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[HylianTom]

That would have been great. Though I feel like Bork would have gone for it because he's a jerk.

I'm pretty damn liberal, but Kelo left an absolutely horrible taste in my mouth. Just terrible.

And yep.. I keep forgetting about the timing of Windsor and his departure.

 

[NeoXChaos]

Is this your coping mechanism?

lol. Just.....hoping for the best and preparing for the worst. Out of the entire field of clowns, jeb is if elected the only one I could regrettably stomach.

 

[dabig2]

A Republican winning next year wont be so bad as some of us are making it out to be. Jeb Bush can be different then W and his father.

We have had great Republican presidents in the past.....

He'll be the same post-Reagan Republican garbage, except he'll now have an all Republican Congress (if Jeb wins,then not even the Senate is looking good to retake) to tell him exactly what he needs to do. And he'll do it like the good Conservative soldier he is. I don't think I have to tell you how much human suffering will unfold with that nonsense (abroad AND domestically).

 

[Metaphoreus]

Metaphoreus is pretty clearly a Republican. Benji is closer to Republican than to Democrat (in the sense that Mars is closer to Earth than it is to the sun).

All the other Republicans that used to post here are banned now, as far as I know.

Yeah, somehow those of us on the political right can't seem to stick around. I know some people feel like that's because of some anti-conservative bias, but I don't think I'd still be here if it were that simple.

I hate to say it, but I think ultimately it's because such folks end up saying something stupid or being overly hostile.

EDIT: Or terrified of posting. It's not easy to be (or feel like) the lone dissenting voice.

 

[benjipwns]

He'll be the same post-Reagan Republican garbage, except he'll now have an all Republican Congress (if Jeb wins,then not even the Senate is looking good to retake) to tell him exactly what he needs to do. And he'll do it like the good Conservative soldier he is. I don't think I have to tell you how much human suffering will unfold with that nonsense (abroad AND domestically).

Expanded federal school oversight and funding, fast track trade agreements, large scale Medicare expansions, big handouts to energy companies and renewable fuels, allowance of pension plans to be underfunded, hostility towards freedom of speech and press, crony handouts masquerading as economic stimulus, tax cuts, deficits, aerial bombings of Muslims, interventions without Congressional declarations of war, torture, spying, government working for powerful banking interests, ever increasing debt.

Oh god it'll be terrible and the President will do nothing to stop it.

 

[NeoXChaos]

"human suffering"....? No matter how bad a Republican will be, it wont be the end of the United States. You will not see I repeat will not see a mass exodus of U.S citizens if we get Jeb over Hillary.

As much damage as W did, I cant see Jeb doing any worse. How many economies suffered under Republican Presidents besides Hoover?

The Republican Party are clowns but maybe with their own, they will get something done. We have to be optomisitc if a R comes true. We have been tainted by having less that spectacular Republican Presidents in our lifetime. The Nixon, Reagan and Bushes of the worlds all did good and bad things....

 

[benjipwns]

How many economies suffered under Republican Presidents besides Hoover?

Well, there were the recessions under Eisenhower, the default under Nixon and heavy inflation under him and Ford, the number of recessions, high unemployment from breaking inflation and Black Monday under Reagan, the recession during Bush that Clinton beat him over the head with, the bubble and the Great Recession as W. Bush "destroyed the free market in order to save it."

But other than that, I can't think of anything right now, I'll have to get back to you.

 

[ivysaur12]

Do I seem like the melting down sort?

I imagine however it would manifest would be fun!

lol, the only data in this graph is the inverse of the difference between the two parties in House seats and the Congress/year and I smoothed it to be a moving ten year average:


This is the DW-NOMINATE graph that's supposed to be proof of the horrible polarization of modern politics based on a ton of votes and determining ideology and so on:


If it wasn't for that crazy jump in my graph caused by the 1920 election combined with my smoothing...

Yeah, it sort of was a bit of a nothing article that was more "no shit". So. Whatever.

 

[benjipwns]

Yeah, somehow those of us on the political right can't seem to stick around. I know some people feel like that's because of some anti-conservative bias, but I don't think I'd still be here if it were that simple.

