• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

PoliGAF 2012 |OT3| If it's not a legitimate OT the mods have ways to shut it down

Status
Not open for further replies.
C

CharlieDigital

Banned
Amir0x said:
I think Kosmo is fun to have around. I wish there were more actual intellectual Republicans around here, but I'll take Kosmo if we have to.

So much back-patting in PoliGAF
Click to expand...

"Intellectual Republicans" are more or less the folks who are behind Obama; already here.

Liberal GAF are the ones hating on Obama for no public option, not taking a stronger stand on gay marriage earlier on, not making cap & trade a priority, not going for a bigger stimulus, not pouring even more money into NASA, etc.

A large part of Obama's stimulus was in the form of tax cuts. He escalated the war in Afghanistan. He renewed the Patriot Act. He has supported consistent use of drone strikes, even authorizing the killing of an American citizen. Oil production has increased under his watch. Obama is pretty far from the Left.
 
W

worldrunover

Member
Serious question:

Should Obama be responsible for everything embassies say? I know that he appoints ambassadors but I don't know how much authority he has over what they release. No opinion on it either way, just curious.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
Snake said:
"Game Change 2: Electoral Boogaloo" coming soon to a bookstore near you.
Click to expand...

You joke, but I'm pretty confident this will happen after this election. Maybe not with that subtitle. (But then again, maybe with that EXACT subtitle.)

worldrunover said:
Serious question:

Should Obama be responsible for everything embassies say? I know that he appoints ambassadors but I don't know how much authority he has over what they release. No opinion on it either way, just curious.
Click to expand...

In the larger sense, Obama's responsible for everything the State Department does, but when embassies do things without consulting with the State Department (as that statement was), then Obama can only be responsible in the most tenuous sense. I mean if they did something completely crazy you could question his judgement in appointing them, but I don't think that's the case here.
 
C

codhand

Member
"Apparently President Obama can’t see Egypt and Libya from his house," former Republican vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin wrote on Facebook. "It’s about time our president stood up for America and condemned these Islamic extremists. ... We already know that President Obama likes to 'speak softly' to our enemies. If he doesn’t have a 'big stick' to carry, maybe it’s time for him to grow one."
Click to expand...

Sorry if it's already posted. This is a real head shaker.
 
A

adamsappel

Member
Diablos said:
It's an attack on an embassy and a perception by some of Obama's opponents that he helped these people carry out their plans, and that's more than enough for the media and Romney to try and come up with a narrative that says he's a pussy when it comes to foreign policy. Will it work? I don't know yet, but if they can sway just enough people when this election already has enough bullshit for voters to sift through, it's an unwelcome distraction and disingenuous to political discourse.

You don't need to lecture me, I know this isn't exactly a hostage crisis; but I'm simply saying lots of Americans love their completely invalid historical context being injected into US politics, particularly Presidential politics.

"An attack on an embassy just like 1979/first casualties since 1979" is all some people need to hear before they start freaking out. Legitimately. Not over the politics of it like some of us tend to.

I know Romney fucked up but this is not something you want to see escalate. Hopefully the other embassies are being endowed with some serious fucking security measures.
Click to expand...

I assume you weren't around in 1979? When every newscast on the air talks about "Day 287 of the attack on the Libyan Embassy," then this might be comparable to the Iran hostage situation.
 
A

Allard

Member
Cyan said:
PD was right!



It's not the ongoing crisis aspect that people are talking about though, it's the mindbogglingly stupid, flailing response.
Click to expand...

Yep as one might say "A test of presidential qualifications", he isn't in the republican primary anymore, he is one stone throw away from being the president depending on election results. The stuff you say now until election under developing issues is a time for you to show 'how' you might run the White house. His response was petty, politically motivated without a shred of dignity and no one wants to see the president act like that during an international tragedy, he failed an important test just like McCain did but I would say this mess up is closer to the "Suspending my Campaign" as McCains Lehman flub was just out of touch, this was a political stunt that backfired horribly.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
worldrunover said:
Serious question:

Should Obama be responsible for everything embassies say? I know that he appoints ambassadors but I don't know how much authority he has over what they release. No opinion on it either way, just curious.
Click to expand...

