, maybe a burst system like persona or guilty gear. maybe a way to use some of your meter to drain your opponents.
or
Should they just go traditional system with healthbars and redesign all the characters from the ground up? and maybe keep level 3's as instant kills and then you can keep the metagame for the level 3's but the first 2 supers will just lower your healthbar.
Also I'm gonna add all of you.
I'm not going to lie I like the metagame that evolved from the "Super System" but I'm not gonna act like this system isn't the main source of this games problems.
Should they work on the system they have with multiple supers for each character, an improved dodging system, maybe a burst system like persona or guilty gear. maybe a way to use some of your meter to drain your opponents.
or
Should they just go traditional system with healthbars and redesign all the characters from the ground up? and maybe keep level 3's as instant kills and then you can keep the metagame for the level 3's but the first 2 supers will just lower your healthbar.
Also I'm gonna add all of you.
Sure, if someone needs a partner.
Well the sequel could have a defend system too, let's say someone atks you with a lv 2, you can protect yourself if you have a lv 2 bar with r2+L1, the other thing I want is L2+square lv1, rl2+triangle lv 2, r2+ circle lv3, and r2 alone simply uses the lv your bar is.
And the one I just want right now, everytime you die you lose some AP, you don't drop it like a grab, you just lose it.
And the one I just want right now, everytime you die you lose some AP, you don't drop it like a grab, you just lose it.
TimeEffect
Member
God I hate Drake's barrel lol
I think the point he was getting across is that not all characters are user friendly. Some have a high entry barrier but also a high ceiling. For example Dante doesnt jump off of the page as a beast character when you first play him. Hes decent, his guns are lacking but if you learn to empty cancel he is very rewarding. I think mink has a screenshot of a shut out featuring a boat load of kills.
Now I didnt say the game was PERFECT but its PRETTY GOOD. Yeah some supers need some obvious tweaks. Fat Ps level 3 is WAY too short, drakes and slys are a bit too long. I think tweaking the level 3s has the biggest effect on FFA.
Some level 2s need reworks. Sweet tooth and Nariko need new ones. Those are the main 2. Kuma shouldn't be such a dummy. Jaks should be a bit faster.
Level 1s are pretty balanced. A few characters need set ups/ true hit confirms (jak, spike, heihachi).
Sure there are a few characters with less tools than others but I feel that I can lose a 1v1 match to about 70% of the roster. If I lose a 1 v 1 regardless of the character my opponent chose its because they were better than me. 1v1 loss to a kratos? They were better. 1v1 loss to a raiden? They were better. 1v1 loss to drake? He was better. Its not the character its the player.
Now i am not sure what you meant by Drake being worse than Nariko. Did you mean it is the other way around? Drake has a strong level one that has multiple hit confirms as well as range and the ability to be used off of platforms. Its one of the most versatile level 1s in the game. His level 2 is a guaranteed kill or multikill if you pressure an opponent(s) towards a wall. His level 3 is one of the best in the game. Nariko's level one is bad. It has 1 or two unreliable hitconfirms. Her level 2 is awful. Really awful. Shes more likely to get killed by a super than to get multiple kills with her super. However, her level 3 is one of the best in the game. It is comparable to Drake's level 3. Nariko has an amazing moveset and the rare ability to throw opponents from the air into a crumple to set up a team mate for a level 1. Watch the socal regionals to see a Nariko throw her opponents to kratos who is ready with a level 1.
Now I am not saying that nariko is a bad character. There is a reason BOTH teams in the socal regionals had a nariko on their teams. She is one dimensional. She is the most "all or nothing" character on the roster. Worse than Jak or sackboy. Shes good, but one dimensional.
Its also helpful in these discussions Spin if you would point out what characters you use and what characters you have trouble with. I used to get stomped by drakes and Sly's but I slowly developed different play styles to deal with them and they are more manageable now.
Sorry for the wall of text. To be a little more to the point I would say that Over half of the cast is more than capable of winning FFA and Any combination of characters is capable of winning 2v2(Thats right ANY) and A seperate 60% of the cast is capable of 1v1
I like the super system. I think it could get deeper. I personally hate that level 3s essentially stop the game. I'd like to be able to kill a persons team mate during his level 3. I also hate using a level 2 but having it wasted and interrupted by someone activating a level 3. I think level 3s could be a bit more seamless.
My PSN is Choo411. I play as E. cole. If anyone wants to add me DO IT!
Yeah. I losing AP from deaths would be interesting. I also like the idea of losing AP from every hit you take. Think 5-10%. Say someone lands a burst combo on you then you lose somewhere between 20-35 AP. Nothing too huge or game changing but enough to have an effect. Actually I just realized this is a lot like fighting sly. I have to be extra defensive when I am at the cusp of a level 1 since I could lose it if he catches me with a counter.
WAHAHAHAHAHHAA- no the Level 1's are not balanced at all. Good luck winning against Raiden, Kratos, Evil Cole, or Fat Princess as someone like Sir Dan, PaRappa, Big Daddy, or Sackboy using Level 1's exclusively.