I hate to say it, but I think ultimately it's because such folks end up saying something stupid or being overly hostile.

EDIT: Or terrified of posting. It's not easy to be (or feel like) the lone dissenting voice.

I know people both "right" and "left" who have left or decreased their PoliGAF involvement because they don't find it as interesting or consider it just a "look what a dumb Republican did/said this week" circlejerk now. The latter which doesn't really lend itself to a Republican viewpoint compared to say, the debates you have with people on court cases, which activate people on all sides of an issue.

Also PollinGAF.

 

[Diablos]

King v. Burwell is just so... offensive to me.
When I read it i cringe. It's just so gross.

I'm sure this made Metamucil chuckle.

 

[Metaphoreus]

King v. Burwell is just so... offensive to me.
When I read it i cringe. It's just so gross.

I'm sure this made Metamucil chuckle.

I laugh heartily every time I see you post.

 

[ivysaur12]

Yeah, somehow those of us on the political right can't seem to stick around. I know some people feel like that's because of some anti-conservative bias, but I don't think I'd still be here if it were that simple.

I hate to say it, but I think ultimately it's because such folks end up saying something stupid or being overly hostile.

EDIT: Or terrified of posting. It's not easy to be (or feel like) the lone dissenting voice.

I would say most fiscal conservatives tend to stay quiet because of the overwhelming progressive viewpoints most posters have, but…

I would also agree it's not that simple. This is especially true when it comes to social movements, like gay marriage or pot. Gay marriage used to be a very different type of discussion on GAF, youngsters. A lot of posters, when presented with evidence to the contrary, don't really say "hmm, that's interesting." They dig their heels in. You see this with the vaccination threads that have been popping up. Digging your heals in leads you to saying something, well, stupid, rash, and ban-able. Or, they might not actually understand as much as they purport about the issue, and then it becomes a quagmire of moving goalposts.

When you compounded this with sometimes being the lone dissenting voice, especially on social issues but sometimes also on economic issues, that would seem to explain why we see so few conservative GAFers. I think you'd more likely see Libertarian than anyone resembling the modern Republican party.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

I can't believe the Senate has gone from a juggarnaut like Ted Kennedy to a simpleton like Ted Cruz in like six years.
Insane.

Things were so much better

 

[benjipwns]

Wow, he kinda looks like Ted Cruz in that picture.

Maybe it's just me.

 

[NYCmetsfan]

nvm reading is for winners

 

[Diablos]

I laugh heartily every time I see you post.

Every single time? I should've known you had a crush on me...

Wow, he kinda looks like Ted Cruz in that picture.

Maybe it's just me.

Of course he does. It's not just you.

 

[ivysaur12]

Wow, he kinda looks like Ted Cruz in that picture.

Maybe it's just me.

Ahhh he does stop that.

 

[Diablos]

Also APK: I just mean it's a fucking sick irony that the next Ted in the Senate is a polar opposite of Ted Kennedy and a greedy, stark raving mad loon to boot. What were the odds? It kind of smothered and lingering thought of Kennedy too, because now every time someone associates Ted with a Senator they're going to think of the moron that enjoys shutting down the government.

 

[benjipwns]

Also APK: I just mean it's a fucking sick irony that the next Ted in the Senate is a polar opposite of Ted Kennedy and a greedy, stark raving mad loon to boot. What were the odds? It kind of smothered and lingering thought of Kennedy too, because now every time someone associates Ted with a Senator they're going to think of the moron that enjoys shutting down the government.

Ted Stevens is rolling in his $398 million grave.

 

[Diablos]

Ted Stevens is rolling in his $398 million grave.

That series of tubes guy?
No one cares.

Kennedy was the real deal. I have a lot of respect for Jimmy Carter but Ted would have been a vastly superior President.

 

[benjipwns]

That series of tubes guy?

See! Another landmark!

What'd Ted Kennedy ever do*? Say "the dream shall never die" after getting crushed by the guy who got crushed by Reagan?

*Other than work with Carter on their sweeping and historic deregulation agenda! And help Bush enact NCLB and Medicare Part D!