In this particular case, WH disavowed the embassy's initial statement which was let out to calm the raging protesters and more importantly maintain self-preservation. But yes, embassies are the extensions of the State department, which is the executive branch of federal government.
 
D

Dr. Pangloss

Member
If anything the timing of this is really bad for Romney. With the election in two months, do you want the race focused on the economy or foreign policy? Also this allows the media to explore new territory. They have been writing and talking about the economic policies of both campaigns for months now. Starting this week and the next several weeks there will be a focus on the foreign policy aspects of the race, and winning on that playing field will be extremely hard for Romney. This is evident from just what happen today.

He should become less in attack mode if he wants to win. More ambiguous. Instead of diving head first into the mud of politics, he should just ask questions like, "Is Obama doing the right thing?" The media can role with that and give their usual pro and con analysis. But this hard right stance puts Romney more in the spot light than the President. Now he becomes part of the questions instead of the administration itself.
 
T

TacticalFox88

Banned
Dr. Pangloss said:
If anything the timing of this is really bad for Romney. With the election in two months, do you want the race focused on the economy or foreign policy? Also this allows the media to explore new territory. They have been writing and talking about the economic policies of both campaigns for months now. Starting this week and the next several weeks there will be a focus on the foreign policy aspects of the race, and winning on that playing field will be extremely hard for Romney. This is evident from just what happen today.

He should become less in attack mode if he wants to win. More ambiguous. Instead of diving head first into the mud of politics, he should just ask questions like, "Is Obama doing the right thing?" The media can role with that and give their usual pro and con analysis. But this hard right stance puts Romney more in the spot light than the President. Now he becomes part of the questions instead of the administration itself.
Click to expand...

Extremely hard? Virtually impossible. Obama getting OBL pretty much sealed any argument the GOP had against him in Foreign Policy.
 
S

speculawyer

Member
Dr. Pangloss said:
If anything the timing of this is really bad for Romney. With the election in two months, do you want the race focused on the economy or foreign policy?
Click to expand...
Yeah . . . it was kind of dumb to even try to make foreign policy an issue to discuss, he should have issued condolences and moved on to talk about the economy somehow. Romney is going to lose in the foreign policy territory no matter what. But then to fuck it up made it hilarious.

The only way Romney could have won was to make this a referendum on Obama & unemployment. Yet this campaign has been about birth control, abortion, Mitt's taxes, rape, and now some news cycles on foreign policy. Good luck with that.
 
R

RustyNails

Member
From the US embassy attack thread

z209Wl.jpg


aS7gr.jpg


pscez.jpg




Credit:kurtofan
 
A

AlteredBeast

Fork 'em, Sparky!
speculawyer said:
Yeah . . . it was kind of dumb to even try to make foreign policy an issue to discuss, he should have issued condolences and moved on to talk about the economy somehow. Romney is going to lose in the foreign policy territory no matter what. But then to fuck it up made it hilarious.

The only way Romney could have won was to make this a referendum on Obama & unemployment. Yet this campaign has been about birth control, abortion, Mitt's taxes, rape, and now some news cycles on foreign policy. Good luck with that.
Click to expand...

Exactly.

I wish I were running that campaign, I really do. Obama should not be winning with 8%+ unemployment and terrible deficits (hot button topics)

Instant win. Instead, Romney and his staff were convinced that the Tea Party spoke for the party and the country.
 
H

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
From what I'm hearing, Stevens is even considered a hero among many Libyans for his work in helping Free Libya win against Gaddafi.
 
M

markatisu

Member
Hitokage said:
From what I'm hearing, Stevens is even considered a hero among many Libyans for his work in helping Free Libya win against Gaddafi.
Click to expand...