Also, 1v1 is horrible and I'm glad they're not putting it in because even though people think they want it, they really don't. Characters in the "Forbidden 5" as I like to call them (Raiden, Kratos, Sly, Drake, Evil Cole) would all dominate for these reasons:
-Kratos: His range is so ridiculous, you'll barely have a chance to get near him before he's gotten a 10-hit combo on you. His Level 1 isn't too hard to dodge but it's easy for him to get kills with Level 2 and 3 if he knows what he's doing, and he WILL get those supers FAST.
-Raiden: hit confirms, hit confirms everywhere
-Sly: Sly will have his way with you thanks to his teleport and screen-spanning counter, to say nothing of his spammable electric slide and projectile-reflecting barrel. Also,
good luck avoiding Murray.
-Drake: His barrels and rifle are extremely annoying to get past, and his supers are all extremely good.
-Evil Cole: Giga Punch is ridiculously easy to charge up, totally safe, hard to avoid (mainly due to lag), and will get tons of easy Level 1's on the opponent.
Troubled Bat
Member
I wish I could the join the fight with you guys. I am currently without internet, its saddening. D:
#1 defender
Member
SSReborn and Smithnco (didn't recognize the other guys, are they GAFers too? At least Alpha-Male sounds familiar), those were some good, fun games! It was nice getting to use characters other than Drake for a change. In ranked matches i use him exclusively, since i'm the most familiar with him, but the fun atmosphere of our matches encouraged me to select characters i'm still learning to play with.
SSR, that one time you stopped my skateboard super with Kratos' level 2 cracked me up, i was all "Oh, now i'm gonna get him!", and sailed right into it. XD
SSR, that one time you stopped my skateboard super with Kratos' level 2 cracked me up, i was all "Oh, now i'm gonna get him!", and sailed right into it. XD
E. coles nT obliterates the barrels so thats an easy matchup for me. Sorry I meant to add parappa to the list of characters that needed a true hit confirm. But parappa is still decent at 1v1 because his skateboard is so strong. You seem to exclude ratchet and good cole and toro from your list. I know players who are very strong with each of these characters. They are more than formiddable in 1v1(Yes using only level ones). Also sackboy has an easy confirm off of sT. Similarly I play against a sackboy who holds his own at 1v1. My partner in a 2v2 tournament uses sir dan and beats my evil cole a good percentage of the time. He is good at landing the arrow, and if the arrow doesnt land he can read techs well and land his super raw.
Kratos, Parappa, Fat Princess, Sly, good cole, E. Cole, Ratchet, Toro, Dante, Raiden, Sackboy, and Sir dan are all good at 1v1.
Jak, spike and Nariko are all 1 hitconfirm away from being solid 1 v 1 characters. The game isnt perfect and yes some characters are better at 1v1 but others are good at FFA. "Forbidden 5" is a joke. Toro and ratchet are absolute beasts and better than drake at 1v1.
Details on all of next week's DLC has seemingly been put up early on the Asian PS Store:
Kat
Emmett Graves
Fearless
Minion Bundle
Complete Minion Bundle
Kat
Emmett Graves
Fearless
Minion Bundle
Complete Minion Bundle
Evil Cole having a move that can beat Drake's barrel does not make Drake balanced. Sackboy can also use his fan to send them back at Drake and Sir Dan can absorb the barrels. But against the majority of the cast, the barrels are an extreme nuisance that makes it very hard to get near Drake (not to mention they can set you up for a Level 1), hence why I say it is overpowered.
PaRappa is mediocre at best in 1v1. Although he is decent at building AP, he is almost always forced to go for his Level 2 due to his shoddy Level 1, which gives opponents that have good Level 1's an advantage.
I exclude Ratchet, Good Cole, and Toro from my top tier list for a reason.
-Ratchet has a good moveset and a great Level 1, but his Level 2/3 supers are very bad. If the opponent is good at dodging your grabs into Level 1, you won't have much else to rely on.
-Good Cole is essentially Evil Cole, but without the cheap Giga Punch.
-Toro is similar to Ratchet, a great moveset (dat divekick) and a great Level 1 but his Level 2 and 3 are lacking. His Level 1 is also pretty easy to see coming since it almost always follows a divekick.
Sackboy does have an easy confirm off of jetpack, but that jetpack move is also used to get Sackboy get a 145 AP combo so good players will know to stay away from it. Blocking or jumping neuters the jetpack's efficiency.
I main Sir Dan, and I know for a fact that his arrow cannot be used to setup Level 1's against good players. Literally all you have to do to dodge it is hold down after the square x2 > up square combo, and then roll away to avoid a possible kill from being too close to Dan's Level 1. It is a highly opportunistic super that requires great prediction skill and luck to win with.
i sincerely hope this is not overpriced
I'd really like to see the full-sized version of this icon: http://202.182.225.58/icon/101/101/resources/4eee78bda71509e55dd00149f62db8b8ec2c5212
Awesome. Any word on pricing for the minion packs?
I would like ranked 1v1 because you can focus on the characters even if they're strong, so there's no guys sneaking up behind you and breaking your combos or something like in FFA. If they're already dominating in FFA anyway (because of more opportunity to get people locked into their attacks/multikills) then they should just add 1v1 for the hell of it.