 

[NeoXChaos]

See! Another landmark!

What'd Ted Kennedy ever do*? Say "the dream shall never die" after getting crushed by the guy who got crushed by Reagan?

*Other than work with Carter on their sweeping and historic deregulation agenda! And help Bush enact NCLB and Medicare Part D!

"There you go again" "Are you better off then you were 4 years ago"

Since you brought that crushing election up. I wonder if we will see a 49 state landslide for either side in our lifetime.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Speaking of the melting down sort...

The only political thing that could incite a genuine meltdown in me is if SCOTUS ruled against marriage equality. I would be quite livid. Hillary losing in 2016 probably wouldn't do that for me.

 

[NeoXChaos]

The only political thing that could incite a genuine meltdown in me is if SCOTUS ruled against marriage equality. I would be quite livid. Hillary losing in 2016 probably wouldn't do that for me.

Since you went there...What about the 1% chance Ted Cruz being elected & Palin is VP?

 

[benjipwns]

"There you go again" "Are you better off then you were 4 years ago"

Those are both from the lone debate. Which was less than a week before the election.

Carter refused to debate with Anderson on stage, and Reagan wanted both. So there were no debates other than one between Reagan and Anderson where they originally were going to put an empty chair for Carter, but the League of Women Voters objected after the Democrats complained.

Carter had also refused to debate Kennedy during the primaries.

 

[jamesinclair]

Obamas thugs on the move

Federal law enforcement officials have launched a criminal investigation of New Jersey Gov. Chris Christie and members of his administration, pursuing allegations the governor and his staff broke the law when they quashed grand jury indictments against Christie supporters, International Business Times has learned.

Two criminal investigators from the U.S. Department of Justice on Wednesday interviewed the man who leveled those charges, Bennett Barlyn. He was fired from the Hunterdon County prosecutor's office in August 2010, and subsequently brought a whistleblower lawsuit against the Christie administration, claiming he had been punished for objecting to the dismissal of the indictments of the governor's supporters for a range of corrupt activities.

Barlyn told IBTimes that he met with the federal investigators at his Pennsylvania home for more than an hour on Wednesday afternoon. He said they specifically focused on why Christie’s then-attorney general, Paula Dow, had moved to expunge the indictments. The investigators are examining what state and federal laws may have been broken in the process. Barlyn said the investigators appeared to be at an exploratory stage, with no certainty that criminal charges would ultimately be filed. The meeting followed a June letter to Barlyn from New Jersey’s U.S. Attorney, Paul Fishman, instructing Barlyn to be in touch with his office’s investigative team about the case.

The New Jersey U.S. Attorney’s office declined to comment. Christie has denied any involvement in Barlyn's termination, while maintaining that he does not even know the men and women he has been accused of aiding. The governor's office did not respond to a request for comment.

The case centers on exurban/rural Hunterdon County, in western New Jersey along the Delaware River. There, Barlyn claims, then-county Sheriff Deborah Trout ran her office like a private fiefdom, hiring her friends without respect to their experience, and without initiating proper background checks as mandated by state law.

Barlyn’s office began probing Trout in 2008, eventually convening a grand jury that returned 43 indictments against her, Undersheriff Michael Russo and investigator John Falat Jr. The Christie administration then intervened, took over the prosecution and -- in an extraordinary step -- moved to have the grand jury indictments overturned, saying they were legally and factually deficient. When Barlyn raised objections, he was fired.

The expunging of those indictments, Barlyn's termination and his allegations that Christie’s administration quashed the case to protect the governor’s supporters were first aired in a lengthy story in the New York Times in 2013. Several members of the grand jury told the Times that the evidence supporting the indictments was strong, and that overturning them seemed motivated by political considerations.

According to the Times account and Barlyn's claims in his whistleblower lawsuit, Sheriff Trout, Undersheriff Russo and investigator Falat gained Christie's protective intervention because of the political connections of those involved in the case.

http://www.ibtimes.com/chris-christie-administration-target-new-federal-criminal-probe-1806644

 

[Diablos]

Get in line!