I heard before I left for work they carried his body to the hospital hoping to revive him, the people really are saddened by his loss.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Hitokage said:
From what I'm hearing, Stevens is even considered a hero among many Libyans for his work in helping Free Libya win against Gaddafi.
Click to expand...

They friggen loved the guy, look at all the apology marches going on. You don't do that for some guy you're indifferent about.
 
B

Byakuya769

Member
NullPointer said:
I'm honestly sick of hearing Romney talk and talk and talk about leadership, while not acting like a leader. He's had opportunities aplenty to show us what his brand of leadership would look like, but he doesn't utilize them, preferring to remain silent, take potshots, lie, or fumble on the world stage. Are we supposed to believe he'll transform after the election?
Click to expand...

Yes. His tax plan will be revealed, it will end the deficit as we know it. His plan for the economy will be made clear, it will set the stage for a 500 year expansion! And his leadership will take form, his beguiling smirk will bring peace to the entire world!!

You're biased if you think different.
 
A

Allard

Member
Hitokage said:
From what I'm hearing, Stevens is even considered a hero among many Libyans for his work in helping Free Libya win against Gaddafi.
Click to expand...

Yeah which is another reason we needed a level headed response from our side. Give the people of Libya a chance to show these actions do not represent them. After the political dust settled from Romney's spat I actually got a chance to really look at the meat of the incident and it seemed pretty clear most of the people near by, even the protestors, were horrified at what ended up transpiring and were desperately trying to change the situation almost immediately after the transgression happened. Instead of it being a test for America its a larger test of Libya, freak terrorist activities can and will happen, you can attempt to mitigate the possibility with higher security but the greatest weapon you can use against terrorists is the general good will of the people around the incident, don't spit in their face before they have a chance to prove themselves with talk of war or violent rhetoric against the assailant like I started seeing popping up almost immediately after word got out.
 
K

Kosmo

Banned
PhoenixDark said:
Great comment. No mud slinging, and while it's certainly condescending I think that's the point here - a president should know better than what Romney did today, and the fact that he didn't know better should tell everyone he's not ready to be president.
Click to expand...

Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
 
M

markatisu

Member
Kosmo said:
Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
Click to expand...

Well he certainly offered a staggering amount of contrast....and in the process showed why he would be horrible as President
 
M

Mercury Fred

Banned
Kosmo said:
Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
Click to expand...

lol
 
S

Shadow Hog

Member
So a conservative-leaning coworker in cubicle immediately next to me is ranting to somebody on the phone about the whole Libya thing. Nothing especially condemning of either side, politically, but things like "security separated out them and then basically gave them up to the mob" (I'm assuming "them" means the victims), and then directly comparing the situation of how we helped the Ayatollah into power in Iran to the situations in Libya/Egypt - stuff like "if you're going to oust somebody, make sure whoever goes into power isn't, y'know, worse".

I'm not entirely sure how legit these are - the security giving up the victims to the crowd sounds seriously far-fetched.

(Would this be better in the other topic specifically for this subject...?)
 
P

-PXG-

Member
I can't wait for Obama to etherize Romney' punk ass into oblivion. The debates will be extraordinarily delicious, especially the last one. I hope I never hear the name "Mitt Romney" ever again, after the election.
 
M

markatisu

Member
Shadow Hog said:
So a conservative-leaning coworker in cubicle immediately next to me is ranting to somebody on the phone about the whole Libya thing. Nothing especially condemning of either side, politically, but things like "security separated out them and then basically gave them up to the mob" (I'm assuming "them" means the victims), and then directly comparing the situation of how we helped the Ayatollah into power in Iran to the situations in Libya/Egypt - stuff like "if you're going to oust somebody, make sure whoever goes into power isn't, y'know, worse".

I'm not entirely sure how legit these are - the security giving up the victims to the crowd sounds seriously far-fetched.

(Would this be better in the other topic specifically for this subject...?)
Click to expand...