Plus, if you can successfully counter the stronger characters you'd have a better shot at winning because there are less variables in 1v1.
Characters without easy confirms would suffer though, like Spike and Nariko.
Plus, if you can successfully counter the stronger characters you'd have a better shot at winning because there are less variables in 1v1.
Characters without easy confirms would suffer though, like Spike and Nariko.
Haha yup those were some fun matches and yes everyone who was in them was from GAF; Alpha-Male is TimeEffect
The kill was actually pretty funny I knew I wouldn't have been able to dodge your level 2 so I had to counter it I was betting on you not expecting it.
Disagree here. Good Cole has tools that I believe are much more useful in a 1v1 situation then Evil Cole's. I'll elaborate on them later when I have a bit more time, but for now I'll just list them:
-The properties of his Grenades.
-His Redirect Rocket.
-His Frost Shield (especially against Drakes or Radecs).
-His Ice Missile.
-His Ice Barrier.
I also want to say that Evil Cole's Giga Punch can be countered by air camping, while Good Cole can combo into a level 1 from the air. Sure, Evil Cole has his up-throw into super, but it'll be easier to read when he's going for it during a 1v1 situation imo.
^^^To those who responded to my post^^^
Don't take this as me hating on the game lol.
I actually like it, and play it at least a few times a week. Even after buying quite a few games since.
I was just looking forward to getting really deep into the game. But with the issues it does have it's pretty discouraging. I will actually retract what I said earlier, at this point, I don't think there's much they can do for the games balance lol.
I'll just take the dlc characters that come, and enjoy the game for what it is. The combat is still fun and engaging. It's just a real mess sometimes. Free 4 All is still very terrible, and the majority of stage layouts is really bad. But whatever, for some reason I can't put it down. It does a lot of things that differentiates it from most fighters, some good things and some bad things. I really believe if we ever got a sequel it'd be better.
It would be kind of funny if Microsoft picked up Superbot to make a similar game, that ended up being better. Although, almost of the characters would be like Drake and Radec *burn*.
Don't take this as me hating on the game lol.
I actually like it, and play it at least a few times a week. Even after buying quite a few games since.
I was just looking forward to getting really deep into the game. But with the issues it does have it's pretty discouraging. I will actually retract what I said earlier, at this point, I don't think there's much they can do for the games balance lol.
I'll just take the dlc characters that come, and enjoy the game for what it is. The combat is still fun and engaging. It's just a real mess sometimes. Free 4 All is still very terrible, and the majority of stage layouts is really bad. But whatever, for some reason I can't put it down. It does a lot of things that differentiates it from most fighters, some good things and some bad things. I really believe if we ever got a sequel it'd be better.
It would be kind of funny if Microsoft picked up Superbot to make a similar game, that ended up being better. Although, almost of the characters would be like Drake and Radec *burn*.
I'm not knocking Microsoft, but I seriously can't name any characters that would work in a game like All-Stars beyond Master Chief, Marcus Fenix, Banjo & Kazooie, and Joanna Dark. Blinx? Conker? Kameo?
(I miss Rare.)
There would probably be far more 3rd party guest if anything. Lol.
E. Coles forward O and Down Triangle are nothing to sleep on though. They both have great tools for 1v1. E. Cole can actually set up his lvl 1 through a grab.
Xenien7
Add away. I mostly play Raddec (I just finished going through his 'combo' trail thinking I was missing something. They really had to stretch the word 'combo' with him. They almost shouldn't have bothered including it for him, sheesh).
I do too. I find Drake to be a very obnoxious character to play against.
Her level 1 has some interesting 'gotcha' ability because most people don't realize that the range of the barrel spawn isn't completely static, but overall it's still extremely situational and sub par.
I've beaten all those characters in a match with nothing levels 1. There's no substitute for skill when dealing with level 1s.
Exactly, to say nothing of the extra AP a character with easy combos gets when he catches more than one person in the string. 1v1 would in no way be broken, and would be more skill based than the current FFA ranked and what not.
JStein0222
Member
Just played 3 matches in a row with exclusively Raiden/Kratos enemy players. So tired of that
I would like to see the former personally. I would love a sequel to continue to embrace the spirit of the game. In terms of what I'd like to see to the mechanics:
- ensure every character has a reliable hit confirm or no characters should have hit confirms. it should be one or the other.
- i like the idea of a shield/burst mechanic that allows you to use your meter to soak a super, this could lead to same very high level play and mind games.
- along those lines, maybe successfully attacking depletes an opponent's shield/burst meter, guarding fills it, and grabs could still be a punish for guarding
- this may be complicated, but super loadouts could be interesting so u can customize your character for 1v1 vs FFA, etc
- i think there could be more interesting items. i mean seriously, where's my groovitron?
I don't want the sequel to resort to a simple HP mechanic, when the game is really fun. To me it would seem like a step back and not true to what makes this game interesting and unique.
Well look the bright side, on a week it is going to be only Kat/Emmetts.