 

[WayneMorse]

The greatest postwar Senator is easily Glen Taylor, the cowboy socialist from Idaho who wanted the UN to be the basis for a one world government. His two biggest contributions were preventing Ted Bilbo from being seated in the Senate which prevented him from taking his seat before he died, and being Henry Wallace's running mate in 1948.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glen_H._Taylor

Taylor ran for the Senate for a third time in 1944, defeating incumbent D. Worth Clark in the Democratic primary and Gov. C. A. Bottolfsen in the general election. In the Senate Taylor, known as "The Singing Cowboy," acquired a reputation for eccentric behavior. Upon his arrival in Washington D.C., Taylor rode his horse, Nugget, up the steps of the United States Capitol building.[4] Nugget also accompanied Taylor during a 1947 tour of the country highlighting his anti-war activism and opposition to the U.S. foreign policy of the time.[5]

When Taylor moved to Washington in preparation to be sworn in in January 1945, the housing shortage caused by World War II continued to be in full swing and he and his family had a difficult time finding a place to live. In response Taylor – a musician and songwriter – stood outside the US Capitol building and sang O GIVE US A HOME, NEAR THE CAPITAL DOME, WITH A YARD FOR TWO CHILDREN TO PLAY to the tune of "Home on the Range." He and his family were offered several places to rent.

On election night in 1946, Taylor made national headlines by allegedly breaking the jaw of a local Republican leader, Ray McKaig. Taylor claimed that McKaig had called him an obscene name, and struck him first with a punch that broke his nose,[6] but McKaig denied those claims.[7] McKaig claimed that while he was lying on the floor Taylor proceeded to kick him, but Taylor denied that claim.[6] Later when Taylor lost his 1950 reelection campaign, McKaig sent a telegram that said, "You may have broken my jaw, but I just broke your back!!!"

 

[benjipwns]

Speaking of Henry Wallace, now there was an interesting fellow. Soviet apologist who the Party refused to keep from becoming President even against FDR's wishes. Who then ran a third party campaign that went nowhere. Then Korea led him to become not only a staunch Eisenhower supporter, but to investigate and repudiate his prior views on the Soviets and Stalin, and by 1960 was campaigning hard for Nixon because of his anti-communism history.

Hazel Abel was the best post-war Senator. Rebecca Latimer Felton was the best Senator of the 20th Century despite being a slave owner, the last member of Congress to be one in fact.

 

[WayneMorse]

Rebecca Latimer Felton was the best Senator of the 20th Century despite being a slave owner, the last member of Congress to be one in fact.

Ah yes, she supported the progressive movement, reforming prisons and schools, a suffragist too! She uh...also supported lynching.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Since you went there...What about the 1% chance Ted Cruz being elected & Palin is VP?

I'd laugh and move to Canada, I'm close enough

Of the GOP field I think Jeb Bush and Scott Walker are the most likely to win the nomination. Bush I could live with, I might shove over a magazine rack if Walker wins but at least he won't be governor of Wisconsin anymore

 

[NYCmetsfan]

we need more random US history in here.

 

[benjipwns]

we need more random US history in here.

I try!

 

[WayneMorse]

I'd laugh and move to Canada, I'm close enough

Of the GOP field I think Jeb Bush and Scott Walker are the most likely to win the nomination. Bush I could live with, I might shove over a magazine rack if Walker wins but at least he won't be governor of Wisconsin anymore

Yeah but you would have to deal with Stephen Harper so it's not like Canada is any better.

 

[thepotatoman]

It's dumb to think this, because if Bork made it to the court then there's no way of knowing if things would have moved forward in the same way. I.e. you take a job at one place opposed to another, and x, y and z happen to your life and those around you because of it.

Bork on the court could have caused liberals to rage against the right-wing more than they even did back in the 80s which could have changed the direction of US politics and thus impaced races differently resulting in different people elected to Congress, a set of Democratic governors that varied from what we had, outside influences, etc. etc.

Good to know that Diablosing also works in retroactive hypotheticals.

You seem to think everything will cause a wave one way or the other, when in reality most people don't really care about most things in politics.