Well the Ambassador died of smoke inhalation, so he was not giving up to anyone
 
N

NihonTiger90

Member
Shadow Hog said:
So a conservative-leaning coworker in cubicle immediately next to me is ranting to somebody on the phone about the whole Libya thing. Nothing especially condemning of either side, politically, but things like "security separated out them and then basically gave them up to the mob" (I'm assuming "them" means the victims), and then directly comparing the situation of how we helped the Ayatollah into power in Iran to the situations in Libya/Egypt - stuff like "if you're going to oust somebody, make sure whoever goes into power isn't, y'know, worse".

I'm not entirely sure how legit these are - the security giving up the victims to the crowd sounds seriously far-fetched.

(Would this be better in the other topic specifically for this subject...?)
Click to expand...

Probably. And to answer your question, there seems to be some rumblings that some security forces pointed out where they were.
 
K

kehs

Banned
Kosmo said:
Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
Click to expand...

Funny, cause when he was asked a hypothetical question abut having the facts and how he would react and he said "I'm not gonna answer hypotheticals".
 
N

NullPointer

Member
Kosmo said:
Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
Click to expand...
I have yet to hear much of this, at all, when it comes to Romney.

We could be having conversations about actual contrasts and policy differences and how Romney's ideas would have been more successful when it comes to issues X, Y, and Z. But the man doesn't offer any specifics whatsoever.

I'd like to judge the man on the merits of his ideas, but he's chosen not to let me.
 
M

markatisu

Member
Not sure if this was posted, but Obama is going to subdue today's campaign event

Obama campaign spokeswoman Jen Psaki added that while Thursday evening’s rally would be more subdued and that the president would open his remarks with a tribute to the fallen diplomats, it was “still a campaign event.”
Click to expand...

And wow at McCain basically shitting all over Romney

John McCain said:
"After such a heartbreaking loss for our nation, I know many Americans are asking whether the United States was naïve or mistaken to support the vast movement for change known as the Arab Spring. I know many Americans may feel a temptation, especially with so many domestic and economic challenges facing us here at home, to distance ourselves from people and events in Libya, and Egypt, and elsewhere in the Middle East. We cannot afford to go down that path.

"We were right to take the side of the Libyan people, and others in the region who share their peaceful aspirations. And we would be gravely mistaken to walk away from them now. To do so would only be a betrayal of everything that Chris Stevens and his colleagues believed in and ultimately gave their lives for, but it would also be a betrayal of America's highest values and our own enduring national interest in supporting people in the Middle East who want to live in peace and freedom."
Click to expand...
 
M

Manmademan

Member
The portrayal of Romney in the inevitable Obama movie will not be kind. This dude is a mess. My hardcore pro life republican voting acquaintance came out on facebook against Romney this morning because she's convinced he's "dangerously incompetent" now.
 
B

BotoxAgent

Member
Kosmo said:
Romney isn't President - that's not his job right now. His job was to offer condolences (check) and contrast with what he would have done if he thought the White House wasn't handling things properly. Even the White House has pulled back on the initial statement that was released.
Click to expand...

haha, whatever makes you sleep better at night man
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Similar threads

[GI.biz] Cheap money and bad bets: How the games industry turned pandemic success into disaster
2
75
3K
sharp weiner replied
  • Poll
Palworld has, once again, highlighted the on going deficiencies in PC Game Pass and the Xbox app on Windows 11 (Windows Central)
Hardware Platform 2 3
111
13K
Unknown Soldier replied
Suicide Squad: Kill The Justice League |OT| Sent to Die
18 19 20 21 22
1K
67K
T-0800 replied
[PC Gamer] How Cyberpunk 2077 clawed its way back from disaster to complete one of the greatest redemption arcs in gaming history
Opinion News 2
99
8K
EDMIX replied
[Verge] Google canceled its next Pixelbook and shut down the team building it
News Business
48
3K
01011001 replied
Top Bottom