What 5-4 cases are you guys thinking of that Bork would have voted different from Kennedy? (Honestly, I haven't bothered to look up big 5-4 cases.)

Assuming all else being equal any 5-4 cases roughly 2012 forward would have been decided by an Obama appointee rather than Kennedy/Roberts.

I wouldn't be that hung up on his death. Dude would have been 81 in 2008, with a clear Democrat wave on the horizon. You don't think he would have given Bush and a Republican senate the chance to nominate his replacement?

 

[Metaphoreus]

On the topic of random history and presidential succession:

In 1841, President William Henry Harrison died in office--barely a month into the ninth presidency of the United States. At his inauguration, he had spoken for nearly two hours in the rain and contracted pneumonia, from which he died: a lesson to all bloviators. His vice president, John Tyler, became the new president.

Or did he?

The answer turned on the wording of Article II of the Constitution: "In Case of the Removal of the President from Office, or of his Death, Resignation or Inability to discharge the Powers and Duties of the said Office, the Same shall devolve on the Vice President." The question was what it was, precisely, that devolved. Was it the office, or was it the powers and duties of said office? From a grammatical point of view, what is the antecedent of the legalistic pronoun same? Did John Tyler become the tenth president, or did he remain the vice president while having the powers and duties of the presidency? Constitutional scholars long debated the point.

Scalia and Garner resolve the conundrum in the following way:

The so-called last-antecedent canon resolves the issue favorably to Tyler: office is the nearest reasonable antecedent of same; the phrase powers and duties is a more remote antecedent. As a result, we can now confidently pronounce that there have been 44 presidents in the history of the United States as of 2012.

Luckily, we've since remedied the problem:

The ambiguity was finally eliminated in 1967. The 25th Amendment remedied it by providing that if the president dies, resigns, or is removed, “the Vice President shall become President.” If the president is disabled, the vice president assumes the office’s powers and duties as “acting president” for as long as the disability continues.

 

[FiggyCal]

Not at all a new, but I just found out a story regarding Haiti that made me legitimately upset:

Contractors for Fruit of the Loom, Hanes and Levi’s worked in close concert with the US Embassy when they aggressively moved to block a minimum wage increase for Haitian assembly zone workers, the lowest-paid in the hemisphere, according to secret State Department cables.

The factory owners told the Haitian Parliament that they were willing to give workers a 9-cents-per-hour pay increase to 31 cents per hour to make T-shirts, bras and underwear for US clothing giants like Dockers and Nautica.

But the factory owners refused to pay 62 cents per hour, or $5 per day, as a measure unanimously passed by the Haitian Parliament in June 2009 would have mandated. And they had the vigorous backing of the US Agency for International Development and the US Embassy when they took that stand.

To resolve the impasse between the factory owners and Parliament, the State Department urged quick intervention by then Haitian President René Préval.

This is sad stuff

 

[benjipwns]

Tyler went badass over the whole thing:

Immediately after his inauguration, Tyler called the Cabinet into session, having decided to retain its members. Webster informed him of Harrison's practice of making policy by a majority vote. The Cabinet fully expected the new President to continue this practice. Tyler was astounded and immediately corrected them:

I beg your pardon, gentlemen; I am very glad to have in my Cabinet such able statesmen as you have proved yourselves to be. And I shall be pleased to avail myself of your counsel and advice. But I can never consent to being dictated to as to what I shall or shall not do. I, as President, shall be responsible for my administration. I hope to have your hearty co-operation in carrying out its measures. So long as you see fit to do this, I shall be glad to have you with me. When you think otherwise, your resignations will be accepted.

Clay never forgave him for not being a puppet of Clay's:

Two vacancies occurred on the Supreme Court during Tyler's presidency, as Justices Smith Thompson and Henry Baldwin died in 1843 and 1844, respectively. Tyler, ever at odds with Congress—including the Whig-controlled Senate—nominated several men to the Supreme Court to fill these seats. However, the Senate successively voted against confirming John Canfield Spencer, Reuben Walworth, Edward King and John M. Read (King was rejected twice). One reason cited for the Senate's actions was the hope that Clay would fill the vacancies after winning the 1844 presidential election.

My favorite:

However, Tyler never wavered from his conviction that he was the rightful president; when his political opponents sent correspondence to the White House addressed to the "Vice President" or "Acting President", Tyler had it returned unopened

 

[eBay Huckster]

Yeah but you would have to deal with Stephen Harper so it's not like Canada is any better.

Depending on how bizarre this fall's campaign gets, he might get to deal with Trudeau or Mulcair (or both!) instead.

 

[benjipwns]

Depending on how bizarre this fall's campaign gets, he might get to deal with Trudeau or Mulcair (or both!) instead.

I think the NDP's boomlet is over unless something changes over the next eight months:

Though as you note they could still be the swing vote since they have a lot of strong regional support.

I also can't believe the Liberals numbers jumped like that just because of Trudeau lol

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Tyler went badass over the whole thing:

Clay never forgave him for not being a puppet of Clay's:

My favorite:

Yeah I remember reading literally verbatim these quotes. Is this from wiki?

That 1830-1850 period in US history is really forgotten though its extremely consequential

 

[benjipwns]

Yeah I remember reading literally verbatim these quotes. Is this from wiki?

That 1830-1850 period in US history is really forgotten though its extremely consequential

Yeah, I just grabbed them off wikipedia because it's like why even bother going elsewhere for internet posts anymore. Even if I have to sacrifice some more of Tyler's badassery since he and Clay had some epic meetings where Tyler was just like "go fuck yourself."

James K. Polk despite having the They Might Be Giants song is an interesting political figure. Had four goals, met them all. Mexican War grabbed a huge amount of land and started based on a lie by the government, Texas' annexation along with creation of Nebraska and Kansas out of some of that seized land to the Civil War eventually, etc. Then stepped down after one term. And died.

Franklin Pierce was a pretty "good" politician but his son died right before inauguration and he fell into a drunken depression he never came out of. So he essentially allowed Douglas to become the dominant figure in the Democratic Party which wound up splitting it.

 

[eBay Huckster]

I think the NDP's boomlet is over unless something changes over the next eight months:

Though as you note they could still be the swing vote since they have a lot of strong regional support.

I also can't believe the Liberals numbers jumped like that just because of Trudeau lol

Probably so (RE: the NDP having no shot at being the primary party in a government) but after everything that happened in the 2011 campaign period, I ain't ruling anything out until after the debates.

 

[WayneMorse]

Harper's luster is gone but so is Trudeau's. Like what was said over in the Canada poligaf thread Trudeau's lack of any meaningful statements on things like security and civil liberties has definitely made him look more like a man more concerned about his image than policy.

He makes good arguments for pot legalization I'll give him that.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Diablos gonna diablos

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1004955&postcount=3

Spoiler

lol

 

[benjipwns]

http://www.vox.com/2015/2/5/7978823/congress-secrets

How are any of these "secrets" lol

 

[ivysaur12]

http://www.vox.com/2015/2/5/7978823/congress-secrets

How are any of these "secrets" lol

#Vox

 

[benjipwns]

The amusing thing about Vox is that it actually seems to be turning Ezra Klein into a better writer while the rest of it and the writers are plummeting downhill towards a fancier looking Buzzfeed at simply a remarkable speed.

I've been shocked how many writers aren't even doing basic Google searches or looking at Wikipedia about subjects anymore.

My favorite is still the 40 Maps that explain the Roman Empire or whatever where one of the "maps" was just a picture of a boat.

 

[East Lake]

Is there a name for Vox's type of site layout. I feel like we're slowly approaching some singularity where you can't distinguish between the ads and the articles.

 

[Oblivion]

Andrew Jackson was kind of a douche, but I always liked what he said about his biggest regrets in life:

Andrew Jackson had no such positive feelings for him at all. Not a shred. He characterized him as "the basest, meanest, scoundrel that ever disgraced the image of his god...," branded him "The Villain," a characterization taken up by many historians over the years, and stated near the end of his life that he only regretted that he had not shot Henry Clay and hanged John C. Calhoun.